Captain America vs Batman(no shield-no gadgets)

Originally posted by lifeisaglich
Batman kicking down that three is not PIS because it is within his character. First off the people in the comics are far more stronger than the people in real life. They are stronger than regular joes, so this combined with their form of martial arts makes them far greater than any of us.

So you are ok with Cap. being able to hurt Class 75 beings with just his punches and he is not even using persure points which carry so much weight during fights in comic battles?

Batman has demonstrated that he has the better speed. And one of the best was him dodgeing bullets matrix style.

It is not in Batman's character to kick huge trees in half. Only batman fans says things like this. It is a huge difference in breaking a standing tree in half and knocking down a standing tree. The reason people in the comic are stronger than people in real life is because they have super powers or are altered in some way. Cap is altered. Batman is not. It is more plausible to hurt class 75 beings than kicking a huge tree in half. It takes more than 100tons of force (assuming the area of batman's foot edge) to kick a 2.5ft tree in half (knocking it down requires less force). Where can more than 100tons of force come from in a human being? Also hurting class 75beings takes a lot of less force. It is even plausible for a non-altered human (provided you hit them in the right spot) to do this. That is why mantis can hurt thor by using pressure points. How many times have batman kicked a huge tree in half and ripped a huge steel pole in half? Exactly! His other feats come no were near these. It is therefore PIS and is not allowed as proof.

Originally posted by Dizzle
Cap can't bench 5 tons... The site wasn't official, and it wasn't even close to being suported by in comic evidence. Marvel says twice his body weight, his best feats say 1,000 lbs.

Batman can too kick trees in half... I can provide a completely separate cscan of him doing it, if you relly want me to. Batman also threw a guy through a brick wall and caused internal bleeding once... These, combined with the entire steel pipe thing, show that he is very, very strong, and can hit very, VERY hard. No one on this thread has given any real proof that Cap can match Batman in most physical stats, let alone fighting skill. Saying Cap has fought for 100 years is trivial. He wasn't training and learning anything new, it's simply him gaining more experience. Ra's Al Ghul has lived and fought for millenia. Batman beats the crap out of him. Time lived really means nothing, once people hit a certain point. Time spent really training DOES, since one would be learning and rapidly improving while training, where simply fighting wouldn't really make one "better" at a point.

Dizzle where have you been? We missed you.
It has already been establish by me and others that this site isn't official and shouldn't be used for proof. I listed the reason why I chose to list it in my previous posts. I have also shown that kicking the tree in half and ripping the steel pole is PIS. They are PIS because they are humanly impossible and of the super rarity that batman does something humanly impossible. Note: Batman other great feats are very much humanly possible.

The other scans were shown of batman's speed and agility and knowledge of martial arts. I have already stated that the 1 scan showing cap's speed combined with his definition is more than 10times better than anything of those other batman scans shown. This is my opinion of course. But I bet you that many will agree with me here.

Originally posted by Dizzle
Cap can't bench 5 tons... The site wasn't official, and it wasn't even close to being suported by in comic evidence. Marvel says twice his body weight, his best feats say 1,000 lbs.

Batman can too kick trees in half... I can provide a completely separate cscan of him doing it, if you relly want me to. Batman also threw a guy through a brick wall and caused internal bleeding once... These, combined with the entire steel pipe thing, show that he is very, very strong, and can hit very, VERY hard. No one on this thread has given any real proof that Cap can match Batman in most physical stats, let alone fighting skill. Saying Cap has fought for 100 years is trivial. He wasn't training and learning anything new, it's simply him gaining more experience. Ra's Al Ghul has lived and fought for millenia. Batman beats the crap out of him. Time lived really means nothing, once people hit a certain point. Time spent really training DOES, since one would be learning and rapidly improving while training, where simply fighting wouldn't really make one "better" at a point.

Dizzle where have you been? We missed you.
It has already been establish by me and others that this site isn't official and shouldn't be used for proof. I listed the reason why I chose to list it in my previous posts. I have also shown that kicking the tree in half and ripping the steel pole is PIS. They are PIS because they are humanly impossible and of the super rarity that batman does something humanly impossible. Note: Batman other great feats are very much humanly possible.

The other scans were shown of batman's speed and agility and knowledge of martial arts. I have already stated that the 1 scan showing cap's speed combined with his definition is more than 10times better than anything of those other batman scans shown. This is my opinion of course. But I bet you that many will agree with me here.

Lastly, it is more evidence supporting that cap knows all forms of combat than not. It is mentioned in numerous handbooks and cards (many of these such as handbooks are written by the original writers). It is mention in one of cap's quotes. Cap has been shown to teach akido. Cap has been shown to use various techniques such as many style of kicks, knife hands, elbows, knees, etc. This is clearly more than boxing and judo my friend. Also I never seen cap lie. He is one of the most honest and corniest characters in history. His quote should be taken seriously along. Also no one here has read every entire cap comic book. Therefore it is highly possible that one of these comics mentioned explains how he learned all forms of combat. Why else what he demonstrate on countless times knowledge of other martial arts?

From a Cap respect thread loc at http://superherochat.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=100779

Here Caps puts his shield through the thick steel engine of a supply truck.

Cap hits a high flying helicopter.

Caps shield reaches a flying missile.

Cap's shield intercepts a thrown hammer by Thor.

Cap bends metal bars.

Breaking through a thick brickwall of a building.

With a broken shoulder Cap knocks down and dents a thick steel door.

Cap pulls a supply truck in the desert.

Cap rips out steel from a tractor.

Cap kicks through the special training room of the Super Agents of shield.

Cap moves the the wingflap from the outside and holds on to a jet.

Cap breaks out of some thick ice when completely encased in it. He started breaking it with just finger movement, showing there was not space for much movement or leverage to begin with.

Cap catches his shield thrown by an angry Hulk.

Cap gets hit by a vehicle going around 40mph it does not even fase him.

Cap working out easily with 1100 lbs/2200 lbs. while conversing.

^dude it said in his profile on the marvel directory, hes learned judo and boxing...THATS ALL..and batman has mastered 127 different forms of combat, and has yes, whether u believe it or not, thrown people through brick walls, sliced through bricks with his hand, kicked down trees ect. why do u think each time when he fights a criminal and KO's them, he always gives em major internal bleeding or 3-5 broken ribs?? and thats holding back so he doesnt kill them...if this fight had bloodlust on and batman didnt care about killing, Rogers would get his skull crushed to a pulp

All forms > 127

Also according to the Marvel handbooks, the scale for fighting ability is

1.Poor
2.Normal
3.Some training
4.Exp fighter
5.Master of a single form of comabt
6.Master of several forms of combat
7.Master of all forms of combat

Guess what they list Cap as? here is a hint, it comes after 6 and before 8.

Actually, once you get up that high, what the hell's the difference between 127 and all forms of combat? And besides, Batman has mastered his own unique style of martial arts.

Originally posted by Silent Master
With a broken shoulder Cap knocks down and dents a thick steel door.

Cap pulls a supply truck in the desert.

Cap rips out steel from a tractor.

Cap kicks through the special training room of the Super Agents of shield.

Cap moves the the wingflap from the outside and holds on to a jet.

Originally posted by batdude123
Actually, once you get up that high, what the hell's the difference between 127 and all forms of combat? And besides, Batman has mastered his own unique style of martial arts.

A lot, there are more than 400 styles of just Kung-fu

However I think it's interesting that number of styles no longer matters when it's Cap that knows more

Well, Batman has his own unique style of fighting anyway. He wouldn't use it if it wasn't better than all of the fighting skills he know.

Can you say if Captain America has HIS own style of fighting? I think not.

Originally posted by batdude123
Can you say if Captain America has HIS own style of fighting? I think not.

dude, it's even listed in his own official bio. a personalized style encoporating judo, boxing, etc.

Who has Captain America beaten in pure H2H, that Batman couldn't?

Who has Batman beaten in pure H2H that Cap couldn't?

^ I asked first.

Originally posted by Silent Master
A lot, there are more than 400 styles of just Kung-fu

However I think it's interesting that number of styles no longer matters when it's Cap that knows more

Originally posted by Silent Master
Who has Batman beaten in pure H2H that Cap couldn't?

Originally posted by Juntai
Aquaman.
Green Lantern.

Green Lantern's aren't that good of fighters, as for Aquaman

Cap vs Namor clone

Cap vs the Controllor ( Controllor is a already a heavy weight and had just stolen Namor's strength and speed)

Now, let's see the scans of Batman beating the people you mentioned.