cap vs spider-man

Originally posted by Soljer
There's plenty of evidence that shows Cap as multiple times faster than normal humans too. Cap isn't a normal human. 😐.

Which is why I asked if you have any proof to show that Cap is much faster than say Daredevil or Iron Fist.

Originally posted by Soljer
He's also been depicted as faster than Iron Fist - and Iron Fist never had too much problem keeping up with Spiderman.

Are you refering to the Iron Fist issue where Danny tried to break into the mansion? I don't recall Cap being stated as much faster, it was an offhand remark that didn't even play out in the fight.

Originally posted by Soljer
Nor did Daredevil, save a SINGLE occasion, whereas every OTHER time they've met, they managed with each other.

But not cause of speed. In each confrontation Daredevil always a reason to hang. If he's not irrational, he's hypnotized, and then there's his senses which give him an edge. Kinda funny that you discount perhaps the only straight up competition between the two for the other instances.

Originally posted by Soljer
Anyways. The speed feats that were posted earlier in this thread - I was apart of.

I know, which is why I'm not getting into a "scan" war here. Its been done.

Originally posted by Soljer
I matched pretty much any Spidey speed feat with a Cap one. They're similar.

Its all relativity friend. I can find a Spider-Man, Captain America, Green Arrow and Robin feat that are all similar. Are they all in the same speed league? Nope. Just look at the characters together and you can see the speed difference.

QUOTE From Wikipedia:

Steve Rogers in the regular Marvel Universe has NO SUPERHUMAN POWERS, although as a result of the Super-Soldier serum, he is transformed from a frail young man into a "perfect" specimen of human development and conditioning.

Captain America is as intelligent, strong, fast, agile, and durable AS IT IS POSSIBLE FOR A HUMAN BEING WITHOUT BEING CONSIDERED SUPERHUMAN. He was once seen bench-pressing 1100 lb. unassisted.[41] The formula enhances all of his metabolic functions and prevents the build-up of fatigue poisons in his muscles, giving him endurance far in excess of an ordinary human being. This accounts for many of his extraordinary feats, including running a mile in a little more than a minute.[42]

Spider-Man has the ability to cling to walls, superhuman strength, a sixth sense ("spider-sense"😉 that alerts him to danger, perfect balance and equilibrium, as well as SUPERHUMAN SPEED AND AGILITY.

Spider-Man's overall metabolic efficiency has been greatly increased, and the composition of his skeleton, inter-connected tissues, and nervous system have all been enhanced. Spider-Man's musculature has been augmented so that he can lift (press) about 10 TONS.

Spider-Man's reflexes are FASTER than an average human by about a FACTOR OF 15. Spider-Man is extraordinarily limber and his tendons and connective tissues are twice as elastic as the average human being's, despite their enhanced strength. He has developed a unique fighting style that makes full use of his agility, strength, and equilibrium.

Does this prove that Spidey is definitely too fast for Cap?

Cap loses.

No because it's from wiki and their data isn't perfect.

Feats from comics >>>> Wiki

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
No because it's from wiki and their data isn't perfect.

Feats from comics >>>> Wiki

I agree. But, Spider-Man feats >>>> Captain America

Originally posted by jasonk3
I agree. But, Spider-Man feats >>>> Captain America

Yes. But Cap is still above what we would consider to be "peak human".

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Yes. But Cap is still above what we would consider to be "peak human".

I agree. But, unlike Spider-man, Cap is no super-human.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
No because it's from wiki and their data isn't perfect.

Feats from comics >>>> Wiki

Your right. Spider-Man's actually gotten even more of boost since the Other. I believe at least his new strength level has been documented in CW: Battle Report (Spidey can now bench 20 tons).

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Yes. But Cap is still above what we would consider to be "peak human".

Not much further above and that still puts him a ways below Peter

Originally posted by marvelprince
Which is why I asked if you have any proof to show that Cap is much faster than say Daredevil or Iron Fist.

Much faster? Perhaps not. However, Daredevil has admitted that Cap is faster than he is, and Iron Fist has described Cap's speed as incredible.

And Cap and Danny have both kept up with Spiderman in the past.

Originally posted by marvelprince

Its all relativity friend. I can find a Spider-Man, Captain America, Green Arrow and Robin feat that are all similar. Are they all in the same speed league? Nope. Just look at the characters together and you can see the speed difference.

Sure you can, and for that particular feat? All four were probably doing it at similar speeds. For example, if the Flash dodges a punch, he doesn't need to do it at the speed of light, even though he can. Same with Spidey. If he's dodging a normal human, he doesn't need to go all out, and odds are, he won't.

The thing is, I can find Spiderman and Captain America feats that have not been replicated by Robin. I can't find too many Spidey feats that Cap hasn't performed himself, unless they rely solely on things that Cap doesn't have - a sixth sense or webbing.

Originally posted by jasonk3
I agree. But, Spider-Man feats >>>> Captain America

Speed wise?

Name one. 😐.

Originally posted by Soljer
Sure you can, and for that particular feat? All four were probably doing it at similar speeds. For example, if the Flash dodges a punch, he doesn't need to do it at the speed of light, even though he can. Same with Spidey. If he's dodging a normal human, he doesn't need to go all out, and odds are, he won't.

Agreed here

Originally posted by Soljer
The thing is, I can find Spiderman and Captain America feats that have not been replicated by Robin. I can't find too many Spidey feats that Cap hasn't performed himself, unless they rely solely on things that Cap doesn't have - a sixth sense or webbing.

Robin was pushing it a bit. Lets try Nightwing, the most agile of the DCU heroes. He has some crazy speed feats also, and you'd be hard pressed to find a feat the Cap's done that he hasn't. In fact based solely on feats you could argue Dick is Cap's superior even though we know thats not the case.

Really the way I look at it is that Spider-Man's villians normally faster than the other street level heroes. Dodging an Ock tentacle and Scorpion tail is a lot different that dodging Crossbones, even though on panel they look similar.

And I know your probably tired of hearing this, but lets not also forget that Spider-Man holds back alot. Thats why most issues when we see him cut lose speed-wise normally he's followed by the strobe effects. Things are different for him. Other heroes move to dodge bullets, etc and for him its second nature. He doesn't even think about it, he just moves. It may look the same on panel but the amount of effort exerted by each character clearly differs.

Simple fact of the matter is that spider-sense makes up for Cap's superior fighting skill, which helps counter spidey's advanced reaction time, which...etc.

The deciding factor here is spidey's ability to wall-crawl. All he has to do is climb about ten feet up a wall and launch a series of hit-and-run attacks on Cap...

Over the long run, though, I say this could easily stalemate...

Originally posted by marvelprince
Dodging an Ock tentacle and Scorpion tail is a lot different that dodging Crossbones, even though on panel they look similar.

Captain America's dodged tentacles from both Ock and Lady Ock, as well.

Not to mention has knocked the shit out of scorpion on no less than two occasions, to my memory.

Just pointing it out...

Originally posted by Soljer
You didn't say he was infinitely faster, but xkalybr did.

And there's no way Spidey is twice as fast as Cap. 😐.

At least, there is no evidence to say that he is.

hell... yeah!

Originally posted by jinzin
hell... yeah!

Hell yeah as in 'Go Soljer!'

Or...

Hell yeah as in 'Hell yeah there is, idiot.'

😬.

I was rockin in the "Go Soldier" boat myself....

I just don't get why even NOW after all this time people like captain america are being
A) classified in the same class as "normal humans"

and

B) ignored when they give spiderman all hell on multiples of occasions.

😬
I've been thinking about making a respect street levels and regular speed guys vs. Spiderman thread for a while now.. so that we don't have to go over why these "but spiderman is uber fasterz than theze gies" arguments aren't... well.... necassarily true every damned freakin time there's a thread with spider vs. "insert street level here".... but I fear that it may appear to look too much like a disrespect thread, though that's not what it's intended for so much as education... 🙁

I say go for it. You'd have my support.

I mean, Spiderman's faster than the likes of Wolverine and Cap. But he isn't twice as fast. He isn't too fast to track. He isn't too fast to dodge. He isn't too fast to hit.

He's faster - but they can keep up. You'd have my backing if you decided to make such a thread, 👆.

Originally posted by Soljer
I say go for it. You'd have my support.

I mean, Spiderman's faster than the likes of Wolverine and Cap. But he isn't twice as fast. He isn't too fast to track. He isn't too fast to dodge. He isn't too fast to hit.

He's faster - but they can keep up. You'd have my backing if you decided to make such a thread, 👆.

agreed.

Cool..

well if the idea garners some support and Digi doesn't have a problem with it then I'll do it for sure.

We would just need the Spidey fans to be respectful of the thread itself and leave debates out of it even if they didn't agree, as with any respect thread.

Originally posted by jinzin
agreed.

Cool..

well if the idea garners some support and Digi doesn't have a problem with it then I'll do it for sure.

We would just need the Spidey fans to be respectful of the thread itself and leave debates out of it even if they didn't agree, as with any respect thread.

Well this Spidey fan promises to be good anyway.

I'd say go for it, for one thing it'd just be nice to compare all the speed feats of the street levellers lol

To be honest I don't know where this "Spidey can't be hit by anything" came from, I mean I used to suffer from it and when I look back I can't actually figure out where I got that idea from and this was long before I went on forums 😖 maybe Marvel put some sort of hidden message in Spidey's comics to make people think that lol.

Originally posted by Soljer
Captain America's dodged tentacles from both Ock and Lady Ock, as well.

Not to mention has knocked the shit out of scorpion on no less than two occasions, to my memory.

Just pointing it out...

As I said earlier...

Originally posted by marvelprince
Things are different for him. Other heroes move to dodge bullets, etc and for him its second nature. He doesn't even think about it, he just moves. It may look the same on panel but the amount of effort exerted by each character clearly differs.

Originally posted by jinzin
agreed.

Cool..

well if the idea garners some support and Digi doesn't have a problem with it then I'll do it for sure.

We would just need the Spidey fans to be respectful of the thread itself and leave debates out of it even if they didn't agree, as with any respect thread.

As long as its not a disrespect thread I'm cool.

And just to clarify where I stand, I don't think Spider-Man would curbstop Cap in a fight I just don't think that their speed level is near enough for it to be considered a non-factor. If Spider-Man is 15 times faster than a normal human, even though Cap isn't "normal" then I don't see how he can't be at least twice as fast as Cap. There is a notable speed difference, its just that Cap makes up for it with his "knowledge" of Spidey and his skills.

Originally posted by marvelprince
Generally I agree except you also forget that is also "infinitely" stronger and has that handy spider-sense that helps him dodge.

Which is why he was getting punched in the face all day. Wack.

Originally posted by Soljer

I'm not Alfheim - I'm not gonna go around saying that Cap can hit like a hundred tonner. Hell no.

*sigh* Cap cant destroy manhattan or asteroids with his fists but this is what I meant.

http://img286.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captainamericav3048142ve.jpg
http://img286.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captainamericav3048157yg.jpg

Heres what somebody who understood what I was saying said.

Originally posted by chilled monkey
That's the point. Cap doesn't hit with 100 ton damage. He doesn't need to, because his skill allows him to hit weak ponts with precision. That's how he's able to defeat super-strong foes. Not with force, but with precision.

I hope this clears things up.