GalacticStorm
Smart Alec Know-It-All
"says LT is the highest in the Food chain (not Phoenix Force)"
Because LT is the highest in the food chain. The Phoenix force doesnt exist as a being unto itself. It is the primal force of creation which those born with the right genetic potential tap into. It is not a being that Thanos could vanquish. The avatars themselves can see the outcomes of events from the white hot room and it is from seeing this that the Voice decideds when to send the avatars down below to carry out its work. In the End Thanos gave up his power. There was no need for intervention. Without Jeans intervention in the M'kraan crystal situation the multiverse would have ceased to exist.
"Eternity holding many universes."
Youve misunderstood your own proof. If you actually read the scan and its captions it says that eternity is time incarnate. He is not literally holding universes he is showing Strange many universese from past and present. Jean literally held the univers in her hand and then directly affected it. Im sorry but as i suspected this is clearly a visualisation.
"here is another showing death is multiversal"
Ok cool deaths multiversal but it doesnt exist outside of the multiverse it runs through it. Phoenix is beyond deaths power, death is dependent on the phoenix. The phoenixes exist outside of the multiverse only entering our plane of reality when their work is needed.
IG punked deaths form in the 616 universe not death as a whole. Death takes on many forms in different universes but as you have shown there is only one death entity. Ig just dealt with death in 616 theres absolutely no evidence whatsoever that death as a whole was defeated only its incarnation in 616. Unlike when the beyonder handled death where the multiversal effects were clearly stated. There are many phoenixes(avatars) throughout the universe however there is only one multiversal force behind them. Shards of the phoenix have been defeated by Set and the goblin force in alternate realities but either entity would be childs play for one who commands the totality of the force's multiversal power. In that respect death and phoenix are alike it seems. Both have forms in different universes however both are single multiversal things Phoenix embodies both life and death it creates the multiverse and destroys it. Without the phoenix there would be no death because phoenix is life.
"you are saying Phoenix Force = TOAA "
Not once in this thread have i said that phoenix IS TOAA. I said that it is heavily suggested to be the case by Chris C and Grant M. However i then went on to state what is definitely the case as is stated in the comics.
"Phoenix Force had to follow LT will to save her universe. (not a fraction the entire force)"
What you forget KG is that the phoenix was retconned. This scan is of the retcon era but fortunately such foolishness is now a thing of the past. The phoenix was never a being that acted independently like this as was originally intended by Chris C. Phoenix wasnt a separate force at all. Phoenix actually came into being when the primal force of creation became one with Jean after she burnt up and became a being of pure thought. She then reformed and called herself phoenix because of her rebirth.
Phoenix was basically downgraded into "just another cosmic being" as Zephro put it earlier. It was made a separate force called Phoenix itself and given a different origin and was made to be simply an entity composed of the energy from the psyches of all living things as opposed to phoenix being a union of Jean and the primal force of creation. It was this entity that LT commanded. Chris C's Phoenix would never have done this.
Grant Morrison went on to fix this mess by making it so that certain individuals are born with the genetic potential to tap into the primal force of creation becoming a phoenix. The name merely representative of their rebirth into a higher state and not the name of a separate force.
These phoenixes all exist in the white hot room. The phoenix was made to be the avatars themselves and a higher consciousness which regulates them in the white hot room outside or the multiverse. It was this that was suggested to be TOAA.
In Chris C's original phoenix story and in GM's which is now continuity Jean is referred to as the Phoenix of the White Crown.
Go to this link and look under the title "The Hebrew Triad":
http://www.prs.org/gallery-kabblh.htm
The crown is one of the sephiroth. The sephiroth are one of ten attributes that God created to project himself into the Universe of Man.
Check out this link for confirmation:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sephirah
Do you see the connection now. Jean burnt up in re entry and became a being of thought. The primal force of creation joined with her making her phoenix. Jean is called the phoenix of the white crown. The crown is one of the sephiroth which God uses to enter our plane of existence.
The other phoenix avatars are likened to seraphim. The definition of seraphim is:
"Definitions of Seraphim on the Web:
mentioned in Isa. 6:2, 3, 6, 7. This word means fiery ones, in allusion, as is supposed, to their burning love. They are represented as "standing" above the King as he sat upon his throne, ready at once to minister unto him. Their form appears to have been human, with the addition of wings. (See ANGELS.) This word, in the original, is used elsewhere only of the "fiery serpents" (Num. 21:6, 8; Deut. 8:15; comp. Isa. 14:29; 30:6) sent by God as his instruments to inflict on the people the righteous penalty of sin."
You cannot fail to see the connection. The seraphim are called the "fiery ones". What are the phoenixes in Marvel comics if not fiery both in appearance (the energy signature) and in passion. The phoenixes do after all embody the passion to create and destroy. Also the seraphim are depicted to be fiery humans with wings. NUFF SAID!!!!
Grant Morrisons Phoenixes on order of the Voice are sent down into our reality to perform a healing or a disinfection. The Seraphim were the King(Gods) highest order of angels which attended him and he sent down from heaven to burn away what was not right in the world of man. Much like the Phoenixes disinfection duties eh? Jean in New Xmen when Prof X addresses her as Phoenix says that she must perform her destined disinfection. It is her job to burn away what doesnt work.
This is the phoenix of continuity. This is supported by endsong which states that Jean and Phoenix are one and the same. Greg Pak also states that endsong fully supports both CC and Gm's takes on the phoenix. Heres another link where he states this:
http://www.newsarama.com/Qrama/Qrama7.htm
Im sorry guys but this is continuity.