Originally posted by Juntai
That was merely how they percieved him. Just as Corrigan and Hal both saw things differently. It's all perception. The Kirby character shown in the fantastic four book even mentioned it. He also mentioned being flawed.
No none is perfect and if the supreme being is meant to illustrate the writers that are humans then the Supreme being must like the humans that represent them have some flaws.
(wow this Thread has gone far off) 😂
Originally posted by quanchi112Thanos became one with a docile power source, which was ripe for the taking, [THOTI].
its onle deemed uncontrollable becuz thanos isnt over there in dc.😉
When a "true" GW is released, [ie. when the Source Wall is breached], the energy released does nothing but destroy everything in existence... This raw/true GW can't be harnessed in a similiar fashion to THOTI.
In fact,
Takion, [a being OF the Source], was killed by merely attempting to slow the GW..
Originally posted by Galan007ud have to give thanos time. ye of little faith. im sure he could come up with a way to absorb the godwave and make it nonlethal to himself. but anyways what was it that ares was trying to absorb? thought that was the godwave as well.
Thanos became one with a docile power source, which was ripe for the taking, [THOTI].When a "true" GW is released, [ie. when the Source Wall is breached], the energy released does nothing but destroy everything in existence... This raw/true GW can't be harnessed in a similiar fashion to THOTI.
In fact,
Takion, [a being OF the Source], was killed by merely attempting to slow the GW..
Originally posted by quanchi112What I meant, is that Thanos was able to merely plunge into THOTI to absorb it's energies.
but anyways what was it that ares was trying to absorb? thought that was the godwave as well.
And while power from the GW can be leeched, one cannot jump into the middle of it, to absorb it's full power.
Originally posted by Galan007i know it s a different monster to tackle. one must do it ina differnt way then just simply jumping into it. but thanos would leech it obviously. he wouldnt just run into it blind before he did his research. he d leech enough power to where he couldnt be challeneged.
What I meant, is that Thanos was able to merely plunge into THOTI to absorb it's energies.And while power from the GW can be leeched, one cannot jump into the middle of it, to absorb it's full power.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
No, the Presence is Supreme. He sits on the throne in Heaven. He created the angelic host...Michael, Lucifer, etc..
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
Beyonder is not Supreme in Marvel...he is below the TOAA.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
TOAA has nothing to do with DC....only Marvel, hence TOAA can not be above ALL things comic...only all things comic in Marvel.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
In the other thread, I stated that DC does not have a Supreme Being that is represented by the writers or editors of the company. Marvel is the only company with that concept. I meant to imply that if you went by the logic of writers as Supreme Beings...then the Presence would only be on the level of the most supreme being in Marvel not represented by a writer...and that would be Beyonder. However, I don't follow that logic. Presence is meant to be the Creator...the Supreme Being over all of DC comics...even though He isn't represented by a writer. Just because two companies do things differently does not mean that one Supreme Being is beyond another, hence the Presence is just as Supreme as the TOAA.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
The TOAA does not write DC comics...therefore He can not erase what He has no jurisdiction over. You see the dilemma?
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
The Beyonder is not Supreme as presented on panel.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
If Beyonder was Supreme...he would've blinked Molecule Man from existence...and he wouldn't have acted so dumb at times.
This scan also proves that the Presence isn't omniscient. The Spectre asks Amy Beitermann! What of her?! The Presence responds with a shocked expression "Was she in heaven?" "Then I ate her, too." That shows he didn't even know all the people he ate. I'm sure that you'll just come up with some bogus answer like "he was acting like he didn't know" but that's not what's on panel. The face expressions tell it all.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
The Presence has never been caught off guard...and He has never been challenged by anyone....much like the TOAA.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
Again..as far as this fight goes....Presence would win...effortlessly.
Yo.
Originally posted by quanchi112
so ur calling cronus a liar, huh?😆
http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa41/quanchi112/wwv2150-30.jpg
THE POWER OF THE PRESENCE IS MINE.!!!!!!!!!!!!!
again, the Godwave came from the destruction of the "2nd World"; Ive never seen anything that actually ties it to "The Presence" so Im not sure how it applies here.
Tazer
Originally posted by Tazerhe says on panel that the power of the presence is mine. black and white. clear as day. he just couldnt handle it is all. i love using evidence to prove my points.
Yo.again, the Godwave came from the destruction of the "2nd World"; Ive never seen anything that actually ties it to "The Presence" so Im not sure how it applies here.
Tazer
💃 💃
Originally posted by Air Legend
Did you even read what I wrote? Define "supreme" for me even though I gave you the definition already. I also proved the Presence isn't a Supreme Being with definitions from 4 different dictionaries.There wasn't a TOAA back then. Beyonder, by your incorrect definition of supreme, was supreme.
I never said that. I said above the comic world- as in God/TOAA draw and write what we read.
Actually, using logic, one "supreme being" can be above another, especially since the Presence isn't supreme. I already proved that the Presence is not a "supreme being" by showing you 4 definitions of "supreme being." Lets not get this thing going in circles.
TOAA can write the Presence and all of DC being defeated by Captain America. The only dilemma that would cause is the Marvel company more than likely getting sued, but they can do it if they wanted too.
I don't think Beyonder is Supreme, but by your definition of supreme, he is.
Enough with the "blink from existence" phrase. That is the worst argument you can make. Just because one is omnipotent doesn't mean they will "blink" something from existence. Here is an example of why...
http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/6717/spectre6102do2.jpg
If the Presence was "supreme" then why did he eat the people when he could have blinked them from existence? I'll answer; simply because that is what he wanted to do.This scan also proves that the Presence isn't omniscient. The Spectre asks Amy Beitermann! What of her?! The Presence responds with a shocked expression "Was she in heaven?" "Then I ate her, too." That shows he didn't even know all the people he ate. I'm sure that you'll just come up with some bogus answer like "he was acting like he didn't know" but that's not what's on panel. The face expressions tell it all.
Oh yeah? Then what the hell did the Great Evil Beast do?
👇
Son, you didn't prove anything to me. I don't need dictionary definitions to understand what Supreme means. If the Presence isn't the Supreme Being in DC, then you tell me who is above Him in Power.
Just because the Presence "seemed" surprised at a particular question...like "Was she in Heaven"....means nothing. Take the Bible for instance. In Genesis, when God was walking through Eden...He inquired..."Where art thou"...in reference to Adam and Eve. God knew that they had eaten of the Tree of Knowledge. He knew where they were. The phrase "Where art thou" had nothing to do with their location...but, rather their spirituality. Where art thou now that you know both good and evil. How does it feel to sin and separate yourself from God and from future access to the Tree of Life. That is what was meant when God said..."Where art thou"
I'm sure the Presence knew full well what He had done. If not, it was a mistake by whomever was writing that story.
You're right....the Presence didn't blink them from existence because He chose not to. However, it is not beyond His ability to "blink" life from existence. If you think otherwise, then you are a moron.
Yes, Marvel could write the TOAA destroying all of DC using Captain America. However, what is to stop DC from writing a story using Superman to destroy all of Marvel? It could go either way. I understand the TOAA represents the writer in Marvel and that DC does not have an equivelent to that.
However, if people want to keep using that logic. I could twist it further like this. What would happen if Marvel went out of business? No more TOAA...no more stories to write...no more anything. It could very well happen, eh? I guess the TOAA doesn't seem so Supreme now, does he?
In fact...the LT would be the only Supreme Being in Marvel comics at that point, because all the comics that Marvel ever published will live on indefinitely with the LT as Supreme...due to his Feats. No more TOAA, so LT is Supreme by default.
Now, in DC..if DC went out of business...well, no writer represents a particular character...so the Presence would remain Supreme within the comic books itself. The Presence's feats remain valid...while the Comic Company went out of business. In this case...Presence>>>>DC comics. That doesn't seem logical...but, it can be viewed that way. As with Marvel...if they went out of business. Marvel Comics can be viewed as>>>>>>>>TOAA(writer or the Company) due to the timeless nature of the comic books themselves as opposed to the Company that went out of business and the Writers who are now unemployed.
You see you can view this crap in a lot of different ways. Just because the TOAA represents the writer means NOTHING when you're comparing two different companies. In DC...the Presence is MEANT to be Supreme. Do you understand that? That means that all in all...the Presence and the TOAA can only be viewed as EQUALS. One can not be placed above the other.
And yes..that is all
Originally posted by KMC_Drifterthe presence cant be supreme if he was stalemated by the geb. cant have two number ones now can we?
Son, you didn't prove anything to me. I don't need dictionary definitions to understand what Supreme means. If the Presence isn't the Supreme Being in DC, then you tell me who is above Him in Power.Just because the Presence "seemed" surprised at a particular question...like "Was she in Heaven"....means nothing. Take the Bible for instance. In Genesis, when God was walking through Eden...He inquired..."Where art thou"...in reference to Adam and Eve. God knew that they had eaten of the Tree of Knowledge. He knew where they were. The phrase "Where art thou" had nothing to do with their location...but, rather their spirituality. Where art thou now that you know both good and evil. How does it feel to sin and separate yourself from God and from future access to the Tree of Life. That is what was meant when God said..."Where art thou"
I'm sure the Presence knew full well what He had done. If not, it was a mistake by whomever was writing that story.
You're right....the Presence didn't blink them from existence because He chose not to. However, it is not beyond His ability to "blink" life from existence. If you think otherwise, then you are a moron.
Yes, Marvel could write the TOAA destroying all of DC using Captain America. However, what is to stop DC from writing a story using Superman to destroy all of Marvel? It could go either way. I understand the TOAA represents the writer in Marvel and that DC does not have an equivelent to that.
However, if people want to keep using that logic. I could twist it further like this. What would happen if Marvel went out of business? No more TOAA...no more stories to write...no more anything. It could very well happen, eh? I guess the TOAA doesn't seem so Supreme now, does he?
In fact...the LT would be the only Supreme Being in Marvel comics at that point, because all the comics that Marvel ever published will live on indefinitely with the LT as Supreme...due to his Feats. No more TOAA, so LT is Supreme by default.Now, in DC..if DC went out of business...well, no writer represents a particular character...so the Presence would remain Supreme within the comic books itself. The Presence's feats remain valid...while the Comic Company went out of business. In this case...Presence>>>>DC comics. That doesn't seem logical...but, it can be viewed that way. As with Marvel...if they went out of business. Marvel Comics can be viewed as>>>>>>>>TOAA(writer or the Company) due to the timeless nature of the comic books themselves as opposed to the Company that went out of business and the Writers who are now unemployed.
You see you can view this crap in a lot of different ways. Just because the TOAA represents the writer means NOTHING when you're comparing two different companies. In DC...the Presence is MEANT to be Supreme. Do you understand that? That means that all in all...the Presence and the TOAA can only be viewed as EQUALS. One can not be placed above the other.
And yes..that is all
Yo
Originally posted by Tazer
Yo.U can if theyre 2 facets of the same being: in Catholicism they believe in "The Trinity" -concept, where theres 3 diff part yet ALL are God.
Originally posted by Tazer
this is similar.[/COLOR]
Originally posted by Tazer
Tazer
Yo.
Originally posted by Air Legend
First of all don't include the real GOD in this debate and secondly GEB and Presence are not the same being
as I understand it, theyre 2 halves of the same being; if Im wrong, then plz explain.also, if U dot like my comparing the desing of this character to God.....welp, I'll still do it, but know that theres no offense intended.
Originally posted by Air Legend
No it isn't
then plz explain
Tazer
Originally posted by quanchi112
so ur calling cronus a liar, huh?😆
[/IMG]
THE POWER OF THE PRESENCE IS MINE.!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He thought he could take the power of the Creator away from him 😆 that's all that means. Cronus touched The Presence's power and was humbled remember??? Why are u asking something you obviously already know?
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
Son, you didn't prove anything to me. I don't need dictionary definitions to understand what Supreme means.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
If the Presence isn't the Supreme Being in DC, then you tell me who is above Him in Power.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
Just because the Presence "seemed" surprised at a particular question...like "Was she in Heaven"....means nothing. Take the Bible for instance. In Genesis, when God was walking through Eden...He inquired..."Where art thou"...in reference to Adam and Eve. God knew that they had eaten of the Tree of Knowledge. He knew where they were. The phrase "Where art thou" had nothing to do with their location...but, rather their spirituality. Where art thou now that you know both good and evil. How does it feel to sin and separate yourself from God and from future access to the Tree of Life. That is what was meant when God said..."Where art thou"
First of all I don't appreciate you comparing the Presence to the real GOD. Also, of course GOD knew where they were spiritually, but this completely irrelevant to what we are talking about. The Presence was surprised; it is clear to see by his facial expression and by how he added "then I ate her, too." Again, don't compare the Presence to the real GOD because he is nothing like him.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
I'm sure the Presence knew full well what He had done. If not, it was a mistake by whomever was writing that story.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
You're right....the Presence didn't blink them from existence because He chose not to. However, it is not beyond His ability to "blink" life from existence. If you think otherwise, then you are a moron.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
Yes, Marvel could write the TOAA destroying all of DC using Captain America. However, what is to stop DC from writing a story using Superman to destroy all of Marvel? It could go either way.
Yes DC can write a story using Superman destroying Marvel, but that would be the artists and writers doing it, not the Presence.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
I understand the TOAA represents the writer in Marvel and that DC does not have an equivelent to that.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
However, if people want to keep using that logic. I could twist it further like this. What would happen if Marvel went out of business? No more TOAA...no more stories to write...no more anything. It could very well happen, eh? I guess the TOAA doesn't seem so Supreme now, does he?
In fact...the LT would be the only Supreme Being in Marvel comics at that point, because all the comics that Marvel ever published will live on indefinitely with the LT as Supreme...due to his Feats. No more TOAA, so LT is Supreme by default.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
Now, in DC..if DC went out of business...well, no writer represents a particular character...so the Presence would remain Supreme within the comic books itself.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
The Presence's feats remain valid...while the Comic Company went out of business. In this case...Presence>>>>DC comics. That doesn't seem logical...but, it can be viewed that way.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
As with Marvel...if they went out of business. Marvel Comics can be viewed as>>>>>>>>TOAA(writer or the Company) due to the timeless nature of the comic books themselves as opposed to the Company that went out of business and the Writers who are now unemployed.
You know, I see what you are trying to say but Marvel hasn't gone out of business so your point is inconsequential.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
You see you can view this crap in a lot of different ways. Just because the TOAA represents the writer means NOTHING when you're comparing two different companies.
I don't like the logic you're using here for a couple of reasons. Technically Marvel feats mean nothing compared to DC feats and vice versa that is why this comic vs forum is hypothetical. If we are to debate- feats, being the writer, bios, etc. have to mean something when comparing the two companies or else this forum wouldn't exist.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
In DC...the Presence is MEANT to be Supreme. Do you understand that?
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
That means that all in all...the Presence and the TOAA can only be viewed as EQUALS. One can not be placed above the other.
Originally posted by KMC_Drifter
And yes..that is all
Originally posted by Air Legendi do agree that dc did a horrible horrible job with the presence. for him to be stalemated is unforgivable. shame on dc.
🤨The external forces that formed him aka the artists and writers.
First of all I don't appreciate you comparing the Presence to the real GOD. Also, of course GOD knew where they were spiritually, but this completely irrelevant to what we are talking about. The Presence was surprised; it is clear to see by his facial expression and by how he added "then I ate her, too." Again, don't compare the Presence to the real GOD because he is nothing like him.
Yes it was a mistake by the writers. DC did a poor job on the Presence.
So now you're going to start flaming with me?
Yes DC can write a story using Superman destroying Marvel, but that would be the artists and writers doing it, not the Presence.
👆 TOAA=DC writers>Presence
Marvel going out of business? 😆
He wouldn't REMAIN supreme because like I pointed out in the beginning the Presence was never supreme to begin with, the external forces aka the writers and artists are.
I don't know what to say to this because I don't get what you are trying to say.
You know, I see what you are trying to say but Marvel hasn't gone out of business so your point is inconsequential.
I don't like the logic you're using here for a couple of reasons. Technically Marvel feats mean nothing compared to DC feats and vice versa that is why this comic vs forum is hypothetical. If we are to debate- feats, being the writer, bios, etc. have to mean something when comparing the two companies or else this forum wouldn't exist.
Again, the external forces that created him aka the artists and writers are supreme, not the Presence. The Presence is merely a piece of artwork to them.
No TOAA and DC writers can be viewed as equals and DC writers are greater than the Presence.
You made good points on the companies going out of business ,but seeing how they are not out of business, it becomes all inconsequential. 🙂
