Originally posted by Galan007And he was apparently keeping it in orbit too. Unbelievable.
Never thought to mention this here, but Estala Maru(from THR) using his TK to hold Starlight Beacon together long enough for everyone to be safely evacuated, is pretty up there:
...The Beacon was f*cking massive. It was basically a floating Jedi Temple.
Originally posted by SheevHe wasn't a GM, but I'd honestly be willing to put a *prime* Porter Engle in at least the same tier as Yoda at this point. Porter's bio states that his lightsaber skills were "unparalleled" and admired across the entire galaxy... And tbh, some of his skill-feats in The Blade(which is set 150 years before the fall of Starlight Beacon --so ~350 years before TPM-- and features Porter in his prime) are pretty ridiculous, and unlike anything else I've seen in canon. Same with his practical application of TK, for that matter(which is equally as impressive/uber.)
I'm assuming Yoda is still the #1 lightsaber duelist in the High republic right? Only asking because I know there were a few other Grand Masters in that era besides Yoda, so wondering if any of them rivaled him as swordsmasters?
tl;dr
Porter's swordsmanship was regarded as unparalleled, in an era where Yoda would have still been like 500 years old, was already a Grand Master, was arguably at his physical peak, and moreover, was in the Jedi Order's 'golden age'(ie. before the dark side began diminishing their ability to use the Force, and before they fully became political puppets and whatnot)... Food for thought, I guess. /shrug
*That said, some of the other notable THR Jedi(like Avar, Vernestra, Keeve, Stellan, Elzar, etc.) are all amazing swordsmen in their own right, but by all accounts, peak-Porter is just... Better. Where swordplay is concerned, the dude was a master amongst masters.
I'm reading Trials of the Jedi, and it basically outright confirmed Porter>Yoda as a duelist. Porter went into semi-retirement because his entire thing was lightsaber combat, and there was simply nobody in the Order who could challenge him. This would naturally include Yoda.
Spoiler:
Her beskar blade flashed, a high outside lunge designed to take out his throat. She was fast—Viess really was good. A fine sparring partner. So few were. That was one reason Porter had chosen to retire from the daily work of the Order, before the Nihil conflict had called him back. He was the Blade. He was good at many things, but at the lightsaber, he was the best. No one could match him, and it had come to feel pointless, even depressing to unsheathe his weapons, to respond to duel requests from younger Jedi. The joy of the lightsaber was the idea that your dance partner might surprise you, might even best you. Only Barash had ever managed that, and she almost never used her lightsaber at all, and she was gone.
"He was good at many things, but at the lightsaber, he was the best. No one could match him"... Really says it all. The fact that Porter's bio also corroborates the fact that his lightsaber skills were "unparalleled" just cements his status as *the* duelist of THR (as an aside, if you haven't read The Blade yet, you definitely should... It's HEAVY on the Porter-wank.) 👆
So yeah, I'm inclined to agree that "just" being a Yoda-tier swordsman is kind of a lowball in Porter's case, all things considered... But not many people seem to have read much THR material, so I was trying to stay humble at first and work up to that. 😛
(Didn’t have* a lightsaber)
It’s true Yoda was younger, but we can’t tell for sure he was a better duelist. Sidious and Dooku reached their prime in their old age. Dooku was what? 80? And he was still growing during the clone wars.
Anyway, it’s true the High Republic is regarded as the prime of the Jedi Order and that the dark side was weaker back then, but I don’t think PT era Jedi are weaker on average. Every time this topic is addressed, the context ist about the ability of the Jedi to see the future or to feel and identify a threat. It’s not about their individual skills.
Let’s not forget someone like Kit Fisto, who isn’t exactly a powerhouse, was considered by 22BBY one of the 25 best duelist the Jedi order ever had in its whole history. So even reaching Fisto level is extremely rare. Probably many of those high republic Jedi masters who are exceptional are below him… otherwise he would end up in the top 100 rather than 25
Originally posted by Total WarriorSure, but even guys like Kenobi and Anakin have been captured by pirates and droids. The Nihil are most definitely a more credible/realistic threat to the Jedi than that. /shrug
But we don't know how powerful Yoda or the other GMs were. I remember one of them was captured by the Nihil
Originally posted by Total WarriorMace's feats from the CW micro-series aren't canon. I know Mace's victory on Dantooine has been loosely mentioned in other canon sources, but that doesn't canonize everything about the CW showing by default(certainly not Mace physically tearing through hundreds of droids like tissue paper at super-speed.) Said references have been subtle Easter eggs more than anything, iirc... Unless you're referring to something else I'm unaware of?
but this feat scales below Windu destroying hundreds of droids in Dantooine with his bare hands
That said, GM Pra-Tre Veter did use "Shon-Ju" against the Nihil:
https://ibb.co/Ps1svfY5
...Which, ironically enough, is similar to what EU/CW Mace did against the droids. Heh.
Originally posted by Total WarriorI would just point out that as of RotS, Yoda was only like 25 years away from natural death. If we use Grogu-maths as our gauge(where he is 50 years old, but still a toddler due to how his species ages), then 25 years to Yoda would only be like 1-2 years to an average person... So from a biological POV, RotS Yoda was really close to dying, is what I'm saying. But who really knows how aging works with Yoda's species? Maybe age didn't overtly hinder his physical abilities until he was literally days/months away from death? Dunno. It's just hard for me to imagine a 500-600 year old Yoda not being physically superior to a 800-900 year old (nearing-death) Yoda. /shrug
It's true Yoda was younger, but we can't tell for sure he was a better duelist. Sidious and Dooku reached their prime in their old age. Dooku was what? 80? And he was still growing during the clone wars.Anyway, it's true the High Republic is regarded as the prime of the Jedi Order and that the dark side was weaker back then, but I don't think PT era Jedi are weaker on average. Every time this topic is addressed, the context ist about the ability of the Jedi to see the future or to feel and identify a threat. It's not about their individual skills.
But you're correct in that we don't know exactly how much Yoda's power/skill increased in that time(if at all.) What we do know is that Yoda was still one of THE most powerful/skilled/respected Jedi ever, was still a Grand Master, and was [logically] at least closer to his physical prime... Yet Porter's lightsaber skills were so unparalleled that no one else in the Jedi Order could rival him(to the point where Porter literally could not find a legitimate challenge, so he got depressed and went into pseudo-retirement.) IOW, the heavy/overt implication is that even the likes of THR Yoda would've had to improve his saber skills significantly, just to reach peak-Porter's level. That is ridiculously impressive by any metric.
*And yeah, I'm not saying that PT-era Jedi were necessarily weaker across the board, but the dark side was canonically diminishing their ability to use [certain aspects of] the Force -- but nothing of the sort would have been hindering Yoda and the others during THR. That was the Order's overall peak.
Originally posted by Total WarriorUgh. This is the problem with most fictional lists... Especially lists created before certain characters had even been introduced/invented. ermm
Let's not forget someone like Kit Fisto, who isn't exactly a powerhouse, was considered by 22BBY one of the 25 best duelist the Jedi order ever had in its whole history. So even reaching Fisto level is extremely rare. Probably many of those high republic Jedi masters who are exceptional are below him... otherwise he would end up in the top 100 rather than 25
Originally posted by Galan007Mace's feats from the CW micro-series aren't canon. I know Mace's victory on Dantooine has been loosely mentioned in other canon sources, but that doesn't canonize everything about the CW showing by default(certainly not Mace physically tearing through hundreds of droids like tissue paper at super-speed.) Said references have been subtle Easter eggs more than anything, iirc... Unless you're referring to something else I'm unaware of?
Wouldn't he just power scale anyway being the 2nd most powerful Jedi.
Is his no.2 rank still canon?
In fact, are Lucas's statements still canon? His movie commentary is still official movie commentary.
I think he did insist when he sold Lucasfilm that TCW stays canon, and no messing with his 6 movies so it will be in the sale contract.
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Wouldn't he just power scale anyway being the 2nd most powerful Jedi.Is his no.2 rank still canon?
In fact, are Lucas's statements still canon? His movie commentary is still official movie commentary.
I think he did insist when he sold Lucasfilm that TCW stays canon, and no messing with his 6 movies so it will be in the sale contract.
Creator quotes are no longer canon, not even ones from George Lucas. New official canon stance is that if it isn't part of an officially published work, it's still up in the air. We've had plenty of things in canon that contradict Lucas statements, like Vader>Anakin definitively in canon. Even the wider variety of lightsaber colors we have in canon go against George's intentions (when working on TCW, he said Jedi only have Blue or Green. Ahsoka's second saber and the temple guard sabers were "a very yellow looking green" according to Filoni to get around this, iirc).
Originally posted by Darth ThorIirc, a fairly recent [canon] source confirmed that Palpatine did intentionally throw his fight with Mace -- so the whole "Mace > Palpatine" argument(which was always Mace's primary claim to fame) is out the window now. That said, I'd probably have Mace in the #3 PT-era Jedi slot, tbh(under Yoda and RotS Anakin.) /shrug
Wouldn't he just power scale anyway being the 2nd most powerful Jedi.Is his no.2 rank still canon?
Originally posted by Underachiever59👆
Creator quotes are no longer canon, not even ones from George Lucas. New official canon stance is that if it isn't part of an officially published work, it's still up in the air. We've had plenty of things in canon that contradict Lucas statements, like Vader>Anakin definitively in canon. Even the wider variety of lightsaber colors we have in canon go against George's intentions (when working on TCW, he said Jedi only have Blue or Green. Ahsoka's second saber and the temple guard sabers were "a very yellow looking green" according to Filoni to get around this, iirc).
*A bit more Porter-wank, fwiw(from The Blade TPB):
https://ibb.co/5ghXKWWv
"Porter Engle is perhaps the most skilled lightsaber wielder in the High Republic [...] No warrior can stand against him. No one even comes close."
Originally posted by Galan007
*A bit more Porter-wank, fwiw(from The Blade TPB):
https://ibb.co/5ghXKWWv
"Porter Engle is perhaps the most skilled lightsaber wielder in the High Republic [...] No warrior can stand against him. No one even comes close."
Originally posted by Total WarriorIt's more likely that Dooku was just being an arrogant asshat(as Sith tend to be) in thinking he could best Yoda during AotC, imo. Kind of like Maul thinking that he and Savage, or he and Ahsoka, could overthrow/defeat Palpatine... Or RotS Anakin thinking he could solo Palpatine, or thinking that he could just jump over high-ground Kenobi, ftw. Etc.
which kinda reconciles with Dooku thinking he can beat Yoda in AOtC (when he was nowhere close to him. However he was probably thinking of how powerful Yoda was when he left the Order) and Yoda being beaten by Atha Prime pre-32BBY
As Luke said: "Your overconfidence is your weakness." 👆
Originally posted by Total WarriorJust the typical "legendary" type of quotes, and pretty much everyone creaming in their pants when he enters a battle. UA might know of some other more direct quotes, though.
Anyway, do we have any hype about Yoda at this pint in time?
Iirc, there was a SW.com article some years ago that stated THR Yoda was "at the height of his youth and power" or somesuch... If you put any stock in that. /shrug