Mace vs Palps

Originally posted by Nai Fohl
Read the ****ing ROTS novel ! Hell...people just get me crazy with that kind of stuff. Write it on a piece of paper and pin it to your monitor:

Mace started fight Sidious.
Mace used his shatterpoint ability to disarm Sidious.
Sidious threw so much power at Mace that the power he channeled was ravaging his mortal frame.
Sidious got his ass kicked an without Anakin helping him he simply would have get killed there.

And it doesn't matter if the outcome of the fight was the decission of SJ or GL...you see what you see in the movies and that is Sidious going down vs Mace. Case closed.

Sidious didn't get his ass kicked. People say Yoda and Mace both kicked his ass. Sorry, they would've each killed him if they kicked his ass. You can say BARELY defeated at best. But Sidious killed Mace. And Sidious defeated Yoda. Case closed.

Sidious killed Mace with luck, if anakin wasnt there, well, bye bye sidous.

The msitake in yoda vs sidious was losing his saber, that shifted the entire battle.

Palpatine wins. He knew that Mace was not the chosen one so he just took it easy.

I would like to take the 'Palps played easy on Mace so that Anakin would fall' argument, but it's gone back and forth so many times that nobody really cares.

I say Mace, in a contest of lightsabers, and Sidious, in a contest of the Force.

I say you're wrong. Mace was incredibly strong in the force and Palpatine was no stronger then Yoda.

Originally posted by Count Kent
I say you're wrong. Mace was incredibly strong in the force and Palpatine was no stronger then Yoda.

Mace is weaker than Yoda and Sidious in the Force.

Mace can best Palpatine in a lightsaber battle but that's it. Palpatine could have killed Mace with a Force Push at the end. Mace would have got thrown out of the office and into the slums below.

Mace was virtually undefeatable as of ROTS when compared to other force users at the time. His battle precognition combined with his shatterpoint combined with his vaapad combined with his incredible defence against the force (DAF) meant that basically nobody could defeat him.

Originally posted by Count Kent
Mace was virtually undefeatable as of ROTS when compared to other force users at the time. His battle precognition combined with his shatterpoint combined with his vaapad combined with his incredible defence against the force (DAF) meant that basically nobody could defeat him.

Explain how my post was hypocritical.

Originally posted by Count Kent
Explain how my post was hypocritical.

Originally posted by Count Kent
Thanks for the supprort Depwnzor, oh and Rex, I apologise. I have recently been informed that a site that I frequent that is supershadow-esqe contains N-Canon material. I will no longer talk about uncanonical events or people.

Now look at:

Originally posted by Count Kent
Mace was virtually undefeatable as of ROTS when compared to other force users at the time. His battle precognition combined with his shatterpoint combined with his vaapad combined with his incredible defence against the force (DAF) meant that basically nobody could defeat him.

And if you want me to point it out, it goes like this: You promise to stop with the bullshit, you get banned, you come back; and now you claim that Mace had in fact, become more powerful so that "basically nobody could defeat him" when Dooku, Sids and Yoda could beat him.

That's my opinion and not bs. And I was being sarcastic with that comment to Rex.

Get it through your head. No one is denying Mace's incredible skill, which was on par with Dooku - and possibly superior. Hell, he may have legitimately overpowered Palpatine in a contest of lightsabers.

But he is weaker than Yoda and Palpatine in the Force. By a good margin.

That's your opinion.

Well, his perception and grasp of the Force is amazing, as his shatterpoint technique as a youngling surpassed that of most Jedi Masters. Some examples:

- After being set up and captured, he's questioned by a man named Geptun: instantly, revealed in his mind are a dozen points on the man's body where a single blow would break him.
- A Corusca gem is described as being hard enough to withstand a full-on blow from a 5 kg hammer. Mace could shatter it with a gentle tap on its weak points, which are nigh impossible to find.
- When trying to rescue a group of children in an oven of a steamcrawler, he uses the Force to swiftly trace the network of cracks and fissures to a single weak point, and then brings an entire cliff down.
- He literally rides this like a wave, manipulating parts of its course to get to the sandcrawler.

His raw power is impressive as well:

- After he triggers a landslide, one of the kids in the vehicle shoot at him, disrupting his focus. The landslide is lost from his control, and begins to drag the steamcrawler into a volcano. On his back, Mace manages to grip and suspend - in the air - the entire landslide, which was said to consist of several hundred metric tons of rock, earth, and the ilk.
- In When They Were Brothers, he gets pissed off at Grievous, who'd just killed Adi Gallia, and slams him into the ground with a massive swoop.

And on a side note, when he was but fourteen and went to Hurikane to find the elements of his almost prophesized lightsaber, he was frightened by a band of natives, and hurled them into an abyss.

I'd have to say, however, that Mace's most impressive feats are in the ways he manipulates his physical self with the Force. There are far too many to list, but here're a couple.

- Against Kar Vastor, he launches himself with such speed and power that he and the shaman are suspended in the air for enough time to engage in a short, airborne brawl.
- In the same battle, he fires off six combination blows - two elbows, a pair of crosses, a knee to the midsection, and a palm to the face - before his enemy can blink.

If you want martial and dueling feats as well, I can provide some.

You can't be selective about this, Kent. Mace admits that Yoda would have handled the steamcrawler situation far better; he claims Yoda would have been able to casually lift the streamcrawler on top of the volcano while muttering something like "Size matters not" then would have been able to easily stop the landslide. Mace pretty much admits inferiority in the force to Yoda.

He's humble. Yoda's arrogant. Plus also consider that Yoda was growing less powerful while Mace was quickly growing more powerful - he hadn't even reached his peak. I'm not disputing that Sidious as of DE, and Yoda in his day were more powerful then Mace, however as of ROTS, Mace is the strongest.

Dark Rendevous almost outright states Yoda is stronger and better...since when was Yoda getting weaker?

Since he was ancient, way past his peak and dying.

Not so. You don't DECREASE in power as the years wear on. You decrease in physical ability, sure, but not power in the Force. Otherwise, Dooku, Yoda, and Sidious would suck terribly. Bad argument.

As for Yoda's arrogance...we don't see anyone call him arrogant except a Sith Lord who hates him, do we?