Who in marvel is powerful enough to beat COIE Anti Monitor

Originally posted by ODG
1) So no multiversal feats. Right. 👆

2) Well... you're ignoring multiple Anti-Monitor's (and other's) statements about how he defeated only thousand(s) universes. Given it's the Anti-Monitor's feat you're trying to build up, why do Anti-Monitor's own statements mean nothing to you? Rheotorical question. My opinion only needs changing when reasoning compels it. So let's not pretend the shoe's on the other foot here, mang. But I've challenged you to post scans too many times only to be met with silence. So it's about time I just bludgeon you with scans from the actual comics now:

3) Ruh roh. You better reread Crisis on Infinite Earths. Anti-Monitor was actually at his peak power when Supergirl confronted him. Don't try to argue otherwise. Cmon now.

Then again, what does it matter at this point? You won't apply your understandable skepticism over supposedly multiversal powers like the Beyonders when they were defeated by a 100,000+ Molecule Man bomb, to the supposedly megaversal COIE Anti-Monitor, after all. Pointing out your double-standard should be enough but I'm all set to go another step forward and utterly disprove your argument.

Just to jump in on point #3: would it not just be an extension of DC's fetish for Kryptonians?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Just to jump in on point #3: would it not just be an extension of DC's fetish for Kryptonians?

The Anti-Monitor had 4 forms if I recall correctly.
[list=1][*]Original Armor Form
[*]Updated Armor Form
[*]Anti-Matter Universe Absorbed
[*]Shadow Demons Absorbed[/list]Only #3 can be argued to be universal/multiversal in the original story imo.

Originally posted by Astner
So why was the Anti-Monitor hurt by the fires of Sun...or a planet turned into a Sun? I mean that's how he lost most of his body. Superman only delivered the finishing blow.

The Anti-Monitor had 4 forms if I recall correctly.
[list=1][*]Original Armor Form
[*]Updated Armor Form
[*]Anti-Matter Universe Absorbed
[*]Shadow Demons Absorbed[/list]Only #3 can be argued to be universal/multiversal in the original story imo.

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
Wasn't Anti-Monitor weakened when it was thrown into the black sun?

Originally posted by Astner
Yes. He had been taken a few hits and he was hit by Darkseid's Omega Beams. But the ignition of the planet into a Sun was purposely orchastrated to kill him, and it did damage him if nothing else.

Originally posted by ODG
1) So no multiversal feats. Right. 👆

2) Well... you're ignoring multiple Anti-Monitor's (and other's) statements about how he defeated only thousand(s) universes. Given it's the Anti-Monitor's feat you're trying to build up, why do Anti-Monitor's own statements mean nothing to you? Rheotorical question. My opinion only needs changing when reasoning compels it. So let's not pretend the shoe's on the other foot here, mang. But I've challenged you to post scans too many times only to be met with silence. So it's about time I just bludgeon you with scans from the actual comics now:

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/oo326/OneDumbG0/COIE01.jpg

3) Ruh roh. You better reread Crisis on Infinite Earths. Anti-Monitor was actually at his peak power when Supergirl confronted him. Don't try to argue otherwise. Cmon now.

2.) When did I "ignore" the use of more finite terminology within the source material? Shall I repost the numerous instances where I fully acknowledged such in this very thread? All you're doing is "bludgeoning me" with a point that I already agreed with from the very start... So gg, I guess?

In point of fact, you are the one who is evidently willing to ignore Alex's explicit "infinite universes" statement(also made within the source material), along with all of the other statements made about the pre-crisis multiverse's infinitude in various comics released over the years. But hey, if your opinion is that the pre-crisis multiverse only contained 1,000ish universes, and was not infinite, then run with it. I don't care either way. 👆

3.) I have always been under the impression that AM's 'peak' was after he absorbed the anti-matter universe, which gave him enough power to return to the dawn of time in an effort to reforge creation. Is that incorrect?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Just to jump in on point #3: would it not just be an extension of DC's fetish for Kryptonians?

superman and sbp are obviously the best examples and do illogical things that are way above their typical weight class all the time. why would supergirl be any different? especially in her death issue.

Originally posted by ODG
1) So no multiversal feats. Right. 👆

2) Well... you're ignoring multiple Anti-Monitor's (and other's) statements about how he defeated only thousand(s) universes. Given it's the Anti-Monitor's feat you're trying to build up, why do Anti-Monitor's own statements mean nothing to you? Rheotorical question. My opinion only needs changing when reasoning compels it. So let's not pretend the shoe's on the other foot here, mang. But I've challenged you to post scans too many times only to be met with silence. So it's about time I just bludgeon you with scans from the actual comics now:

3) Ruh roh. You better reread Crisis on Infinite Earths. Anti-Monitor was actually at his peak power when Supergirl confronted him. Don't try to argue otherwise. Cmon now.

Then again, what does it matter at this point? You won't apply your understandable skepticism over supposedly multiversal powers like the Beyonders when they were defeated by a 100,000+ Molecule Man bomb, to the supposedly megaversal COIE Anti-Monitor, after all. Pointing out your double-standard should be enough but I'm all set to go another step forward and utterly disprove your argument.

the “thousand” universe doesn’t contradict infinite universes, it’s just that a thousand universe before the current one AM is trying to destroy, offered less resistance. Who know how much resistance was offered by the universe before these thousand?

Also it was crises of infinite earth not crises of thousands earths. With that said no way Supergirl should have been able to ko AM under any circumstances, she ain’t no Superman.

Personally, I've never really bought in to Anti Monitor's hype.

It wasn't just Supergirl, AM had issues with his own Thunderers and Flash as well.

And after Flash destroyed his anti matter machine AM had to absorb all the power from the Anti Matter Universe because it's how he was destroying all those positive matter universes and seemingly couldn't finish the job without it.

On top of that, after he did absorb all the power from the enhanced Anti Matter Universe, he then switched to plan B and travelled to the dawn of time. But when AM did that, just making the trip drained nearly all the power he'd gotten from the absorbing the Anti Matter Universe. He had to wait for the heroes to catch up so he could absorb their energy too so that he would have enough to restart the universe. On the other hand, Hal as Parallax said that restarting the universe from the dawn of time would be easy

To me, AM seemed like a skyfather lever until he absorbed his own universe. Now after absorbing his universe I could see how one might justify attributing him with something like multiverse power, but even then he seemed to have less in the gas tank than Hal as Parallax

But Galan and I agreed to disagree about all that nearly 20 years ago because between the scope of the original event and the numerous references in other stories since then, so many writers have touched on COIE that there are contradictions all over the place and it's impossible to resolve them all.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Personally, I've never really bought in to Anti Monitor's hype.

It wasn't just Supergirl, AM had issues with his own Thunderers and Flash as well.

And after Flash destroyed his anti matter machine AM had to absorb all the power from the Anti Matter Universe because it's how he was destroying all those positive matter universes and seemingly couldn't finish the job without it.

On top of that, after he did absorb all the power from the enhanced Anti Matter Universe, he then switched to plan B and travelled to the dawn of time. But when AM did that, just making the trip drained nearly all the power he'd gotten from the absorbing the Anti Matter Universe. He had to wait for the heroes to catch up so he could absorb their energy too so that he would have enough to restart the universe. On the other hand, Hal as Parallax said that restarting the universe from the dawn of time would be easy

Hal was just that powerful.

To me, AM seemed like a skyfather lever until he absorbed his own universe. Now after absorbing his universe I could see how one might justify attributing him with something like multiverse power, but even then he seemed to have less in the gas tank than Hal as Parallax

But Galan and I agreed to disagree about all that nearly 20 years ago because between the scope of the original event and the numerous references in other stories since then, so many writers have touched on COIE that there are contradictions all over the place and it's impossible to resolve them all.

Which skyfather in marvel can destroy infinite-5 universes with their power, goober?

He was using a machine to destroy the positive matter universes and had to alter course after the machine was destroyed. So it's quite quite possible than anyone(even sub-skyfathers) who knew the proper sequence of buttons could have done it if they had access to the machine and enough time.

technically anyone who can operate a universe destroying machine can destroy universe

i can do it by pushing buttons

Without reading the responses (seriously, I didn't) I will admit, I was unnecessarily confrontational/antagonistic here, Galan007.

But... it had nothing to do with the fact that I was drunk. Srsly.

Nevertheless, I shall step away from this conversation for a few days.

I'll likely come back when I'm drunk again.

Originally posted by darthgoober
He was using a machine to destroy the positive matter universes and had to alter course after the machine was destroyed. So it's quite quite possible than anyone(even sub-skyfathers) who knew the proper sequence of buttons could have done it if they had access to the machine and enough time.

https://ibb.co/Ksj3Vn0

Read the story, again.

he uses a machine to convert positive matter into anti-matter
that's how he destroy the universes, the universe was destroyed by anti-matter that's external from him

Originally posted by abhilegend
There was no machine to destroy the positive matter universes, it was all Anti Monitor. The only machine he created to destroy the remaining 5 universes was in issue 8 and that was only because those universes were in a realm Anti Monitor couldn't get into.

https://ibb.co/Ksj3Vn0

Read the story, again.

"At the height of its abilities, the Anti-Monitor has unmatched levels of power, such as power to create antimatter waves that engulf universes and transform them into energy it can absorb."
https://ibb.co/9c53WZ5

I.E, creating antimatter waves that destroy universes is one of its abilities

It does not make sense to think that the Anti-Monitor could summon Anti-Matter Waves at the drop of a hat because he literally ha a Anti-Matter Cannon built when the Wave was stopped.

Originally posted by MrMind
he uses a machine to convert positive matter into anti-matter
that's how he destroy the universes, the universe was destroyed by anti-matter that's external from him

Originally posted by Astner
It does not make sense to think that the Anti-Monitor could summon Anti-Matter Waves at the drop of a hat because he literally ha a Anti-Matter Cannon built when the Wave was stopped.

Right, but it wasn't exactly the universe-busting waves we saw in Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Originally posted by MrMind
he uses a machine to convert positive matter into anti-matter
that's how he destroy the universes, the universe was destroyed by anti-matter that's external from him