Mormons

If it didn't contradict The Bible, if it didnt claim there is a goddes mother (polyteism) if it didn't belive Jesus and Satan were not Spirit bros., if they didnt belive in many gods, etc. Then I would be a Mormon.
Oh, I have some questions maybe you guys can answear since I am the only one here non-mormon.

Why was Joseph Smith still preaching against polygamy in October 1843 after he got his revelation in July 1843 commanding the practice of polygamy? (Doc. & Cov. 132; and History of the Church Vol. 6, page 46, or Teachings of the Prophet, page 324).

How could Moroni "read" Heb. 13:8 and James 1:17 when the N.T. never reached America? (Mormon 9:9).

Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Micah 5:1-2; Matt. 2:1).Why in the Book of Mormon (Alma 7:9,10) it says it was Jerusalem?

How did Joseph Smith carry home the golden plates of the Book of Mormon, and how did the witnesses lift them so easily? (They weighed about 230 lbs. Gold, with a density of 19.3 weighs 1204.7 lbs. per cubic foot. The plates were 7" x 8" by about 6". See Articles of Faith, by Talmage, page 262, 34th ed.)

If the Book of Mormon is true, why do Indians fail to turn white when they become Mormons? (2 Nephi 30:6, prior to the 1981 revision).

If Jesus was conceived as a result of a physical union between God and Mary, how was Jesus born of a virgin? (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 1, page 50).

Later.

Oh, after you answear them lets find some common ground. Things we both belive in.Like, we both belive that Jesus died for us right?

okay here it is, read Alma 7:9-10 again, but this time use footnotes, and cross refrences, and it also says in those scriptures that Christ will be born of a Virgin, there are two answers to your question.

and i just want to say, very few of the books you have listed for your refrences, can be found in church publications so i suggest, you use books that are in church publications

With Indians failing to turn white, it was never a statment of change in skin color, it was misinterpreted by people, which is what brought about the revision, it always refered to a spirtual sense of change.

the question about Moroni is easy enough, he was a Prophet of God, in the americas, and God reveals to his Prophets what he needs to reveal. so that one is answered

Faith the size of a mustard seed can move a mountain, Joseph Smith had enough faith to be able to move the plates, which is why he wasnt allowed to move them when he first found them, he had to learn, and gain faith.

and yes we both believe Jesus suffered and died for us

Originally posted by Son of Man
If it didn't contradict The Bible, if it didnt claim there is a goddes mother (polyteism) if it didn't belive Jesus and Satan were not Spirit bros., if they didnt belive in many gods, etc. Then I would be a Mormon.
Oh, I have some questions maybe you guys can answear since I am the only one here non-mormon.

Why was Joseph Smith still preaching against polygamy in October 1843 after he got his revelation in July 1843 commanding the practice of polygamy? (Doc. & Cov. 132; and History of the Church Vol. 6, page 46, or Teachings of the Prophet, page 324).

How could Moroni "read" Heb. 13:8 and James 1:17 when the N.T. never reached America? (Mormon 9:9).

Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Micah 5:1-2; Matt. 2:1).Why in the Book of Mormon (Alma 7:9,10) it says it was Jerusalem?

How did Joseph Smith carry home the golden plates of the Book of Mormon, and how did the witnesses lift them so easily? (They weighed about 230 lbs. Gold, with a density of 19.3 weighs 1204.7 lbs. per cubic foot. The plates were 7" x 8" by about 6". See Articles of Faith, by Talmage, page 262, 34th ed.)

If the Book of Mormon is true, why do Indians fail to turn white when they become Mormons? (2 Nephi 30:6, prior to the 1981 revision).

If Jesus was conceived as a result of a physical union between God and Mary, how was Jesus born of a virgin? (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 1, page 50).

Later.

Thanks for the questions!
If you don't mind regalus, I'm going to answer some in my own words.

1.You must undertand that when the church practiced poligamy it was strickly by comandment from God through the prophet, thereby for necessity (like when a woman was left alone, which in that time period spelled trouble for her). So He was probably speaking of members practicing unaproved poligamy. For wich they coudl have been ex-communicated.

2. (How could Moroni "read" Heb. 13:8 and James 1:17 when the N.T. never reached America? (Mormon 9:9). I'm not sure what you mean by this. God is often found repeating doctrine. Also, God commanded the nephites to bring with them, the brass plates, a copy of the prophets words given to the jews up to that time (kind of like a more complete old testament). I believe that moroni is speaking of reading these records, as is often mentioned by prophets in the book of mormon. Or possibly other records of the people that are not in the book of mormon.

3. This is probably speaking of when mary was taken up in the spirit, and recived Jesus, which happened in Jerusalem.

4. We believe that men can do extraordinary things when taken by the spirit. (moses parted the red sea, I think God could help his prophet escape death to help his work go forward) I think adrenaline coudl play a part too. Besides, as for the witnesses, some men can bench 230 can't they? besides, they did a lot more manual labor back then than we do now.

5. Why aren't black people white once they recive God? The story of Ham is quite like lamen and lemuals (the lamenites) don't you think?

6. The prophets never actually said there was a phisical union, only that by some miracle God is literally Christs father (so that he could have power over death to accomplish the resurection), while mary stayed a virgin.

hope that helps.

It's nice to have common ground isn't it? I love christ so much! It's nice to know you do too.

Thanks for sharing your childhood experience too, that put everything into a new light.

😉

(your answear to my questions dont really seem to be answears but speculation. You use phases like, "This is probably", "I'm not sure", and
"This is probably speaking ". Oh and questio # 5, I said Indians, not blacks.)

So you guys belive in hell? right?

Originally posted by Son of Man
Barker.I can post on any thread I want. I belive this tread is for ALL. Oh, and why am I here? I am here to show Mormons there (dont get mad at me for saying this.) error.

Why are you going around trying to poke holes into Religions you don't understand? It makes sense to us, otherwise we wouldn't be into it. We're not stupid.

So, now, Go away.

Excuss me, but from your posts I seem to know Mormoism better than you. Please actually contribute to the disscussion and not just attack me.

Originally posted by Son of Man
Excuss me, but from your posts I seem to know Mormoism better than you. Please actually contribute to the disscussion and not just attack me.

And now, I'm gone. 😐

Son of Man, you said you know mormonism better than barker, but yet you misquote quite a bit from what i have read. let me start with this, your question...
"How could Moroni "read" Heb. 13:8 and James 1:17 when the N.T. never reached America? (Mormon 9:9)."
ok, so that was a good one, but pretty much a waste of my time. nowhere does it say that Moroni read Heb. 13:8, it is just a footnote, or cross reference so that we can better understand it. But if you look at the next foot note there, it says 1 Nephi 10:18. Hmm, if i am not mistaken, i think Moroni had the plates of Nephi with him.
And about the gold plates, I think the others have covered it well enough, but how in the world do you know how much they truly wiegh? you dont, you cant even think how much they weigh. only 12 people were given the priveledge to see the plates, no other man was able to. so no other man knows of what they wiegh. you being a man who has not seen them, nor touched them cannot speak on how much they wiegh. anyways, 230 pounds im sure was a snap for somebody back in those days to lift. i mean, they didnt have fork lifts like we do these days...

anyways, i hope you start to understand things a little better, but as it says throughout all the scriptures, those who are hard headed, and have harden their hearts towards the Word of God, shall deny It's truth when they hear it. I have found this to be true, and i find you hard at your heart. For i know that any man who has softened his heart, then the Spirit would be welcomed, other than that... the Spirit does not dwell in those who are wicked.

Point out some of my I have asked you to show me what I misquoted.
Yet you provided none.About the whole hardened heart thing, I could say the same for you. That can go both ways. These were gold they had to wegih alot. I dont have to see a truck to know it weights alot. It seems you guys can't answear my questions. You might as well just stop now you are wasteing your breath. Now, do you guys belive in hell?

Barker, if you know Mormonism you would know that what I say is true.

OK! Enough! please stop attacking each other! that goes for everybody. lets answer and talk in a civilized way!

Please, it's obvious we all feel a deep conviction for what we understand in our hearts to be the truth (son_of_man, as much as the rest of us).
Lets except that we each have our own point of view, and talk about our beliefes kindly.

to answer your question son_of_man (can i call you som?), yes, mormons believe in hell.

We call it spirit prison (it is to a deeper degree as i understand). It is for the son's of perdition, poeple who have seen God or angels, or know they have felt the holy ghost and fiercly deny the existence of them. other than these there are three glorys of heaven depending on how you lived, or how convicted you are( all will have a chance at the highest). the Celestial, Terrestreial, and telestial.

here is a bible reference. 1cor 15:40-42;
There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.
So also is the ressurrection fo the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption.

We do not quiet understand what the telestial is like, but it is a place where murderers and such will go, they will never live with God. But they have been granted a glory (to a very, very small degree) because it is part of the plan.But the terrestrial and Celestial are the places where the good will go and live in eternal happiness.

so we belive in heaven and hell, but to different degrees.

Oh, and i would like to apoligize for my reluctant type language, those statements in my last quote are true veiws of the church, i guess i was trying to be more genteel. I want you to know those ARE my convictions.

I don't want to tackle the hell question right now. Besides...as you are LDS...or were born into it...and your father still believes it...you should know already.

And Son of Man...hun...I love you, but...SEVERAL people are answering your questions. We've been answering the same questions for days now. We keep repeating or trying new ways to try to get you to understand. You just don't.

Please...hun...tell me what it is you really want from us. Tell us the truth as far as you see it and be done with it. Your constant repeated questions...and the constant repeated answers aren't going to sway anyone...it's just going to get old REALLY fast.

Oh...I have an idea. Why don't you just debate your argument with us...using only...ONLY...scriptures from the Book of Mormon and the Bible. USE BOTH...and DO NOT use anything from any other books or talks or anything. ONLY use God's word from both books. Plan out your argument...look it up...get it prepared...and let's see what we can do with that. Mmkay pumpkin?

🙂

One more thing, I see that you are deply convicted in the bible. we know it to be true too. So many of our beliefs are intertwined in it, even the book of mormon.

Would you agree that one of the most important things about the Bible (if not the most imoprtant) is that it is a testimony of Christ? The Book of mormon is another testament of him.

It is a book written by the other sheep Christ mentions in John 10:16; And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepard.

So, you see, the book of Mormon is a companion to the Bible, they work hand in hand. They were both written by a people mentioned and loved, as well as led by god. Loved as we are, that is why he sent them to the world.

Also,here is a scripture containing the view in which we hold the Bible's value:

Now this is the prophet nephi seeing setlers on the americas, the colinists. He see's that they prosper in the land, and that they have a book. The angel is telling nephi about that book (which, you guessed it, is the bible) as we come in.

1nephi 13:23-;
And he (the angel) said: Behold it proccedeth out of the mouth of a jew. And I Nephi, beheld it:and he said unto me: The book that thou beholdest is a record of the Jews, which contains the covenants fo the Lord, which he hath made unto the house of Israel,: it also cantainith many of the prophesies fo the holy prophets; and it is record like unto the engravings wich are upon the plates of brass, save there are not so many;nevertheless, they contain the covenants of the lord, which he hath made unto the house of Israel; wherfor they are of great worth unto the Gentiles.

And the angel of the lord said unto me: thou hast beheld that book proceedeth forth from the mouth of a Jew; and when it proceeded forth from the mouth of a Jew it contained the plainess of the gosple of the lord, of whom the twelve apostles bear record; and they bear record according to the truth which is in the lamb of God. (repeated in 25 so i'll move to 26)

And after they go forth by the hand of the twelve apostles of the Lamb, from the jews unto the gentiles, thou seest the foundation of a great and abomitable chruch, which is most abomitable among all other churches; for behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the Lamb many parts which are plain and most precious; and also the covenants of the lord they have taken away.

So the bible still has the gospel, but precious things have been taken from it. Dont' be offended by the great and abominable church thing thougth, no one who believes the people who took out these things (not knowing that they did) is at falut at all. it is not an insult to you.

I would like comment about if we, as you like to call it, mormons believe in hell. Yes, we latter-day saints believe in hell. Though hell is where Lucifer, and his fallen angels were sent when they decided to go against God's plan. For every one of use here on earth, we shall not be punished with that punishment. We believe that all men will go to one of the three glories, as before mentioned, the Celestial, the Terestial, and the Telestial kingdoms. Though there is an outer darkness for those who deny Christ to his face in a matter of speaking. Only a prophet, or an apostle can pretty much do that, but I may be wrong on who will end up in the outter darkness. Sorry, to have sort of disagreed with you dorkerina, but we do not believe anybody will go to hell. Hell is for those that did not make it to this earth who forsake God. Sorry, I am not using any scripture reference, mainly because I got to go to work now. So, before you attack, just remember we answered your questions, but you did not accept them... later.

Will

Ramses, you are correct but incorrect as well, you are thinking of hell as Outer Darkness, but it is what Dorkerina said it was, it is the Spirit Prison, and those that have not repented of their sins before they die, will spend from the day they die, to the day they accept Christ, and repent, in Spirit Prison or in other words, Hell, But you are right in saying no one will go to hell, everyone will eventually accept the truth in the spirit world, before judgment, and then nobody will be in Hell, Hell is only a temporary state, whereas, the Glories, and Outer Darkness are permanent.

RAB

Here's a questions to all mormons.
How does it feel to never drink coffe? 😱

Actually, Eis, it feels great not to. Before I joined the church, I was addicted to it. I would drink probably close to four pots of coffee before lunch, and then from there on it was tea. Honestly, not drinking those two substances I don't find my stomach being as upset as often. Not sick, just wierd feeling. I find myself free from addiction in those areas. This year I have said I will not drink caffienated soda all year, but that is just because I'm sick of feeling like I'm so close to having kidney stones.

And Rab, you may be correct, and thank you for correcting me. Sorry, you have more advanced teachers, and classes than I do in the church right now. That and I never really studied the Doctrine and Covenants as much as I should have. Though I will be sure to read them this year. I was just saying what I was taught in sunday school, and I know spirit prison will be like hell for those who are there, but it is not litterally hell... atleast I don't think it is. And no I am not thinking, nor was thinking, that hell is the outter darkness. I am saying hell is where the fallen angels serve their punishments. Oh well, I love to learn and that is why I am on this earth.

RamZ

😂 Well, if you never drink it...I guess you aren't missing anything.

However, when I was inactive I started drinking coffee and I started to feel sick a lot more often. I love frozen cappucinos, but I have chosen not to drink them anymore. And it will be a HUGE temptation when I go to Disney World in April not to drink a frozen coffee from the France Pavillion in Epcot or the Ghirradelli Chocolate shop in Downtown Disney.

But...for reference. I never drank a sip of coffee until I was 23 years old. I had no interest to try it. I started when I kept falling asleep at work and my boss caught me and I had to do something to stay awake or get fired. After that I sort of became dependent on coffee...and now I just crave it now and then, but I try to just ignore it and let the craving pass.

Yeah...so...😄