Death Penalty

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Official statistics, yes, yes i do.

Why would anyone lie about how many people there are on the death row? What the hell are you talking about?

Oh right, or is it that people on your death penalty are murdering people, so they are giving us the wrong statistics? Yeah, thats possible too.

Maybe one day when i finish my degree, i can go work in the government and give everyone the false statistics about how many triels and convictions there are. 😱

Is it too much to ask you to post those "Official" statistics? The reason I'm asking is because I've heard many anti-death penalty groups come out with the most outrageous numbers in statistics. But since you say there are "Official" statistics I would like to see them. Can you post a link or something for everyone to see.

Whatever you do when you finished your degree is none of my business. I only care for the facts behind your arguments.

im not against or for nething like the death penalty cuz some times its rite to do unto others but only if they now the are the killer ... not some innocent....

Originally posted by WindDancer
Is it too much to ask you to post those "Official" statistics? The reason I'm asking is because I've heard many anti-death penalty groups come out with the most outrageous numbers in statistics. But since you say there are "Official" statistics I would like to see them. Can you post a link or something for everyone to see.

Whatever you do when you finished your degree is none of my business. I only care for the facts behind your arguments.

FFS, I posted them so many times in the other ''Death Penalty'' thread, that got closed, in my argument with Linkalicious.

Anti-Death penalty groups? I've never heard of such groups, what are their names?

me neither tho i just thought people did protesting

For example this one:

http://www.ncadp.org/youth_action.html

Plus, there are some "Christian Agaisn't the death penalty" groups I can't remenber the exact names right now. I might do a search on them.

lil, Is too much to ask to post at least a link to those "Official" statistics? You know what nevermind! I'll do my own search.

😬

Originally posted by ragesRemorse
These people commit viscious hanus acts, and still have not one, not two but three possiblities of trial to prove their innocence.

Your predisposition is showing. Not only do you state that these people "commit vicious heinous acts" when the issue here is that some people DON'T and are still accused - but you follow up with "trial to prove their innocence" when supposedly these pre-guilty people are in fact innocent 'till proved otherwise.

We live in a society where to be accused of a crime is enough proof of guilt for most people, because they cant conceive of a society where the government and law of the land could ever be mistaken. It's a comforting lie - and it's what makes extremes like the death sentence so damn dangerous.

Originally posted by WindDancer
For example this one:

http://www.ncadp.org/youth_action.html

Plus, there are some "Christian Agaisn't the death penalty" groups I can't remenber the exact names right now. I might do a search on them.

lil, Is too much to ask to post at least a link to those "Official" statistics? You know what nevermind! I'll do my own search.

Im actually looking through the old thread now.

And you should have done your research before you came to this thread!

RaventheOnly> “we should not let up and allow the true guilty to get a free pass because we are afraid to make a mistake”
So you’re willing to risk killing innocent people? How morbid indeed. What about the families of those innocent people who got the death-penalty? Why don’t they matter in your world-view?
“most executed we say were innocent did not have the legal system and technology we have today...”
What legal system? Are you truthfully saying the legal system of today is flawless?

Finti & BF> Why not simply castrate child-molesters and rapists? Cut “it” off, then they can’t repeat the offence?

WD>
1) And here I thought it was “innocent until proven guilty.” Not “Suspected until cleared of all charges.” When did that change?
2) It’s not a matter of how many. When did quantity matter more than quality of human life? Innocent people HAVE been sentenced to death and been killed by the state, only to later be acquitted by DNA-tests. Too late though.
As long as there is the slightest change an innocent may get sentenced I cannot understand how anyone can support the death-sentence. Not to mention the fact that it is barbaric and does not belong in a modern and civilised society.

well sed indeed....

Originally posted by The Omega
RaventheOnly> “we should not let up and allow the true guilty to get a free pass because we are afraid to make a mistake”
So you’re willing to risk killing innocent people? How morbid indeed. What about the families of those innocent people who got the death-penalty? Why don’t they matter in your world-view?
“most executed we say were innocent did not have the legal system and technology we have today...”
What legal system? Are you truthfully saying the legal system of today is flawless?

Finti & BF> Why not simply castrate child-molesters and rapists? Cut “it” off, then they can’t repeat the offence?

WD>
1) And here I thought it was “innocent until proven guilty.” Not “Suspected until cleared of all charges.” When did that change?
2) It’s not a matter of how many. When did quantity matter more than quality of human life? Innocent people HAVE been sentenced to death and been killed by the state, only to later be acquitted by DNA-tests. Too late though.
As long as there is the slightest change an innocent may get sentenced I cannot understand how anyone can support the death-sentence. Not to mention the fact that it is barbaric and does not belong in a modern and civilised society.

My god The Omega you are the breath of fresh air. And ever so right.

You have a degree in physics and maths, right? It shows, even though we are not talking about the subject.

For all your replies I have read, you have my absolute respect. And if we happen to disagree in stuff or I happen to be wrong in things, i guess it would be a no problem for me admiting my mistakes against The Omega. pray

Anyway, I found some of my old replies...so here they are.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness

- [b]About 30 to 60 prisoners are currently killed annually, most by lethal injection. About two out of three executions (65.6%) are conducted in five states: Texas, Virginia, Missouri, Florida and Oklahoma. Texas leads the other states in number of killings (256 killings; 34% of the national total). There were about 3,690 prisoners sentenced to death in 37 state death rows, and 31 being held by the U.S. government and military. 4 About 1.5% are women. Recent laws have expanded the number of crimes for which capital punishment can be applied. Other legislation has reduced some of the appeal mechanisms available to those on death row.

-About 90% of those executed could not afford a lawyer when they went to trial. They had to rely upon a court-appointed lawyer.

Doesnt that up there tell you anything?! What JUSTICE are you serving?! [/B]

How about this link here http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?scid=8&did=839

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
[b]I would like to show certain facts to you all, about which countries still practice capital punishment and those which do not....i would also like you to compare these 2 groups of countries...!

Death Penalty Outlawed

Andorra
Angola
Australia
Austria
Azerbaijan
Belgium
Bermuda
Bulgaria
Cambodia
Canada
Cape Verde
Colombia
Costa Rica
Côte d'Ivoire
Croatia
Cyprus
Czech Republic
Denmark
Djibouti
Dominican Republic
East Timor
Ecuador
Estonia
Finland
France
Georgia
Germany
Guinea-Bissau
Haiti
Honduras
Hungary
Iceland
Ireland
Italy
Kiribati
Liechtenstein
Lithuania
Luxembourg
Macedonia
Malta
Marshall Islands
Mauritius
Micronesia
Moldova
Monaco
Mozambique
Namibia
Nepal
Netherlands
New Zealand
Nicaragua
Norway
Palau
Panama
Paraguay
Poland
Portugal
Romania
San Marino
São Tomé and Príncipe
Serbia and Montenegro
Seychelles
Slovak Republic
Slovenia
Solomon Islands
South Africa
Spain
Sweden
Switzerland
Turkmenistan
Tuvalu
Ukraine
United Kingdom
Uruguay
Vanuatu
Vatican City State
Venezuela
Yugoslavia

Death Penalty Permitted

Afghanistan
Algeria
Antigua and Barbuda
Armenia
Bahamas
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belarus
Belize
Benin
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Chad
China (People's Republic)
Comoros
Congo (Democratic Republic)
Cuba
Dominica
Egypt
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Gabon
Ghana
Guatemala
Guinea
Guyana
India
Indonesia
Iran
Iraq
Jamaica
Japan
Jordan
Kazakhstan
Kenya
Korea, North
Korea, South
Kuwait
Kyrgyzstan
Laos
Lebanon
Lesotho
Liberia
Libya
Malawi
Malaysia
Mauritania
Mongolia
Morocco
Myanmar
Nigeria
Oman
Pakistan
Palestinian Authority
Philippines
Qatar
Rwanda
St. Kitts and Nevis
St. Lucia
St. Vincent and the Grenadines
Saudi Arabia
Sierra Leone
Singapore
Somalia
Sudan
Swaziland
Syria
Taiwan
Tajikistan
Tanzania
Thailand
Trinidad and Tobago
Tunisia
Uganda
United Arab Emirates
United States of America
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Yemen
Zambia
Zimbabwe

Note: The countries not included, practice death penalty in special cases, such as treason, countries included that practice capital punishment do so as a part of every day justice system [/B]

Originally posted by The Omega
Finti & BF> Why not simply castrate child-molesters and rapists? Cut “it” off, then they can’t repeat the offence?

WD>
1) And here I thought it was “innocent until proven guilty.” Not “Suspected until cleared of all charges.” When did that change?
2) It’s not a matter of how many. When did quantity matter more than quality of human life? Innocent people HAVE been sentenced to death and been killed by the state, only to later be acquitted by DNA-tests. Too late though.
As long as there is the slightest change an innocent may get sentenced I cannot understand how anyone can support the death-sentence. Not to mention the fact that it is barbaric and does not belong in a modern and civilised society.

Remenber we touch that arguement of "cut if off" in this thread:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=30742&highlight=Death+penalty

By cutting it off it doesn't mean that the offender will not find other means of pleasure.

"Innocent until proven guilty" applies to everyone. But since you mention "link" to a crime, I came out with the view of a "suspect". A suspect must prove his/her own innocent in front of a judge. Plus, the accuse has a lawyer next to him/her that will help prove his/her innocense.

As I said many MANY times, anyone that has been found guilty of a crime and the evidence verifies that the person is guilty. Then that person must be trial and eventually a Judge will decide his/her punishment. Does the crime fit the punishment? That was my latter observation.

Lil Bitchiness> 😎
To the best of my knowledge we've never disagreed on any topic this far, be it abortions, death-penalty, religion etc. et. etc. 🙂

Without meaning to muddy the water - those of you advocating physical bodily mutilation as a happy kinder alternative to the death penalty are just as bad as the "string-em-up" mob in my opinion.

How you can say the death penalty is barbaric and then advocate the worst kind of torture is baffling - I'd be curious as to how you reconcile the two (if it wont interfere with the thread...)

My god, in Arkansas, USA, the minimum age for death penalty is 14. 😐 so that means that if a 15 year old does something very wrong, he/she can be qualified for a death row.

How truly barbaric.

And in USA gas chambers and electric chair are still used as the methods of execution.

Sad, barbaric..

And WindDancer, these statistics, i took from a pro death penalty website. 😱

http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/Methods.htm

Originally posted by Mr Zero
Your predisposition is showing. Not only do you state that these people "commit vicious heinous acts" when the issue here is that some people DON'T and are still accused - but you follow up with "trial to prove their innocence" when supposedly these pre-guilty people are in fact innocent 'till proved otherwise.

We live in a society where to be accused of a crime is enough proof of guilt for most people, because they cant conceive of a society where the government and law of the land could ever be mistaken. It's a comforting lie - and it's what makes extremes like the death sentence so damn dangerous.

No i was commenting that people have up to three chances to appeal a verdict in court. this is three different prosecuter, three different judges, and three different jury's that find the suspect guilty. It is not the system sentencing these people to death, it is ordinary people.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
My god, in Arkansas, USA, the minimum age for death penalty is 14. 😐 so that means that if a 15 year old does something very wrong, he/she can be qualified for a death row.

How truly barbaric.

And in USA gas chambers and electric chair are still used as the methods of execution.

Sad, barbaric..

And WindDancer, these statistics, i took from a pro death penalty website. 😱

http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/Methods.htm

Justice is blind to age and race. If a fifteen year murders three people in cold blood, they shouldnt be held accountable for death penalty? A person on death row can stay on death row twenty years before being put to death. This is plenty of time to combat the sentencing with appeals Let me ask you, what would the difference be between sentencing someone to death and sentencing them to life in solitary confinment? their life is being taken with eigther verdict.

"Finti & BF> Why not simply castrate child-molesters and rapists? Cut “it” off, then they can’t repeat the offence?"

They still have hands, which can be used to fondle children and what not. And they can still forcefully violate women and hurt them, which has been proven as a high probability for people who commit these crimes. But, castration would be a much better punishment then what happens to them now.

"My god, in Arkansas, USA, the minimum age for death penalty is 14. so that means that if a 15 year old does something very wrong, he/she can be qualified for a death row."

14 year olds are old enough to know the difference between right and wrong. If they murder someone they should be held accountable, they are ultimately responsible. I know when I was 14 I knew better then to kill someone. Other people do as well.

"And in USA gas chambers and electric chair are still used as the methods of execution."

A barbaric crime deserves a barbaric punishment. Again, if they don't like it, they shouldn't kill people. They MUST be held accountable for their actions, and they must be punished accordingly in order to ensure justice and to ensure that they will never ever have the chance to kill another innocent person again.

Im for it only if there is a certain amount of evidence to prove the defendant completley guilty like DNA matching up. Like before we could match DNA i woulnt be for it.