Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
@TheVaultDweller.Have fun proving Superman can cross from Canada to Africa in seconds. 😂
Does it appear (or feel) that time elapsed between the cut scenes?
What was the writer trying to show?
Unless you can prove (or give strong evidence) that some time elapsed time between cut scenes then you must assume that the writer's intention was that no time elapsed from the cut scenes.
Originally posted by h1a8
Does it appear (or feel) that time elapsed between the cut scenes?
What was the writer trying to show?Unless you can prove (or give strong evidence) that some time elapsed time between cut scenes then you must assume that the writer's intention was that no time elapsed from the cut scenes.
The writer's intention was to portray superman flying through multiple scenarios.
Time between cutscenes is irrelevant to the writer. It doesnt mean he is showing a single scene or that Superman crossed the Atlantic Ocean in 1s. 😂
And i didnt based my numbers on the time between cutscenes but the time within the cutscenes.
In which case my numbers remain intact.
Originally posted by h1a8
Does it appear (or feel) that time elapsed between the cut scenes?
What was the writer trying to show?Unless you can prove (or give strong evidence) that some time elapsed time between cut scenes then you must assume that the writer's intention was that no time elapsed from the cut scenes.
You're the last person allowed to demand proof. seeing as you still haven't proven that 1 second = 11 days for Superman, it's "human" size Surtur in this thread or that knowledge = 100% of the information.
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Exactly. How much? The answer:Nice to know you agree with me! Unless Gubz quotes the people who did the scene stating that the time between the cutscene is 1min [B] his numbers mean nothing! Hot Air! Useless
This is why i wont take his mach 27.5 number. Because there is an unknown variable in his equation which is time. Any scientist knows that you cant pull out numbers from unknown variables!
FURTHERMORE:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=T2lBsFbWe4w&t=836s
Minute 13:50.
Gubz:
He isnt counting for the cutscenes time. His calculations are currect, but his timing variable isnt literal and therefore his calcs are hypothetical and not solid.
You dont need a Ph.D in Physics to know such calcs must not be taken.
But I follow your monkey dance... I will run some calcs, be patient. [/B]
Nope. It doesn't work like that. We use the screen evidence as it is unless there is evidence to suggest otherwise. Cutting between locations does not automatically mean timelapse (especially not to the degree you are implying). Again, you need to prove it, as your claim regarding Superman's speed is dependent on it.
And stop hiding behind Gubz. What he said is irrelevant at this point. We don't need him to tell us the distance to reach the outer atmosphere etc. That can easily be googled. This is about you proving that the scene in question is longer than it appears to be. That has nothing to do with what Gubz said.
Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Why should I prove something I never said? We're discussing your claims.Besides, Nemebro already made a long post about it, which you flat-out refused to properly address.
Because you are claiming my numbers are errouneous! Therefore, prove they are.
You mean RetardBro? The one who never properly quoted and refuted my original arguments, but instead went arround wailing and bringing youtube videos and links?
I don't have to address something I've already won the moment he decided not to counter my points.
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Because you are claiming my numbers are errouneous! Therefore, prove they are.You mean RetardBro? The one who never properly quoted and refuted my original arguments, but instead went arround wailing and bringing youtube videos and links?
I don't have to address something I've already won the moment he decided not to counter my points.
What an epic strawman/deflection attempt. Where did I comment on any of the other numbers you posted? Oh wait, I didn't. We are discussing that scene in particular. The one that provided the Mach 27.5 number.
We know the distance that he had to travel.
We know how long it took him, based on screen time.
We know what speed he would need to have traveled in order to do it in that amount of time.
We know what you claimed his maximum speed is.
And we know that in order for your claim to hold true, that scene would need to be more than five times longer than it appears to us.
This has absolutely nothing to do with any of your other numbers, as he doesn't need to be traveling the same speed in every scene.
So, again, prove that the scene in question was more than five times longer than it appeared.
Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Nope. It doesn't work like that. We use the screen evidence as it is unless there is evidence to suggest otherwise. Cutting between locations does not automatically mean timelapse (especially not to the degree you are implying). Again, you need to prove it, as your claim regarding Superman's speed is dependent on it.
We debate based on scenes! What happens between 2 scenes is unknown, and therefore, you cant draw a straight line connecting 2 scenes!
It's funny, cause you can't prove neither that there is no timelapse between scenes.
Therefore we fall at a dead end, in where you can't prove there is time in between nor can I, nor can Gubz.
Therefore his numbers are erroneous and not literal.
Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
And stop hiding behind Gubz. What he said is irrelevant at this point.
What!?
Excese me Mr. TheVault, but what Gubz said is COMPLETELY relevant since it's his mach 27.5 estimation what we are debating.
So every word, every number Gubz used is completely relevant.
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
The writer's intention was to portray superman flying through multiple scenarios.Time between cutscenes is irrelevant to the writer. It doesnt mean he is showing a single scene or that Superman crossed the Atlantic Ocean in 1s. 😂
And i didnt based my numbers on the time between cutscenes but the time within the cutscenes.
In which case my numbers remain intact.
So what evidence do you have that time elapsed between cut scenes?
Originally posted by TheVaultDwellerScrew it, I will make it simple for you. Mach 27.5 is 5.5 times more than Mach 5, which is the speed you are claiming is Superman's max. So, from that, the 1 minute we see onscreen would actually need to be more like 5 and a half minutes as well (going at less than a 5th of the speed means he would require more than 5 times as long). So, prove that the 1-minute scene Gubz referenced is in fact at least 5-and-a-half minutes long. As that would need to hold true for your claim to also be true. And if you can't, you are basically conceding that you can't actually prove your claim.
Okay it's time to put the final nail to the coffin.
I've analyzed Gubz calc's, the scenes, and ran some corrected calcs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnVsgrjQUn0&t=30s
(I will use this video as source, all timings presented bellow are pertaining this clip)
1. Mach 27.5 calculation:
After analyzing the movie sequence, i realize a MASSIVE error! Doomsday.
Should we follow Gubz methodology, we SHOULD take the time in the scene linear.
Therefore, it took Doomsday 28s (minute 2:25 - 2:53) to cross 480km (according to Gubz)
Should we put that into the velocity formula, DD would be moving at:
61714 Km/h or Mach 50!!!
Now, DD is definetly not Mach 50!!!!! (Should I now expect RetardBro or TheVault, or H1 to come arguing DD is 2x faster than Superman!!? 😂 🙂 )
It's clear that either the timing of the sequence is wrong, or the distance is wrong. One way or another, the outcome is erroneous!
Why should we take Gubz mach 27.5 calculation serious then!? It's clear there is a flaw in Gubz calcs.
2. Distance error:
Okay, initially I took Gubz 480km distance as granted...Then after reviewing the scenes (the explosion scene) I realized there is problem with it.
How familiar are you with the Tsar Bomba mr. Vault? Either way, the Tsar Bomba is the biggest nuke ever detonated, and presumely the biggest ever built. It's size was massive!!!!
A Tsar Bomba is a 50MT bomb, whose fireball radious is about 58km!
Now, put a the fireball's radious into a calculator along with the distance, and you can get the perceived size of such an explosion.
So that's what I did, and:
The perceived size such an explosion would have on the sky is of 7 degrees approx!!! (using 480km as the distance from the spectator)
However if we check the actual footage, anyone can realize that is FAR from being 7 degrees.
https://oneminuteastronomer.com/860/measuring-sky/
(In case you don't know how to measure the degrees of an object in the sky).
Now, this is the Tsar bomba we are talking about! The problem is that it's a bomb, not a missile! The US missiles Trident and Minuteman carry between 100-170KT warheads (10x more powerful than the Hiroshima bomb) not Tsar Bomba's size warheads.
Using the 170KT one for the sake of debating, the size of this would be 0.6 degrees (A bit smaller than what the sun appears to be)
Conclusion: The distance used by Gutz clearly is for some reason mistaken.
Now what is the distance? We can get a clear picture of the size of the explosion in minute 2:35 (Batman's ship passes right infront of the camera showing the explosion radious at the back) i would estimate 21deg (For the sake of debating, since I think its more).
Running calculations, for something like this to happen the explosion should have taken place 10km above the city!!! Now, [B]For the sake of debating lets stick to the Tsar Bomba.
Should the Tsar Bomba had detonated instead, the distance should have been 116km above the city
Clearly, either Gubz calcs are erroneous or DCEU's physics is amazingly stupid!
3. Dear Gravity!:
How funny indeed! Not even myself initially remembered about gravity and how objects accelerate the further they fall.
What this means is that Superman's speed in that scene isn't purely his velocity, but the addition of it to that of the acceleration being supplied by Gravity.
In other words TheVaultDweller, Superman's speed in that scene must not be taken solely as his flying speed
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, after doing some intensive research and analyzing the scenes over and over again I finally feel confident to forumulate a proposition.
Here are my numbers!
Using the new distance implied by the scene and supported by physics (and not the hypothetical 480km used by Gubz), here are my numbers.
Distance from the soil to the explosion: 140 km
Time: 1 minute
[I will use Gubz numbers in order to prevent you TheVault to come saying i don't have evidence to back up the timelapse between the cutscene
Using calculations, Superman's speed for that scene is of approximately Mach 7
And note this isn't accounting for the acceleration supplied by gravity, so it could be less!
Now, I respect Gubz and constantly watch his videos for intel. It's not really his fault to get such erroneous calculation.
The scene is pretty messed up. Many wholes and things that can easily make you commit errors
P.S:
Let's keep in mind that the US misiles use way smaller nukes than the Tsar Bomba.
Originally posted by h1a8
So what evidence do you have that time elapsed between cut scenes?
Read my above post.
I spent hours reviewing the scene and drawing up calcs. Results that Time isn't the only problem, but also the distance used.
And i can't give account for the time, no one can. So Gutz calcs are one way or another wrong!
I want to add a cherry to the cake.
Superman's speed in the various movies
MoS: mach 1-3
BvS: mach 2-5 (except for a single isolated scene in where Gubz estimated a mach 27)
JL: mach 3-7 approx
In other words, there is a discontinuity in character traits. Why didn't we saw a mach 27.5 Superman in JL???
Either the movies are wrong or the scene is wrong or there was a miscalcuation.
I think it's pretty obvious there is a miscalc.
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Okay it's time to put the final nail to the coffin.I've analyzed Gubz calc's, the scenes, and ran some corrected calcs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnVsgrjQUn0&t=30s
(I will use this video as source, all timings presented bellow are pertaining this clip)[B]1. Mach 27.5 calculation:
After analyzing the movie sequence, i realize a MASSIVE error! Doomsday.
Should we follow Gubz methodology, we SHOULD take the time in the scene linear.
Therefore, it took Doomsday 28s (minute 2:25 - 2:53) to cross 480km (according to Gubz)
Should we put that into the velocity formula, DD would be moving at:
61714 Km/h or Mach 50!!!
Now, DD is definetly not Mach 50!!!!! (Should I now expect RetardBro or TheVault, or H1 to come arguing DD is 2x faster than Superman!!? 😂 🙂 )
It's clear that either the timing of the sequence is wrong, or the distance is wrong. One way or another, the outcome is erroneous!
Why should we take Gubz mach 27.5 calculation serious then!? It's clear there is a flaw in Gubz calcs.
2. Distance error:
Okay, initially I took Gubz 480km distance as granted...Then after reviewing the scenes (the explosion scene) I realized there is problem with it.
How familiar are you with the Tsar Bomba mr. Vault? Either way, the Tsar Bomba is the biggest nuke ever detonated, and presumely the biggest ever built. It's size was massive!!!!
A Tsar Bomba is a 50MT bomb, whose fireball radious is about 58km!
Now, put a the fireball's radious into a calculator along with the distance, and you can get the perceived size of such an explosion.
So that's what I did, and:
The perceived size such an explosion would have on the sky is of 7 degrees approx!!! (using 480km as the distance from the spectator)
However if we check the actual footage, anyone can realize that is FAR from being 7 degrees.
https://oneminuteastronomer.com/860/measuring-sky/
(In case you don't know how to measure the degrees of an object in the sky).Now, this is the Tsar bomba we are talking about! The problem is that it's a bomb, not a missile! The US missiles Trident and Minuteman carry between 100-170KT warheads (10x more powerful than the Hiroshima bomb) not Tsar Bomba's size warheads.
Using the 170KT one for the sake of debating, the size of this would be 0.6 degrees (A bit smaller than what the sun appears to be)
Conclusion: The distance used by Gutz clearly is for some reason mistaken.
Now what is the distance? We can get a clear picture of the size of the explosion in minute 2:35 (Batman's ship passes right infront of the camera showing the explosion radious at the back) i would estimate 21deg (For the sake of debating, since I think its more).
Running calculations, for something like this to happen the explosion should have taken place 10km above the city!!! Now, [B]For the sake of debating lets stick to the Tsar Bomba.
Should the Tsar Bomba had detonated instead, the distance should have been 116km above the city
Clearly, either Gubz calcs are erroneous or DCEU's physics is amazingly stupid!
3. Dear Gravity!:
How funny indeed! Not even myself initially remembered about gravity and how objects accelerate the further they fall.
What this means is that Superman's speed in that scene isn't purely his velocity, but the addition of it to that of the acceleration being supplied by Gravity.
In other words TheVaultDweller, Superman's speed in that scene must not be taken solely as his flying speed
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, after doing some intensive research and analyzing the scenes over and over again I finally feel confident to forumulate a proposition.
Here are my numbers!
Using the new distance implied by the scene and supported by physics (and not the hypothetical 480km used by Gubz), here are my numbers.
Distance from the soil to the explosion: 140 km
Time: 1 minute[I will use Gubz numbers in order to prevent you TheVault to come saying i don't have evidence to back up the timelapse between the cutscene
Using calculations, Superman's speed for that scene is of approximately Mach 7
And note this isn't accounting for the acceleration supplied by gravity, so it could be less!
Now, I respect Gubz and constantly watch his videos for intel. It's not really his fault to get such erroneous calculation.
The scene is pretty messed up. Many wholes and things that can easily make you commit errors
P.S:
Let's keep in mind that the US misiles use way smaller nukes than the Tsar Bomba. [/B]
Where do you get that DD traveled 480km? When was this?
Originally posted by Josh_AlexanderBetween both MoS and BvS Superman has several feats of speeding to distant locales in matters of seconds to minutes, and several other characters have some notable speed feats that makes Superman's ability to render them statues in comparison to his speed extremely impressive.
I want to add a cherry to the cake.[B]Superman's speed in the various movies
MoS: mach 1-3
BvS: mach 2-5 (except for a single isolated scene in where Gubz estimated a mach 27)
JL: mach 3-7 approxIn other words, there is a discontinuity in character traits. Why didn't we saw a mach 27.5 Superman in JL???
Either the movies are wrong or the scene is wrong or there was a miscalcuation.
I think it's pretty obvious there is a miscalc. [/B]
You can't properly address my post and deep down you know this. 👆
Whereas I didn't address your excremental post because it was just you whining that because your mother's sagging titties or whatever the phuck they were were moving in some scene, Superman and Flash are only mach 2-3, ignoring all of his feats far in excess of that. Rather than responding to counter your stupidity, I chose to support what I was saying.
And I did. 👆
Originally posted by NemeBro
Between both MoS and BvS Superman has several feats of speeding to distant locales in matters of seconds to minutes, and several other characters have some notable speed feats that makes Superman's ability to render them statues in comparison to his speed extremely impressive.You can't properly address my post and deep down you know this. 👆
Whereas I didn't address your excremental post because it was just you whining that because your mother's sagging titties or whatever the phuck they were were moving in some scene, Superman and Flash are only mach 2-3, ignoring all of his feats far in excess of that. Rather than responding to counter your stupidity, I chose to support what I was saying.
And I did. 👆
You have no right to demand anything from the Tribunal.
You dont address my points, I wont address yours.
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Okay it's time to put the final nail to the coffin.I've analyzed Gubz calc's, the scenes, and ran some corrected calcs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnVsgrjQUn0&t=30s
(I will use this video as source, all timings presented bellow are pertaining this clip)[B]1. Mach 27.5 calculation:
After analyzing the movie sequence, i realize a MASSIVE error! Doomsday.
Should we follow Gubz methodology, we SHOULD take the time in the scene linear.
Therefore, it took Doomsday 28s (minute 2:25 - 2:53) to cross 480km (according to Gubz)
Should we put that into the velocity formula, DD would be moving at:
61714 Km/h or Mach 50!!!
Now, DD is definetly not Mach 50!!!!! (Should I now expect RetardBro or TheVault, or H1 to come arguing DD is 2x faster than Superman!!? 😂 🙂 )
It's clear that either the timing of the sequence is wrong, or the distance is wrong. One way or another, the outcome is erroneous!
Why should we take Gubz mach 27.5 calculation serious then!? It's clear there is a flaw in Gubz calcs.
2. Distance error:
Okay, initially I took Gubz 480km distance as granted...Then after reviewing the scenes (the explosion scene) I realized there is problem with it.
How familiar are you with the Tsar Bomba mr. Vault? Either way, the Tsar Bomba is the biggest nuke ever detonated, and presumely the biggest ever built. It's size was massive!!!!
A Tsar Bomba is a 50MT bomb, whose fireball radious is about 58km!
Now, put a the fireball's radious into a calculator along with the distance, and you can get the perceived size of such an explosion.
So that's what I did, and:
The perceived size such an explosion would have on the sky is of 7 degrees approx!!! (using 480km as the distance from the spectator)
However if we check the actual footage, anyone can realize that is FAR from being 7 degrees.
https://oneminuteastronomer.com/860/measuring-sky/
(In case you don't know how to measure the degrees of an object in the sky).Now, this is the Tsar bomba we are talking about! The problem is that it's a bomb, not a missile! The US missiles Trident and Minuteman carry between 100-170KT warheads (10x more powerful than the Hiroshima bomb) not Tsar Bomba's size warheads.
Using the 170KT one for the sake of debating, the size of this would be 0.6 degrees (A bit smaller than what the sun appears to be)
Conclusion: The distance used by Gutz clearly is for some reason mistaken.
Now what is the distance? We can get a clear picture of the size of the explosion in minute 2:35 (Batman's ship passes right infront of the camera showing the explosion radious at the back) i would estimate 21deg (For the sake of debating, since I think its more).
Running calculations, for something like this to happen the explosion should have taken place 10km above the city!!! Now, [B]For the sake of debating lets stick to the Tsar Bomba.
Should the Tsar Bomba had detonated instead, the distance should have been 116km above the city
Clearly, either Gubz calcs are erroneous or DCEU's physics is amazingly stupid!
3. Dear Gravity!:
How funny indeed! Not even myself initially remembered about gravity and how objects accelerate the further they fall.
What this means is that Superman's speed in that scene isn't purely his velocity, but the addition of it to that of the acceleration being supplied by Gravity.
In other words TheVaultDweller, Superman's speed in that scene must not be taken solely as his flying speed
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, after doing some intensive research and analyzing the scenes over and over again I finally feel confident to forumulate a proposition.
Here are my numbers!
Using the new distance implied by the scene and supported by physics (and not the hypothetical 480km used by Gubz), here are my numbers.
Distance from the soil to the explosion: 140 km
Time: 1 minute[I will use Gubz numbers in order to prevent you TheVault to come saying i don't have evidence to back up the timelapse between the cutscene
Using calculations, Superman's speed for that scene is of approximately Mach 7
And note this isn't accounting for the acceleration supplied by gravity, so it could be less!
Now, I respect Gubz and constantly watch his videos for intel. It's not really his fault to get such erroneous calculation.
The scene is pretty messed up. Many wholes and things that can easily make you commit errors
P.S:
Let's keep in mind that the US misiles use way smaller nukes than the Tsar Bomba. [/B]
So, your supposed super counter depends on a series of approximate estimations regarding angles and assuming a bunch of stuff from a fictional universe operates exactly like a real one? And you call Gubz's numbers hypothetical?
And just to be clear, which explosion are you claiming took place 140km from the ground? Your post is, quite frankly, extremely messy, and hard to track what you are assigning to what.