Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Precisely. Nobody else's business what anyone takes or uses, and it's much easier to keep a track of who bought what, where, and when. It's taxable etc. That's for a different thread, though.
Sorry but I disagree for these reasons:
An Individual taking drugs like Cocaine, Crack, etc. doesn't just harm oneself. That person also harms his or her own family, his or her own children, his or her own lover. Mental and Physical detioration doesn't just harm the individual...it harms everyone he or she loves, and everyone that loves him or her.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I quote clearly said that if someone is stabbed, you don't blame the knife do you? Why blame abortions for an idiot frivolously using them then?-AC
1)Note that I never referred to a woman that has an Abortion as an "idiot". You just did. 😉
2) The knife is not an action. An Abortion is. If you are going to compare an action to another action, then you must compare Abortion to stabbing, not abortion to a knife.
If you are going to compare a noun to another non, then you must compare the knife to whatever tools the doctor uses to carry out the Abortion.
Do i think the tools themselves are immoral? No....only the people using them 😉
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
That doesn't mean they should be refused abortions.
I agree. A womans right to abort should not be taken from them, even if they are the most selfish human beings on this planet.
But we could do more by finding out why they act the way the do-why do some women brag, and others don't? Counselling might also be in order, perhaps to make the woman realise the seriousness of her situation. This would be strictly voluntary, of course.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
People continually raise people problems, not abortion problems. It's like blaming drugs instead of people who misuse them, or a knife because it was sharp enough to stab someone with.
I don't think anyone would blame a knife that was too sharp, but when it comes to drugs, for some reason, the person using escapes blame for his or her wrongdoings while under the influence.
Constantly, our courts hand down inadquedate sentences because the offender was on drugs at the time he comitted the offence. We basically say 'Hey, it's alright if you killed someone, wasn't your fault, it was the drugs!'.
We forget about the person who chose to take drugs in the first place.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
An Individual taking drugs like Cocaine, Crack, etc. doesn't just harm oneself. That person also harms his or her own family, his or her own children, his or her own lover. Mental and Physical detioration doesn't just harm the individual...it harms everyone he or she loves, and everyone that loves him or her.
One crucial thing missing: It's still up to that person what they take into their body. nobody else's. It's not up to you to decide if they should do something or not. If they hurt their family then that's what happens, it's still entirely up to them what they do. Just like abortion, nothing to do with anyone, at all.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
1)Note that I never referred to a woman that has an Abortion as an "idiot". You just did. 😉
Oh! You got me! You go...no, you didn't.
I've said that I think people who use abortion for birth control are idiots, but that's none of my business. Matters none to me.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
2) The knife is not an action. An Abortion is. If you are going to compare an action to another action, then you must compare Abortion to stabbing, not abortion to a knife.
You get the point. Don't blame the act, blame the person taking it. Either way, it's none of your business, why are we still discussing that point Urizen? Why? Make me understand why I still have to explain to you that it's nobody's business but the woman's.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
If you are going to compare a noun to another non, then you must compare the knife to whatever tools the doctor uses to carry out the Abortion.Do i think the tools themselves are immoral? No....only the people using them 😉
The last horse finally crosses the finish line.
-AC
Originally posted by DarkC
In my opinion? They're disgusting and should be refused any abortions in the future.People who do have an abortion do it out of necessity. It might ruin their social life, give them bucketfuls of emotional stress, plus the fact that they likely can't support their baby if it is born.
Having an abortion takes away life. It may seem cruel but it's still an act of desperation by many; most don't see it like that until after it's been carried out. But to brag about it after? That's stupid on multiple levels.
If she is such a "disgusting" and "stupid" human being, why would you refuse her an abortion? Is that the kind of person you want procreating?
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yeah, I know, but they're absolutely nothing to do with you. You have no right to decide what a woman can and cannot have, regardless of how much you dislike it.
Originally by Alpha Centauri
They have no right to offer, because people don't take into consideration that a woman has chosen abortion because she wants it above all other options. Ignorant idiots assume she does it because she is a clueless little girl with no knowledge of what else there is, instead of accepting she might just want one.
Consider a woman who wants an second abortion, she chose it because there are no other options. The concept of governments giving out grant money like that is that they're offering a different option. I can't really see presenting alternatives as blatant interference; it doesn't violate her own individual rights. Or at least, not seriously.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Governments don't give a shit, but if they want women to have babies, then I suggest all these women drop their kids off on the steps of the supreme courts and see how quick the government become pro-abortion then. They have no right to interfere.
Anyways, I really don't think governments are brainless as to want women to have babies and simply let them drop their children off at the steps like that. They do need to devise some sort of method as to stop that from happening. It's inhumane and illegal to dump your own child like that. And if the government wants women to have more babies, simply cutting out abortion rights ain't exactly going to solve the problem. I would expect them to offer the individual something in return so that they're given less motives to dump their own child.
And some governments have different motives than others on population control, which is why they would intervene like that in the first place.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
All governments are essentially self-serving or if they serve others it's because they will get a better something out of it. You've got a lot of learning to do.
Originally posted by DarkC
It's hardly as if I'm supposed to decide her fate if this were reality, would it? Judges make the decision, and they, unlike me, are unbiased. I was simply stating my opinion. Don't get me wrong, I'm pro-abortion but definitely not so much if someone chooses to abuse that right.
Wow, you have got a lot to learn. Judges make the call mostly based on the jury verdict, and the jury can be anything but unbiased.
Originally posted by DarkC
They have the right to offer, but not to make her own decision for her.
It depends what you mean by offer. Offer or stick your nose in repeatedly?
Originally posted by DarkC
Consider a woman who wants an second abortion, she chose it because there are no other options. The concept of governments giving out grant money like that is that they're offering a different option. I can't really see presenting alternatives as blatant interference; it doesn't violate her own individual rights. Or at least, not seriously.
No, you don't get it. Not all women choose abortion because they're unaware of other choices. Chances are, they are aware, and they choose abortion. So therefore, sticking your nose in and saying "LOOK! YOU CAN DO THIS!" is not wanted nor needed.
Originally posted by DarkC
They do give a shit if it affects them. Probably their own egos and reputations to maintain, so let's just leave it at that.
Basically what I just said, so yes.
Originally posted by DarkC
Anyways, I really don't think governments are brainless as to want women to have babies and simply let them drop their children off at the steps like that. They do need to devise some sort of method as to stop that from happening.
There are many. Abortion, adoption etc. They allow one but not the other, because it's not in their best interests. It's simple, abortions are nothing to do with anyone else but the woman who wants it. As soon as the governments and people accept this, we can get on with more important issues.
Originally posted by DarkC
It's inhumane and illegal to dump your own child like that. And if the government wants women to have more babies, simply cutting out abortion rights ain't exactly going to solve the problem. I would expect them to offer the individual something in return so that they're given less motives to dump their own child.
It's not a matter of that, some women don't want to deal with the idea of their child coming to find them in the future, some just want abortions. In many cases it's not about "I'm doing this because I'm not being paid not to.", it's because they want an abortion and that's that.
Originally posted by DarkC
And some governments have different motives than others on population control, which is why they would intervene like that in the first place.
You're operating under the assumption that governments care about what people think enough to cater to them primarily.
Originally posted by DarkC
Dictatorships are like that, but what about democracy? (By democracy, I mean not as propaganda-saturated as others. I live in Canada.) To get into a decision-making position you have to make promises that you'll keep, or you won't stay in power. But it doesn't necessarily mean that they'll always make the bad one.
This whole issue is over-complicated by the fact that everyone thinks that the poor, helpless woman needs their help.
Government: Want money for the baby?
Woman: No, I'm having an abortion.
That should be it, if at all.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Wow, you have got a lot to learn. Judges make the call mostly based on the jury verdict, and the jury can be anything but unbiased.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
It depends what you mean by offer. Offer or stick your nose in repeatedly?
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
No, you don't get it. Not all women choose abortion because they're unaware of other choices. Chances are, they are aware, and they choose abortion. So therefore, sticking your nose in and saying "LOOK! YOU CAN DO THIS!" is not wanted nor needed.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You're operating under the assumption that governments care about what people think enough to cater to them primarily.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
This whole issue is over-complicated by the fact that everyone thinks that the poor, helpless woman needs their help.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[b]Government: Want money for the baby?
Woman: No, I'm having an abortion.That should be it, if at all.
-AC [/B]
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
One crucial thing missing: It's still up to that person what they take into their body. nobody else's. It's not up to you to decide if they should do something or not. If they hurt their family then that's what happens, it's still entirely up to them what they do. Just like abortion, nothing to do with anyone, at all.
1) Abortion and Drug Taking are very different my freind, They're not the same thing.
2) An Abortion only harms the foetus, possibly the father, and perhaps the mother if she suffers post-abortion depression.
3) Illegal Drug Taking doesn't just harm the individual. It harms the person's family members as well. It harms everyone who loves that individual seeing that person destroying him or herself, while at the same time having his/her mind so messed up that this person's logic and personality changes. This person becomes more dangerous, due to the fact that thier mind is getting scrambled.
Not to mention if this person who takes those kinds of drugs becomes sexually active with another person, etc.
An Individual person who takes these kinds of drugs puts other people's happiness AND safety in danger. You have not proved otherwise.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Oh! You got me! You go...no, you didn't.I've said that I think people who use abortion for birth control are idiots, but that's none of my business. Matters none to me.
HENCE you called the woman who frequently gets an abortion an idiot. What exactly are you denying ?
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You get the point. Don't blame the act, blame the person taking it. Either way, it's none of your business, why are we still discussing that point Urizen? Why? Make me understand why I still have to explain to you that it's nobody's business but the woman's.
1) So attack the woman who has the abortion, but don't attack the concept of Abortion itself?🤨 Okay, if you wanna judge the person instead of the actual ACT, then you do that.
I'm not cool with judging a woman who has the abortion, I'm only stating my opinion that Abortion is immoral.....that's all. I'm not here to throw insults or call names.
2) It's none of any of our business...true. But this is an Abortion Debate Thread. Therefore we can say whatever the hell we want on the subject. 😉
3) You do not have to explain shit to me....is this your attempt to fake a valid point?
I already stated that I am Pro-Choice for many reasons....I even stated to Omega that i could care less what a woman i dont know does with her foetus....I am merely stating why i thnk the action of Abortion is immoral.
I am not violating any particular woman's privacy, business, or anything of that sort. I NEVER judged Omega for her decision to have an abortion, nor Will I ever. 😉
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
The last horse finally crosses the finish line.-AC
Forgive me for beleiving that you were comparing an Abortion to stabbing someone. 🙄 Watch the way you word things next time.
But yes. I have nothing against the TOOLS used in Abortion..they are inanimate objects.
I have nothing personal against the people who are involved in Abortions...i don't know what every individual situation is.
But I do feel Abortion itself is an immoral act.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
1) Abortion and Drug Taking are very different my freind, They're not the same thing.2) An [b]Abortion
only harms the foetus, possibly the father, and perhaps the mother if she suffers post-abortion depression.3) Illegal Drug Taking doesn't just harm the individual. It harms the person's family members as well. It harms everyone who loves that individual seeing that person destroying him or herself, while at the same time having his/her mind so messed up that this person's logic and personality changes. This person becomes more dangerous, due to the fact that thier mind is getting scrambled.
Not to mention if this person who takes those kinds of drugs becomes sexually active with another person, etc.
An Individual person who takes these kinds of drugs puts other people's happiness AND safety in danger. You have not proved otherwise.[/b]
1) Really? I wasn't aware.
2) Go on. I'm waiting for the breaking news.
3) That's bullshit, plain and simple. There are people who have bad experiences on drugs and there are people who have great experiences on them. That's just a fact. I know plenty of recreational drug users and they lead very comfortable lives. You have obviously been brainwashed into thinking that drugs are bad and if you so much as touch them, your life is gone. Sad, truly sad. The media show one side of the drugs coin, there are two, that's a fact.
None of this disproves what I'm saying does it? Regardless of all that, it's entirely up to the person what they do with their body. Be it abortions or drug taking. The government has no right to tell someone what to do with a foetus anymore than they have the right to say "HEY! You can't smoke that!" "Why?" "Your family will be upset." "Let me worry about me, my life and my family, ok? Cool with you?" Yeah, drop that, or, alternatively, open a thread. Because this is all reasonably off topic.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
HENCE you called the woman who frequently gets an abortion an idiot. What exactly are you denying ?
Nothing, what are you trying to prove? Her being an idiot for using it as birth control doesn't mean she doesn't have the right to abortions.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
1) So attack the woman who has the abortion, but don't attack the concept of Abortion itself?🤨 Okay, if you wanna judge the person instead of the actual ACT, then you do that.
You're mildly simple. Read carefully: I believe that if a woman is being frivolous with abortion, she's an inconsiderate fool. That said, it's none of my business and regardless of how I feel, I have no business interfering, nobody does. Why am I still telling you this?
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I'm not cool with judging a woman who has the abortion, I'm only stating my opinion that Abortion is immoral.....that's all. I'm not here to throw insults or call names.
I'm not judging her, she can do what she wants, but I have the right to an opinion.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
2) It's none of any of our business...true. But this is an Abortion Debate Thread. Therefore we can say whatever the hell we want on the subject. 😉
Ooooh, you're a clever one.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
3) You do not have to explain shit to me....is this your attempt to fake a valid point?
I'm just curious as to how you miss the most obvious of points, is all.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Forgive me for beleiving that you were comparing an Abortion to stabbing someone. 🙄 Watch the way you word things next time.
Nah, I worded it fine. Watch the way you read.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
But yes. I have nothing against the TOOLS used in Abortion..they are inanimate objects.
You don't get my point, you're taking it too literally, so I'll dumb it down for you.
Abortion isn't to blame for people misusing it. You don't get rid of abortion just because people might misuse it.
-AC
Originally posted by DarkC
A little offhand, but that's only one type of trial. That's a trial by jury you described, while there are possibilities open such as trial by judge and trial by both judge and jury. At least in Canada.
There you go then. I don't live there, not sure if you noticed that.
Originally posted by DarkC
By 'offer', I mean call them once and if they say no, then leave them alone. Otherwise it's interfering, not offering.
It's not that simple in the real world, Mills. There's too much ego and reputation at stake to just be selfless.
Originally posted by DarkC
How can a woman consider all her choices when she hasn't been presented with them? And I really wouldn't expect the government to be so forthcoming like that; it would make them monumentally bigheaded and annoying. They call her and give her an alternative. She either takes it or leaves it. End of story.
Oh don't talk a load of old rubbish, don't be so damn patronising. Maybe she doesn't need to be presented with them by some government official, maybe she's gone to the doctor's practice and found out, maybe she doesn't care about other options and just wants an abortion.
Stop assuming that these women are entirely unaware.
Originally posted by DarkC
Governments don't really give a shit about individual matters, hence the use of the term 'population growth'.
I said this, they don't care, there's always an underlying motive. There shouldn't be any middle-men, none are needed. Leave the woman to decide.
Originally posted by DarkC
As many independent women there are in this world, there are women that are. It's undeniable. And it's probably a more courteous gesture to offer help when it's not needed rather than not offer help when needed.
Now you're operating under the assumption that your help is wanted, that your courteous nature is invited. Don't get involved in that which doesn't concern you.
Originally posted by DarkC
So pretty much what I said earlier, yes.
I meant if the government had to have a say, which they shouldn't.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
1) Really? I wasn't aware.
It sure as hell seems that way. 😉
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
3) That's bullshit, plain and simple. There are people who have bad experiences on drugs and there are people who have great experiences on them. That's just a fact. I know plenty of recreational drug users and they lead very comfortable lives. You have obviously been brainwashed into thinking that drugs are bad and if you so much as touch them, your life is gone. Sad, truly sad. The media show one side of the drugs coin, there are two, that's a fact.
The point is Drugs are potentially very harmful. And I am not talking about drugs like Marijuana or Alcohol, I am talking about Crack, Coke, Herione, hardcore drugs that do nothing but **** up a person' mind and body.
How are you going to validly deny that these kinds of drugs are responsible for a lot of damage that happens to individuals and thier families???
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
None of this disproves what I'm saying does it? Regardless of all that, it's entirely up to the person what they do with their body. Be it abortions or drug taking. The government has no right to tell someone what to do with a foetus anymore than they have the right to say "HEY! You can't smoke that!" "Why?" "Your family will be upset." "Let me worry about me, my life and my family, ok? Cool with you?" Yeah, drop that, or, alternatively, open a thread. Because this is all reasonably off topic.
The Government has no right.....
Yet I recall you so clearly defending the Law as saying it is up to the Government to decide what "Murder" is.
I also recall you defending the Death Penalty saying that as citizens under the Law, the Government has the right to not waste "tax" money on criminals and end thier lives.
Now all of a sudden the Government can't interfere with people's lives and choices? You certainly did a 180 !
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Nothing, what are you trying to prove? Her being an idiot for using it as birth control doesn't mean she doesn't have the right to abortions.
So you're not judging her by calling her an idiot?
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You're mildly simple. Read carefully: I believe that if a woman is being frivolous with abortion, she's an inconsiderate fool. That said, it's none of my business and regardless of how I feel, I have no business interfering, nobody does. Why am I still telling you this?
Well then we have a similiar stance. I too have my opinion on Abortion, but I wouldn't force it down a woman's throat. 🙂 (No pun intended)
I
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
'm not judging her, she can do what she wants, but I have the right to an opinion.
I agree. Same here. If only Omega understood this 🙁
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Ooooh, you're a clever one.
I know 😉
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I'm just curious as to how you miss the most obvious of points, is all.
WRONG.....wrong....wrong.....
I perfectly understand that you do not have to personally approve of the Abortion, but regardless of that it is none of your business and it's the woman's choice.
This has pretty much been my argument all along, yet you Omega and PVS jump down my throat demaning I take a "stance". 🙄
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Nah, I worded it fine. Watch the way you read.
Nuh uh......You contradict yourself from what you write now, from what you wrote then...and now try to excuse yourself with the quote "You know what I meant"
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You don't get my point, you're taking it too literally, so I'll dumb it down for you.
Oh please do Intelligent One 🙄
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Abortion isn't to blame for people misusing it. You don't get rid of abortion just because people might misuse it.-AC
1) Who said anything about getting Rid of Abortion?
2) STILL you are making a judgement on the person who is having the abortion.
The major difference between you and me is I disapprove of the ACT, not the person.
You treat the ACT as neutral, and blame the person.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
It sure as hell seems that way. 😉
Look up "Sarcasm".
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
The point is Drugs are potentially very harmful. And I am not talking about drugs like Marijuana or Alcohol, I am talking about Crack, Coke, Herione, hardcore drugs that do nothing but **** up a person' mind and body.
Haha, how funny. Alcohol kills more people than any illegal drug and is more than likely responsible for more domestically drug related problems than any other. Now who's unaware?
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
How are you going to validly deny that these kinds of drugs are responsible for a lot of damage that happens to individuals and thier families???
I don't know, I wasn't going to deny it. I was just saying that it's not a guarantee. It happens or it doesn't.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
The Government has no right.....Yet I recall you so clearly defending the Law as saying it is up to the Government to decide what "Murder" is.
Yeah, because that's a concept and idea. It's not infringing upon any person. Nice try, I cover all bases.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I also recall you defending the Death Penalty saying that as citizens under the Law, the Government has the right to not waste "tax" money on criminals and end thier lives
You don't recall me defending the death penalty, since I'm notoriously anti-death penalty, and multiple members will vouch for that fact.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Now all of a sudden the Government can't interfere with people's lives and choices? You certainly did a 180 !
I didn't, you misremembered, because you're simple.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
So you're not judging her by calling her an idiot?
I'm not judging her lifestyle, no. She acted idiotically, ergo I call her an idiot.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Well then we have a similiar stance. I too have my opinion on Abortion, but I wouldn't force it down a woman's throat. 🙂 (No pun intended)
I know this.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Nuh uh......You contradict yourself from what you write now, from what you wrote then...and now try to excuse yourself with the quote "You know what I meant".
No, you thought I meant something else. You weren't entirely wrong, but you misread or misinterpreted my point. That's your problem.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
1) Who said anything about getting Rid of Abortion?
You really cannot grasp any advancing points can you? I used it as an example.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
2) [b]STILL you are making a judgement on the person who is having the abortion.[/b]
Exactly. It's not the act's fault that she's using it the wrong way. That's like blaming a car because someone got drunk and drove it into a tree.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
The major difference between you and me is I disapprove of the ACT, not the person.
Exactly, once more. Stupid, backward and remarkably illogical.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
You treat the ACT as neutral, and blame the person.
Because the act is neutral. Do you go up to a pot leaf and say "Hey, you're to blame for that man smoking you?" no, because that's stupid.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Http://www.dictionary.comLook up "Sarcasm".
😆 Dude, i know you were being sarcastic. So was I....
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[Haha, how funny. Alcohol kills more people than any illegal drug and is more than likely responsible for more domestically drug related problems than any other. Now who's unaware?
1) I am aware of the fact that use of Alcohol has been responsible for numerous deaths. Just because I didn't use it as my example, does not make me unaware.
2) Drug related problems? Alcohol is legal...the illegal drugs are not...thereby, the deaths caused by illegal drugs are not recorded to the extant that deaths by Alcohol consumption are.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[I don't know, I wasn't going to deny it. I was just saying that it's not a guarantee. It happens or it doesn't.
But just because something is uncertain, does not mean you should chance it considering what kinds of horrible consequences may occur.
That's like letting a serial killer loose on the street, and say "don't worry. He probably won't kill again"
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[Yeah, because that's a concept and idea. It's not infringing upon any person. Nice try, I cover all bases.
Abortion is a concept and idea then no? You said Murder was. So how would banning Abortion be worse than the ban on murder ?
*Not I am not for banning abortion, but I ask for the sake of my point.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[You don't recall me defending the death penalty, since I'm notoriously anti-death penalty, and multiple members will vouch for that fact.
That was PVS then or someone else. Sorry, no offense, but i get you guys confused a lot since you guys have very similiar points of views.
I am anti death penalty as well 🙂
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[I didn't, you misremembered, because you're simple.
Simple mindedness has nothing to do with it. I can say the same for you. I simply may have confused you for the dozens of other pro-abortion or pro-choice members on this debate.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[I'm not judging her lifestyle, no. She acted idiotically, ergo I call her an idiot.
Idiotically, According your your standards. That is no more valid than my opinion that Abortion is immoral.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[I know this.
Good.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[No, you thought I meant something else. You weren't entirely wrong, but you misread or misinterpreted my point. That's your problem.
Okay, fair enough.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[You really cannot grasp any advancing points can you? I used it as an example.
That's not it. I just wanted to make sure that you understood I am not for banning abortion, regardless of my opinion.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[Exactly. It's not the act's fault that she's using it the wrong way. That's like blaming a car because someone got drunk and drove it into a tree.
Nope. A car is an object. Abortion is an action. How are you comparing the two? There's no valid comparison.
Abortion in this case would be correctly compared to drunk driving. another action 😉
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[Exactly, once more. Stupid, backward and remarkably illogical.
In your opinion....irrelevant to me.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
[Because the act is neutral. Do you go up to a pot leaf and say "Hey, you're to blame for that man smoking you?" no, because that's stupid.-AC
Again a Leaf is an object, Abortion is an ACT.
You don't blame the leaf. But you disapprove of smoking. Thereby, if you held the same logic in Abortion, you wouldn't attack the woman or the Abortion tools...you would disapprove of the abortion itself.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
2) Drug related problems? Alcohol is legal...the illegal drugs are not...thereby, the deaths caused by illegal drugs are not recorded to the extant that deaths by Alcohol consumption are.
Alcohol is much widely used and distributed, it's readily available. As are cigarettes.
That's besides the point anyway.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
But just because something is uncertain, does not mean you should chance it considering what kinds of horrible consequences may occur.
Let them decide that, not you.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
That's like letting a serial killer loose on the street, and say "don't worry. He probably won't kill again"
No, it's nothing like that because you're not putting anybody but yourself in danger. Making others sad is totally different.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Abortion is a concept and idea then no? You said Murder was. So how would banning Abortion be worse than the ban on murder ?
What on Earth are you on about? Murder is a specific type of killing, the killing of another living human being, unlawfully with malice. Why am I having to explain it to you again?
Abortion is termination of a foetus for the benefit of a living human, it's nothing to do with anyone but the woman. Murder is a bit more of an infringement than abortion is (which is none).
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
That was PVS then or someone else. Sorry, no offense, but i get you guys confused a lot since you guys have very similiar points of views.I am anti death penalty as well 🙂
Happy joy.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Simple mindedness has nothing to do with it. I can say the same for you. I simply may have confused you for the dozens of other pro-abortion or pro-choice members on this debate.
The only confusion I have with you is your ridiculous point of view. Other than that, I grasp everything you've said, because I'm the one who's replying to you clearly.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Idiotically, According your your standards. That is no more valid than my opinion that Abortion is immoral.
Your opinions on abortion being immoral are very debateable. The reason I think it's stupid to use abortion as birth control is because abortion is under enough of a microscope as it is, and there's people in world power who would ban it as a result of their religion. We needn't make things worse by frivolously using it. That said, it will happen.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Nope. A car is an object. Abortion is an action. How are you comparing the two? There's no valid comparison.[b]Abortion
in this case would be correctly compared to drunk driving. another action 😉[/b]
So you are agreeing that you wouldn't blame alcohol for someone drunk driving?
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Again a Leaf is an object, Abortion is an ACT.You don't blame the leaf. But you disapprove of smoking. Thereby, if you held the same logic in Abortion, you wouldn't attack the woman or the Abortion tools...you would disapprove of the abortion itself.
So you're against abortion as a whole, as an act...but you don't make moves to stop it...and you believe there are some cases when it's necessary...
Riiiiiight.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
It's not that simple in the real world, Mills. There's too much ego and reputation at stake to just be selfless.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Maybe she doesn't need to be presented with them by some government official, maybe she's gone to the doctor's practice and found out, maybe she doesn't care about other options and just wants an abortion.Stop assuming that these women are entirely unaware.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Now you're operating under the assumption that your help is wanted, that your courteous nature is invited. Don't get involved in that which doesn't concern you.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I meant if the government had to have a say, which they shouldn't.
A question: What, if anything, do your Governments pay women for having a child? Over here it is $3000 per child, but on the 1st of July, that ammount will rise to $4000.
The Government is using money as a way of bribing women to chose to have children-but they do nothing to provent abortion.
Now, on a television documentary the other night, a 14 year old girl told of how she heard about the money the Government was offering, and got herself pregnant. She intended to spend the money on herself. She got a huge shock when the baby arrived and she realised how expensive they are.
Do you think the Government actually encourages teenage pregnancy by doing this? The money is deposited into the mothers bank account-they do not receive vouchers or anything unless they ask, and many women are having children and spending the money on a boob job or a flashy car, then end up with next to no money to support their child.
On one hand, the money is good idea-$3000 would be a huge help if used correctly, for what it should be used for-the baby.
But on the other hand, the Government is creating a generation of 13-14 year old single parents who spread their legs out of greed.
Any thoughts? 😕
"Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Oh! You got me! You go...no, you didn't.
I've said that I think people who use abortion for birth control are idiots, but that's none of my business. Matters none to me."
"So you're against abortion as a whole, as an act...but you don't make moves to stop it...and you believe there are some cases when it's necessary...
Riiiiiight.
-AC"
i thought you said that it was none of our business...? 😉