All Of Star Trek Vs All Of Star Wars

Started by Darth Zhin76 pages
Originally posted by Bill Gates
lol im still sorry but i just cant see them fighting thousands and thousands of borg cubes and spheres and winning when the borg have the ability to adapt to almost any weapon, regenerative capabilities, and still their ships being able to work and fight with 70% of it destroyed. And then having to also fight the Dominion fleet.

YES!!!!!!!!

Finaly someone who doesn´t let his love for SW or ST clouds his judment!!!!!!!!!.

When you look to the facts in an objective and calm way is obvius that the Borg will win against the SW universe (and they also win in the ST if the writing wasn´t so biased towards the main characters 🙂 ) thanks to their adapt capabilietes (Hell! they even could adapt to the lightsabers!!!).

Sure, the Death Star will destroy a few cubes, but they will finally adapt to the Super Laser. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE GUYS!!!!!!!!

I need to relax........

The only way that the Borg could really be beaten is by sending Kirk to have a talk with them.

Heck! If you send Kirk to talk to anyone in the SW universe he will probably convince him/her/it to destroy itself/himself/herself!

But that will be unfair

So no Q and no Kirk 😛

Originally posted by Bill Gates
lol im still sorry but i just cant see them fighting thousands and thousands of borg cubes and spheres and winning when the borg have the ability to adapt to almost any weapon, regenerative capabilities, and still their ships being able to work and fight with 70% of it destroyed. And then having to also fight the Dominion fleet.

Weren't borg cubes destroyed in ST? How did ST win from those bastards? And more importantly are those things actually able to withstand a blast that can destroy an entire planet easily? Alderaan was blown by a weaker smaller slower Death Star then the second one was... Don't you think that the second Death Star would be able to blow the shit out of anything that comes up against it, unless you take out its shield generators?

Which IMO is really impossible because ST just doesn't have a real ground force army... Again because they are exploring a lot, thats their job. Its not really a fair fight IMO... People that fight against people that explore. ST is still in the beginning of the Empire, when SW is already long past that. SW has thousands of years of history with hyperspace travel, with a republic with empires and all that crap. How can anyone honestly compare the two?

Originally posted by Fishy
Weren't borg cubes destroyed in ST? How did ST win from those bastards? And more importantly are those things actually able to withstand a blast that can destroy an entire planet easily?

They'd probably just see the weapon charging on their sensors and stay out of the way.
Alderaan was blown by a weaker smaller slower Death Star then the second one was... Don't you think that the second Death Star would be able to blow the shit out of anything that comes up against it, unless you take out its shield generators?

Chroniton. Torpedoes. They phase out of space time, bypassing shielding, until they reach their target.

If Vader is in a ship that is erased from time by the temporal ship(s) the whole empire would probably disappear. No death star. No star destroyers. Just undoubtedly pansy peace keeping ships in their place.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
They'd probably just see the weapon charging on their sensors and stay out of the way.
[b]
Chroniton. Torpedoes. They phase out of space time, bypassing shielding, until they reach their target.

If Vader is in a ship that is erased from time by the temporal ship(s) the whole empire would probably disappear. No death star. No star destroyers. Just undoubtedly pansy peace keeping ships in their place.

So they have torpedo's that travel through time?? Because weapons could not bypass Death Star shields... And are those torpedo's actually powerful enough to blow up a moon? Because thats basically what the Death Star is

Originally posted by Fishy
So they have torpedo's that travel through time?? Because weapons could not bypass Death Star shields... And are those torpedo's actually powerful enough to blow up a moon? Because thats basically what the Death Star is

They didn't travel through time, they phased out of exisistance just so as to allow them to bypass shielding but not so much that they'd completely disappear. The only defense was chroniton shielding.

In ST yes... SW shields are supposed to stop anything that is matter that hits them, that would include those things... You can't make things dissapear completly at will... And if you could, then well a Star will still do more damage 😛

Anyways this thing will never ever be discussed fairly unless we start setting some rules...

Lets say we only debate the ST and SW movies... not the TV shows or the EU... That way we have far less to debate about and it would be a lot more fair IMO...

Originally posted by Fishy
In ST yes... SW shields are supposed to stop anything that is matter that hits them, that would include those things... You can't make things dissapear completly at will... And if you could, then well a Star will still do more damage 😛

Well... photo torpedoes are anti-matter warheads. And Species 8472's combined ship attacks I'm sure could destroy a moon considering one shot obliterated borg cubes.
Anyways this thing will never ever be discussed fairly unless we start setting some rules...

Lets say we only debate the ST and SW movies... not the TV shows or the EU... That way we have far less to debate about and it would be a lot more fair IMO...


Hahahaha... that eliminates all the insane time and transphasic weapons from Star Trek but it also eliminates the apparently crazy machinegun Death Star and super powered Luke. Still, there's the teleporting anti-matter trick.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
Well... photo torpedoes are anti-matter warheads. And Species 8472's combined ship attacks I'm sure could destroy a moon considering one shot obliterated borg cubes.
[b]
Hahahaha... that eliminates all the insane time and transphasic weapons from Star Trek but it also eliminates the apparently crazy machinegun Death Star and super powered Luke. Still, there's the teleporting anti-matter trick.

So its agreed? Movies only?

Originally posted by Fishy
So its agreed? Movies only?

You know what you get with the movies? KKKKKAAAAAAHHHHNNNNN!!!!

The ships in the first six movies sucked so bad. The ships are really the hinge of why I was supporting Star Trek. Little skirmisher/escort Defiant ships have at least 10 times the power of Kirk's old jalopy and then considered a heavy cruiser ship. And even more powerful ships outrank the Defiant class.

On the upside, a relatively small group of those ships fought a borg cube in First Contact.

Down side, it was a relatively small group fighting a single cube. If only movies are considered, are they taken purely of face value? Do the borg only get one cube? Do non-movie references to how powerful the previously mentioned ships count? Because the movie didn't go into any of that. And not a whole lot of tech tricks.

Star Wars doesn't have that problem. The EU and books were an expansion on their movies. The movies and books were an expansion of the shows for Star Trek, y'know?

But on a second upside, the star destroyers seem to have weak sauce shielding compared to Trek ships.

I guess it really comes down to the Federation ships and such holding their own until the borg are an overwhelming force. I guarantee at least half of those star destroyers will become borg ships. Even with jedi and armed guards, it's only a matter of time before they adapt to block lightsabers and blasters.

I suppose I'm still with Star Trek with movies only.

You think so? You think that SW won't just blow the hell out of ST its ships with ships a lot bigger then them? You don't think that the Death Star wil just blow up the one and only borg cube, because there is apparently only one now...

And I do not think Jedi can be controlled by anything, the weak minded people can but Jedi can do that to the ST people too. But controlling a Jedi is going to be so much harder if not impossible. If the borg can control somebody like Yoda or Sidious they would be incredibly, but I don't think anybody has the chance to do that.

One thing though how do they start controlling them? Just by looking at them or something or do they have to hit the Jedi with a weapon? Because if is the second they don't stand a chance in hell of getting one controlled. The Force is going to be a very powerful ally when beating those guys away.

Originally posted by Fishy
You think so? You think that SW won't just blow the hell out of ST its ships with ships a lot bigger then them?

Not really. They have advanced shielding and although some of the bigger ships are roughly half the length of a star destroyer, they're shown to be way more manueverable and have stronger weapons.

Did you not read what I said about the Defiant class ships vs Kirk's old Cruiser? His ship was way bigger than a Defiant but the Defiant class has his ship totally outclassed.

You don't think that the Death Star wil just blow up the one and only borg cube, because there is apparently only one now...

Well, you said movies only and the borg only used one cube in one movie. I don't think I've seen an escape pod much less a ship not be able to read weapons charging. They'll simply fly out of the way.
And I do not think Jedi can be controlled by anything

It's not really like mind control. They inject nanites into their target and they start the conversion to borg at the molecular level. Seeing how so many movie jedi were taken out by troopers that were seconds ago following orders, I don't see much of a difference. Taking even one jedi would hurt pretty bad since they assimilate the knowledge as well.
Jedi can do that to the ST people too.

I'm sure they can but the people who will be boarding the ships, borg, aren't really weak minded. In fact, I think any mindtrick attempt would immediately be overwritten by hive orders.
One thing though how do they start controlling them? Just by looking at them or something or do they have to hit the Jedi with a weapon? Because if is the second they don't stand a chance in hell of getting one controlled. The Force is going to be a very powerful ally when beating those guys away.

They have tubes that come out of their... second knuckles I think. It instantly injects nanites and begins the process.

The beauty of it is at first the affected pretty much looks normal, albeit sick, but carrys out the borg commands. So many times this has lead to an unsuspecting peer going "Hey? Are you alright?" or reacting like normal as their friend walks up to them only to get injected themselves.

Seeing how the jedi former comrade clones took them out, I imagine them being taken not by the obvious pale skinned drones in black body armor but the newly assimilated who look almost exactly the same as the people they once called their allies.

The clones took them out because they weren't expecting them... Not because they were more powerful... But like you said it comes from the hand of the Borg thingies... I really don't give them a chance in hell of hitting a Jedi then. As soon as they notice a difference (and believe me Palpatine and Yoda will notice a difference in the Jedi) they will figure out was happened and make sure that no borg even comes close to a Jedi... Lots of fire power around them and then there is the force to choke them. Shoot lightning at them, or just a simple throw of their lightsbers...

Whatever the case, if the Jedi even let it happen once they will find out about what happened not necessarily how, but at least what and do whatever they can to stop it. And the force is going to be very powerful when you want to do that.

Now about the other thing, you have said superior technology. I heavily disagree. I have not once, seen ST ships do what SW ships can do. SW ships bomb entire planets to the ground. Okay this happens in EU but with weaker ships and less weapons, meaning SW ships can do it too. Yes ST does name weapons more often which would make it seem like they have more of them. But more does not mean better, and just because they improve their weapons every movie doesn't mean they become the best their are... Their weapons still have a lot of limits. And the fact that they have room for improvement only speaks against it.

A year 1600 small frigate could expirement with its cannons and create stronger one's. It still wouldn't be a match for a WWII destroyer

And about the borg avoiding a Death Star ray? How?

Unless they could enter hyperspace every single second (which they can't even enter) they would get hit. The Death Star doesn't give a warning message and doesn't require two shots... In ROTJ the rebel fleet is caught completely of guard by the shot, and they were looking at the damn thing concentrating on it.

Originally posted by Fishy
The clones took them out because they weren't expecting them... Not because they were more powerful

And I'm not saying they'd be powerful, compared to the jedi/sith, but they wouldn't expect their ally to infect them with nanites just as they wouldn't expect their clone troopers to shoot them in the back.
Now about the other thing, you have said superior technology. I heavily disagree. I have not once, seen ST ships do what SW ships can do. SW ships bomb entire planets to the ground. Okay this happens in EU but with weaker ships and less weapons, meaning SW ships can do it too.

You don't think a couple hundred anti-matter warheads would level a planet?
Yes ST does name weapons more often which would make it seem like they have more of them. But more does not mean better, and just because they improve their weapons every movie doesn't mean they become the best their are... Their weapons still have a lot of limits. And the fact that they have room for improvement only speaks against it.

You can't say the "laser" and "bigger laser" couldn't use improvements. In fact, there are always room for improvements. To me, the multiple types of weapons that have arisen only shows that they develop it further than the standard laser beam.
And about the borg avoiding a Death Star ray? How?

Unless they could enter hyperspace every single second (which they can't even enter) they would get hit. The Death Star doesn't give a warning message and doesn't require two shots...


How big is this beam? And how oblivious would the ships have to be to not read that much energy building on their sensors?

They don't need hyperspace. For one, impulse is pretty fast. Fast enough to cover a couple hundred thousand kms in a second. Two, they have warp if they really need to get away that fast.

By the way, why is the death star firing at the borg ship first?

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
And I'm not saying they'd be powerful, compared to the jedi/sith, but they wouldn't expect their ally to infect them with nanites just as they wouldn't expect their clone troopers to shoot them in the back.

No they wouldn't expect it, at first... So maybe a few of the clones could be taken over. (which can actually be doubted because as soon as that happens they betray their programming) Maybe a few of the Jedi can be taken over but that would be noticed, but then there would still be the countless of droids who will do a shit load of damage especially droideka's.

You don't think a couple hundred anti-matter warheads would level a planet?

Honestly I have no idea, have they ever done it? Have they blown up an ST ship with one blast? What have they done?

You can't say the "laser" and "bigger laser" couldn't use improvements. In fact, there are always room for improvements. To me, the multiple types of weapons that have arisen only shows that they develop it further than the standard laser beam.

Of course they could use improvement, the fact is however in ST they seem to be constantly working on it with a small crew. In SW they just use engineers for it. This isn't strange seeing as SW has organised army's that are build to fight and can travel faster when ST can't return to earth in a day or two to get the upgrades and then travel past thousands of systems to their destination again. But this does once again mean that ST is more on their own when SW is more of an organised army. ST weapons improve all the time yes, but not because a few engineers found out what can improve but because a captain thought "hey lets do this and that".

Personally I would rather have the SW way, thats how it works in army's here.

Look at it like this, the German army in WWII, by the end of WWII they had thousands of people working on weapons in laboratory's. It gave them the V1 and V2 rocket, which could blow up entire neighbourhoods with just one hit. The first Jet fighters, who did a shit load of damage against the RAF and all the other air forces in the area. They were almost finished with the nuclear missile (yes i know Germany lost, but just to show what a lab can do)

And on the other hand you have Ancient Rome, good troops. Well trained, good technology and all of that crap. But once somebody in Rome discoverers how to set walls on fire those guys in Egypt won't know within a day. So they will have to find out their own way to break down a wall. Now which would you rather have? A lot of people constantly thinking about upgrades that don't require you to do anything. Or would you want to think off them yourself, or build them yourself? Gimme the first

How big is this beam? And how oblivious would the ships have to be to not read that much energy building on their sensors?

The beam isn't all that big, form what I've seen and it moves incredibly fast so once it fires you can't avoid it anymore. And the rebel alliance was caught completely of guard by it in ROTJ when it fired at one of their capitol ships. And they were actually watching the Death Star because they wanted to attack it.

They don't need hyperspace. For one, impulse is pretty fast. Fast enough to cover a couple hundred thousand kms in a second. Two, they have warp if they really need to get away that fast.

Well hyperspace was faster but that should do too I guess.

By the way, why is the death star firing at the borg ship first?

Its going to be the biggest enemy ship there...

You know what you get with the movies? KKKKKAAAAAAHHHHNNNNN!!!!

Boss Boss! Tha Plane Tha Plane!

Originally posted by Fishy
No they wouldn't expect it, at first... So maybe a few of the clones could be taken over. (which can actually be doubted because as soon as that happens they betray their programming)

The programming won't matter. It'd just be overwritten or suppressed for the new programming.
Maybe a few of the Jedi can be taken over but that would be noticed, but then there would still be the countless of droids who will do a shit load of damage especially droideka's.

They'll adapt to weaponry.
Honestly I have no idea, have they ever done it? Have they blown up an ST ship with one blast? What have they done?

From the movies alone, the only ship I can remember getting blown up in one shot was a bird-of-prey but that was a pretty small ship.
Of course they could use improvement, the fact is however in ST they seem to be constantly working on it with a small crew. In SW they just use engineers for it.

ST has their engineers. They have their own groups of people in science ships testing and refining. They also have the engineers that keep the regular ships going that discover techniques and refine on the field.
This isn't strange seeing as SW has organised army's that are build to fight and can travel faster when

ST has gunships as well and can travel faster than light. What do you think warp is?
ST can't return to earth in a day or two to get the upgrades and then travel past thousands of systems to their destination again.

That's impractical. Only something insanely great and complicated would be worth returning to a station for. They have replicators and spare parts for stuff that won't replicate. If it's that great and they have the time they'll have the schematics sent to them and their teams will upgrade the ship themselves.
But this does once again mean that ST is more on their own when SW is more of an organised army. ST weapons improve all the time yes, but not because a few engineers found out what can improve but because a captain thought "hey lets do this and that".

Personally I would rather have the SW way, thats how it works in army's here.


I think you're under the allusion that all the Star Trek ships are like lone wolves out doing whatever with minimal communication. And that the captain is the only one who's trained. But that's not true. In the case of the Federation, it IS the army in the future. They make daily reports, they've got organized systems, specialists, the works.

Have you ever heard the phrase "necessity is the mother of invention"? What did the Empire have to deal with? A small band of resistance? When you have to fight people with time distorting weapons and people who adapt to every attack and cloaking and sensor evasion, you HAVE to come up with new techniques or get killed.

The beam isn't all that big, form what I've seen and it moves incredibly fast so once it fires you can't avoid it anymore. And the rebel alliance was caught completely of guard by it in ROTJ when it fired at one of their capitol ships. And they were actually watching the Death Star because they wanted to attack it.

Watching it and scanning it are two different things. That much power charging is going to be an easy red flag.
Well hyperspace was faster but that should do too I guess.

How fast is hyperspace in light speeds? Or is the travel via bending space?
Its going to be the biggest enemy ship there...

Fair enough. SW seems to have some weird size fetish so I guess they'd want to get rid of something so big.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
[B]The programming won't matter. It'd just be overwritten or suppressed for the new programming.

How do you know? Clones were made for only one thing, they obey orders without question i'm not so sure they can take over


They'll adapt to weaponry.

If they can even do that... But the casualty's will still be incredibly high, and let them blow up a few droids more will come to fight.

From the movies alone, the only ship I can remember getting blown up in one shot was a bird-of-prey but that was a pretty small ship.

So size does matter afterall, and I'm just saying that those weapons never really destroyed an entire planet, so I don't know if they can do it... But seeing as they can hardly take out anything but a small ship fast I would seriously doubt it. Just look at how much time they have between each shot fired at them, and the time to repair their shields and all that crap.


ST has their engineers. They have their own groups of people in science ships testing and refining. They also have the engineers that keep the regular ships going that discover techniques and refine on the field.

Okay, but this is on a small ship how many of them could there be? How would they compare against those working on Coruscant or whatever.

ST has gunships as well and can travel faster than light. What do you think warp is?
A few pages earlier Janus described the difference between Wapr and Hyper... Warp had set speeds incredibly fast and whatever, Hyperdrive engines could give you virtually unlimited amounts of speed. Faster then Warp then.

That's impractical. Only something insanely great and complicated would be worth returning to a station for. They have replicators and spare parts for stuff that won't replicate. If it's that great and they have the time they'll have the schematics sent to them and their teams will upgrade the ship themselves.

Right, so they can replace existing parts... And for SW its hardly impractical, if your only a few hours away sending one Super Star Destroyer to get upgrades isn't that impractical, one's it returns you send the new one.

I think you're under the allusion that all the Star Trek ships are like lone wolves out doing whatever with minimal communication. And that the captain is the only one who's trained. But that's not true. In the case of the Federation, it IS the army in the future. They make daily reports, they've got organized systems, specialists, the works.

Far from... I'm just saying that they have limits with how much they can work together. Limits that SW does not seem to have, because of greater speed. Of course they are not alone but lets say somebody on earth develops a new weapon that could penetrate the deflector shields on the Death Star with some new material. In SW they could return to that planet get upgrades and attack the thing thousands of systems away all in one day. In ST that would take months.

Have you ever heard the phrase "necessity is the mother of invention"? What did the Empire have to deal with? A small band of resistance? When you have to fight people with time distorting weapons and people who adapt to every attack and cloaking and sensor evasion, you HAVE to come up with new techniques or get killed.

I know, but does it not seem reasonable to you that a ship build for war, who'se only purpose is to fight would naturally be more ready to fight then an ST ship that operates on its own, most of the time. SW is build for large scale fights. ST can fight, yes but they are not build for it. Their ships weren't build for destroying moons, planets or a lot of other ships. They don't have fighters or whatever they are for exploring mostly. They do fight and they can fight, but SW is designed for it.

Watching it and scanning it are two different things. That much power charging is going to be an easy red flag.

Okay so they were scanning, whatever you want to call it. They were scanning and looking at the Death Star keeping their eye on it and they still didn't see it coming. Besides SW can jam those scanners. You don't just find out a way to stop that in seconds.

How fast is hyperspace in light speeds? Or is the travel via bending space?

Try looking a few pages back, Janus made a huge post about it. I don't know by head anymore but at the end SW was just faster because it could reach unlimited speed, far faster then even that mystical warp 10 thing.

Fair enough. SW seems to have some weird size fetish so I guess they'd want to get rid of something so big.

I would hardly call it a fetish, more smart thinking. If you are up against an enemy that you don't know about what are you going to attack first? The biggest thing you see or the smaller things? I would take out the biggest first, especially if I could do it with one shot.

Originally posted by Fishy
How do you know? Clones were made for only one thing, they obey orders without question i'm not so sure they can take over

Because the technology suppresses the person's individuality, instincts, and memory. They are essentially a vessel to carry out the hive's will.
If they can even do that... But the casualty's will still be incredibly high, and let them blow up a few droids more will come to fight.

I don't see why they wouldn't be able to. Drones have personal forcefields and lightsaber blades and blaster shots are energy are they not?
So size does matter afterall

To hold itself together, yeah. Enterprise E was getting fired at by that same ship with plasma torpedoes and taking pretty heavy damage, because they had stolen the shield frequency, but it held together after many, many hits.
and I'm just saying that those weapons never really destroyed an entire planet, so I don't know if they can do it... But seeing as they can hardly take out anything but a small ship fast I would seriously doubt it.

Don't jump to conclusions now. The newer movies without the suck technology were all about the Enterprise. A Federation ship. The good guys. Photon torpedoes are mainly Federation. Asking if photon torpedoes can destroy a planet is essentially asking if the good guys have ever bombed a planet.

They have disabled many-a-ships on the shows but generally don't go for the kill. The borg... oddly, I don't think they destroy a lot of big ships either. They beam them into their cube and disable it, board it, and strip it.

Just look at how much time they have between each shot fired at them, and the time to repair their shields and all that crap.

That's really a credit to their weapons isn't it?
Okay, but this is on a small ship how many of them could there be? How would they compare against those working on Coruscant or whatever.

On a science ship, there could be anywhere from 70-200 crew members. There are folks in space stations, their respective stations, and outposts that do research as well.
Right, so they can replace existing parts... And for SW its hardly impractical, if your only a few hours away sending one Super Star Destroyer to get upgrades isn't that impractical, one's it returns you send the new one.

That's really more of a credit to the travel speed. It isn't going to help unless they have to race somewhere or escape.
Far from... I'm just saying that they have limits with how much they can work together. Limits that SW does not seem to have, because of greater speed. Of course they are not alone but lets say somebody on earth develops a new weapon that could penetrate the deflector shields on the Death Star with some new material. In SW they could return to that planet get upgrades and attack the thing thousands of systems away all in one day. In ST that would take months.

How would somebody on Earth find out a material pierced the death star's shields? That's something you can only find out on the field or by stealing information. I suppose if they couldn't replicate it they could send a freighter and use wormholes. If it's that desperate of a situation, they can send the cargo back in time so it arrives quicker. Why a material and not a type of weapon that they could just modify torpedoes or phaser banks to be?
I know, but does it not seem reasonable to you that a ship build for war, who'se only purpose is to fight would naturally be more ready to fight then an ST ship that operates on its own, most of the time. SW is build for large scale fights. ST can fight, yes but they are not build for it. Their ships weren't build for destroying moons, planets or a lot of other ships. They don't have fighters or whatever they are for exploring mostly. They do fight and they can fight, but SW is designed for it.

Because they usually operate solo, they're designed to hold their own. A lot of the exploration ships are as heavily armed and armored as the gun ships, if not more as they don't have the luxury of back up most of the time.
Okay so they were scanning, whatever you want to call it. They were scanning and looking at the Death Star keeping their eye on it and they still didn't see it coming. Besides SW can jam those scanners. You don't just find out a way to stop that in seconds.

Star wars don't seem to be that great. Seeing all the shots of the screens, it looks like they're about as complex as an Atari.

I know after one shot they'll know to stay away from the giant circle but damn the movie's single borg cube! Really, I think the borg are their only hope in that case.

Try looking a few pages back, Janus made a huge post about it. I don't know by head anymore but at the end SW was just faster because it could reach unlimited speed, far faster then even that mystical warp 10 thing.

Hmm... Wikipedia describes it as closer to the space distorting method of travel. And that Star Trek does indeed use, or at least the concept, it for communications.

Oh, and the mystical warp 10 is infinite speed.

I would hardly call it a fetish, more smart thinking. If you are up against an enemy that you don't know about what are you going to attack first? The biggest thing you see or the smaller things? I would take out the biggest first, especially if I could do it with one shot.

Size isn't always relative to power. The future Janeway's ship had the power to destroy borg ships with one shot. And the Species 8472 bio ships could destroy them with one beam as well with their flower-like beam attack and all the ships needed to use that attack combined aren't as big as a borg cube, a star destroyer, or even an average star trek ship.

LOL the atari thing does fit ...lol but being more of a star wars fan I have to say ST had cheesier games than star wars atari empire strikes back game at the time!( I use to love that one)...lol....anyways NJO Luke force cammnds all the borg the planeteater weakassminded Q and everyone else to just headbutt each other to death........ end of line