DN Luke Runs a Short Guantlet

Originally posted by zod360
[QUOTE=6197183]Originally posted by Fishy
[B]No, no he couldn't...

You are once again speculating without prove, the amulet was created on Korriban before Sadow even knew about Yavin... [/QUOTE

Well it is just a theory so calm down. It's based on the fact that he never used the ability outside Yavin 4 and it was full of dark side energy. [/B]

Did you not read the comics?

Naga Sadow made it, he had it on his hand on Korriban, Ziost, he took it with him when he attacked Republic space. He was able to use it on Yavin, apparently, when there was nothing there.

Yeah, you speculate that the amulet used dark side energies of a location (despite the fact that it was never mentioned as such, and that it was mentioned as using Kun's anger), and then you pass your speculation as "proof."

Bravo, slugger, just the kind of 10 year old logic I'd expec.... oh wait, you are 10 years old.

As Faunus said, Luke was never shown to have fatigue and fear after his instakill, that Kun had after his amulet blasts. The only time any of Luke's force powers drained him physically and mentally was when he created the illusion of his ship, I believe.

Originally posted by tdtd
As Faunus said, Luke was never shown to have fatigue and fear after his instakill, that Kun had after his amulet blasts. The only time any of Luke's force powers drained him physically and mentally was when he created the illusion of his ship, I believe.

Your point being? Luke still wouldn't use the attack right away just like Exar Kun wouldn't use the attack right away...

What makes you think so Fishy? What makes you think Kun would ever use the attack again anyways? Luke didn't have a problem with his technique, while Kun was scared to death of his.

Originally posted by tdtd
What makes you think so Fishy? What makes you think Kun would ever use the attack again anyways? Luke didn't have a problem with his technique, while Kun was scared to death of his.

Kun may have been scared to death because of the attack, but as he's shwon against Nadd he would rather use it then serve anybody, he would rather use it then die.

And Luke, Luke doesn't go into battles and then just shoots his enemy with something that should kill him. That isn't Luke his way, that isn't the Jedi way.

Right Fishy but this is a hypothetical 1 on 1 versus fight, we're not dealing with philosophical and moral issues, know what I'm saying. It is more logical to assume Luke would use and reuse his since there weren't any consequences shown, than Kun reusing his blast even a second time. You're right he used it on Nadd because he didn't want to serve him, but he didn't use it again because he was fearful of it. I'm not saying he wouldn't use it again, but what makes you think he would gain the confidence to do it?

Originally posted by tdtd
Right Fishy but this is a hypothetical 1 on 1 versus fight, we're not dealing with philosophical and moral issues, know what I'm saying. It is more logical to assume Luke would use and reuse his since there weren't any consequences shown, than Kun reusing his blast even a second time. You're right he used it on Nadd because he didn't want to serve him, but he didn't use it again because he was fearful of it. I'm not saying he wouldn't use it again, but what makes you think he would gain the confidence to do it?

Looking death in the eye is ussually a good motivation.

And the morales of the character heavily apply in every VS fight, otherwise we could see Yoda literally ripping the spine out of his opponents body's we could see Mace choking everybody he fights. Human emotions matter in a VS fight up to some extent.

and if Luke can use it removing his moral objections to use such an attack, then you should allow Kun to use his blast removing the fear he might have because of the amulet.

So you're comparing Luke's moral qualms as a Jedi, to Kun's incredible fear of the amulet? Interesting

I agree that death is a great motivator, however Kun knows he cannot control the amulet and he knows it could also kill him, so he would have a dilemma of his own, would he not?

So you're comparing Luke's moral qualms as a Jedi, to Kun's incredible fear of the amulet? Interesting

In a way yes, both fear and morale objections are essential parts of a character if you remove one to strengthen a character you should do so the other. If you allow one to weaken the character you should do so with the other. You can't make one character different and more powerful and refuse to do the same with the other, it would make the fight unfair.

I agree that death is a great motivator, however Kun knows he cannot control the amulet and he knows it could also kill him, so he would have a dilemma of his own, would he not?

Not really, a possible death is far better then certain death, and if he would have to choose between risk it and possibly die and possibly survive, or just die i'm certain he would choose to risk it.

Originally posted by tdtd
So you're comparing Luke's moral qualms as a Jedi, to Kun's incredible fear of the amulet? Interesting

I agree that death is a great motivator, however Kun knows he cannot control the amulet and he knows it could also kill him, so he would have a dilemma of his own, would he not?

You forget the reason he used it in the first place was to escape an inevitable death otherwise against Sadow's machination.

Originally posted by Faunus
Because Kun's attack is potentially as dangerous to to himself as it is to an enemy; what would happen if he lost control of it? He could vaporize himself, destroy the ground beneath his feet, bring a building down onto his head, etc. Luke's attack has no such implications.

And I highly doubt that the Jedi Master's attack is taxing for either his physical condition or his reserves in the Force. Even after using the attack, he managed to bring down three or four more slayers, keep his footing and ''fiercely'' engage another crafty Vong elite while the dovin basal tossed everyone else around like ragdolls, and defeat the greatest warrior of the Yuuzhan Vong race; Supreme Overlord Shimrra himself. Exar, on the other hand, noted that his hand was burned, and that he nearly lost control of the blasts.

True, but its very possible that the Emerald Lightning puts its user at risk, as Luke would be drained, however i can't argue its speculation.

But the fact remains that he can reproduce the Blasts, the point is he generally doesn;t untill he looks death in the eye, so fighting someone like DN Luke, he would most likely use it as Luke uses his Emerald Lightning, tking them both out.

Originally posted by tdtd
So you're comparing Luke's moral qualms as a Jedi, to Kun's incredible fear of the amulet? Interesting

I agree that death is a great motivator, however Kun knows he cannot control the amulet and he knows it could also kill him, so he would have a dilemma of his own, would he not?

It doesn't matter; the only reason he used the lightning was because Jacen's life was in danger. Luke doesn't use the Force to kill unless it is absolutely necessary, and I doubt that will change with Kun. I see it being used as a last resort, as I see Exar using the gauntlet.

Exar, on the other hand, noted that his hand was burned, and that he nearly lost control of the blasts.

Quick post, inasmuch as I'm busy:

So his hand was burned, huh? That's why we see a closeup of it moments later and it appears perfectly fine? It seems Kun only believed his hand to be burned.

Evidence:

Does that look burned to you?

Originally posted by w00t2112
True, but its very possible that the Emerald Lightning puts its user at risk, as Luke would be drained, however i can't argue its speculation.

But the fact remains that he can reproduce the Blasts, the point is he generally doesn;t untill he looks death in the eye, so fighting someone like DN Luke, he would most likely use it as Luke uses his Emerald Lightning, tking them both out.

Again, neither are going to use those attacks unless they have no other choice. Skywalker won't use the Force to kill unless he has no other choice. Exar won't blast Luke with the amulet unless he's desperate, either, because a) He'd fear a loss of control, and b) His arrogance would probably push him to try and beat down Luke in a lightsaber duel.

Originally posted by IKC
Quick post, inasmuch as I'm busy:

So his hand was burned, huh? That's why we see a closeup of it moments later and it appears perfectly fine? It seems Kun only believed his hand to be burned.

Evidence:

Does that look burned to you?

I don't think Exar would muse about it unless it was true; unless, of course, he can't tell a burn from a psychological reflex.

Even if his hand burned with the energy output, but wasn't roasted in the literal sense, I doubt that can speak well for him.

You're not addressing the point: He apparently believed his hand was burned, but as it's depicted on-panel, it wasn't.

His dialogue is, "My hand, the flesh is burned, but I feel no pain!"

His dialogue, I would argue, is trumped by on-panel depiction.

By that logic, Kun really didn't have in his possession more knowledge than he could ever use, because we only see a mediocre amount of artifacts and scrolls in the said panel. I'd say Kun's own observation trumps mistakes made by the artist.

Except the quote in question by your example is made by the narrator, which is on equal or greater canon grounds than the art depicted. That, and it was speaking of all the knowledge Kun collected, not just what he had from Ossus. The point was all he had gathered from Ossus combined with what he already had was "more than he could ever use."

So your example is faulty and you have no reason to say the artist made a mistake, especially since it was apparently a "mistake" repeated ad infinitum by the artist given that there's no panel in existence with damage shown to Kun's hand.

Originally posted by w00t2112
True, but its very possible that the Emerald Lightning puts its user at risk, as Luke would be drained, however i can't argue its speculation.

But the fact remains that he can reproduce the Blasts, the point is he generally doesn;t untill he looks death in the eye, so fighting someone like DN Luke, he would most likely use it as Luke uses his Emerald Lightning, tking them both out.

Yes, but the issue here is that it's speculatory at best to say that said Green Lightning would be instantly fatal to a strong force user, such as an Exar Kun.

Just as it is speculatory that Kun could use it on Luke who as we've argued, was shown to stop an AT-AT laser.

Then again, as one of you said, if Luke can use it on someone that doesn't belong in the force(which is impressive enough), why wouldn't he be able to use the same technique against someone of the force?