Read the stips!! Batman/Punisher vs Thor

Originally posted by -Pr-
It just really, really comes across as cherry picking on your part, tbh. Not saying that's what you're doing, just how it looks to me. Like you wouldn't regard those same feats as being valid if they were used against another herald.

Fair enough. Fwiw, it'll be the same with Hal Jordan (no ring) 😈

But on a serious note, it's rare for a herald of this level to have so many street speed feats against him. Especially considering speed is not 'traditionally' part of his powerset.

All the feats I mentioned, have happened in a canon comic. Thor has superspeed, yes, but I'm beginning to think it's not THAT great, if two humans are not even 4x slower.

Not saying Alfred or Riddler or whatever would be able to slice and dice, btw. There's a reason I chose to elite streets here.

Edit: with regards to Alberto's accusation, I go by the canon comic showings. On handbooks, sure, Thor SHOULD annihilate.

But based on comics? Story is quite different.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Fair enough. Fwiw, it'll be the same with Hal Jordan (no ring) 😈

But on a serious note, it's rare for a herald of this level to have so many street speed feats against him. Especially considering speed is not 'traditionally' part of his powerset.

All the feats I mentioned, have happened in a canon comic. Thor has superspeed, yes, but I'm beginning to think it's not THAT great, if two humans are not even 4x slower.

Not saying Alfred or Riddler or whatever would be able to slice and dice, btw. There's a reason I chose to elite streets here.

Edit: with regards to Alberto's accusation, I go by the canon comic showings. On handbooks, sure, Thor SHOULD annihilate.

But based on comics? Story is quite different.

lol.

I agree for the most part with you on those points at least. His speed just isn't that far ahead of the elite streets, and he does have the aforementioned feats against him by streets that you mentioned.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Considering your rampant anti-Superman bias, I really would think twice about hopping in to discussions like this, if I were you.

I think I'm pretty fair when it comes to judging superman power levels IMO, but I don't wanna go off topic. that's a discussion for another time

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Fair enough. Fwiw, it'll be the same with Hal Jordan (no ring) 😈

But on a serious note, it's rare for a herald of this level to have so many street speed feats against him. Especially considering speed is not 'traditionally' part of his powerset.

Superspeed was traditionally a part of his powerset. It was defined in his early days.

I think some writers just chose to ignore it or made so it is a bit more ambiguous for some reason or other. Most likely because apart from being incredibly strong and durable, he literally pulls so many powers(mostly via hammer) out of his @$$, that it would be almost impossible to tackle a story for him.
It is more evident when he is fighting streets or characters that are normally seen as having little to no threat to him. They literally have to dumb him down.
The only problem is every now and then, he performs a speed feat that perpetuates the idea that he does have remarkable superspeed. This usually when the danger gets kicked up a notch. Not inconceivable since he's performed a bunch of them in the past and that he's physically very powerful. Hence why i always say, though he's not your traditional speedster, he will perform a speed feat that can be considered far beyond what streets can normally do. He is as fast as the story needs him to be.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Frank isn't for sure. Batman is....iffy.

Unless I'm out of the loop and Frank is a meta.

Both are iffy, both are doing stuff they shouldn't be capable of, peak human or not.

Both have had their whole bodies rejuvenated and restored fairly recently, both have ridiculous feats vs. superhumans.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
It only seems many because u guys r singling him out. If u take gladiator for example, he gets tagged all the time by streets or characters who do not have defined superspeed... And he's a character with a much more defined superspeed.

Superspeed was traditionally a part of his powerset. It was defined in his early days.

I think some writers just chose to ignore it or made so it is a bit more ambiguous for some reason or other. Most likely because apart from being incredibly strong and durable, he literally pulls so many powers(mostly via hammer) out of his @$$, that it would be almost impossible to tackle a story for him.
It is more evident when he is fighting streets or characters that are normally seen as having little to no threat to him. They literally have to dumb him down.
The only problem is every now and then, he performs a speed feat that perpetuates the idea that he does have remarkable superspeed. This usually when the danger gets kicked up a notch. Not inconceivable since he's performed a bunch of them in the past and that he's physically very powerful. Hence why i always say, though he's not your traditional speedster, he will perform a speed feat that can be considered far beyond what streets can normally do. He is as fast as the story needs him to be.

It still is, he just never has to use it. Also low key fandral is a speedster too but they only showed him using it a few times

Originally posted by -Pr-
lol.

I agree for the most part with you on those points at least. His speed just isn't that far ahead of the elite streets, and he does have the aforementioned feats against him by streets that you mentioned.

Can I count on this as being official?

For me debating how a holding back Thor would fare with his speed vs elite streets (who can afford to go all out) it's honestly something you can argue about. As I said, the scenario 2 or 3 allow this discussion that I haven't really tackled.

But the scenario 1 begs the question of dropping someone who can hang a bit in the sun with pressure points. Thor has fought with Cap in the past in several scenarios without being defeated by straight physical damage, and Steve is stronger and is armed with a shield, you cannot come and tell me Captain America is written down so he doesn't stomp Thor. So I think there is extensive comic proof that supports that Batman and Punisher in scenario one are massively phucked.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Can I count on this as being official?

I'm not making a ruling, if that's what you're saying.

But I don't for one second believe that Thor can fight on the same level speed-wise as someone like Superman or even Surfer.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm not making a ruling, if that's what you're saying.

But I don't for one second believe that Thor can fight on the same level speed-wise as someone like Superman or even Surfer.

If not....why not?

I mean, we already have a ruling on the minimum speed of Thor (i.e he is at least faster than a human). From the responses here, its sounding like he's not 4x faster than a human....so that's a max speed right there.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
If not....why not?

I mean, we already have a ruling on the minimum speed of Thor (i.e he is at least faster than a human). From the responses here, its sounding like he's not 4x faster than a human....so that's a max speed right there.

Ok

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
If not....why not?

I mean, we already have a ruling on the minimum speed of Thor (i.e he is at least faster than a human). From the responses here, its sounding like he's not 4x faster than a human....so that's a max speed right there.

Bump for a mod.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

Although scans I only saw, not read the comics, I've seen plenty of examples of swords, spears, bullets and I think arrows ranging from cutting/piercing him to being avoided as a danger. And I most cases they weren't special, just normal blades and projectiles. I know there's examples of the other way around, him being superficially hurt to tanking with little to no damage (like a fighter jet auto cannon merely bruising him) but it seems there's enough to not dismiss as "PIS"(which I should note I feel more often than not is just used to say "I don't like it so it doesn't count"😉.

Given the stips I would agree the team has at least a decent chance of winning even in the first.

Also I thought Stilt was just trolling with that scan given how overly dramatic Hercules is over Thor getting rid of his beard. I almost stopped reading before seeing the point to the scan. 😆

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Moreover, remember people: there are THREE rounds.

Rd1: h2h fighting.
Rd2: Batman/Punisher get adamantium knives
Rd3: Everyone gets an adamantium knife, the team have to slash Thor 10 times, Thor has to slash EACH of the team 10 times to win.

Yah, I had 3 rounds, and no one could actually offer any real argument for Thor past Round 1.

Originally posted by Delta1938
Although scans I only saw, not read the comics, I've seen plenty of examples of swords, spears, bullets and I think arrows ranging from cutting/piercing him to being avoided as a danger. And I most cases they weren't special, just normal blades and projectiles. I know there's examples of the other way around, him being superficially hurt to tanking with little to no damage (like a fighter jet auto cannon merely bruising him) but it seems there's enough to not dismiss as "PIS"(which I should note I feel more often than not is just used to say "I don't like it so it doesn't count"😉.

Given the stips I would agree the team has at least a decent chance of winning even in the first.

Also I thought Stilt was just trolling with that scan given how overly dramatic Hercules is over Thor getting rid of his beard. I almost stopped reading before seeing the point to the scan. 😆

That's why I posted it in both this and Ownage thread.

This one --- because it's yet another example of Thor's skin not doing well against piercing damage.

Ownage --- because of Herc's reaction to Thor shaving.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yah, I had 3 rounds, and no one could actually offer any real argument for Thor past Round 1.

I do lean towards Thor winning round 1, but I find it ridiculous how people are arguing Thor stomps or the team has no chance. Batman has enough feats of hurting or even outright KOing Top-Tier bricks to prove he has a chance. Not the norm, but they've happened, they're canon, and numerous enough you can't say "PIS THEY DON'T COUNT!!" And even ignoring those, ignoring pressure point/nerve strikes, even without this thread I've seen enough of Thor's speed that I see him having trouble hitting them. Even though I lean to Thor winning, this is no stomp and people arguing that went full retard. The others I don't see Thor doing that well.....

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
That's why I posted it in both this and Ownage thread.

This one --- because it's yet another example of Thor's skin not doing well against piercing damage.

Ownage --- because of Herc's reaction to Thor shaving.

😆

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yah, I had 3 rounds, and no one could actually offer any real argument for Thor past Round 1.

😆

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW