Originally posted by carver9
Also, Pr, even though you will ignore this because it's coming from me, this is what started the WWH debate.
Originally posted by -Pr-
There's nothing wrong with using other fights as a point of comparison. You've just gone way, way ****ing past that.And strayed in to ABC logic a fair bit too.
👆
Originally posted by carver9
Lol... why are you still going? The discussion is done. Beast backed by a team couldn't even avoid Hulk punches. I was obviously joking there. Move on because I am. We can BZ this? Is Beast faster than WWH or can he dance around WWH in a fight. Let me know.
Because the discussion is not done.
My point was to show that my stance has always been that Beast and WWH are in the same ballpark in terms of speed.
I mean, I even said it in THIS thread:
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
@Stilt:Indeed.My point is that WWH and Beast and X-23 and Logan were all in the same ballpark in terms of speed.
Unless we want to argue that all of them were hypersonic, lmao.
@Csrver: he was trying to catch Beast. And failed.
And before:
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I mean, what is your excuse? That Hulk 'allowed' it to happen? That the writers 'allowed' it to happen? Fact remains, Beast, whilst carrying someone, was too fast for WWH. You can show WWH tagging him, [b]that's A-OK.All that shows is WWH and Beast are in the same ballpark. [/B]
So....yeah, I am and always have been consistent. WWH/Logan/Beast are all in the same ballpark in terms of speed.
This is an amped Hulk, btw. In a well written storyline, where all characters are being written well, so it is valid for this thread (where Logan is written at his peak).
Logan, who as per your own scans is unable to tag speedsters, and has to rely on prediction.
THUS, in summary:
In a well-written story (😂 ), WWH, Beast and Logan are all ~the same level of speed.
WWH is fast enough to be able to grab Logan, and punch him until he got brain damage. Same WWH who wasn't able to grab Beast. Same Logan who is unable to tag Speed Demon, and has to rely on prediction to hit him.
Meanwhile, Kalibak is fast enough to tag actual bonafide speedsters (MAx Mercury), whilst laughing at them.
Kalibak grabs Logan (remember, he is massive lol) and smashes him in. Maybe even uses his Beta Club, lol.
Finally, we are back on topic. Wolverine tagged Gladiator who have light speed showings. Even jumped on his back while he was flying. Read the Impulse book (thanks for the issue number) and the speedster was still too fast for him, even while injured. Kalibak lost the fight due to speed. He got speed blitzed. So we have Kalibak hitting an injured speedster vs Wolverine stabbing a non-injured speedster. ABC logic to its finest. Wolverine shanks him to death.
Originally posted by carver9
Finally, we are back on topic. Wolverine tagged Gladiator who have light speed showings. Even jumped on his back while he was flying. Read the Impulse book (thanks for the issue number) and the speedster was still too fast for him, even while injured. Kalibak lost the fight due to speed. He got speed blitzed. So we have Kalibak hitting an injured speedster vs Wolverine stabbing a non-injured speedster. ABC logic to its finest. Wolverine shanks him to death.
Except, we also have WWH catching him, punching him and giving him brain damage.
Same WWH who was unable to catch Beast, who was carrying a guy on his back.
So it doesn't take much to grab Logan and beat his brains out.
Assuming it was a well written comic, of course 😂
Originally posted by carver9
I agree with you that Wolverine might be too fast for Kalibak and WWH is too fast for Kalibak as well based off fts. What about the other people? Do you feel Mongul could win?
I never said that, so I don't know what you are agreeing with.
I feel confident that Kalibak would annihilate Wolverine based on his WWH showings, and as per your opinion that is all that is needed.
So stops hard at 3. Don't know about Metallo, though, as I haven't seen any feats for him. Could stop at 2, depending on what you think is the version that doesn't make this a spite match 🙂
Yes, Kalibak will do good in the beginning but like you said based off his WWH showing, Wolverine should be able to endure punches from Kalibak ending with him getting the kill in the end. Yep, WWH punches>>>Kalibak punches based off fts. Wolverine having the speed advantage, being able to withstand Kalibak punches, healing factor, Adamantium claws and bones, he wins a healthy majority against Kalibak. What about the others?
Originally posted by carver9
Yes, Kalibak will do good in the beginning but like you said based off his WWH showing, Wolverine should be able to endure punches from Kalibak ending with him getting the kill in the end. Yep, WWH punches>>>Kalibak punches based off fts. Wolverine having the speed advantage, being able to withstand Kalibak punches, healing factor, Adamantium claws and bones, he wins a healthy majority against Kalibak. What about the others?
Kalibak's hand is like, larger than Wolverine's entire body, lmao. If you accept he can be hit, then you accept he can be grabbed.
Except Kalibak's hand is larger than Hulk's, lol. So Logan can't do anything when his entire body is held by a single hand. You aren't thinking this through, lol. Again, against 6ft 2 Batman:
Stops hard at 3. Kalibak just holds him. If you want, he can simply hold Logan and keep blasting him with the Beta Club 😂 Logan is like a whole foot shorter than Bats.
You didn't answer my question about Metallo. Rebirth Metallo has zero feats. So which version are you using?
Well carver might like this then.
Against the 6 ft 4 Grail, lol. She's quite fast, isn't she? But note how large his hands are compared to her, and she would dwarf poor Logan:
I remember Carver was quite impressed with Grail - this scene is also from her first few appearances, iirc, when she was still quite impressive.
Now imagine instead of throwing her, he just.....held her, lol. But then, I seem to recall she was stronger than WW (and hence, Logan). So not quite applicable.
I said Wolverine might be to fast for Kalibak AND that he can endure hits from him. I never said he would get hit. Also, Kalibak got not only speed blitzed by a dog but he got hurt as well...
Wolverine claws>>>>>>>>>>dog bite. Wolverine speed>>>>>>>>>>>>Dog speed.
Latest version of Metallo.
Originally posted by carver9
I said Wolverine might be to fast for Kalibak AND that he can endure hits from him. I never said he would get hit. Also, Kalibak got not only speed blitzed by a dog but he got hurt as well...Wolverine claws>>>>>>>>>>dog bite. Wolverine speed>>>>>>>>>>>>Dog speed.
So wait....you said Kalibak would do well. Now you are saying Kalibak wouldn't even get a hit in?
Dear me. You have to make your mind up, Carvy. And are you saying ONLY Wolverine gets his high end feats, but everyone else is using their low end feats? Tsk tsk.
Edit: what feats does this Metallo have? Educate me, please.
Originally posted by carver9
Yes, he endures Wolverine claws as long as he can and dies in the end. Proof that Wolverine can cut him is above.
Ahh, so you are using the low showings for everyone else.
So not full capacity. Got ya.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Wolverine could be at his worst and he'd still clear.
You are so predictable 😂I genuinely tried to debate, but once more you disappoint me.
I don't think Kalibak can endure much, tbh.
Unless we want to discuss Pre-Crisis Kalibak:
https://i.imgur.com/TRb8pZZ.jpg
Never getting tired of seeing Supes put in his place.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I don't think Kalibak can endure much, tbh.Unless we want to discuss Pre-Crisis Kalibak:
https://i.imgur.com/TRb8pZZ.jpg
Never getting tired of seeing Supes put in his place.
He's not withstanding Wolverine claws, period and based off of Wolverine showings against elite bricks, he should be able to take Kalibak out imo.
Based on Logan being grabbed by WWH, who in turn was unable to avoid slashes from X-23, and was unable to catch Beast whilst he was carrying Elixir.
In turn, Kalibak has grabbed Grail (who is faster? than WW), and has straight up laughed at Max Mercury whilst tagging him.
Now, the first paragraph I typed out may just be bad PIS writing,where the writer didn't know how to write a good fight scene with an amped Hulk. But you are convinced it's good writing, so it's actually usable for this thread. I'm not low balling Hulk, or Logan - the events happened just as I described.
So all one needs is ~ Beast /mid meta level speed to grab Logan, which I am confident Kalibak at least has. I'm not saying Kalibak is the fricking Flash lol, just that he is able to duplicate WWH level speed AS DISPLAYED when Hulk faced the X-Men.
