Originally posted by abhilegend
Really? Here's Monarch dying destroyed an entire universe.Monarch is infinitely more powerful than Moro, right?
And this showing isn't an indication of power level. Example, Darkseid death, the same Darkseid who was matching Anti Monitor only left a crater in the ground. Is Darkseid only building level? Let me know. We can do this all day ...
Originally posted by carver9
Stay in topic. This is why I'm discuss this. I never mentioned Moro death destroying a Galaxy as a way he could win, but when you downplay someone's death that would wipe away the largest Galaxy in the universe, you're trolling. This doesn't happen in comics and it's FAR and away from being a low showing or showing the capabilities of someone's power level. Especially considering beings like LT death not destroying sh**.
You really don't understand Galan's point, do you?
Originally posted by Galan007
*sigh* I feel like my posts regarding the general irrelevance of collateral damage, and the much higher importance of attack potency, are just falling on deaf ears to some here.Like I said before: SPC was SS2-tier, and stated that his final Kamehameha had the power to destroy the solar system(which was corroborated in a guidebook, iirc.) That said, when SS2 Majin Vegeta kamikaze'd against Boo, he released the sum total of his energy(killing himself in the process), and this was the end result:
This is important because SS2 Majin Vegeta > SPC. And even though the collateral damage he caused 'only' appears to be nuke-like, we can logically infer that said kamikaze might've had solar system+ level potency within that localized area(ie. if you're inside the bubble, you are only surviving if you can endure a solar system buster.)
So why couldn't the Moro instance be the same, except his 'bubble' is on a galactic scale instead..? After all, we know that even low level God-tier characters can generate universe-busting shockwaves as a corollary of a short brawl between them, and Moro is orders of magnitude above that level, so...
ermm
This.
Originally posted by carver9
And this showing isn't an indication of power level. Example, Darkseid death, the same Darkseid who was matching Anti Monitor only left a crater in the ground. Is Darkseid only building level? Let me know. We can do this all day ...
Originally posted by abhilegend
As we know Darkseid is more powerful than Monarch, it's just a case of potency, not destructive capability. Just using DBZ logic.
Lol... Nope, you're not using DBZ logic or any logic tbh because a person's death doesn't translate to the amount of power they have. Frieza is a bonified planet destroyer, Roshi is a bonified moon destroyer and neither of their deaths destroyed anything.
😕
Moro is the exception
Originally posted by abhilegendHuh? I have provided evidence to support every single claim I've made here. If you don't like(or can't accept) DB-logic, then... Sorry? But that's just how it is.
So it basically boils down to pick and choose from what you think is appropriate for that power level and discarding anything below that level as "Do you really think this and that". As I said DBZ is apparently immune to the law of averages every other fictional setting is judged by.
Originally posted by abhilegendHow many dozens of writers has Superman, Batman, Hulk, Spider-Man, etc. had over the last 40 years? How many writers did DB have over the last 40 years?
You'll not accept comic characters having chain scaling like that.
There's your answer. DB had ONE writer... And if Toriyama himself wasn't physically writing the material, he was at least heavily involved in the overall creative process -- still pointing the story in the direction he wanted it to go.
Now, I'm certainly not saying that DB has always been 100% consistent across the board... But with power-scaling in particular, it has generally been very consistent. Flip side, a comic character's level can(and does) fluctuate wildly, depending on who's writing them at any given time. That's why power-scaling in comics will never be as reliable as it is with something like DB.
^ It's not as much of a rules thing, so much as it's just understanding why comic characters cannot be power-scaled in the same way as the majority of manga characters.
DB = one writer, and one direction the characters/story will go. A singular vision.
Comics = dozens of writers, and dozens of directions the characters/stories will go. A muddled vision.
Manga and comics simply do not operate on a 'like-for-like' system in that way, so I'm not sure why abhi keeps bringing it up?
Yeah I am just thinking that these threads will always devolve into....well, whatever it is now. I mean, not that it's necessarily a bad thing, what with the low traffic and all.
But with the two VASTLY differing genres, what would happen is what carver is doing - low showings will always get brought up, when high-end showings are perfectly usable. Manga and Comics are simply too different to be comparable, unless we have consistent rules to compare the two.
Also, to stay on topic with the thread, I think you are thinking of AoU Luke Cage.
And I still say Ben Grimm and/or Spidey.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85👆 There's a reason why manga and comic discussions are usually separated into different forums. Cross-genre stuff can work, but you have to be willing to accept the fact that there is a completely different set of parameters that govern each medium(particularly where power-scaling/placement is concerned.)
Yeah I am just thinking that these threads will always devolve into....well, whatever it is now. I mean, not that it's necessarily a bad thing, what with the low traffic and all.But with the two VASTLY differing genres, what would happen is what carver is doing - low showings will always get brought up, when high-end showings are perfectly usable. Manga and Comics are simply too different to be comparable, unless we have consistent rules to compare the two.
Also, to stay on topic with the thread, I think you are thinking of AoU Luke Cage.
And I still say Ben Grimm and/or Spidey.
In comics it's all about using quantifiable on-panel evidence in order to prove 'x' character can definitively preform a certain caliber of feat... But in a manga/anime like DB, for example, I don't need to see Krillin ever destroy(or even talk about destroying) a planet on-panel, because his PL alone supports the claim that he undoubtedly CAN.
Ohh yeah, AoU sounds right. 👆
I agree with Thing, though(assuming KP's blast was 'just' nuke-level, obvs.)
Originally posted by carver9
Yes. In all threads including this one, is Spiderman durability in your opinion always Ultimate Nullifier levels? Please don't answer my question with a question. Thanks.
Oh if it is non-canon then no use discussing it.
I would like to see proof that it is non-canon, though. Thanks. Otherwise you are lying your ass off.
And to answer your question, no, it is not always at UN levels. In THAT scene, it is, though.
Originally posted by carver9
Didn't mean to say yes on it being non-canon. It's canon. So you agree that it's not always UN level?
Can you not read? (I know you said not to answer a question with a question, but...)
Come on Carvy, let's see you try a trap for once. Different writers have differing views on power levels.
Let me guess - you are going to say that in the comic, he was trans-level or something, and this makes you happy?
Nope, not what I'm going to say. What i am going to say is, since you agree that Spiderman durability isn't UN levels and my thread is no different than any other thread, we both agree this attack would kill Spiderman. I'm sure if I made a Darkseid vs Spiderman thread, you wouldn't use that scan on why Spiderman would defeat Darkseid.