Originally posted by Mindship
Generally speaking, I agree: Thor is very versatile. But DD appears to have equal versatility in response to prior defeats. I noticed that in the Doomsday vs Mangog thread, DD was assigned one life only. Why? To even the playing field.My understanding is this: DC has defined DD--over the long haul--to be undefeatable by conventional means (energy blasts, slugfest, whatever), BFR being the only real option (or the psych approach, which Supes used...but now that option's been exhausted). Like it or not (and personally, I'm Not crazy about the idea), Doomsday is Plot Device Incarnate. Thor can do a lot of things to DD...But. He. Will. Come. Back.
Although...now that I think about, here is another option that Thor, Surfer or anyone with time travel ability could use: go back in time and prevent the scientists from creating DD in the first place. He may be "beyond Death," but is Doomsday beyond Never Existing In The First Place? If so, how?
Dude, i can't even count how many characters have been created in the marvel and dc universes, that were not supposed to be beatable by conventional means.
but, i can tell u that mangog was one of them also.
also, in the mangog/dd thread, dd had one life because, originally, if dd was defeated, that would be the end of that fight, and there would have to be a good deal of time for him to come back to life.
originally.
so, mangog would not even be there for a second fight.
Originally posted by h1a8
Show me that Thor put up a shield against a bomb that would destroy a fifth of the MU. The reason I responded to you before like that before is because I didn't catch the Universe part in MU. I was merely thinking one fifth of the characters of the MU and not one fifth of the entire universe.
If you want proof that it was really that powerful, Iron Man failed to deactivate an equally powerful bomb the blew up and really did destroy a fifth of the MU.
Originally posted by h1a8
Are you implying that DD won't go through Thor's body like tissue paper as he went through Superman's and Darkseid's?
Originally posted by h1a8
If yes then understand this:
First, Thor is hella tough to energy. That is why he is the god of thunder. As he has shown this.
But Thor is nowhere near as durable as Superman physically. That means taking physical blows and such.
Originally posted by h1a8
Thor simply takes too long to do anything exotic (Even though some of these feats are PIS).
Originally posted by h1a8
DD's speed and relentlessness will keep Thor from doing anything. In one or two punches DD's fist will be stuck in Thor's head.
Originally posted by h1a8
Opening a portal and sending DD through it is unrealistic (in the comic sense).
Saying a magic hammer using special powers in a comic book is unrealistic holds no weight here, especially when defending a monster who you claim is as powerful as a bomb that can destroy a fifth of the universe.
Originally posted by h1a8
Many characters that are on par in reflexes with Thor couldn't even react to DD (WW, flash, Superman, etc).
Originally posted by h1a8
Plus Thor has been hit by super slow moving foes a billion times.
Originally posted by Accel
He used in an Avengers Annual # 15, I think.1. If you want proof that it was really that powerful, Iron Man failed to deactivate an equally powerful bomb the blew up and really did destroy a fifth of the MU.
2. Pretty much, as Thor won’t be duking it out with him.
3. He’s plenty durable to take punches form DOS Doomsday, as he has shown many, many times. However, like I said, he can just rely on his versatility.
4. Mjonir is a huge plot-device. How are his extra powers PIS? And again you say he takes too long to anything based on nothing, even though I’ve shown you pics of him creating shields and such with nothing more than the wave of his hand.
5. Coming from the guy who told me not to use real science.
Saying a magic hammer using special powers in a comic book is unrealistic holds no weight here, especially when defending a monster who you claim is as powerful as a bomb that can destroy a fifth of the universe.
6. Superman and Flash always get hit more times than they should.
So has Flash. Your point?
1. I still don't believe that. Sorry. need proof. Why hasn't thor used the shield more often in his battles. He used it so rarely that I think he can't do anymore (or at all).
2. Thor always duke it out with brawlers. At least in the beginning anyways.
3. I doubt it as most durable heros nearly got killed by DOS DD from only a few punches (some of which DD was holding back). Not to mention that superman can take physical punishment better and DD was still ripping him a new a@#hole. Plus thor got his butt nearly killed from the likes of such as Juggernaut and Hulk. And DOS DD's power is much greater than theirs with an added speed and bony protrusions bonus. Man! Those bony protrusions is going to do some serious murder.
4. Some are PIS because writers will never write Thor doing such things again. That is why he did those things which are considered PIS once or maybe twice in his whole comic history. From what i've seen it takes Thor at least a few seconds to erect a shield. Even though he nearly never does it. Wonder why?
5. That is why I said in the comic sense. This implied that I am not using real science but comic logic. DD is known to attack fast and hard. It is unrealistic in the comic sense for thor to have time to use his exotic powers. Especially when he always duke it out with a brawler.
6. My point exactly. That is why Thor is going to get hit and get hit bad.
Originally posted by JuntaiAre we talking about Avengers thor or regular thor because their almost as different as JLa Batman and regular Batman.
I admit I don't own very many Thor comics, mostly only a handful during the Jurgerns era... but every Thor comic I read--from Avengers or his own series, or infinity watch, or whatever-- of him fighting had him going hammer to fist with someone. Powers came as a rare thing.
Originally posted by Juntai
I admit I don't own very many Thor comics, mostly only a handful during the Jurgerns era... but every Thor comic I read--from Avengers or his own series, or infinity watch, or whatever-- of him fighting had him going hammer to fist with someone. Powers came as a rare thing.
Thank you!
That is probably why Thor is an moron most of the time.
If he was wise as say Thanos or Dr. Strange then boy wouldn't he be a force to be wreckon with (even though he still is).
Originally posted by h1a8
1. I still don't believe that. Sorry. need proof. Why hasn't thor used the shield more often in his battles. He used it so rarely that I think he can't do anymore (or at all).
I have no reason to lie about it.
Originally posted by h1a8
2. Thor always duke it out with brawlers. At least in the beginning anyways.
Originally posted by h1a8
3. I doubt it as most durable heros nearly got killed by DOS DD from only a few punches (some of which DD was holding back). Not to mention that superman can take physical punishment better and DD was still ripping him a new a@#hole. Plus thor got his butt nearly killed from the likes of such as Juggernaut and Hulk. And DOS DD's power is much greater than theirs with an added speed and bony protrusions bonus. Man! Those bony protrusions is going to do some serious murder.
Not to mention he doesn’t have to slug it out with DD in the first place.
Originally posted by h1a8
4. Some are PIS because writers will never write Thor doing such things again. That is why he did those things which are considered PIS once or maybe twice in his whole comic history. From what i've seen it takes Thor at least a few seconds to erect a shield. Even though he nearly never does it. Wonder why?
Originally posted by h1a8
5. That is why I said in the comic sense. This implied that I am not using real science but comic logic. DD is known to attack fast and hard. It is unrealistic in the comic sense for thor to have time to use his exotic powers. Especially when he always duke it out with a brawler.
Originally posted by h1a8
6. My point exactly. That is why Thor is going to get hit and get hit bad.
Originally posted by Accel1. I highly doubt his overall power at DOS levels is much greater Savage Hulk’s or Classic Juggernaut’s. Thor’s taken blows from the best and never faltered. He won’t falter here either.
Not to mention he doesn’t have to slug it out with DD in the first place.
2. A lot of people have one-time powers, mainly Thor and Green Lantern. That doesn't discredit the powers at all. If Superman never used T-Vo again, would you say it never existed in the first place?
3. Not at all. Thor has used his versatility tons of times, mainly in his own series. We see Thor duking it out with the Hulk because no one wants to read a comic where he simply absorbs his radiation and be done with it. Fortunately for Thor, he won’t be limited to that on these forums.
4.That’s some of the worse logic I’ve heard yet. Doomsday has been beaten down by fists alone. Therefore, Thor can do the same.
2. Yes it does discredits. Many character's power always change throughout their history without explanation. Such as Things strength increase, invisible woman's powers, etc. In order for something not to be PIS it has to be done consistently enough times. What is T-Vo? Yes, if superman never used it again then I couldn't use it.
3. Just because one does something to one being, one or two times, doesn't mean that they can do it to someone else (or at all again). Why do people use such ancient Thor comics anyway to show one time powers from scans. Because writers today know it was PIS and wouldn't dare write that sh@t again.
4. It was superman's physical durability that made him last long enough to put DD down. I'm sorry but Thor doesn't have anywhere that amount of physical durability. He would get a protrusion stuck in him.
Originally posted by h1a8
1. DOS DD power >>>>>>>>>Savage Hulk/Classic Juggernaut power
Thor has faltered and faltered badly. He is going to get a bony protrusion stuck in him.
There is no comparison here. Yes he does have to slug it out with him. He has no choice (or time to react for that matter).
no he doesn't have to slug it out with him.
.and to my knowledge a weakened superman was able to break DD's bony protrusion...Thor with mjinor in his hand can to the very same thing.
Originally posted by h1a8
2. Yes it does discredits. Many character's power always change throughout their history without explanation. Such as Things strength increase, invisible woman's powers, etc. In order for something not to be PIS it has to be done consistently enough times. What is T-Vo? Yes, if superman never used it again then I couldn't use it.
who made u stan lee to say that a person cant use their powers? This forum states that a character has to fight to the best of their abilities..that saying thor can use any power he wants to use, if they are backed up by scans and proof that he has them.
Originally posted by h1a8
3. Just because one does something to one being, one or two times, doesn't mean that they can do it to someone else (or at all again). Why do people use such ancient Thor comics anyway to show one time powers from scans.
again ur are trying to limit thors abilities because u cant counter arguments ..why wouldn't thor be able to duplicate powers he used back in the day? did he forget how to use the mijinor? 🙄
Originally posted by h1a8
Because writers today know it was PIS and wouldn't dare write that sh@t again.
NO writers don't believe it is PIS, they want to make money, and entertain their audience. do u know wat PIS means? 😐
Originally posted by h1a8
4. It was superman's physical durability that made him last long enough to put DD down. I'm sorry but Thor doesn't have anywhere that amount of physical durability. He would get a protrusion stuck in him.
whats with up and doomsday's protrusion?...yes Thor has durability that matches superman.., he has fought tougher opponents such as the destroyer, and mangog..the same results would happen with doomsday.
Originally posted by Juntai
I admit I don't own very many Thor comics, mostly only a handful during the Jurgerns era... but every Thor comic I read--from Avengers or his own series, or infinity watch, or whatever-- of him fighting had him going hammer to fist with someone. Powers came as a rare thing.
No, no, characters here figth at best of all abilities no matter how they usually fare in comics. This means he will pull godblasts left and rigth.
Thor FTW!
Originally posted by Priest
1. who made u stan lee to say that a person cant use their powers? This forum states that a character has to fight to the best of their abilities..that saying thor can use any power he wants to use, if they are backed up by scans and proof that he has them.2. again ur are trying to limit thors abilities because u cant counter arguments ..why wouldn't thor be able to duplicate powers he used back in the day? did he forget how to use the mijinor? 🙄
3. NO writers don't believe it is PIS, they want to make money, and entertain their audience. do u know wat PIS means? 😐
4. whats with up and doomsday's protrusion?...yes Thor has durability that matches superman.., he has fought tougher opponents such as the destroyer, and mangog..the same results would happen with doomsday.
Originally posted by olympian
Wait a minute there. But isent that using a character IN character?1. No, no, characters here figth at best of all abilities no matter how they usually fare in comics. This means he will pull godblasts left and rigth.
Thor FTW!
1. True. You are right.
Sorry.
But anyway a Godblast won't put a scratch on DD.
Plus Thor wouldn't ever get a chance to use it.
Originally posted by h1a8
1. DOS DD power >>>>>>>>>Savage Hulk/Classic Juggernaut power
Thor has faltered and faltered badly. He is going to get a bony protrusion stuck in him.
There is no comparison here. Yes he does have to slug it out with him. He has no choice (or time to react for that matter).
This was a Thor who relied on fisticuffs and didn’t go down. Imagine if he actually used his other powers.
Originally posted by h1a8
2. Yes it does discredits. Many character's power always change throughout their history without explanation. Such as Things strength increase, invisible woman's powers, etc. In order for something not to be PIS it has to be done consistently enough times. What is T-Vo? Yes, if superman never used it again then I couldn't use it.
It’s not any more PIS for a plot device weapon such as Mjolnir to use a wide variety of attacks any more than it is for Doomsday t evolve beyond energies and such. Get over it.
Originally posted by h1a8
3. Just because one does something to one being, one or two times, doesn't mean that they can do it to someone else (or at all again). Why do people use such ancient Thor comics anyway to show one time powers from scans. Because writers today know it was PIS and wouldn't dare write that sh@t again.
Again, get over it.
Originally posted by h1a8
4. It was superman's physical durability that made him last long enough to put DD down. I'm sorry but Thor doesn't have anywhere that amount of physical durability. He would get a protrusion stuck in him.
This is of course assuming he just sits there, waiting for Doomsday to attack him before he does any thing like fly or put up shields to begin with.
Originally posted by h1a8
Sorry. I mean SvFL
1. False. Not if its SvFL
2. No. Because is was SvFL
3. Yes they do (SvFL instead).
And SvFL means "[B]a feat that is not repeated or is rarely repeated again relative to the character's overall established career, as well as the character's opponents' established showings. In statistical terms, it is an outlier, something that is radically beyond the character's established capabilities. For example, Spiderman defeating a herald of Galactus is a case of the SvFL exemption; however, Batman being able to sneak up on Superman is not because he has done so frequently under different writers". [/B]
Originally posted by h1a8
1. True. You are right.
Sorry.But anyway a Godblast won't put a scratch on DD.
Plus Thor wouldn't ever get a chance to use it.
Originally posted by Accel
1. DOS Doomsday? Not really. And Thor never faltered. He took their punishment and kept coming.2. This was a Thor who relied on fisticuffs and didn’t go down. Imagine if he actually used his other powers.
3. Faulty logic. Both Thor and Green Lantern have used plenty of one-time powers over their careers. Guess what? We still credit these powers unless something happens to them (such as Thor losing his ability to freeze time).
4. It’s not any more PIS for a plot device weapon such as Mjolnir to use a wide variety of attacks any more than it is for Doomsday t evolve beyond energies and such. Get over it.
5.Writers today rarely care about Thor’s power-set when they have him fight Hulk. The fact is, those powers are still canon. Thus, they are still viable in a battle setting.
5.Thor’s taken worse than what DOS Doomsday can dish put primarily. He can take DD’s punishment long enough to take to the skies and do whatever the hell he wants to DD form there, which is all he needs to be.
6.This is of course assuming he just sits there, waiting for Doomsday to attack him before he does any thing like fly or put up shields to begin with.
1. Yes really. DOS DD is way more powerful with added speed and protrusions(to help increase the power and damage).
2. Thor did go down (he didn't completely stay down though). DOS DD is far more powerful than these two (especially Juggernaut). And if Thor had the miracle of having time to use his other powers, it would do him no good.
3. This is not faulty logic but forum rules. Did you see my quote in bold?
I quoted from the forum rules.
4. Your right it isn't PIS but SvFL. And DD has shown this power consistently through his career so it isn't SvFL.
5. Cough Cough Bullsh#t. Thor has taken far worse only in energy. Not physical blows of DD's power and damage ability. DOS DD has punctured Superman's body. This my friend is a physical power feat that proves he can do worst to Thor.
6. Of couse he will sit there. Why? Because DD will be on him before he has time to react. Unless Thor has prep of course (in which he needs).
And you keep confusing physical force with energy force. DD is immune to the latter so Thor's only chance is to beat him physically (Which isn't going to happen since he will be going down in a few seconds).