Exar Kun vs NJO Luke and DE Sidious

Just to say Fishy, if the writers of Exar Kun, had constantly depicted him as shooting out blasts and destroying people, do you honestly believe that it would make a interesting read? Hell if it went "kun blasts muahahahahahaa, he pwnzors" it'll be getting heaps of hate mail. Same reason, why didn't Luke use his emerald lightning constantly? With your logic it means he cant, he did it once, and he never did so again, so that means he cant do it? It means that one, he didn't feel there was a need, or two the writers of Luke, did not want to depict him reusing the same feat over and over again.

Yeh, Luke and Sidious have had more training, why? because they are both much older than Kun himself, whats to say Kun wouldn't learn more or reach a higher potential if he had not died? Your logic is pointless, as well the sources on both Sidious and Luke surpass the sources on Kun by a astonishingly large amount.

Consider Also Kun, had absolutely no equal during his time, it took thousands upon thousands of Jedi to force him to entrap himself, he never had to demonstrate amazing feats, he was the strongest of the time, he had no-one to even remotely challenge him, having tooled the greatest of the Jedi in his time, completely humiliated the Senate on Coruscant.

Instead of proving what Kun can/can't do, why not try proving that Sidious and Luke can replicate the feats on which you believe can destroy Kun. NJO Luke using green lightning? Sidious using his force storm? Prove up, just because Sidious did it once does not mean he will do it again, so thereby unless you can prove Sidious and Luke can replicate their feats, you have defeated yourself with your own logic.

Just to say Fishy, if the writers of Exar Kun, had constantly depicted him as shooting out blasts and destroying people, do you honestly believe that it would make a interesting read? Hell if it went "kun blasts muahahahahahaa, he pwnzors" it'll be getting heaps of hate mail. Same reason, why didn't Luke use his emerald lightning constantly? With your logic it means he cant, he did it once, and he never did so again, so that means he cant do it? It means that one, he didn't feel there was a need, or two the writers of Luke, did not want to depict him reusing the same feat over and over again.

Does it matter Kun only used the blasts once and he says he could barely control it, I don't care why they didn't, its like saying Luke is a lot better with a lightsaber then what we see in the movies because the technology in the 70's suck. Thats no excuse, he used the blasts once then never again, and he said he could barely control him, that it almost destroyed him. So the reason why he never used it again would be very easy to see. He was afraid that he would die or lose control or something like that.

Yeh, Luke and Sidious have had more training, why? because they are both much older than Kun himself, whats to say Kun wouldn't learn more or reach a higher potential if he had not died? Your logic is pointless, as well the sources on both Sidious and Luke surpass the sources on Kun by a astonishingly large amount.

I never said this, and I couldn't care less. Kun died he didn't become more powerful. Point moot, for both sides.

Consider Also Kun, had absolutely no equal during his time, it took thousands upon thousands of Jedi to force him to entrap himself, he never had to demonstrate amazing feats, he was the strongest of the time, he had no-one to even remotely challenge him, having tooled the greatest of the Jedi in his time, completely humiliated the Senate on Coruscant.

And Luke did have an equal? And we don't know how many Jedi it took, just that all Jedi went there.

Instead of proving what Kun can/can't do, why not try proving that Sidious and Luke can replicate the feats on which you believe can destroy Kun. NJO Luke using green lightning? Sidious using his force storm? Prove up, just because Sidious did it once does not mean he will do it again, so thereby unless you can prove Sidious and Luke can replicate their feats, you have defeated yourself with your own logic.

Who ever said I believe they will win? Your putting words in my mouth, and there is a difference between the force storm (that Sidious has done twice) Emerald lightning and a blast that Kun himself said he could barely control. Kun had a reason to never use those attacks again, the Narrator even says it almost destroyed him. And seeing as he never used it again, its safe to say that he feared the amulet or the power that it could create, unless you can prove otherwise.

W00t with your logic, just because Kun did something once who's to say he'll do it again?
NJO Luke using green lightning? Sidious using his force storm? Prove up, just because Sidious did it once does not mean he will do it again, so thereby unless you can prove Sidious and Luke can replicate their feats, you have defeated yourself with your own logic.
^You've just ruined your whole argument or at least made it look like a biased Kun argument. Downplaying the duo's feats and then exaggerating Kun's sounds like a biased argument. Why don't you look at reality here. Not enough was written to make him out to be the G-d you and IKC want him to be, he died while Luke and Sidious lived. As a duo they might take him out or they might not, but if you're going to sit here and tell us to prove that Sidious did a force storm and NJO Luke did emerald lightning, which by the way this is DE Luke in the thread, then youre just being biased. And don't post the crap about "If he did it once doesnt mean he can do it again". Because I can say the same for Kun.

Does it matter Kun only used the blasts once and he says he could barely control it

Does it matter that Luke controlled a black hole once? Does it matter that Luke could barely cloak a ship without getting tired in DN? Does it matter that Luke could use Emerald lightning once?

This logic is bullshit, Fishy, and if you have any respect for debating conventions, you'd know it.

Even as a newly converted dark-sider, he was still able to control it. So why exactly wouldn't he be able to control it when he has gained a whole crapload of knowledge and power?

And Luke can use emerald lightning? Okay.

I don't care why they didn't, its like saying Luke is a lot better with a lightsaber then what we see in the movies because the technology in the 70's suck. Thats no excuse, he used the blasts once then never again, and he said he could barely control him, that it almost destroyed him. So the reason why he never used it again would be very easy to see. He was afraid that he would die or lose control or something like that.

And a look at his very hand shows that there was NO DAMAGE whatsoever.

And then seconds later, he uses the amulet to destroy Freedon Nadd.

So by your logic, Luke cloaking a ship will never happen again, because he was really tired after doing it.

And Luke did have an equal? And we don't know how many Jedi it took, just that all Jedi went there.

All Jedi means 2? The narration says "thousands upon thousands of force wielders."

So yes, it's perfectly logical to assume there were 2 guys there :eyeroll:.

Yes, Luke had an equal.

It took the combined force potential of 3 Skywalkers to top a Sidious. Note "potential," not just ability, so don't pull the whole "well Luke got stronger" card on me.

Who ever said I believe they will win? Your putting words in my mouth, and there is a difference between the force storm (that Sidious has done twice) Emerald lightning and a blast that Kun himself said he could barely control. Kun had a reason to never use those attacks again, the Narrator even says it almost destroyed him. And seeing as he never used it again, its safe to say that he feared the amulet or the power that it could create, unless you can prove otherwise.

Uhh... no. A Kun in battle said that he couldn't control it, that he could only direct it.

The only mention the narrator says is that "with each pulse of his anger, it doubles in power."

In fact, he is shown to be perfectly fine immediately after the Sith beast was destroyed.

Yep, he feared the power so much that he used it again on Nadd, and he found/built another damn amulet!

Honestly, logically IKC has been kicking some major ass. However, the point has deviated so much from the fight, that you guys are all arguing one big non sequitur.

Actually no, IKC's logic, like yours, diminishes Luke's achievements and embellish's Kun's. And this is NJO luke in case you misread the title. NJO Luke had no equal. "Luke had Emerald Lightning, ok". Um ok... Kun had Sadow's amulet, ok? What is your point? You haven't done anything to show Kun is more powerful than NJO Luke and especially DN Luke. All you've done is elevate Kun on a status beyond what he deserves, and diminish Luke.. Congratulations. I won't call you a fanboy only because some of your arguments are logical.

Neither have you or Fishy, proven that DN Luke/NJO Luke is more powerful than Kun, unfortuanely, how have i do what you said? I have not said that Kun is > Luke, im merely saying that if Kun can only use his blasts once, and you therefore say he cannot do so again, its the same as saying Luke used his lightning once, therefore he will not do so again. How is that embellishing Kun's achievements? How is that downplaying Luke's achievements? As far as we have said, we merely pointed out, that by your logic, if the character has only ever used the attack a once to a few times, then it applies to all of them, not merely the one's you want it to apply to. This debate although is meant to prove that one character is stronger than the other, as far as it has gone, noone has proven that either Luke or Kun is stronger.

It's impossible to prove. So we've thrown around feats and what not. Didn't you, a few posts ago agree that DN Luke was superior to Kun, and threw in the argument that he was older and more experienced.

Originally posted by tdtd
Actually no, IKC's logic, like yours, diminishes Luke's achievements and embellish's Kun's. And this is NJO luke in case you misread the title. NJO Luke had no equal. "Luke had Emerald Lightning, ok". Um ok... Kun had Sadow's amulet, ok? What is your point? You haven't done anything to show Kun is more powerful than NJO Luke and especially DN Luke. All you've done is elevate Kun on a status beyond what he deserves, and diminish Luke.. Congratulations. I won't call you a fanboy only because some of your arguments are logical.

When the hell did I use that argument? Read the damn post.

I argued that saying Kun couldn't use his amulet blasts because he only did them once is stupid, considering Luke only used emerald lightning once.

Got it yet?

Wow, I don't even know why I would bother responding to your post if you don't bother even reading someone else's before you go parrot why you think Luke is a force god.

Show me where I diminished Luke's feats? Show me where I elevated Kun's feats to ridiculous, illogical proportions.

IKC has used better logic in this case. You don't know a thing about logical debate, so I'm sure you wouldn't understand.

The fact that you would consider wars characters in hypothetical situations as a "logical debate" speaks volumes about the extent of your "logic".

And you're right I don't read the crap you and the other geniuses on this board spew out because you kids get heated about unrealistic situations... I like your faulty logic in the fact that I know nothing about "logical debate", when it doesn't exist on a star wars forum.. Thank you come again.

Originally posted by tdtd
The fact that you would consider wars characters in hypothetical situations as a "logical debate" speaks volumes about the extent of your "logic".

And you're right I don't read the crap you and the other geniuses on this board spew out because you kids get heated about unrealistic situations... I like your faulty logic in the fact that I know nothing about "logical debate", when it doesn't exist on a star wars forum.. Thank you come again.

Yes, because hypotheticals mean logic doesn't exist. I suppose that means we can't debate about philosophy, because those are completely abstract!

Genius. You get taken behind the woodshed so you turn on "SUPER FLAME MODE!!!!!11!!one!!"

Funny how you argue that we're all kids and nerds after you have a wet dream about Luke, isn't it? Yes, I enjoy pwning the crap out of you in your own theatre, I'm sure I'll come again.

-Waits for your inevitable weakass reply-.

pwning the crap out of me in your theater? We can't debate about philosophy????LOL... You've said enough..Yea I have wet dreams about Luke as you verbally fellate Kun. And what you call logic, I call biased opinion. Maybe you should visit dictionary.com before making yourself look dumber than you really are.

But please for a laugh, show me some logic that states Kun is above Luke... What's that you can't? Yet I can state that Luke is superior to Kun in the force just BECAUSE of the feat wars described.. Try again..

Originally posted by tdtd
It's impossible to prove. So we've thrown around feats and what not. Didn't you, a few posts ago agree that DN Luke was superior to Kun, and threw in the argument that he was older and more experienced.

By agreeing, its due to a number of reasons : Lack of Sources, Lack of Feats, yes i did, due to the fact, noone could solidy provide Kun's power, and i speculated that Luke is more powerful, but it doesnt neccesarrily make it true.

If you throw in feats, do not go listing, that just means the person with more feats wins. By that standard Ragnos would lose to Luke, as Luke has around 20 more feats, however going and saying. "Kun only ever used his amulet blasts once therefore he cannot do so again" is pure speculation adding to the fact, it effectively says "Luke has only cloaked a ship/used emerald lightning once, therefore he cannot do so again." If we all go by that, feats are completely useless.

Originally posted by tdtd
pwning the crap out of me in your theater? We can't debate about philosophy????LOL... You've said enough..Yea I have wet dreams about Luke as you verbally fellate Kun. And what you call logic, I call biased opinion. Maybe you should visit dictionary.com before making yourself look dumber than you really are.

But please for a laugh, show me some logic that states Kun is above Luke... What's that you can't? Yet I can state that Luke is superior to Kun in the force just BECAUSE of the feat wars described.. Try again..

You should be able to tell me the definition of syllogism first before you begin parroting other people's insults.

I love the self-pwnage, you can contradict yourself! Good job.

Jar Jar Binks can beat both Marka Ragnos and DN Luke together, Logic doesn't apply, you n3rd!!

Hah, this is too rich, please do standup, you can get free tomatoes.

And what was I saying about waiting for your inevitable weakass reply? Please, you're getting predictable.

Well i'm talking about force abilities alone. Listing more feats is useless I agree, but listing impressive feats for both characters give us at least something to work on.

Originally posted by tdtd
Well i'm talking about force abilities alone. Listing more feats is useless I agree, but listing impressive feats for both characters give us at least something to work on.

No it doesn't.

By that logic, Aleema pwns the crap out of Luke because she has better illusions.

Relevant context.

Instead of lying to yourself about self pwnage and me contradicting myself, give me another good laugh and answer my question. What puts Kun on par with Luke? Come on champ I'm waiting for your "logical argument".

Originally posted by tdtd
Instead of lying to yourself about self pwnage and me contradicting myself, give me another good laugh and answer my question. What puts Kun on par with Luke?

Oh how about him tooling Jedi Masters that actually had someone to learn from.

Wait, Luke is uber because he can beat a dying clone of a Sith Lord with a lot of help, or that he can beat a bunch of people he trained, or that he can slap around non-force sensitives. What a god.

I asked you to put things in relevant context pages ago. You've done thing but parrot the same shit about how anyone who disagrees with your opinion is "verbally fellating" Kun without anything to support your opinion.

Yay for hypocrisy and self-contradiction.

And oh, you still didn't tell me what a syllogism is. I guess your frydar only turns on when you have a statement that goes completely over your head.

Hypocrisy and self contradiction? As I recall, you were the one who told me I was verbally sucking off Luke correct? Now if I said you were doing the same thing with Kun, wouldn't that make YOU a hypocrite? Look up denial and I'll explain syllogism to you, and maybe throw in a short description on the mating rituals of the yack. Btw your reading comprehension skills seem to have failed you a long time ago, as this is NJO Luke, not DE Luke who defeated the "weak and dying" clone.. Perhaps you should read DE before continually verbally fellating Kun.

After you do that you show me where you effectively deduced that Kun is indeed superior to whichever form of Luke you're talking about.

Originally posted by tdtd
Hypocrisy and self contradiction? As I recall, you were the one who told me I was verbally sucking off Luke correct? Now if I said you were doing the same thing with Kun, wouldn't that make YOU a hypocrite? Look up denial and I'll explain syllogism to you, and maybe throw in a short description on the mating rituals of the yack. Btw your reading comprehension skills seem to have failed you a long time ago, as this is NJO Luke, not DE Luke who defeated the "weak and dying" clone.. Perhaps you should read DE before continually verbally fellating Kun.

After you do that you show me where you effectively deduced that Kun is indeed superior to whichever form of Luke you're talking about.

You must have not noticed the line where I mentioned this:

or that he can beat a bunch of people he trained, or that he can slap around non-force sensitives.

Wow, I guess I was pretty accurate with my opinion after all. Anyone that thinks Kun can top NJO Luke is "verbally fellating" him. I guess things are different on the other side of the tracks.

Oh, and I'm not the one that cites bad reading comprehension for a reason that I botched as my supporting evidence.

Honestly, you're getting boring. Got anything interesting to say before you go the way of Numan?

Eh you're not getting you're boring you're actually quite entertaining. I love quasi intellectuals. And yes i'm citing your bad reading comprehension because it's been continuous throughout this insignificant argument and it's worth mentioning due to the fact that you bring up DE Luke's feats, without(and i'm guessing), actually reading the DE Comics, when it's NJO Luke that's involved. I'm not sure you comprehend the difference between the two, but assuming you can, I will continue to correct your lack of reading comprehension skills.. Btw, you still have failed to show me how Kun is more powerful than NJO Luke or DN Luke. Why stop there though? Why not just put Kun above Nadd, Ragnos, all of the ancient sith, and even Artoo?