Originally posted by docb77
Anyone like to translate for those of us who don't speak arabic?
It means ''In the name of Allah most Gracious most Merciful.'' although english translation of 'gracious' is kinda...although I guess you can translate it like that.
It is argued by many independent sources, that the reason last chapter of the Qur'an is the only one which doesn't start with ''In the name of Allah, most gracious most Merciful'' is because there is nothing in the chaptar which is merciful, or gracious.
Originally posted by Alliance
Thats funny, the in the Qur'an that I read from , every chapter begins with "In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful." I don't speak Arabic, so If you're not referring to this. I don't know what you are mentioning.I pride myself on learning from credible scholarly sources, instead of wearing a blindfold of ignorance. Hell, you think Robert Spencer is credible. George W Bush would like Robert Spencer, and thats SAYING something.
Lets try this R-E-A-D.
I have enough of a scope to realize that this is not an Islam problem, the same problems in Islam are the same problems in many religions.
ANY fundamentalist is bad. PERIOD. Some of us are intelligent enough to realize that ANYONE who follows a religious text blindly is at fault.
You are ignorant enough to claim that if you don't follow a religious texts word for word, you can't claim that you follow that religion. That is BLATANTLY not the case in any religion. It is not the case in Islam. Regardless of any hate and intolerance that you over-dramatize in the Qu'ran, the problem lies with people, not the religions text.
I'm not attempting to reclaim Islam, but rather showing that fanaticism is not a product the innate character of Islam.
Warning: Graphic Image
YOU SEE THAT. NOW THIS MIGHT SURPRISE YOUR IGNORANT AND HATEFUL MIND, BUT I UNDERSTAND THAT AND DON'T EVER ACCUSE ME OF SUCH AGAIN. Because you know all about me, because you know what I have seen, and because you know what life is like for me. Thats right. Pipe down.
I don't support the vast majority of the actions by extremeists in the name of Islam. However, I am smart enough to realize that ISLAM is NOT the problem.
You're argument is simply this: "You're from the West. You don't understand." Now THAT is bullcrap.
I wish Salaam for you. I wish for you to find peace in your mind and in your heart.
I wish for you to see that you pin all evil on Islam. That you scapegoat a religion for the failure of rational people to contain fanaticism.
I wish for you to realize the ignorance of your claim that the Qu-ran expresses nothing but hate and then brand all who do not follow the hate as not Islamic, therefore accusing every Muslim of being some rabid assassin.
I wish for you to realize that people who commit terror are uneducated and brainwashed. They are put in that situation because of poverty and political manipulation. They are not brainwashed by religion, they are brainwashed by people in the name of religion. This may be amazing to you, but this happens elsewhere in the world.
I wish for you to realize that extremism and injustice have existed throughout the world and throughout history. Just because there is a current correlation between radicalism and Islam, does not mean its a causation.
I wish for you to realize that extremists are a vocal minority that check the moderate majority through fear and apathy.
And again, I wish Salaam for you. I wish for you to find peace in your mind and in your heart. Instead of the blind hate that apparently fills it now.
My argument is not ''you are from west you don't understand''
My argument is simply ''you are ignorant to Islam''.
I don't know why I even bother with this.
You are just a Dhimmi, anyway. (seeing how you were brought up Christian, you would qualify as one)
I have a good quote I believed it was apropriate to post -
''Islam deserves criticism on account of the logical consequences of its dogma, namely, that the murder of fellow human beings is to be rewarded with sensual pleasure in a hedonistic “Paradise”—a concept born in the fantasies of an Arab rebel some fourteen centuries ago. The religion of Mohammed is a dangerous system when the teachings and example of the “prophet” are believed and followed.''-Richard Dawkins
Another thing saddens me, Allinece about you - you do not see the differance between critisism and hate, because you hate Christians, you expect me to hate Muslims.
I don't. I despise their ideology. If you cannot see the differance, than that is sad too.
I actually, in quite a few retrospects, agree with a lot of them!
They are not afraid of you, you are afraid of them. And they will distry you from within.
This was said by an Islamic scholer, and it is simply - true.
Hopefully people in the West will wake up (in fact I know a lot of people have!), but if they don't. West is West. Makes little differance to me.
It is people like you which make me lose my compassion for the Westeners. Not because they don't know, but because they are not willing to know.
Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Dream on.
With people like Allience, I won't have to dream. I may even live to see it.
Ok, im back.
More pictures on 'Religion of Peace'
Westeners, it is these people you should be afraid of. When they grow up.
Al Quaida are bullshit - here is the danger -
Burning the flag of Israel! What do you think will happen when they grow up?!
School Play!
Seeing this, I kind of don't worry so much about Jesus camp.
Originally posted by docb77
In connection to the photos that lil has been posting, Glenn Beck has a segment most nights on his show on CNN headline news that shows things that are actually being said in Iran and the middle east and translates them so that we can understand. Some of it is pretty scary.
Which reminds me, there is a research institute which explores the Media in the Middle East. They provide translation to a lot of things shown in the Media.
I check it regulary for updates. Here is the link. Its interesting, and as you said, sometimes very scary. Espeically the Jews thing.
Originally posted by Alliance
Thats funny, the in the Qur'an that I read from , every chapter begins with "In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful." I don't speak Arabic, so If you're not referring to this. I don't know what you are mentioning.
That doesn't mean a damn thing learn about the life of Mohammed. As I have said a hundred million times you cant read the Quran on its won you need the hadiths to give it context.
Originally posted by Alliance
I pride myself on learning from credible scholarly sources, instead of wearing a blindfold of ignorance. Hell, you think Robert Spencer is credible. George W Bush would like Robert Spencer, and thats SAYING something.
I have met scholars in real life that have verified what lil has had to say. I also know about the life of Mohammed. George Bush may like Spencer but by and large she seems to be correct about most things. I would quibble with a few things but nevermind.
Originally posted by Alliance
Lets try this R-E-A-D.
Are you talking to yourself?
Originally posted by Alliance
I have enough of a scope to realize that this is not an Islam problem, the same problems in Islam are the same problems in many religions.
To an extent I guess.
Originally posted by Alliance
ANY fundamentalist is bad. PERIOD. Some of us are intelligent enough to realize that ANYONE who follows a religious text blindly is at fault.
Yes.
Originally posted by Alliance
Regardless of any hate and intolerance that you over-dramatize in the Qu'ran, the problem lies with people, not the religions text.
How do you know if shes doing that when you dont know anything about the life of mohammed?
Originally posted by Alliance
but rather showing that fanaticism is not a product the innate character of Islam.
How do you know that? This is incredible........
Originally posted by Alliance
Warning: Graphic ImageYOU SEE THAT. NOW THIS MIGHT SURPRISE YOUR IGNORANT AND HATEFUL MIND, BUT I UNDERSTAND THAT AND DON'T EVER ACCUSE ME OF SUCH AGAIN. Because you know all about me, because you know what I have seen, and because you know what life is like for me. Thats right. Pipe down.
I don't support the vast majority of the actions by extremeists in the name of Islam. However, I am smart enough to realize that ISLAM is NOT the problem.
You're argument is simply this: "You're from the West. You don't understand." Now THAT is bullcrap.
I wish Salaam for you. I wish for you to find peace in your mind and in your heart.
I wish for you to see that you pin all evil on Islam. That you scapegoat a religion for the failure of rational people to contain fanaticism.
I wish for you to realize the ignorance of your claim that the Qu-ran expresses nothing but hate and then brand all who do not follow the hate as not Islamic, therefore accusing every Muslim of being some rabid assassin.
I wish for you to realize that people who commit terror are uneducated and brainwashed. They are put in that situation because of poverty and political manipulation. They are not brainwashed by religion, they are brainwashed by people in the name of religion. This may be amazing to you, but this happens elsewhere in the world.
I wish for you to realize that extremism and injustice have existed throughout the world and throughout history. Just because there is a current correlation between radicalism and Islam, does not mean its a causation.
I wish for you to realize that extremists are a vocal minority that check the moderate majority through fear and apathy.
And again, I wish Salaam for you. I wish for you to find peace in your mind and in your heart. Instead of the blind hate that apparently fills it now.
Ok I think you have a point about poverty and the West, but I do not think this is the only factor.
If you look at the life of Mohammed he was given the opportunity to leave the pagans alone, he instead choose to enforce his way of life on the pagans. If you knew anything about the life of mohammed you would know this. Mohammed did not do this because he was starving. Mohammed got married to a nine year old. Mohammed had twenty wives when everyone else was only allowed four and he started the custom of women covering up. Previoulsy polygamy was rare and women did not have to cover up. Mohammed asked his men to kill someone who insulted him...I could go on forever. Mohammed is not somebody who wanted integrate therefore the religon attracts people who are anti-social to it.
The companions of the prophet also decided to conquer neighboring lands. Umar( a companion of the prophet who was guaranteed heaven) in one area forced the jews and christians to dress differently from the muslims. This did not happen due to poverty. Then of course there is the custom of idol smashing. The Quran talks about it, Mohammed did it and muslims after him invaded India went into temples and smashed idols. this did not happen due to poverty.
Bare in mind some of these people becoming terrorists are not from poor background and some of these people are from rich backgrounds. Basically they are not suffering from poverty they just cant be ***ed to get a life.
One thing you have to understand is that Islam is not just a religon its political as well. The West sees Islam as a threat like Communism. Eventhougth the West is not perfect I dont blame them for trying to shutdown any place which is trying to implement an Islamic State.
I think creating a dialogue would help but muslims need to stop making excuses about their religon. What scares me is that if an Islamic State is created it will not end there it will try to take over the world because that is what muslims and Mohammed tryed to do in the past. Poverty and injustice do not need to be present because thats not why it started in the first place, Islam started because some person did not want to integrate and wanted everybody to do what he wanted.
Lets put it this way. As you know im a heathen and I follow the beliefs and philosophy of the Vikings. Vikings raped and pillaged, the difference is that I will blatantly admit that those people were evil. I wont try to make an excuse for their behaviour.
a rough specualtion of islam BEFORE i read and saw all this was a group of people who are crazy and think things with could only ever been a pile of sh--- er well you get the idea.
AFTER seeing and reading this Isalm is a plague, its immoral and should be eradicated. This is where having a icy hearts coming into play, i can honestly say the work to reform these people whouldn't be worth it, extermination would be more logical. Harsh? yes, true? yes
apparently in like 50 years Islam will have control over most of europe through sheer breeding.
As for religios crimes, how many women were burnt alive because they were said to be "witches"? Hundreds? Thousands? Take any country. Russia for example. There was a time when church was seperated from state and even time when it was controling it, at that time Church was murdering anyone they suspected to be against religion. 100s of people were murdered. Talk about peacefull religion.
Hey, we are sharing pictures? Ok, why not.
If Arab world lays down its weapons, there will be peace in the middle east. If Israel Lays down its weapons it will sease to exist.
Don't throw this propaganda bullshit at me.
The reason I didn't post any pictures of what have Muslims terrorist done in Beslan is because it will breach a PG-13 rule, so don't even bother posting pictures of Children!
Also, how about picures of Hindus butchered by Muslims? What did Hindus do apart from suffered mass urder on the hands of Muslims?
What did children in Beslan do to deserve what they did?
Anti-Semitism is so apperent within Muslim world, it is pointless to deny or make up excuses.
To praise Hitler is just stupid!
As the matter of fact it weren't arabs that attacked jews and took away their land and murdered thousands of people that just happened to be on their way, so it is pointless now b!tching that "bad arabs" want to destroy poor israel, violance makes violance and when jews took over Palestine and murdered thousands of inocent people they knew this will happen. And it is not ME who uses propoganda, you post pictures of enraged people who's realatives AND children were murdered to prove that their religion is violant. I simply explain why arabs hate jew and US. That's the difference betwen us, i don't use war in Iraq, or war in Lebanon and war in Palestine to prove that christians or jews are violant, i post pictures to proves that Israel and US use violance and to prove that it is Israel that gave birth to hatred and as a result to terrorism, you on other hand prefere to connect ANY violant action with religion of Islam. That event is Beslan was painfull for everyone, especially everyone felt it here, in Russia, and i know opinion of MANY muslims here and they are sorry just like everyone else, so don't USE this tradegy to support your sick idea of bad muslims.
Anti-semitism is popular among muslims, yes. But it is US and jews that made muslims hate them. And the only reason why muslims are hated by US and Israel is because they simply happened to be a barrier on their way. And terrorism appeared BECAUSE of this hatred. Who supported Bin Laden at first? Who made muslims hate US and Israel? the answer is US. And now everyone hate Islam for that. Makes a lot of sense.
And praising Hitler is stupid, i don't even know where that your idea came from. Muslims do not praise Hitler. I am muslim, my grandfather was there during WW2, I do not praise Hitler.
Oh, and about that map of yours. So you are saying that large terrotory of arabic world justifies all actions of Israel of taking over palestine? Way to go... Canada is a large country, lets take over it's part and murder thousands people there...
Lil Bitchiness,
Your posted images were very insightful. Because of them, I feel more disrespect towards the majority of Muslims who dwell in the East. However, I still have no resentment towards the majority of Muslims who live here.
Islam in the East is a savage religion...that is very clear. In the West, however, I think we can safely say the fundamentalism of Islam has toned down quite a bit.
Christianity still has a bloodier history than Islam, Lil B....
Yes, TODAY Islam is the bigger threat to Global Peace...but until Muslims succeed in committing a nation wide witch trial, committing national inquisition (not just city-wide), and conquer and rape the culture of numerous nations....it still doesn't accomplish the collective horrors that the Christian Church has.
There is a cause and effect to everything lil bitchiness, do you not question why the fanatics are so fanatical about the Israel and the US? I think they have a pretty damn good reason. Those pictures would make anyone with ab objective view dislike Muslims very much but then when you watch this http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7828123714384920696&q=peace+propaganda
you sympathize with them.
