Originally posted by Rampant ox
Can you prove he couldnt, because it doesnt seem that hard to do. Dooku would lift one hand and fire lightning and with the other hand strike with his blade. Dooku fights with one hand so it would not be too difficult to do.
well can you prove that dooku can strike with lightning and hit at the same time? not even NJO luke can do that, maybe he can
thats like saying o because maul used a double bladed saber so therefore he PWNS vader and pwns the jedi council
Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
[B]ok, so you mean to tell me, that if youre on the phone with someone you cant tell if theyre mad, calm, anxious, or any other emotion? Whats the point of criminologists studying speech stress patterns if you HAVE to look at someones face to see theyre mood?? Exactly, thank YOU.
OK good point. But lets look at Dooku's voice if you will. The only time I can here it falter (feel free to correct me) is when he is in a saber lock with ROTS Anakin - and this is not because he is scared or impatient, it is because he is using a fair amount of strength to keep Anakins blade at bay. I would personally say the two have about the same amount of patience and it is ridiculous to say that Vader has more because of voice/facial expressions because he wears a mask and usually has a monotone voice anyway. Also if one did have more patience than the other it would be by such a small amount that it would be irrelevant anyway.
And yes, while patience is something that CAN take awhile, but again, its like if youre arguing with someone and theyre mad and you remain calm, they get more mad and lose the edge. If Vader stays calm and Dooku gets more and more mad, then he will make a mistake quicker and Vader will capitalize.
True, but it could work the other way around also. Vader could be the one getting impatient therefore Dooku will capitalise. However like I said before the difference will be so little it would make mo difference to the outcome of the fight.
And ok, maybe uncomfortable was the wrong termanology, but just one example of when Dooku looked...less at ease was when he was fighting Anakin and he was saying how he had fear and anger and didnt use them, like the fact that Anakin didnt use them, it pissed him off, hence losing his cool.
Like I said in my first post I think that is more due to the fact he was struggling to keep Skywalkers blade at bay. Frustration I dont think would have been a factor.
I know you'd jump Dooku's lap if you had the opportunity, but face facts, Vader owns...
No. If Vader did win, which I very highly doubt, then it would only be by a small margin.
Originally posted by ESB Vader
well can you prove that dooku can strike with lightning and hit at the same time? not even NJO luke can do that, maybe he can
Thats bullsh*t, just because we dont see him doing it doesnt mean he cant. We dont see the Count eating - doesnt mean he doesnt. We dont see the Count boarding the Invisible Hand - doesnt mean he didnt.
Also sorry for the double post.
Originally posted by Rampant ox
Thats bullsh*t, just because we dont see him doing it doesnt mean he cant. We dont see the Count eating - doesnt mean he doesnt. We dont see the Count boarding the Invisible Hand - doesnt mean he didnt.Also sorry for the double post.
I agree there. There are sources which claim that Dooku uses one hand free for using the force while engaging in saber combat, and we did see him using the force to fend of Obi and at the same time win a saber lock against Anakin and kick him away....
Originally posted by Rampant ox
Thats bullsh*t, just because we dont see him doing it doesnt mean he cant. We dont see the Count eating - doesnt mean he doesnt. We dont see the Count boarding the Invisible Hand - doesnt mean he didnt.Also sorry for the double post.
o? so darth vader can create a force storm because we havnt seen him doing it? thats pure bull sh!t and dooku would never ever do lightning at combat range, see what happened to palpatine when he did it at combat range to mace? he got injured and stunned BY his own lightning which will happen to tyranus besides didnt sidious know that anakin was going to get injured and not become more powerful than him? if so then theres a reason why he allowed anakin to kill count dooku
Originally posted by kamikz
I agree there. There are sources which claim that Dooku uses one hand free for using the force while engaging in saber combat, and we did see him using the force to fend of Obi and at the same time win a saber lock against Anakin and kick him away....
thats in a saber lock not while dooku is striking at the same time
Originally posted by Velkyn
I think this all depends on who got what power off first, the lightning blast of Tyrannus or Vaders force grip, which he was proficient enough to utilize it over a commscreen. Saber duel only - Tyrannus by a landslide.
and makashi is useless against a form V practisioner ESPECIALLY against some one who has mastered it to its finest, even if the makashi user mastered his to its highest degree.
makashi CANNOT beat a blow from djemso/shien
Originally posted by ESB Vader
o? so darth vader can create a force storm because we havnt seen him doing it?
No for two reasons. A) his mechanical limbs probably wouldnt be able to and B) he doesnt know how. Dooku knows how to use force lightning, knows how to strike with his saber so there is no reason he couldnt do both together - especially since he only fights with one hand.
and dooku would never ever do lightning at combat range, see what happened to palpatine when he did it at combat range to mace?
Thats because Mace uses Vapaad and it works like a superconducting loop, sending the lightning back at him.
he got injured and stunned BY his own lightning which will happen to tyranus
Perhaps, but Vader will be dead before it will do any significant damage.
besides didnt sidious know that anakin was going to get injured and not become more powerful than him? if so then theres a reason why he allowed anakin to kill count dooku
I dont understand. Sidious didnt know that Anakin was going to be injured, he wanted the strongest apprentice he could get, not a robot. He even say "Vader will become more powerful than either of us".
thats in a saber lock not while dooku is striking at the same time
Its probably easier to use the force out of a saber lock than in one. Point moot.
Originally posted by Rampant ox
No for two reasons. A) his mechanical limbs probably wouldnt be able to and B) he doesnt know how. Dooku knows how to use force lightning, knows how to strike with his saber so there is no reason he couldnt do both together - especially since he only fights with one hand.
o but vader also fights with 1 hand? so? vader could crush dooku with force crush and can you prove that dooku can do that?
Originally posted by Rampant ox
Thats because Mace uses Vapaad and it works like a superconducting loop, sending the lightning back at him.
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so? vader could use the force to shield him
Originally posted by Rampant ox
I dont understand. Sidious didnt know that Anakin was going to be injured, he wanted the strongest apprentice he could get, not a robot. He even say "Vader will become more powerful than either of us".
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sidious knew that if anakin didnt get injured anakin would have killed him, he wants a powerful apprentice, not more powerful than him
Originally posted by Rampant oxIts probably easier to use the force out of a saber lock than in one. Point moot. [/B]
o? did dooku used lightning on anakin? why not? because anakin could have blocked the lightning and use the force to immobalise dooku, vader is clearly stronger than anakin
and that was in as saber lock, what is going to stop from vader using crush which immobalises their enemies? once crush gets on you, you cant move you cant do anything, even if dooku created a shield, vader could cut him with his lightsaber
and vader has knowledge of makashi, he knows how to counter it, you cant parry a full blow of form V easily
No, Sidious picked Anakin to follow on the legacy of the sith. He would never have struggled so much to get him if all he wanted was for him to become weaker, then he could have picked countless of other people....
And since when is the crush an insta-kill, unblockable force power? I sure didn't see Vader using it on any of the jedi or the dark lady or Maul when he faced them, clearly not that effective. Dooku on the other hand, uses lightning on almost every occasion...
Originally posted by ESB Vader
[B]o but vader also fights with 1 hand? so? vader could crush dooku with force crush and can you prove that dooku can do that?
He fights with one hand against Luke who is pathetically weak. He would need both hands to contend with Dooku. Makashi however is made to use only one hand. Also if Vader did only use one hand the strength of his attacks would diminish.
so? vader could use the force to shield him
When have we ever seen someone to use the force to shield themselves. I personally dont remember any (not to say there arent). Could you please provise some examples.
sidious knew that if anakin didnt get injured anakin would have killed him, he wants a powerful apprentice, not more powerful than him
No, Sidious did not know nor want Vader to be injured. Which is why he states quite assuringly "Lord vadrer will become more powerful than either of us".
o? did dooku used lightning on anakin? why not? because anakin could have blocked the lightning and use the force to immobalise dooku,
and that was in as saber lock,
That was also when Dooku did not want to kill Anakin, hence in that saber lock he was goading him on. "You have hate, you have anger, but you dont use them".
what is going to stop from vader using crush which immobalises their enemies? once crush gets on you, you cant move you cant do anything, even if dooku created a shield, vader could cut him with his lightsaber
Well then it would come down to who is quicker, who we all know is Dooku.
and vader has knowledge of makashi, he knows how to counter it,
Dooku also has extensive knowledge of Djem So because he was the temples saber instructor before he left the order.
you cant parry a full blow of form V easily
No you cant. But parrying the attack instaed of meeting it head on makes it a damn lot easier.
Originally posted by Rampant ox
He fights with one hand against Luke who is pathetically weak. He would need both hands to contend with Dooku. Makashi however is made to use only one hand. Also if Vader did only use one hand the strength of his attacks would diminish.
number1 vader uses a 1 handed variation form of form V whom is equal to his anakin counter part and him using 2 hands is going to blow dooku apart, and do you have any idea how powerful vaders strikes are? dooku can only parry and not block vaders attack, o and didnt he use 2 hands for makashi when anakin overpowered him? which apparently cost him both his hands?
anakin beat dooku and vader is far stronger than anakin i dont see why vader would lose
Originally posted by Rampant oxWhen have we ever seen someone to use the force to shield themselves. I personally dont remember any (not to say there arent). Could you please provise some examples.
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Originally posted by Rampant oxThat was also when Dooku did not want to kill Anakin, hence in that saber lock he was goading him on. "You have hate, you have anger, but you dont use them".
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he wanted to kill obi wan, theres no reason why he wouldnt kill anakin
Originally posted by Rampant oxWell then it would come down to who is quicker, who we all know is Dooku.[/B]
and being fast doesnt mean you will escape a force attack, force crush appears around the outline of your body and it appears there, it doesnt travel in a line like lightning
Originally posted by Rampant oxDooku also has extensive knowledge of Djem So because he was the temples saber instructor before he left the order.
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yes and he can counter it with soresu which he doesnt use, he prefers makashi which will cost him his life
Originally posted by Rampant ox
No you cant. But parrying the attack instaed of meeting it head on makes it a damn lot easier. [/B]
Originally posted by kamikzAnd since when is the crush an insta-kill, unblockable force power? I sure didn't see Vader using it on any of the jedi or the dark lady or Maul when he faced them, clearly not that effective. Dooku on the other hand, uses lightning on almost every occasion...
i never said its insta kill i said it immobalises you and crushes you
vader demonstrated it in ROTS at the end when he found out he "killed" padme and vader used it to kill some one in visionaries.
and dooku DID not use lightning in ROTS
That is why it's been demonstrated once right?
No, you can't possibly mean that 2 Darth Vader's= NJO Luke, he ain't close. His potential might be that way, but his fighting skills does not nearly equal him. And Vader was 80% of Sidious, not 100%....
And it was to show you that DE Luke is leagues above DV, so saying he performed a force shield ain't helping Vader...
i never said vader = sidious i meant vaders potential was only half of what he was suppose to become and he was only able to fufill his remaining half potential because his other half was destroyed.
still even with his injuries sources say he has tremendous mastery of the force. Vader is powerful, half of his full potential, and no 2 vaders isnt njo luke your are correct, because it will be the same powers, only 2 of it,
damm am i confusing you? sorry ><
ok i mean vader according to lucas when he said "he would have been twice as powerful had he not sustained any injuries"
force shield is a basic feat performed by jaden korr and kyle katarn
yoda had done that, well ok even if vader couldnt do it, he has his lightsaber right? and dooku would do lightning at a distance not combat range, because he wont risk it damaging himself
I thought Lucas said, "twice as powerful as Sidious", not just as powerful as he was at the moment...
Well we don't know if those are canon, but either way, I'm just saying that we don't have a source of him ever doing it. Not saying Dooku will win either, I'm just trying to make some points here and there... 😛