No, from my recollection it's because Kressh took the throne of Dark Lord from Sadow after Sadow's defeat at the hands of the Republic.
And if you mean Gav Daragon, he was hardly an apprentice as much as he was a hostage. He was forced into the meditation sphere, was he not? Sadow's illusions, if I'm not mistaken, were disrupted by him, but Sadow wasn't going to win anyway.
Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
I suggest you go pick up a copy of The Science of Star Wars. It will answer you questions quite well.Anyway,
1. [b]Zero-Point Energy
. It's the energy field that exist everywhere. The Force could very well be this same thing(I'm not saying that I believe the Force is real, but that is could scientifically exist).2. Zero-Point Energy, once again. That is all they are doind, calling on an energy field that exist everywhere in the universe.
3. Luke is doing it by calling upon the energy located in the Zero-Point energy field to levitate himself. [/B]
What is this bs Glentract? Passing off this 'zero-point energy' as if it was scientific fact. Go bring me a legitimate source from a respectable physicist stating that using the force would be possible in this universe, 'The science of star wars' doesnt cut it.
Originally posted by Great Vengeance
What is this bs Glentract? Passing off this 'zero-point energy' as if it was scientific fact. Go bring me a legitimate source from a respectable physicist stating that using the force would be possible in this universe, 'The science of star wars' doesnt cut it.
The author of the book is Jeanne Cavelos. She teachers astronomy at Michigan State University and Cornell University. She also is(as of writing of the author bios) in training to become an Astronaut at the Johnson Space Center. That's very reputable incase you didn't notice.
Next is Dr. Jessica Utts, professor of statistics at the University of California at Davis. "It(the force) sounds like an alternative explanation for the data we've seen, and not one I would rule out.
Dr. Michio Kaku,professor of theoretical phyisics at City University of New York also agreed with it, but the quote is really long so I am not going to type it up.
Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
The author of the book is Jeanne Cavelos. She teachers astronomy at Michigan State University and Cornell University. She also is(as of writing of the author bios) in training to become an Astronaut at the Johnson Space Center. That's very reputable incase you didn't notice.Next is Dr. Jessica Utts, professor of statistics at the University of California at Davis. "It(the force) sounds like an alternative explanation for the data we've seen, and not one I would rule out.
Dr. Michio Kaku,professor of theoretical phyisics at City University of New York also agreed with it, but the quote is really long so I am not going to type it up.
Alright so atleast a few respectable people agree with it, still its not like this theory is proven or anything. As of right now if some guy suddenly started flying he would be breaking the laws of physics as we know them.
Originally posted by IKC
Glentract:
IKC:
Originally posted by IKC
It is not revised in a reference book, Glentract. If you keep going down this road that "zOMG THE REFERENCE BOOK IS BETTER THAN THE PRIMARY SOURCE" I'm going to start ignoring you. If it were revised, TOTJ would have been re-released.
The comics are no better than the reference guides, especially when I have mutiple reference guides that say the same thing. Mutiple sources, each of which outweighs each of your sources. Oh, big threat. An ignorant fool will ignore me, oh gosh, I’m crushed.
Originally posted by IKC
Corrected.
Not much of a correction, more of a degration. Everything you said lacks evidence. For one, Sith ARE HUMANOID. Of course Vodo would show Naga as HUMANOID.
[img=http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/1884/nagasdow1fl.th.jpg]
I rest my case.
Originally posted by IKC
Glentract, no they aren't. DLOTS itself was scripted by two people, by the way. The primary source trumps reference books that reference the primary source, period.
The same person worked on both. Can you tell me why the author would allow untrue, inferior facts into the next edition? Prove up or shut up.
Originally posted by IKC
Glentract, you at first wrote that she had "all of the things that King Omnin had, which was quite a bit actually." Don't even try to claim that you didn't. That is what is called hyperbole.
I did. I never denied that. I did use a hyperbole...” You are a moron if you didn’t see that.The quote that I gave that said a wealth of Artifacts has zero hyperbole in it.
Originally posted by IKC
In comparison to the unnamed leaders of the Krath? They accomplished more, far more, than those leaders did. The only threats that came from the Krath were from Aleema and Satal Keto and the army they commanded. That's it. None of the others had an inkling of importance or power to them.
IKC, you at first wrote that there were only two. Don't even try to claim that you didn't. Now realizing that you were wrong, you’ve retreated back to trying to make the others seem irrelevant.
And your point is partly not true. The other Krath were part of that Army, so they are part of that threat.
Originally posted by IKC
In no way does the primary source have any of the other Krath actually performing magic of any sort. Ergo, the other Krath either A) couldn't or B) couldn't perform at the level of either Satal or Aleema.
The reason they aren’t shown is because they aren’t part of the main storyline.
You also left out a major and the most probable point.
C) Did it outside of the main action, thus it was not shown.
Originally posted by IKC
Yes.. because starwars.com is never wrong or inaccurate, especially about obscure subjects, right? The primary source reads that they dabbled in "primitive magic." It, two boxes later, reads that Satal and Aleema, no other Krath, stumbled upon Sith secrets. It is true that Satal and Aleema dealt with the Sith and the Dark Side, that doesn't mean that the unimportant others did.
Starwars.com is the official source. Technically it outweighs all except the movies and a direct quote from Lucas. I don’t know why you assume your source is fool proof.
I’d like to have someone else confirm that it really says no other Krath used Sith Magic.
I have more sources, each of which outweighs your SINGLE source.
Technically, the reference guide is also a primary source.
Primary Source, “A firsthand or eyewitness account of an event.”
Anderson is a firsthand source. All of his books on this are primary sources.
Originally posted by IKC
Oh, I see. So because you command a group you become one of them?I guess the Jedi then were all clones. Or perhaps Nute Gunray was a battle droid? Maybe Lord Sidious was both a clone and a battle droid. Good logic there, Glentract.
I noticed that you dropped, “Added to that, The New Essential Guide To Chronology states, "Instead, Ulic killed Keto in a great duel, and then took his place alongside Aleema as the new ruler of the Krath."”
Stop mincing post. It only shows you own weakness and stupidity.
Originally posted by IKC
And has no indication of any sort in the primary source material. To say that they did is ridiculous anyway, they were a secret society of a handful of aristocrats, dominated by Aleema and Keto, that commanded an army. They did not go out and train others like them in magic or the dark side.
They left the Sith teachings that they had already used to others. The comics focus on one story, but the Essential Guides examen ALL of the history.
Originally posted by IKC
No, Glentract, I was laughing at you. Shipyards were well defended during the Galactic Civil War. They were not so during The Sith War. Good reading skills.
You said the Republic, not the Empire. Wow, you stupidity flows ever outward.
Originally posted by IKC
And they did not do a "great" job of defeating the army that the Krath controlled, Glentract. Read the comics. The Krath rule by the time we get to the end of DLOTS is unquestioned throughout the Empress Teta System.Your examples are irrelevant.
Thankyou for making my point for me. Aleema was powerful enough to rally the entire system to her in a very short amount of time, while other people who are more powerful than Yoda(Shimrra) could not.
Originally posted by IKC
Too bad the Foerost shipyards didn't have fighter squadrons or defending capital ships of any sort. The most they had was turrets, and the Mandalorian and Tetan soldiers took care of them quickly, boarded the station, and seized the foremen. They then took the activation codes for the capital ships that were constructed there. Then they butchered the crew.
The point though was to weaken the Republic Military and bolster their own, making it war, not terrorism.
And incase you have forgotten, the primary defenses on the Death Star were turrets.
Originally posted by IKC
Tactically he did, but he did not decide where and with what, Glentract. The Republic Senate, represented by Palpatine, did. If what you said was true then Yoda could merely have ended the Clone War at any time.
Unit counts and positions are part of tactics. You have just proven that you know nothing about war. Yoda didn’t have the ultimate say, but he did have practical control over the Army.
Originally posted by IKC
Lost? Excuse me Glentract, but he didn't even decide to fight. In case you didn't know because you're ignorant and haven't read the comics, he faced all of the Jedi in the galaxy in orbit. He was not so foolish as to believe he could stand against such a force, so he performed the ritual to unleash his spirit.
You contradict yourself. One sentence you say he faced all of the Jedi in orbit, the next you say he knew he couldn’t defeat them so he fled. WTF is your problem, fanboy.
Originally posted by IKC
And I'll run down the list: He beat Vodo, Grandmaster of the Jedi, twice, the second time killing him. He destroyed the spirit of Freedon Nadd after finally accepting the Dark Side. He stalemated Ulic Qel-Droma (in lightsaber combat) while Kun himself was nowhere near the height of his power. He destroyed Odan-Urr with a wave of his hand. He converted twenty Jedi knights with a sith holocron instantaneously. He thought Sylvar, a former rival of his, so unimportant and beneath him that he sent Massassi to bat her around like a rag doll, which they did. He bested Master Ood in lightsaber combat (Ood had to transform, to enter the next stage of his lifecycle, to stop Kun from getting the treasures he sought). And he survived the most crushing Light Side attack we've ever seen, an attack which set fire to Yavin 4 and scorched the surface of the entire moon.You're blind if you think those aren't wins.
Vodo, it’s a duel, not a large battle. Also remember that Vodo was using a walking stick rather than a lightsaber.
Nadd, once again, not a large battle.
Ulic, it’s a duel, not a large battle. Prove that Kun wasn’t at the height of his power.
Odan, it’s a duel, not a large battle. Comics are notorious for making fights seem shorter than they really were. Prove the length of the battle with a supplementing source.
Ood, it’s a duel, not a large battle.
The battle of Yavin? The one he fled? The one where his physical body was destroyed and he was removed from the galatic picture for 4,000 years? The one he was so weak after that mere apprentices defeated him? The one where he didn’t even kill any of the Jedi? Oh yeah, that was a huge battle. Exar did so great in that. I mean, he only got horribly pwned in it.
All of the ones Exar one were duel duel, not large battles. The only battle he fought in he lost.
Originally posted by IKC
Your ignorance of the story is astounding, Glentract. Ulic stalemated Kun while Kun was nowhere near the height of his power. And Nomi stripped Ulic of the Force while Ulic was overcome with grief after killing his brother Cay and was not resisting her. Please, don't pull things out of thin air and expect to win.
Ulic increased in power to. You have to prove that Exar improved more than Ulic did. I also noticed that late in your post you state that Exar realized his true power when he killed Nadd’s spirit, which was before Ulic stalemated him.
Also note that grief does not overcome natural resistence to force attacks.
Originally posted by IKC
I already covered his first "loss." The second time, he lost to a dozen force users, two lightsabers, the spirit of Luke Skywalker, and the spirit of Vodo Siosk Baas. This is after four thousand years of solitude on Yavin 4, which most likely wasn't healthy for his sanity.
Yes, you covered the battle he was wasted in. Added to that, you have to prove that Luke and Vodo did ANYTHING to help in that, since it was never stated that they did.
B
Originally posted by IKC
y your logic, Marka Ragnos is a weakling because he lost to a single newly-knighted Jedi. Good work, Glentract.
You do realize that Exar was still afraid of Marka Ragnos even when Ragnos was a thousand year old spirit, don’t you?
Added to that, Exar’s equal(Ulic) was to afraid of Ragnos’ spirit to protest being made the apprentice.
Originally posted by IKC
Regarding Nadd, he was at Nadd's mercy because of his own refusal to use the Dark Side. But truly, he was only at his mercy once, when Nadd caused the cave-in that crushed his body. After that, he was attacked by dog-like Sith beasts, and Nadd took his lightsaber. Kun had to use the Dark Side to recover it because the Light had abandoned him. The third time he was captured by the Massassi, again because he wouldn't use the Dark Side. He escaped because of his final acceptance of the Dark as his true power, recovered Sadow's amulet, and slaughtered Naga Sadow's monstrosity. Afterward, he destroyed Nadd's spirit.
Regardless, he was at Nadd’s mercy. Without Nadd, Exar would never have become anything more than a common Jedi.
Originally posted by IKC
Incorrect. DLOTS says only one inducted into the Sith can use the book, ergo the Amulet, while they did have it, isn't necessary.
Nice try, but you’re wrong. The Essential Guides, which you have failed to prove are a lower level of canon(because they aren’t) says that Nadd gave them an Amulet that allowed them to read it. That overrides all evidence you have shown.
Originally posted by IKC
In the chamber of the monstrosity on Yavin IV, it reads, "As the alchemical miscreation squeezes the life out of him, a realization dawns on Exar Kun-- He must let go of the past... forget the pathetic Jedi way... Give in to his true power... the power of rage!"In the next panel, "Suddenly finding he can speak the Sith tongue, Exar Kun reaches towards the focus of power. -- And the Sith amulet (Sadow's) soars toward its rightful owner!"
Thankyou for clearing that up.
Originally posted by IKC
Glentract, you're becoming insufferable. I'm going to quote what I quoted previously. Maybe you'll pay attention this time. This is undeniable.Proof enough? It's the ship, Glentract. Period. Even if none of the other quotes matter, the Narrator spells it out explicitly. You. Lose.
No. It really didn’t have any effect as it doesn’t prove anything. It is irrelevant.
Originally posted by IKC
Corrections in parentheses.
Luke controlled a black hole, but was EXTREMELY drained afterwards. (Controlling a black hole using your own energy is more impressive than ripping the core from a star using a ship's) [Actually it isn’t as a black hole in just a star that has collapsed] Naga wasn't even sweating (nor was Aleema) [point remains that it was eaier for Naga than Luke and that you have not proven that the energy comes from the ship.], but Luke couldn't even stand for several minutes. Moving someone across the galaxy is far easier than destroying a star (really? Is that why teleportation is so common? Oh wait)[I was refering to energy requirments, moron.] . The Millenium Falcon can move people across the galaxy, but it isn't a millionth powerful enough to harm a star.
Corrections in [sdfodsfokmsd].
Originally posted by IKC
Yes it does, when you know as I do that the destruction of the star was caused by a ship and not the user's own Force power.
You have failed to prove this, so stop refering to this as if it is fact.
Originally posted by IKC
Oh, Glentract, your ignorance is showing. Neither Exar nor Ulic showed fear of any kind upon the appearance of the unnamed Sith Lord that manifested himself in front of them. His appearance was only enough for them to stop their fighting in time for him to speak the prophecy regarding them and induct Kun as Dark Lord of the Sith.Pulled that one out of thin air as well, didn't you Glentract? (Please do substitute a ruder phrase).
It was enough to keep Ulic from protesting against being named the lower Sith.
Originally posted by IKC
I'm going to summarize your points, Glentract:"zOMG THIS REFERENCE BOOK TRUMPS THE SOURCE THAT IT REFERENCES!"
"zOMG STAR DESTROYERS CAN'T DO IT, THAT MEANS NO SHIP CAN!"
Here's Illustrious' point:
"zOMG THE AUTHOR KEEPS SAYING THEY WERE POWERFUL!"
More evidence? Laughable. Superior evidence? Absolutely not.
And all you have said amounts to,
“wtf!!!1!1!!11 comic never wrong!!11!1"
“limited views as long as they are mine are best!”
“i haven’t seen it, so it’s not real!”
All you’ve shown is that you are an ignorant Exar fanboy.
Originally posted by IKC
You keep trying to claim that he contained it when there's no evidence of that at all, and indeed you undermine your own argument because you have to believe that Naga's a god (read above).
He had to have contained it to survive the explosion. There is no evidence that the star Naga blew up to an excessive amount of time to go nova. I have proven that a nova expands faster than Naga’s ship can fly. Supernova explode at roughly 1/8 the speed of light. An X-wing, a much faster craft, has a top speed of 26,460 meters per second. The speed of light is ~300,000 meters per second. 300,000/8=37,500
A much faster craft than Naga's ship moves slower than the speed of a supernova.
Get over it. You have lost.
The comics are no better than the reference guides, especially when I have mutiple reference guides that say the same thing. Mutiple sources, each of which outweighs each of your sources. Oh, big threat. An ignorant fool will ignore me, oh gosh, I’m crushed.
Insults yet again. Interesting that my opponents find this easier than debating.
I'm no longer going to answer your points when you claim anything from the reference books while I have the primary source in front of me. You're trumped.
Not much of a correction, more of a degration. Everything you said lacks evidence. For one, Sith ARE HUMANOID. Of course Vodo would show Naga as HUMANOID.
Too bad for you, then, that Vodo shows Naga with human-colored skin. Obviously, Naga did not have such. Vodo didn't know what Naga looked like. Vodo's holocron is, therefore, more than a little fuzzy on details.
I did. I never denied that. I did use a hyperbole...” You are a moron if you didn’t see that.The quote that I gave that said a wealth of Artifacts has zero hyperbole in it.
More insults again. Yes, you certainly did cover your tracks with the second quote.
And your point is partly not true. The other Krath were part of that Army, so they are part of that threat.
A bunch of aristocrats are going to join an army in which they fight with swords and other melee weapons? That's probable.
The reason they aren’t shown is because they aren’t part of the main storyline.C) Did it outside of the main action, thus it was not shown.
If they did perform Sith magic, Glentract, why weren't they lumped in as a threat with everyone else that did the same? Why weren't they part of the storyline, hm?
Starwars.com is the official source. Technically it outweighs all except the movies and a direct quote from Lucas. I don’t know why you assume your source is fool proof.
I know my source is fool proof because it is the subject matter on which we're debating, Glentract. It tells the entire story in detail. You don't own it and you're presuming to argue details armed with faulty summaries. This is entirely different from me inasmuch as what I'm arguing is A) within the material I have and B) has yet to be discredited with any sort of evidence by Illustrious, because he refuses to present.
I noticed that you dropped, “Added to that, The New Essential Guide To Chronology states, "Instead, Ulic killed Keto in a great duel, and then took his place alongside Aleema as the new ruler of the Krath."”
Fine, I'll answer your little point. Satal tried to have Ulic assassinated. Ulic fought off the assassins, was told by Aleema that Satal ordered the attack that killed master Arca, and then went to kill Satal. In a duel that lasted all of one page, he did it.
The Bourbons were the royal family of France. If I were a knight that married a Bourbon princess, does that make me a Bourbon? It makes me as much a Bourbon as much as Ulic was a Krath. Ulic was not part of the secret sect of aristocrats that defined the Krath, ergo he was not a Krath.
Stop mincing post. It only shows you own weakness and stupidity.
I should make a list of all the insults you and Illustrious throw around rather than debating.
You said the Republic, not the Empire. Wow, you stupidity flows ever outward.
I question your literacy, Glentract. Original quote:
Yes, let's compare a time where there were two governments warring for control of the galaxy to a time where the Republic hadn't been challenged by a major power for a thousand years. Good comparison, Glentract. (You brought up Mon Calimari shipyards and the shipyards of Bilbringi. These examples are irrelevant, they were operated by a government that faced a serious threat from a rival power. The Old Republic at the time of the Sith War had no such rival.)The Sith War describes the attack on the shipyards of Foerost, said to be "one of the oldest and successful large-scale orbital construction sites," which produced "a steady stream of advanced warships for the fleet of the Galactic Republic."
One which you would think would be well defended, no? But it wasn't, Glentract. It was captured easily by the combined Tetan and Mandalorian fighters in a fight that, the comic indicates, lasted only minutes. There was no fleet defending it.
There. Perhaps I've made it clearer.
Thankyou for making my point for me. Aleema was powerful enough to rally the entire system to her in a very short amount of time, while other people who are more powerful than Yoda(Shimrra) could not.
It helps an awful lot when you secure the loyalty of the military of the entire system and you're assisted by your equally-powerful cousin. She did not take the system by standing out in a field and waving her arms about, casting Sith spells. She sent her army down and assisted them from orbit with illusions. (Both sides, by the way, fought with swords. Some revolt.)
The point though was to weaken the Republic Military and bolster their own, making it war, not terrorism.
The actions they took to perform this goal was terrorism, not battle. The only real battles were on Onderon and Coruscant.
And incase you have forgotten, the primary defenses on the Death Star were turrets.
Yes, let's compare an instrument of war to an industrial complex. Nevermind that the instrument of war had a capital-ship-destroying superlaser and thousands of starfighters in addition to "turrets." Good one. So are you saying the Foerost shipyards could have withstood an attack from the starfighters the Rebellion used at Yavin IV? Hell no.
Unit counts and positions are part of tactics. You have just proven that you know nothing about war. Yoda didn’t have the ultimate say, but he did have practical control over the Army.
Yes, Glentract, I know nothing of war and you're the expert. Please, oh enlightened one, tell me to whom the Clones answered to: the Chancellor or Yoda?
Also enlighten me as to this: How would Yoda mystically conjure up and position units if Palpatine, because he's the strategic commander, decides to send troops to Mygeeto instead of, say, Geonosis?
Oh please, Mr. Expert, answer a final question: To whom do the United States military answer to: the President, or their generals?
Generals provide advice on strategy and conduct battles, Glentract, but they cannot lawfully commit troops without executive, civilian authorization.
You contradict yourself. One sentence you say he faced all of the Jedi in orbit, the next you say he knew he couldn’t defeat them so he fled. WTF is your problem, fanboy
I again question your literacy. I'll repeat and try to dumb it down for you:
Lost? Excuse me Glentract, but he didn't even decide to fight. In case you didn't know because you're ignorant and haven't read the comics, he faced all of the Jedi in the galaxy in orbit. He was not so foolish as to believe he could stand against such a force, so he performed the ritual to unleash his spirit.
In other words, all of the Jedi in the galaxy appeared above Yavin IV while Kun was on the surface looking over the spoils from Ossus. Kun's not so arrogant as to believe he can survive a confrontation with all Jedi, so he performs the ritual to unleash his spirit.
Did you get it that time?
Vodo, it’s a duel, not a large battle. Also remember that Vodo was using a walking stick rather than a lightsaber.
Also remember that Vodo can make his walking stick more powerful than a lightsaber (DLOTS) and was the Grandmaster of the Jedi Order. Oh, but it's no big accomplishment to slap Vodo around like he's an initiate, isn't it Glentract?
Nadd, once again, not a large battle.
No, it was more Kun lashing out with the Dark Side. He still won instantly.
Ulic, it’s a duel, not a large battle. Prove that Kun wasn’t at the height of his power.
I don't see why you keep saying these aren't large battles, as if that's relevant to the fact that Aleema has never won a confrontation with another Force user aside from her use of Sadow's ship.
And Kun decidedly was not at the height of his power, given that little time had passed since he had destroyed Freedon Nadd. As well, it was only a lightsaber duel, not one in which either used the force offensively. Kun had yet to create his short-hilted double-bladed lightsaber and invent the unique style that cut down the lightsaber Grandmaster of the Jedi order. He had yet to study all that Sadow's horde of knowledge and artifacts had to offer. He had yet to recover the holocron from Odan-Urr.
He was nowhere near the height of his power.
Odan, it’s a duel, not a large battle. Comics are notorious for making fights seem shorter than they really were. Prove the length of the battle with a supplementing source.
Scene:
Kun walks in, the Sith holocron Odan is holding flies to his hand. Odan knows he's in the presence of a dark power and tries to blind Kun to the Force, sending Kun's body into a small pile of debris. Kun reaches up with a glowing hand from the pile, taunting Odan-Urr with "Master, do you really know who I am? I am the Dark Lord of the Sith." Next panel, Odan-Urr falls to the ground and dies.
Kun's win is instantaneous.
Source: The Sith War.
Ood, it’s a duel, not a large battle.
And? Ood was an ancient treelike Jedi master. You act as if beating a Jedi Master in anything isn't an accomplishment, let alone flat-out curbstomping the most ancient and powerful Jedi the Order has to offer in every occasion.
The battle of Yavin? The one he fled? The one where his physical body was destroyed and he was removed from the galatic picture for 4,000 years? (etc)
It was a win for Kun inasmuch as despite the fact that all of the Jedi were against him, he survived because he performed the ritual before the Jedi began their attack. You're ridiculous to say he got "pwned" in it. Even your vaunted Ragnos would have lost horribly in that situation.
Again,
By your logic, Marka Ragnos is a weakling because he lost to a single newly-knighted Jedi. Good work, Glentract.
Ulic increased in power to. You have to prove that Exar improved more than Ulic did. I also noticed that late in your post you state that Exar realized his true power when he killed Nadd’s spirit, which was before Ulic stalemated him.
Ulic increased, but not nearly as much. He was unable to perform feats anywhere near the level of Exar Kun. He was nearly matched in an admittedly-stacked battle with Mandalore.
And I said Kun realized his true power was the dark side. Read what I quoted. I question your literacy yet again.
Also note that grief does not overcome natural resistence to force attacks.
Says who? From what we understand, there is no natural resistance to force attacks, or else Yoda would never have been struck by Sidious' lightning, for instance. In addition, grief would be detrimental to a Sith's defenses because it is much less useful than anger, fear, and hatred.
Yes, you covered the battle he was wasted in. Added to that, you have to prove that Luke and Vodo did ANYTHING to help in that, since it was never stated that they did.
Oh, other than their appearance and their assistance in trapping Kun and apparently destroying him with the Light Side? Funny way of not helping.
You do realize that Exar was still afraid of Marka Ragnos even when Ragnos was a thousand year old spirit, don’t you?
I already disproved this, Glentract. I hate to bring this up again, but I question your literacy:
Oh, Glentract, your ignorance is showing. Neither Exar nor Ulic showed fear of any kind upon the appearance of the unnamed Sith Lord that manifested himself in front of them. His appearance was only enough for them to stop their fighting in time for him to speak the prophecy regarding them and induct Kun as Dark Lord of the Sith.
Added to that, Exar’s equal(Ulic) was to afraid of Ragnos’ spirit to protest being made the apprentice.
We only know that, at that time, Ulic was Kun's equal in lightsaber combat. Kun had, in the small amount of time he spent with Nadd and studying Sith lore on Yavin IV, learned far more than Ulic did while boffing Aleema.
Oh, and like I said, there's no evidence of fear. There's also no evidence that it was Ragnos' spirit.
Regardless, he was at Nadd’s mercy. (Once) Without Nadd, Exar would never have become anything more than a common Jedi.
Good job ignoring my points by bringing up something irrelevant.
Alright Glentract, without R2-D2, Luke Skywalker would've been nothing more than a moisture farmer.
So what?
Nice try, but you’re wrong. The Essential Guides, which you have failed to prove are a lower level of canon(because they aren’t) says that Nadd gave them an Amulet that allowed them to read it. That overrides all evidence you have shown.
Ridiculous and disproven. Read above, I'm not arguing this with you. You're too far gone. My primary source trumps you, end of story.
Thankyou for clearing that up.
Later on it reads that Exar Kun picked up the ability to read ancient Sith with his encounter on Korriban.
No. It really didn’t have any effect as it doesn’t prove anything. It is irrelevant.
Oh, okay. Every quote that virtually slaps you in the face with the fact that the power to wrench cores from stars is irrelevant. Well, good to know you can just dismiss conclusive proof like that.
Luke controlled a black hole, but was EXTREMELY drained afterwards. (Controlling a black hole using your own energy is more impressive than ripping the core from a star using a ship's) [Actually it isn’t as a black hole in just a star that has collapsed] Naga wasn't even sweating (nor was Aleema) [point remains that it was eaier for Naga than Luke and that you have not proven that the energy comes from the ship.], but Luke couldn't even stand for several minutes. Moving someone across the galaxy is far easier than destroying a star (really? Is that why teleportation is so common? Oh wait)[I was refering to energy requirments, moron.] . The Millenium Falcon can move people across the galaxy, but it isn't a millionth powerful enough to harm a star.
Corrections in order:
You first stated it was a black hole, I was going on what you wrote. Point remains that just because you don't want to believe the evidence doesn't make it untrue: it was the ship's power, not Naga's. Energy requirements are irrelevant, Glentract, the point was that using the Force to teleport, let alone teleport someone else is a feat unmatched by anyone.
All you’ve shown is that you are an ignorant Exar fanboy.
And all you've shown is the following:
A) You insult, rather than debate, when you begin to lose.
B) You ignore evidence that goes against your current opinion.
C) As part of ignoring or discrediting said evidence, you've come up with the ridiculous theory that a summary in a reference book (Cliff's Notes) is more accurate about a story than the primary source in which the story is actually told (A Tale of Two Cities, for instance).
D) You selectively read and misunderstand your opponent's arguments.
He had to have contained it to survive the explosion.
1) That isn't true, he need only have run. It's easier since the ship was already at full-speed.
2) There is no evidence - none whatsoever - that he did. While Vodo's holocron is fuzzy on details, it says explicitly that Naga and his crew escaped. Naga could not and didn't hold anything back. He ran.
3) How are you so sure that the supernova's going to travel that fast when A) the core of the star is missing (Aleema's star collapsed and imploded first) and B) the star had not yet reached the point in its cycle where it was supposed to go supernova?
4) Ossus was the only planet close enough to Kemplex Nine to offer military aid when attacked by Sadow's ship. Kemplex Nine is next to the Cron Cluster. It took hours for the firestorm of the Cron Cluster supernovae to reach Ossus.
You've lost. You have little evidence, and what you have is trumped by my own.
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