Originally posted by MR.Grumhe did it already under CIRCUMSTANCES that he wouldn't otherwise have in a fight, especially on these boards.... wolverine's grabbed spiderman by the neck and rammed his head through a tree, does that mean it's likely to happen in a fight? no...
what you mean if hes done it alredy . you must be a wolvie fanatic you probly think he could beat superman 😆
funny though that you would call me a wolverine fanatic when you're obviously shorthanded on the facts around here.
Originally posted by Sparkzwell.... no promises.. but.. we'll see.. lol.
Ok so I’ve decided that the usual posting that goes on in here is getting a little stale and it’s the same stuff over and over again (granted this will probably cause all that again) but I want to at least try to make it seem like I’ve backed up my argument this time.So basically I’m going to make some scenario’s of why I think Spider-man wins the majority out of this fight and back it all up with scans and such instead of just making a random comment like normal, hopefully the Wolverine fans will then do the same for him to try and counter my arguments instead of just saying “He can hit Spider-man” or “He will cut his webbing to shit”
Originally posted by Sparkzscenario one COULD work.. but it's flawed by misrepresentation... in the first scan that's shown we have no idea really how long it took spiderman to make that barrier web, considering how his webbing works during hundreds of fights we know that it isn't anywhere NEAR that potent... to submit that it is isn't accurate.
Scenario 1:As the fight would start Spider-man would leap into the air and backwards while firing a sheet of webbing to slow Wolverine down this not only keeps him out Logan’s reach but will slow him down enough to allow Spider-man a better shot of his webbing. And when I say sheet of webbing I mean this kind…
And yes this is organic webbing so it can be done. Anyway once he has slowed Logan down doing this (Logan probably would have dived into it by accident) he can then proceed to unloading gallons of webbing over Logan thus he won’t be able to move and cut his way out of the webbing.. And I know people will say Logan could have cut through the sheet , but that was purely to slow him down so while Logan is cutting through Spider-man is firing off more webbing to incapacitate Logan all together.
And No Logan can’t break out of the webbing due to physical force as this scan will prove…
also, a backflip might not be the best strategy.. he tried this against cap and it didn't do him much good did it? plus, you have to give credit to wolverine's speed blitz, once he covers whatever short distance between them, well spiderman's not going to have much of a chance if any at all, to make this sheet you're talking about... whatever he does make will get shredded, and it's pretty convinient to assume it's going to slow wolverine down one bit, spiderman tried to use this same exact tactic on black panther and he got crushed.
the second misrepresentation is that the second pic is alot of webbing after it set... the webbing needs at least SOME time to set, sure it allows for spiderman to web swing but he's not exactly trying to rend it apart..
Originally posted by Sparkz
Scenario 2:This is more of a argument for Classic Spider-man but I’ll still use it, basicly the fight starts and undoubtly Logan will move towards Spider-man, this time Spider-man will move towards Logan and just before he gets in Logans reach he will jump for the air throwing down one of his old web Cartridges at Logan who would have probably been in a mid leap and not have had time to avoid the cartridge, upon impact of Logan or the ground the cartridge would then begin to release webbing at Logan expanding all around him Sticking him in his place, Logan will try to slash free but the amount of webbing being produced from the cartridge is to much for Logan to cut at one time, once the webbing has finished expanding it will have formed a cocoon around Logan so he can no longer move his arms to break free, once again being incapacitated.
so I'm confused here.. spiderman has organic webbing but he's still packing his old webbing cartridges? 🤨
ummmmm ok... 😕
well again, what makes you think that spiderman's going to have the time to reach into his little waist belt and pull it out. if it's that simple for him, then why did classic sm always freak out in mid fight when his wrist gauntlets ran out of webbing?
sorry I'm not convinced on this one.
Originally posted by Sparkz
Scenario 3This is a win with Iron Spidey armour, so anyway. As the fight starts Spider-man instantly leaps back and activates his stealth mode, this won’t fool Logan but it will still make Spider-man harder to find for him thus he has to pay a lot more attention to his senses, this could leave him open to attack because he is to busy trying to find Peter that he may take some hits. This is wear the Iron Spidey suit comes in again, he then uses the liquid metal abilities of the suit to create a claw on each arm this will do a lot more damage to Logan, now the fact that he can’t see peter and has to spend a lot of time trying to find him he can be slowed down by webbing and take a lot of damage with the “claws” Peter is using, while he is recovering from these wounds (what about 1 or 2 seconds) Peter can take this opportunity to once again web Logan and even use some of his liquid metal suit to wrap around Logan not only having the webbing to worry about but also the metal, now either Spider-man could continue to beat on Logan while he is completely tied down with metal and webbing and overload his healing factor (eventually) or he could just web him further thus incapacitating him yet again.
wait, so he's got his organic webbing, his web cartridges, AND his iron spidey costume? does he have his captain universe powers too? lol.
well this is iron spidey, while my gut instinct says that iron spiderman wins, his feats weren't impressive enough vs. skilled streeters to back that up...
did spiderman ever successfully use stealth mode WHILE attacking? it seems as though when he actually makes his attack he's visable again, and in that sense..well it didn't work for nightcrawler, I'm not so sure it would work for spidey... also there's the problem that cap beat on iron spidey on more than one occasion..
again my instincts agree that iron spidey wins but the feats say otherwise. 😕
Originally posted by Sparkz
Scenario 4:This next scenario has Spider-man and Wolverine moving at each other and Wolverine going in for attack Spider-man using his superior speed and agility and his Spider-sense manages to avoid these hits.
While at such a close range once again using his superior reflex he can aim webbing right for Logan’s face, when it hits undoubtly Logan will try to get it off with his hands/claws when he tries Spider-man can web his hands to his face in this position he wouldn’t be able to cut himself free then Spidey could pour on more webbing absoulty smoothening him in it and without air Logan would pass out thus another win for Spidey.
flawed by misrepresentation again...
juggernaught can't even hit shatterstar nevermind spiderman... what's wolverine's record vs. shatterstar? 3-zip... and he hasn't tried in not ONE of those fights.
Also, I've said it before, I'll say it again, shooting spiderman and hitting him are two completely different games.. sure spiderman dodges goblins lazers but goblin still lands hits on him ALL THE TIME.
punisher's had trouble landing shots on spiderman but he still lands punches and kicks on the guy.. two different things.
finally, no doubt spiderman can smother logan in webbing if logan's already immobilized, but webbing him at all, let alone in the face is going to be a feat in a close quarters fight.. you know.. the kind where spiderman has admitted that he can't give logan one second, or he'll die.
Originally posted by jinzin
well.... no promises.. but.. we'll see.. lol.scenario one COULD work.. but it's flawed by misrepresentation... in the first scan that's shown we have no idea really how long it took spiderman to make that barrier web, considering how his webbing works during hundreds of fights we know that it isn't anywhere NEAR that potent... to submit that it is isn't accurate.
also, a backflip might not be the best strategy.. he tried this against cap and it didn't do him much good did it? plus, you have to give credit to wolverine's speed blitz, once he covers whatever short distance between them, well spiderman's not going to have much of a chance if any at all, to make this sheet you're talking about... whatever he does make will get shredded, and it's pretty convinient to assume it's going to slow wolverine down one bit, spiderman tried to use this same exact tactic on black panther and he got crushed.
the second misrepresentation is that the second pic is alot of webbing after it set... the webbing needs at least SOME time to set, sure it allows for spiderman to web swing but he's not exactly trying to rend it apart..
so I'm confused here.. spiderman has organic webbing but he's still packing his old webbing cartridges? 🤨
ummmmm ok... 😕well again, what makes you think that spiderman's going to have the time to reach into his little waist belt and pull it out. if it's that simple for him, then why did classic sm always freak out in mid fight when his wrist gauntlets ran out of webbing?
sorry I'm not convinced on this one.wait, so he's got his organic webbing, his web cartridges, AND his iron spidey costume? does he have his captain universe powers too? lol.
well this is iron spidey, while my gut instinct says that iron spiderman wins, his feats weren't impressive enough vs. skilled streeters to back that up...
did spiderman ever successfully use stealth mode WHILE attacking? it seems as though when he actually makes his attack he's visable again, and in that sense..well it didn't work for nightcrawler, I'm not so sure it would work for spidey... also there's the problem that cap beat on iron spidey on more than one occasion..
again my instincts agree that iron spidey wins but the feats say otherwise. 😕
I know its confusing but I did say at the start of the scenarios which verison of Spider-man I was using, not sticking to one version, also we don't know whether Pete dsnt keep spare web cartirdges with him even though he has organic webbing.
And it would be pretty easy to pull a cartridge out of his belt, not like he is falling from the top of new york where he has a major risk of getting smushed if he dosn't change it in time.
Didn't he use a sucsseful sneak attack against Cap and a load of other hero's in civil war (not read any of it so not sure)
Also the fact that Cap was giving Spidey a fight was mainly to make the fight intresting but I don't want to get into that.
Originally posted by jinzin
well.... no promises.. but.. we'll see.. lol.scenario one COULD work.. but it's flawed by misrepresentation... in the first scan that's shown we have no idea really how long it took spiderman to make that barrier web, considering how his webbing works during hundreds of fights we know that it isn't anywhere NEAR that potent... to submit that it is isn't accurate.
also, a backflip might not be the best strategy.. he tried this against cap and it didn't do him much good did it? plus, you have to give credit to wolverine's speed blitz, once he covers whatever short distance between them, well spiderman's not going to have much of a chance if any at all, to make this sheet you're talking about... whatever he does make will get shredded, and it's pretty convinient to assume it's going to slow wolverine down one bit, spiderman tried to use this same exact tactic on black panther and he got crushed.
the second misrepresentation is that the second pic is alot of webbing after it set... the webbing needs at least SOME time to set, sure it allows for spiderman to web swing but he's not exactly trying to rend it apart..
so I'm confused here.. spiderman has organic webbing but he's still packing his old webbing cartridges? 🤨
ummmmm ok... 😕well again, what makes you think that spiderman's going to have the time to reach into his little waist belt and pull it out. if it's that simple for him, then why did classic sm always freak out in mid fight when his wrist gauntlets ran out of webbing?
sorry I'm not convinced on this one.wait, so he's got his organic webbing, his web cartridges, AND his iron spidey costume? does he have his captain universe powers too? lol.
well this is iron spidey, while my gut instinct says that iron spiderman wins, his feats weren't impressive enough vs. skilled streeters to back that up...
did spiderman ever successfully use stealth mode WHILE attacking? it seems as though when he actually makes his attack he's visable again, and in that sense..well it didn't work for nightcrawler, I'm not so sure it would work for spidey... also there's the problem that cap beat on iron spidey on more than one occasion..
again my instincts agree that iron spidey wins but the feats say otherwise. 😕
Oops forgot scenario 1. Well it dosn't matter about making a web that size i'm just saying a large web should be easy to slow him down, and it slow Logan down mainly cause if he's lunging he's gonna dive into the webbing and need time (2 3 secs to cut out)
Also the second pics were to illistrate after spider-man poured webbing all over wolverine not the first web...and Wolverine shouldnt be able to pull free from gallons of webbing covering him.
And as for it setting what does it take like 2 or 3 seconds Wolverine isn't gonna rip out of that,it'll take to long to rip out of,
Originally posted by jinzin
flawed by misrepresentation again...juggernaught can't even hit shatterstar nevermind spiderman... what's wolverine's record vs. shatterstar? 3-zip... and he hasn't tried in not ONE of those fights.
Also, I've said it before, I'll say it again, shooting spiderman and hitting him are two completely different games.. sure spiderman dodges goblins lazers but goblin still lands hits on him ALL THE TIME.
punisher's had trouble landing shots on spiderman but he still lands punches and kicks on the guy.. two different things.finally, no doubt spiderman can smother logan in webbing if logan's already immobilized, but webbing him at all, let alone in the face is going to be a feat in a close quarters fight.. you know.. the kind where spiderman has admitted that he can't give logan one second, or he'll die.
You make good points but the juggernaught pic was mainly just to show the way Spidey fights more than anything eles.
Also I get that he gets hit but when writers have him dodge bullets its because its a sever attack that could kill punches are a basic form of fighting with not much risk, I know Im nit picking there but still. Anyway i still see this being a viable stratagey though it is risky.
Originally posted by Sparkz
Scenario 5:I suppose this could be highly debatable but I think it stands anyway, Spider-man and wolverine go toe to toe due to his superior strength and speed he can counter Logans moves and once again incapacitate him with his webbing when the opportunity arises Though this is a very risky strategy. Now I know people will say Logan is to skilled but Spider-man has had good showings against skiled opponents as well as bad ones.
This scan is more for the entertainment value than the debate but it helps slightly so….
again, misrepresentation,
to the first fight, you can't deem that a character is at the top of their game when they're going through emotional trauma like that, just like when wolverine couldn't hit cyclops and got his ass judo thrown, their heads are somewhere else, not really in the fight.. even then spiderman thinks all he can do is stay out of the guys way.
as for deadpool, well that doesn't show me anything other than, a less skilled fighter than wolverine getting hits on spiderman and NOT being webbed as described in scenario one..
probably could have picked something better than that.
for the last pic.. lol
Originally posted by Sparkz
Scenario 6:This scenario is more reliant on the environment of a city such as New York, any way. The fight starts and Spider-man goes to a next street or so to get away from wolverine to retrieve a car he can then use this as a projectile to do some serious damage or even just to keep Wolverine on the move.
This scan has him lifting 2 cars and carrying them around the city so he should be able to throw one pretty fast and accurate enough to give Wolverine a good work out.
Or Spidey could rip a lamp post down to use as a weapon thus gaining longer reach, Logan may be able to cut it but Spider-man should be able to get some hits in before that happens, But the main point of using the environment is to get Wolverine dodging from one thing and leaving himself open to Spider-man’s webbing again.
I don't think anyone's ever really cared to argue that spiderman can win using the environment to his advantage.. but that's not the same as winning a straight fight is it?
Originally posted by Sparkznice scenario but it wouldn't happen.. spiderman's webbing's been cut by knives and didn't stick to the blade, when he weebed wolverine's hand, wolverine shredded it and it wasn't left caked on, taskmaster cut through the incoming webbing like it was nothing and it didn't cake on, black panther shredder his way through a wall of webbing and it didn't cake on... there's relatively little reason to assume that it would happen to logan...
Scenario 7:This should be a interesting scenario when the fight starts Spider-man fires a stream of webbing at Wolverine either Wolverine chooses to dodge it or he can try to cut it, if he tries to cut it the webbing will then cover his claw, and spider-man can keep pouring on the webbing covering his claw giving it padding thus making it very ineffective, then while wolverine is trying to free it with his other claw’s Spider-man can web the hands together and then just string Wolverine up by them thus he will be incapacitated again.
But if Logan choose to avoid the webbing at the start Spider-man could just keep trying until he finally hit or Logan tried to cut the webbing.
it's also likely that if wolverine opts to just avoid the webbing, that he'll cover the distance between them and take he fight to close quarters before spiderman has much of a chance to do any caking whatsoever.. so... yeah.. not gonna happen.
Originally posted by Sparkzyeah I think spiderman can win by webbing, to be honest I think webbing gives him his only real victories, but as you inadvertantly displayed.... the circumstances have to be so set for spiderman and the odds so against wolverine, that a win-by-webbing just isn't a likely case scenario for giving spiderman the majority in this fight.
Well after all that I hope a Wolverine supporter will do the same and it might bring some depth back into this thread again.As you can see I think Spider-man wins the majority 6/10 due to his webbing (seeing as all the scenario’s involve webbing Logan up)
Originally posted by SparkzI'm not confused i just thought it was funny. And I can't prove a negative so you must prove the positive.
I know its confusing but I did say at the start of the scenarios which verison of Spider-man I was using, not sticking to one version, also we don't know whether Pete dsnt keep spare web cartirdges with him even though he has organic webbing.
Originally posted by Sparkzfalling from a building takes him what.. 2 3 4 seconds? wolverine's speedblitzed over 20 yards to get to a guy before he could pull a trigger. spiderman just doesn't have the time.
And it would be pretty easy to pull a cartridge out of his belt, not like he is falling from the top of new york where he has a major risk of getting smushed if he dosn't change it in time.
Originally posted by Sparkzyeah, but like I said, when he started to attack he was visable again..
Didn't he use a sucsseful sneak attack against Cap and a load of other hero's in civil war (not read any of it so not sure)
Originally posted by Sparkzhe did it twice though.. 😕
Also the fact that Cap was giving Spidey a fight was mainly to make the fight intresting but I don't want to get into that.
Originally posted by jinzin
again, misrepresentation,
to the first fight, you can't deem that a character is at the top of their game when they're going through emotional trauma like that, just like when wolverine couldn't hit cyclops and got his ass judo thrown, their heads are somewhere else, not really in the fight.. even then spiderman thinks all he can do is stay out of the guys way.as for deadpool, well that doesn't show me anything other than, a less skilled fighter than wolverine getting hits on spiderman and NOT being webbed as described in scenario one..
probably could have picked something better than that.
for the last pic.. lolI don't think anyone's ever really cared to argue that spiderman can win using the environment to his advantage.. but that's not the same as winning a straight fight is it?
nice scenario but it wouldn't happen.. spiderman's webbing's been cut by knives and didn't stick to the blade, when he weebed wolverine's hand, wolverine shredded it and it wasn't left caked on, taskmaster cut through the incoming webbing like it was nothing and it didn't cake on, black panther shredder his way through a wall of webbing and it didn't cake on... there's relatively little reason to assume that it would happen to logan...
it's also likely that if wolverine opts to just avoid the webbing, that he'll cover the distance between them and take he fight to close quarters before spiderman has much of a chance to do any caking whatsoever.. so... yeah.. not gonna happen.
yeah I think spiderman can win by webbing, to be honest I think webbing gives him his only real victories, but as you inadvertantly displayed.... the circumstances have to be so set for spiderman and the odds so against wolverine, that a win-by-webbing just isn't a likely case scenario for giving spiderman the majority in this fight.
He may have been going through emtional trauma but he was very determained to save his child, that would cause him to fight alot harder than normal
Anyway what does not webbing DP have to do with my first scenario?
And I know i could have choose a better scan but I just think its awsome (had to fit it in somewhere)
Granted we never debate that yes but I thought I'd through it in there.
Oh well never mind then i would have thought that wolverine's claws would stick to webbing my bad.
And i would say the circumsatnces for Spidey webbing Wolverine have to be heavily set in his favour and in most of my scenarios its up to Spidey to put it in his favour so thats why i think Spidey wins the majority.
