Abortion

Originally posted by autumn dreams
I have a question for all of you: What do you think about women who brag about having had an abortion?

People who do have an abortion do it out of necessity. It might ruin their social life, give them bucketfuls of emotional stress, plus the fact that they likely can't support their baby if it is born.

Having an abortion takes away life. It may seem cruel but it's still an act of desperation by many; most don't see it like that until after it's been carried out. But to brag about it after? That's stupid on multiple levels.

Originally posted by botankus
My dad brags about how they stick a big rod up his a$$ that goes almost to his neck to check his colon, so it depends on the person and what strikes their fancy.

Is he single?

Originally posted by DarkC
In my opinion? They're disgusting and should be refused any abortions in the future.

People who do have an abortion do it out of necessity. It might ruin their social life, give them bucketfuls of emotional stress, plus the fact that they likely can't support their baby if it is born.

Having an abortion takes away life. It may seem cruel but it's still an act of desperation by many; most don't see it like that until after it's been carried out. But to brag about it after? That's stupid on multiple levels.

That doesn't mean they should be refused abortions.

People continually raise people problems, not abortion problems. It's like blaming drugs instead of people who misuse them, or a knife because it was sharp enough to stab someone with.

-AC

Originally posted by LighterFluid
If I may go off on a small tangent - what about hunting to prevent overpopulation? Is that immoral?

No one does that though.

And why should we bother? NATURE already cuts down on overpopulation through the food cycle and through climate changes. Weather and carnivores prevent herbivores from massively populating.

We as human beings feel we have the right to just $@# around with nature all we want. Yes, this is our world to, and we have the right to adapt and change certain things, but change EVERYTHING? We are no Gods, we are not mature enough to **** around with the ecosystem like we always fkn do !

So yes, its immoral and its bullshit. People hunt animals for food, or for thier own hunting pleasure. Who the hell has done it to decrease animal population?

Originally posted by .😖pace Opera:.
i agree with urizen,

its not a matter of judgement, or murder.

when i hear that a woman got pregnant and had an abortion, i say to myself: "damn, thats to bad." trying to empathy for the woman AND the feotus.

when i hear that a woman got pregnant and decided to have the baby and give it up for adoption, then i would probly say to myself: "WOW, that girl is brave and is such a hero for sacrificing her needs to give that baby a future."

now not to impune on the mother who had the abortion, but recognizing that the woman who went through with the pregnancy did an amazing thing

Nice to know we're on the same side, considering we were once against each other lol 😉

Originally posted by Gay Guy
Is he single?

I know it sounds tempting, but I think I'll have to pass on you being step-dad #2.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Who the hell has done it to decrease animal population?

Uncle Jimbo, but he calls it "Thinning out the numbers".

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
That doesn't mean they should be refused abortions.

People continually raise people problems, not abortion problems. It's like blaming drugs instead of people who misuse them, or a knife because it was sharp enough to stab someone with.

-AC

If they're foolish enough after that to need another abortion after getting the first one and bragging about it like an idiot, then I don't see why they deserve the second. Honestly though, I don't think there's a woman in this world that will sink to that level.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Who the hell has done it to decrease animal population?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
That doesn't mean they should be refused abortions.

People continually raise people problems, not abortion problems. It's like blaming drugs instead of people who misuse them, or a knife because it was sharp enough to stab someone with.

-AC

So....

1) We should also allow illegal Drugs to be available to everyone?

2) We shouldn't have a problem with people carrying and using knives as a weapon?

🤨???

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
So....

1) We should also allow illegal Drugs to be available to everyone?

2) We shouldn't have a problem with people carrying and using knives as a weapon?

🤨???

I can answer my own questions, Mills. Thanks.

Originally posted by DarkC
They should know better considering that they chose to have an abortion in the first place than to brag lightly about something a serious matter like that.

Yeah, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be allowed one. Ridiculous logic.

Originally posted by DarkC
If they're foolish enough after that to need another abortion after getting the first one and bragging about it like an idiot, then I don't see why they deserve the second. Honestly though, I don't think there's a woman in this world that will sink to that level.

You don't see why they deserve it, I don't either, but that doesn't mean they should have the right taken away. It's not about what we feel they deserve, it's about what they want to do.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
1) We should also allow illegal Drugs to be available to everyone?

Precisely. Nobody else's business what anyone takes or uses, and it's much easier to keep a track of who bought what, where, and when. It's taxable etc. That's for a different thread, though.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
2) We shouldn't have a problem with people carrying and using knives as a weapon?

I quote clearly said that if someone is stabbed, you don't blame the knife do you? Why blame abortions for an idiot frivolously using them then?

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yeah, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be allowed one. Ridiculous logic.

You don't see why they deserve it, I don't either, but that doesn't mean they should have the right taken away. It's not about what we feel they deserve, it's about what they want to do.

Seeing how most First-World countries are figuratively "free countries", I can't really see the right to abortion being taken away completely. But I do think that the government should try some form of persuasion to make the woman change her mind, but that she still keeps her free will. Money grant, maybe. The circumstances behind the reason for abortion matter as well.

Originally posted by DarkC
If it's opinion based on what we feel, 99.9% of the time it's not meant to be seen as logic at all, anyways.

You don't like them bragging, that doesn't mean they should be stripped of a right. That is a selfish idea.

Originally posted by DarkC
Seeing how most First-World countries are figuratively "free countries", I can't really see the right to abortion being taken away completely. But I do think that the government should try some form of persuasion to make the woman change her mind, but that she still keeps her free will. Money grant, maybe. The circumstances behind the reason for abortion matter as well.

You're wrong, the government has no right to try to persuade a woman to change her mind. It's nothing to do with them and they will have no part in raising this child, they should f*ck off and keep their noses out of it.

The circumstances matter none, it's her choice and what she wants should be what matters. The only opposing argument is "I don't wanna pay for something I disagree with.", really. Which is fine, but it's nobody's business besides the woman. No government has any right to intervene.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You don't like them bragging, that doesn't mean they should be stripped of a right. That is a selfish idea.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You're wrong, the government has no right to try to persuade a woman to change her mind. It's nothing to do with them and they will have no part in raising this child, they should f*ck off and keep their noses out of it.

If governments do try to persuade her, It's not exactly as if they wanted her to be worse off. They do what they believe is best for the individual and for the community, and even if they are misguided in those, I don't think that's an unreasonable motive. Put simply, it's just:

"Hey, if you keep the baby we'll give you money so you can support it."
And she either says: "Oh, sure!" or "Um, no."
Gvn't: "Okay."

It's not like all governments are evil. Some are though, make no mistake.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
The circumstances matter none, it's her choice and what she wants should be what matters. The only opposing argument is "I don't wanna pay for something I disagree with.", really. Which is fine, but it's nobody's business besides the woman. No government has any right to intervene.

-AC

I think the fact that AC and DarkC are from different countries affects your guys' view on "The Government" and rights.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You're wrong, the government has no right to try to persuade a woman to change her mind.

That depends on the govt. in question. In countries like Saudi Arabia, it is the govt's right.

I agree more with DarkC. As long as the government does not force a decision, helping a woman...giving her the other options besides abortion or keeping the baby herself (or infanticide) is a perfectly legit option.

Originally posted by DarkC
It's not just the bragging, as I said before, it's the circumstances present at the time as well.

Yeah, I know, but they're absolutely nothing to do with you. You have no right to decide what a woman can and cannot have, regardless of how much you dislike it.

Originally posted by DarkC
Offering grant money to keep an abortion is not nearly as intervening as much as forcing her to keep the baby if she keeps her free will. After all, it's her decision that matters, isn't it? Who would outsiders be to question that? If she does change her opinion because of an offer then that's just her.

They have no right to offer, because people don't take into consideration that a woman has chosen abortion because she wants it above all other options. Ignorant idiots assume she does it because she is a clueless little girl with no knowledge of what else there is, instead of accepting she might just want one.

Originally posted by DarkC
If governments do try to persuade her, It's not exactly as if they wanted her to be worse off. They do what they believe is best for the individual and for the community, and even if they are misguided in those, I don't think that's an unreasonable motive. Put simply, it's just:

"Hey, if you keep the baby we'll give you money so you can support it."
And she either says: "Oh, sure!" or "Um, no."
Gvn't: "Okay."

Hahaha, I've not seen anything so naive since Makedde.

Governments don't give a shit, but if they want women to have babies, then I suggest all these women drop their kids off on the steps of the supreme courts and see how quick the government become pro-abortion then. They have no right to interfere.

Originally posted by DarkC
It's not like all governments are evil. Some are though, make no mistake.

All governments are essentially self-serving or if they serve others it's because they will get a better something out of it. You've got a lot of learning to do.

Originally posted by DarkC
I'm sorry if that wasn't clear before, but what I meant was from her point of view; so to say, the circumstances would have an effect on her ability to make a decision. Not the government.

Fine.

-AC

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
No one does that though.

And why should we bother? NATURE already cuts down on overpopulation through the food cycle and through climate changes. Weather and carnivores prevent herbivores from massively populating.

We as human beings feel we have the right to just $@# around with nature all we want. Yes, this is our world to, and we have the right to adapt and change certain things, but change EVERYTHING? We are no Gods, we are not mature enough to **** around with the ecosystem like we always fkn do !

So yes, its immoral and its bullshit. People hunt animals for food, or for thier own hunting pleasure. Who the hell has done it to decrease animal population?

Nature does deal with overpopulation in its own way; however, nature's way of dealing with overpopulation is often more cruel than the human way. When overpopulation occurs, the overpopulated species' food source will often be severely depleted and as a result many of that species starve to death and the species has to live at a lower carrying capacity.

Taking no action can be just as bad, if not worse, than taking action sometimes. Why is it immoral to prevent death? I must admit that I was surprised by your response, as so much of your previous post seemed to be about how death is bad and killing is immoral. By taking no action during overpopulation, you are permitting even more death. You cannot escape from playing god - that is the gift and curse of sapience.

Originally posted by LighterFluid
I beg to differ. I know several people who cite overpopulation as a reason for their hunting. Even if nobody hunts with overpopulation in mind, that hardly changes the validity of my question. Everyone else seems to be making up hypothetical situations in this topic; I don't see why I'm not allowed to.

Nature does deal with overpopulation in its own way; however, nature's way of dealing with overpopulation is often more cruel than the human way. When overpopulation occurs, the overpopulated species' food source will often be severely depleted and as a result many of that species starve to death and the species has to live at a lower carrying capacity.

Taking no action can be just as bad, if not worse, than taking action sometimes. Why is it immoral to prevent death? I must admit that I was surprised by your response, as so much of your previous post seemed to be about how death is bad and killing is immoral. By taking no action during overpopulation, you are permitting even more death. You cannot escape from playing god - that is the gift and curse of sapience.

Human beings already have a means to control the population..it's called homosexuality.