Iceman (full potential) vs. Superman

Sup Demi. Good to have you back homie. What did you think of the NBA Draft?

Now to business:

I would argue that his cells are protected. Hence why he never gets sick. There were times where he drank poison. Inhaled fire, taken a bite out of a rock etc. The theory I was always familiar with was that his cells became supercharged and each one emitted the aura.

His cells eminate the biomatrix.

The biomatrix is a byproduct of a biochemical process. When his cells metabolize the metaprotein created from absorbing and metabolizing sunlight and radiant cosmic emissions, the biomatrix is created as a byproduct of this process, meaning when the protein is being broken down, the stored energy is released and creates an energy retentive field around Supes body as a side effect. The catalyst for this biochemical process within the cells can be destroyed by Iceman because using his powers, and riding the lines of Superman's own body composition, he can destroy the cellular peptides in Supes by removing or freezing all moisture in his cells, which would in turn cause this biochemical process to halt and short out Supes "forcefield" (or better yet, "energy field).

Supes cells need moisture, his absorption of sunlight allows him to sustain himself without food and contain the fluids within him from evaporating or being expelled due to overheating (sweating), leaving him without need to replenish them at most times. If all moisture were removed from his organic being, he'd lack cellular cohesion and the ability to faciltate his bodily functions down to a cellular level, being reduced to his base elements.

Basically, he'd be like dehydrated, powdered milk, but in this case, Powdered Kryptonian.

Sup Ill. How ya been. About the NBA Draft: Yawn. Dull. But that's what happens when an Aussie is your #1 pick. Looks like the NBA is quickly becoming UN: Basketball Edition. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

The only good news is that it appears the Knicks' pick might be pretty good. They've needed to get big for awhile...this is a pretty good first step, though I still don't think 6'11" is great as far as centers go...

But since it looks like we'll be getting an off-topic thread made out of the debator thread shortly, you can post a reply there, lol.

On topic: good analysis on Superman's power. Nothing to add.

lol, no prob man.

Just gotta say this: Every time I hear Bogut's name it reminds me of that show "Mr. Bogus" and I can't help but laugh.

Oh, and that Zeke better make some moves. We got Q-Rich from PHX, but we lost a big (K. Thomas). The rest of my hoop comments will go in the appropriate thread.

But as for the actual topic, Supes is murked. Iceman simply has a trump card in this fight that popularity can't overcome.

Originally posted by illadelph12

But as for the actual topic, Supes is murked. Iceman simply has a trump card in this fight that popularity can't overcome.

AMEN

Some great points in this forum, but Icemans chances are still slim to none.

He's have to get to supes which could be impossible if supes wanted it to be.

He does have vulnerabilities, Kryptonite, and Magic. Ice and cold were never included in these. Techincally, supes does not need to sleep, eat, drink, or breathe ever since his revival from the DD battle. He can survive on sunlight alone. Early science has not yet figured out his true physiology, and that is why he has not been able to be cloned yet.

Bobby would end up getting trapped at most, like if Nightcrawler materialized into a wall..or line Whirly said "urinated" out...if Supes even urinates or defacates.

There's way the hell too many openings for Iceman to get in. No way Supes can block every pore. Just because Superman thinks he has won doesn't mean he has. Bobby could turn into vapor as soon as the fight starts. Supes thinks his adversary is gone and leaves. Bobby follows, gets into Superman's system, and kills him.

Turning all of the fluids in Superman's body to ice by way of absolute zero temperatures would kill him. Nothing remains liquid at absolute zero, all particle motion stops completely. Iceman can transfer his consciusness across any liquid, it's nigh on impossible to trap him. The fluid draining would work just as well.

If Superman's metabolism is clean i.e. produces no toxic substances he does not need to urinate replenish any water within him. He does need to recycle that water though, going by the pretty accurate description of Supes abilities. It's not so much he doesn't need water, it's more he doesn't sweat/urinate so he can survive without water. Oxygen is a requirement for even his photosynthetic super metabolism I'd wager, and a source of carbon. Sleep is necessary for humans, dreams keep us sane, but I dunno if that applies to Supes.

Now if Iceman enters his cells if he freezes the water the cells are perforated. If he brings Supes cells to absolute zero where molecules lose all energy and cease all movement then Superman would die.

Great theory, but we are talking about a being that doesnt make any sense. He can live in the sun. Cause gale winds from human sized lungs (which shol d be impossible no matter how strong you are) Move so fast that he can control the weather. Defy gravity at will. Move planets physically. Is immune to sickness and poison. His only weaknesses are kryptonite, and magic and even those are getting toned down.

It's just as easy for him to spin in place at super speed blasting heat vision just hot enough to separate all the water molecules within a few miles radius from him back into hydrogen and oxygen. He can blow bobby miles apart where it would take him quite a long time to recompose, he could suck him in and blow him out into space rather quickly. He could fly at speeds in the area that would cause all air, and water to separate and leave a void. He could generate and electric currents...etc etc.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Great theory, but we are talking about a being that doesnt make any sense.

Originally posted by Creshosk
And a gene that gives you the power to become pure h2o does?

Not at all, but it's exactly my point. We are applying science to a being that has always been stated to only have weaknesses to magic and kryptonite.

Bobby has neither. Even if this scenario were remotely possible, it would be about 1 win in 100 for Iceman.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Great theory, but we are talking about a being that doesnt make any sense. He can live in the sun. Cause gale winds from human sized lungs (which shol d be impossible no matter how strong you are) Move so fast that he can control the weather. Defy gravity at will. Move planets physically. Is immune to sickness and poison. His only weaknesses are kryptonite, and magic and even those are getting toned down.

It's just as easy for him to spin in place at super speed blasting heat vision just hot enough to separate all the water molecules within a few miles radius from him back into hydrogen and oxygen. He can blow bobby miles apart where it would take him quite a long time to recompose, he could suck him in and blow him out into space rather quickly. He could fly at speeds in the area that would cause all air, and water to separate and leave a void. He could generate and electric currents...etc etc.

There's only the small problem that Supes would have no idea that Bobby became water vapor. He's impossible to discern from normal water vapor. Superman would likely leave and deem the battle won while Iceman infiltrates his body. Superman could probably kill Bobby, but would not know to until it's too late.

EDIT: 1/100? Superman has been killed by pure brute force before, but that's far from being his weakness. The magic/kryptonite things are his mainweaknesses, but something as extreme as having all the moisture in his body suddenly drop to absolute zero would work just fine. Superman just has no way to see or keep out Iceman. No one but telepaths could.

Originally posted by Dizzle
There's only the small problem that Supes would have no idea that Bobby became water vapor. He's impossible to discern from normal water vapor. Superman would likely leave and deem the battle won while Iceman infiltrates his body. Superman could probably kill Bobby, but would not know to until it's too late.

That may be true, but I still don't think Bobby has the power to pull it off.
If this was possible, there would not be any chance for supes to go anywhere near the sun. It would dry out his mucus membranes, and eyes causing him great discomfort, and also wither him from the inside essentially dehydrating him... After all, its just heat, and light right? No reason for his immune system to kick in either...but for some reason, the heat, or radiation doesnt affect him. Its not like he plugs his nose, covers his mouth and puts on earplugs to go into the sun or freezing conditions of space.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Not at all, but it's exactly my point. We are applying science to a being that has always been stated to only have weaknesses to magic and kryptonite.

It's not all that sciency, Iceman dehydrates Superman. . .

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
That may be true, but I still don't think Bobby has the power to pull it off.
If this was possible, there would not be any chance for supes to go anywhere near the sun. It would dry out his mucus membranes, and eyes causing him great discomfort, and also wither him from the inside essentially dehydrating him... After all, its just heat, and light right? No reason for his immune system to kick in either...but for some reason, the heat, or radiation doesnt affect him. Its not like he plugs his nose, covers his mouth and puts on earplugs to go into the sun or freezing conditions of space.

Originally posted by Dizzle
EDIT: 1/100? Superman has been killed by pure brute force before, but that's far from being his weakness. The magic/kryptonite things are his mainweaknesses, but something as extreme as having all the moisture in his body suddenly drop to absolute zero would work just fine. Superman just has no way to see or keep out Iceman. No one but telepaths could.

I knew this was going to come up. It took a DD powered villain and pis writing to kill supes through pure physical force. With his current upgrades, DD is now his B*tch. Bobby is definitely not killing him that way.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
I knew this was going to come up. It took a DD powered villain and pis writing to kill supes through pure physical force. With his current upgrades, DD is now his B*tch. Bobby is definitely not killing him that way.

Why? Superman can survive without any water in his body now?

I used that as a counter example to the 'superman only gets hurt from magic and kryptonite!!!!' thing. Didn't say Iceman could pummel Supes. And his skintight biofield protects Supes from intense external cold/heat. But it doesn't stop him from eating, drinking, etc. Also, the sun powers Supes, so the good it does should counteract the harm it potentially could do were the biofield not there.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Because it powers him up so it would power up his resistence to such things?

If you put a plant near the sun it would vaporize. A solar powered battery would do the same.

I love pizza, but I couldnt live inside an ocean of melted cheese and sauce (although it sounds damn tasty)

I need water to survive myself, but If I kept drinking endlessly, I would die from it.

If the sun's heat, and radiation don't hurt even the sensitive membranes that lines supes nose, or even flame up the gel in his hair. I dont see any difference in bobbys attack.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
If you put a plant near the sun it would vaporize.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
A solar powered battery would do the same.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
I love pizza, but I couldnt live inside an ocean of melted cheese and sauce (although it sounds damn tasty)

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
I need water to survive myself, but If I kept drinking endlessly, I would die from it.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
If the sun's heat, and radiation don't hurt even the sensitive membranes that lines supes nose, or even flame up the gel in his hair. I dont see any difference in bobbys attack.

Originally posted by Dizzle
I used that as a counter example to the 'superman only gets hurt from magic and kryptonite!!!!' thing. Didn't say Iceman could pummel Supes. And his skintight biofield protects Supes from intense external cold/heat. But it doesn't stop him from eating, drinking, etc. Also, the sun powers Supes, so the good it does should counteract the harm it potentially could do were the biofield not there.

I know you didn't say that. We both know he cant..just explaing why I didnt bring the force thing into that catagory.

Supes enjoys eating/drinking because he was raised as a human, but he doesnt actually need it to survive. He looks human, but he isn't.

Now his shield is part psionic/biolelectrical in nature. Why both? So the writers have an excuse as to why he is invulnerable to so much even though he shouldnt be.