Lucifer hits the Gauntlet !!!

Originally posted by Mr Master
I got the idea from the comic book.

Here's the "several universes away" thingy.
Magus's Lair...

And another instance...it's actually "many universes/realities away"
Magus's Lair...

Here Galactus sends Thor back to our universe...from Magus's universe.

This is what is happening with our Universe...

Here's where Warlock gets kidnapped in Magus's reality/universe...He takes the IG from Warlock which did not work at the time...and when it was activated...he did what happened in the following scan to 616...from this reality(His Lair)not several...but many universes away.

Magus merges and remakes 616 from universes away(or his Lair)

And those were just some of the instances it was referenced. Great scans Mr. Master.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
And those were just some of the instances it was referenced. Great scans Mr. Master.

thanx...

Your right...there were many more referrences to just how far they were from 616....that was clearly pointed out through several issues, but I didn't think I had to flood him with proof...I'm sure he agrees now....

I was going to pop up the scans of them travelling across many many universes to get to where Magus was at...but I think they get the idea...if not they're there.

People sleep on the IG...because someone had spread around here that it was a universal power...they even said it couldn't be used outside 616 universe 😆

Quite to the contrary I'm afraid.

Here the Goddess merges 30 Cosmic Containment Units...which equal to even greater power as a sum than individually(as when Magus used them)

Here Silver Surfer and the Goddess acknowledge that the Infinity Gauntlet is a "Far More Potent Force" than even 30 Cosmic Containment Units as the Cosmic Egg(un-evolved Cosmic Cubes)and remember it only took five to create an exact duplicate of the 616 Universe.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Hence despite Galactic Storm's justified and possibly Valid opinion, that Facts still stand.

Classic IG is WAY BEYOND the power of the Pheonix. Get over it GS 😉

Where did that come from? You have no justification to present that opinion as fact. Classic IG was still a conduit to the fundamental forces contained within 616 therefore it really isnt if the Phoenix Force is stated on panel to be the Big Bang which spawned 616. Sorry son. 😉

Originally posted by Mr Master
IG was Multiversal...and IG is Multiversal...

Nope. To be multiversal the IG would have had to have demonstrated a feat which involved its power being applied simultaneously across all realities of the multiverse. Simply applying your power in another reality is NOT multiversal.

Originally posted by Mr Master
L. Urizen who made this claim...that there's a classic IG and a retcon version?

You know how we do...if it's not on panel...it's inconsequential.

The original I Gems were fragments of a being claimed by Thanos to have been responsible for creating 616 in Thanos Quest. Since then the Infinity Being has been stated to have been someone who was merely of 616 in the Avengers/Ultraverse crossovers which consequently are canon and are referenced in the bios of Sersi and the Black Knight, whilst the initiator of the 616 creation cycle we've been told is Phoenix. For more details google "marvunapp nemesis"

Originally posted by Mr Master
And as for the first point...

Phoenix REPAIRED the damage of that orphan universe(some one had the balls to say it was 616)...she did NOT reconfigure/restructure/warp call it what you will...but she did NOT do that...she REPAIRED the damage of that universe.

From websters:

Repair: fix or mend (a thing suffering from damage or a fault)

Restructure: organize differently (change a thing)

Please read the comic. Dont go merely by the scans. The universe in the palm of her hand is 616 which she had just damaged by cutting away its future, leaving it in a static state.

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=7/18209533321.jpg&s=f5

Phoenix then restructured/repaired 616 in the palm of her hand displaying control of it in its totality right down to the atomic level

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=7/18209545011.jpg&s=f5

Before growing it a new future by changing Scotts reactions to Emma

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=7/18209562539.jpg&s=f5

The Ig taps into the fundamental forces of 616. It gives you mastery over something Phoenix holds in the palm of her hand like a tennis ball. The Phoenix Force by feats and by definition is greater than the IG.

Originally posted by Mr Master
thanx...

Your right...there were many more referrences to just how far they were from 616....that was clearly pointed out through several issues, but I didn't think I had to flood him with proof...I'm sure he agrees now....

of course, i MUST agree . . . 🙄

before [b]I decide whether or not i agree, i would like your take on something. when dr strange journey's to the dark dimension where dormmammu resides, is he still in the 616? or, more importantly, does he remain within the 'body of OUR eternity'? is cyttorak's realm considered 616 or does 616 relate to specifically the earth dimension/universe? what about mephisto's realm? asgard? olympus? when ss time travels does he remain in the 616 or does he leave the 'body of OUR eternity'? what about limbo? 616/outside eternity? would you say that all these realms/actualities/dimensions/'universes' are all part of 'our' eternity?

your first scan says -- many realities away. asgard is many realities away in a different dimension.

second scan -- many realites away.

in the third scan galactus refers to it as an 'actuality' then later says adam will be returned 'to this dimension'. he also adds an interesting bit about the 'defense of OUR universe'. now does that necessarily imply that just because they are out of the earth dimension/universe, that they have actually exited the body of eternity? does eternity not comprise more than the earth dimension/'universe'?

fourth scan shows nothing really. dommammu has stood and watched and created disasters that unfold in 'our universe' while he was safe and snug in his realm. nightmare has done many similar things. hell, loki has affected earth from agard. attacking across dimensions is nothing really unique.

fifth scan shows . . . i'm not sure . . . dormammu could jump out of the dark dimension and do something similar (in fact he has done something like that, surprising strange. nightmare has done something similar as well.) anyone outside earth's dimension/universe with the ability to open a portal could do the same . . .

sixth scan is much the same as the fourth. anyone not in the earth dimension could sit and watch earth's dimension fall apart and remain unaffected. again, the list of cosmic characters who can/have maddled with the earth dimension from their own dimension is vast. satannish is another who has done something similar.

so, i guess it boils down to this most important question: do you think that all the dimensions i named above (asgard, olympus, dark dimension, limbo, nightmare's realm, mephisto's realm, agamotto's realm, etc) are considered to be part of 'our' eternity? do you agree that eternity comprises nearly limitless dimensions, of which the earth dimension/universe/(616?) is but one small part?

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Where did that come from? You have no justification to present that opinion as fact. Classic IG was still a conduit to the fundamental forces contained within 616 therefore it really isnt if the Phoenix Force is stated on panel to be the Big Bang which spawned 616. Sorry son. 😉

WRONG 👇

That is not Opinion it IS FACT which Mr. Master has already proven, so get with the program. You have no right to challenge that after you Blatantly LIE about the White Pheonix of the Crown having birthed the Marvel Multiverse, and THEN ON TOP OF LYING you try to suggest that the PF is MEGAVERSAL !

LOL u are a JOKE ! Don't lecture on me on warping fact and fantasy, when you yourself are notorious for this on KMC !

9/10 debators agree.....you warp facts, exxagerate feats, and even make things up to further your Pheonix favoritism. Cut it out, ok ?

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
WRONG 👇

That is not Opinion it IS FACT which Mr. Master has already proven, so get with the program. You have no right to challenge that after you Blatantly LIE about the White Pheonix of the Crown having birthed the Marvel Multiverse, and THEN ON TOP OF LYING you try to suggest that the PF is MEGAVERSAL !

LOL u are a JOKE ! Don't lecture on me on warping fact and fantasy, when you yourself are notorious for this on KMC !

9/10 debators agree.....you warp facts, exxagerate feats, and even make things up to further your Pheonix favoritism. Cut it out, ok ?

actually LU it was prolly more accurate to say that both proved points using their respective versions of the PF. personally i tend to think the PF is multiversal, but i don't attribute the same level of power to it that gs does and frankly i don't know enough about lucifer to comment on your gauntlet. i am interested in your response to the question i asked mr. m however -- do you think that 'our' eternity comprises dimension/realities/'universes' outside the earth dimension? and is 616 JUST our 'universe' or does it include these other realities within eternity?

is the Multiversal Eternity the sum total of the multiverse that the LT watches over?

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
WRONG 👇

That is not Opinion it IS FACT which Mr. Master has already proven, so get with the program. You have no right to challenge that after you Blatantly LIE about the White Pheonix of the Crown having birthed the Marvel Multiverse, and THEN ON TOP OF LYING you try to suggest that the PF is MEGAVERSAL !

LOL u are a JOKE ! Don't lecture on me on warping fact and fantasy, when you yourself are notorious for this on KMC !

9/10 debators agree.....you warp facts, exxagerate feats, and even make things up to further your Pheonix favoritism. Cut it out, ok ?

Nope. Another case of fanboys whose arguments i have torn apart ganging together in an attempt to achieve the impossible. Speak for yourself 🙂

Mr Master has not proven that the Phoenix didnt create 616. Not once did he post a scan stating that Phoenix did not create 616 or a scan which meant that Phoenix couldnt have possibly created 616. He posted scans and then he posted his opinion on them nothing more. An opinion you've lapped up because of our last encounter which highlighted how your precious IG aint such hotstuff after all. 🙁

Ive posted scans stating in captions and on panel by reputable characters (Watchers, Omniversal guardians, abstracts etc) stating that Phoenix starts off the creation cycle and that Phoenix ends it. Scans saying that Phoenix is the Big Bang and that she is also the final fire that consumes reality. Such scans came from multiple titles and from multiple sources within said titles making the point canon. Opinion to the contrary in the face of that is rather irrelevant. That makes me happy. 😄

Originally posted by bbrem123
is the Multiversal Eternity the sum total of the multiverse that the LT watches over?

He embodies the temporal axis of the multiverse as a whole without actually being the temporal axis.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
He embodies the temporal axis of the multiverse as a whole without actually being the temporal axis.

o ok thanks

so, gs, what do you think about the eternity/other-realities/616 question? does our eternity embody asgard and the dark dimension, ect . . . and are all these other dimensions/universes within our eternity inclusive in the '616' moniker?

Originally posted by leonidas
so, gs, what do you think about the eternity/other-realities/616 question? does our eternity embody asgard and the dark dimension, ect . . . and are all these other dimensions/universes within our eternity inclusive in the '616' moniker?

Sort of. Ive read something about this recently in some marvel
letters page or something. I'll try and find it and post a quote or something.

Basically places like Asgard, Dark Dimension, Cytorraks Dimension, etc are located outside of the main 616 dimension however they are adjacent to 616 and are considered within the 616 continuity which is why if 616 was destroyed these realms would be affected also to some degree as they are deeply connected to it, maybe even formed via matter and energy from 616. So consider 616 more of a continuity than a single dimension. The sames true for every alternate universe they'd each have versions of Asgard and so on.

so to say magus was outside earth's 'universe', in some other dimension/reality/actuality, doesn't really mean he was outside the 'body of our' eternity . . .?

Originally posted by leonidas
so to say magus was outside earth's 'universe', in some other dimension/reality/actuality, doesn't really mean he was outside the 'body of our' eternity . . .?

Not necessarily no. He couldve just been in a parallel pocket dimension which would still be within the 616 continuity.

Originally posted by leonidas
so to say magus was outside earth's 'universe', in some other dimension/reality/actuality, doesn't really mean he was outside the 'body of our' eternity . . .?

hysterical

Ok, in response to your ever wondrous theories...
You asked gs...you immediately took his word...

Fine...I post this for those who enjoy the On Panel Proof...while correcting your speculation.
Ok, where should we start.

"Powerful Eternity Catatonic"
"Artificially Induced by an OUTSIDE FORCE"...these are direct quotes.

Let's make sure this isn't a onetime thing......
Again...Here is Quasar "Reality Hopping"...trying to find Eternity

He does...He finds Eternity...
"He's Catatonic....It appears to be Induced by OUTSIDE FORCES"....

What did this to Mighty Eternity?...................................Magus.

From where?........many Realities away

Many Realities away...

Doom&Kang find Magus's stronghold after what?
Breaking Through to the Desired Reality.

A Reality is a Universe...a Dimension is not....a Dimension is part of a Reality/Universe.

Continue...

Here Magus asks Thanos, "You now Protect what you once sought to Decimate?"
"What does Reality mean to one such as you?"....I don't think Thanos was very interested in Conquering or Decimating JUST A Dimension.

Thanos tells Magus...It is what brought me to this "Forsaken Corner of the Plane...To Safeguard the Sanctity of my Own Reality"....LOL...I know your not going to say Magus was only trying to warp Thanos "dimension"...when we ALL know he merged 616 Universe with a Duplicate.

Warlock here says.." For The Sake of this Universe....This Fragile Reality(he's referring to the same Universe)once again needed saving"

Next Panel...Warlock, "For the good of This wretched Actuality....let someone else save the Universe this time around"....an Actuality/Reality = A Universe

Galactus and others traveling..."In a TIME and PLACE that is Neither"...sounds like the Cosmic Vortex(Area Between Universes)....I'll prove that in a bit.*

Where do they End Up?...."In a Reality MANY steps removed from Our Own"

Silver Surfer..."We must Return to Our Reality"

Continue...

*What is the Cosmic Vortex?....Where is this place that has Neither Space or Time and allows you to travel from Universe to Universe?
See those little purple balls, thats where Atleza is..and every little purple ball is the domain of the anchor...Yes...very much outside the Multiverse...untouched by space or time.....This is why Atleza, along with Gamora and Warlock were not absorbed by Thanos...the Multiverse are the Bigger balls obviously...


First Warlock enters this place...the Cosmic Vortex.

Now observe Warlock navigating this realm in--between Universes.

Originally posted by Mr Master
hysterical

Ok, in response to your ever wondrous theories...
You asked gs...you immediately took his word...

dam, mr m, get over yourself. please! so now asking an opinion of someone is equated to 'taking his word' for it?? 🙄 good grief, you're something else . . .

anyway, all your scans are no more supportive than the previous ones (just claiming he's realities away, yadda-yadda) with a couple exceptions. even you're equating the vortex with the vortex thanos is talking about is strictly speculation and not your always vaunted proof. these scans are however, as i said, interesting:

"Powerful Eternity Catatonic"
"Artificially Induced by an OUTSIDE FORCE"...these are direct quotes.

"He's Catatonic....It appears to be Induced by OUTSIDE FORCES"....
[/quote]

these could mean that magus was outside the body of eternity, i suppose or it could simply mean that eternity himself had nothing to do with his state. it wasn't self induced for whatever reason but rather an outside force had rendered him that way.

all your talk of definitions for dimensions and actualities and realities and universes is pretty much irrelevent as it is merely your opinion of the terms. so, IS sternity comprised of MORE than just the earth universe?

Handled!! 😂