Originally posted by Juntai
No he wasn't, and Batman counted on it, and knew it. It was clear from the narration the writer never intended that.
"If Clark wanted to he could squish me into the cement.."
"he's got one big weakness. Deep down, he's essentially a good person."If you're out for blood and to kill a guy and he says "LOOK!" and points, do you look?
Please stop reaching dude.
You're being outdone on every account here.
The last panel of the fight ends with Superman holding a car in his hand getting ready to whip it at Batman. Are you claiming that Batman has the durability to tank a car being smashed into him thrown by Superman? Outdone? Seems like its the reverse, you are being done in by your own ridiculous statements.
The fact is he was being controlled by Poison Ivy and attacking Batman instead of Ivy. It is indeed mind control. You keep trying to dodge that bullet...very unsuccessfully I've noticed.
It is still a logical conclusion that he gets his mind shut down by Thanos just like Maker did.
Originally posted by dmillsI would tend to agree with you if it wasn't for one thing. SPEED!
Some interesting points made about CIS, PIS and jobbing. In the context of a forum debate power/skill set should trump all IMO, including feats. Feats should be taken with a grain of salt. If we keep feats in the context of power/skill set then that will help better call out PIS, CIS or jobbing. This is why my views on how certain characters would do vs other characters often conflict with the status quo of this board. For example, I give characters who can manipulate fundamental forces such as gravity i.e. Nova, Graviton, the edge in most battles. I don't place as high a premium on feats in the context of a forum debate as others. For example, I have never been comfortable with Thanos schooling the Surfer the way he has over the years. Thanos is a beast no doubt, but you mean to tell me that with the PC the SS can't manage one win? Not even via bfr?All too often we say PIS/CIS are off, but then we resort to running off to grab our comics and posting our favorite scans to prove points. I'm not saying feats aren't important, but they shouldn't take precedent over power/skill set.
Having said all of that, sometimes a particular character is just flatout outclassed. Superman vs Thanos is one of those times. Thanos wins.
You said you take power/skill set strongly into consideration and that it should trump all. That means you have to take Superman's speed into consideration.
Imagine someone throwing a punch in slow motion at your head. You both move at the same time. But the moment they land their fist on your face you only manage to move a half of inch. You saw the punch coming (you had the reflexes) but you didn't have the speed to defend against the punch.
After the first hit you are momentarily stunned. Before you can recover from the stun another punch lands and renews the stun. More hits are landed in this continued fashion until you are koed. Congratulations! You have just experienced the COMBO TO KO.
Originally posted by CeSoir
The last panel of the fight ends with Superman holding a car in his hand getting ready to whip it at Batman. Are you claiming that Batman has the durability to tank a car being smashed into him thrown by Superman? Outdone? Seems like its the reverse, you are being done in by your own ridiculous statements.The fact is he was being controlled by Poison Ivy and attacking Batman instead of Ivy. It is indeed mind control. You keep trying to dodge that bullet...very unsuccessfully I've noticed.
It is still a logical conclusion that he gets his mind shut down by Thanos just like Maker did.
IVY was biology. Thanos doesn't use biological means to do that.
Lastly, low showings are overruled by high ones (as long as they aren't PIS). You just can't use your own characters high showings against only the other characters low ones. You will win every battle this way. That's not fair.
Originally posted by dmills
Yeah, but you discount Thanos's insane durability. Thanos has never been knocked out. Especially by physical force. I fully expect him to shield himself and then react accordingly.
He can't shield himself. Superman will pop him before he does. Even if Superman allows him to do it then Thanos can't attack with the shield up.
Superman can pound on his shield until it collapses or just sit there and wait.
Thanos durability is not high enough where Superman can't stun him with blows. That said, the more the blows the more the stun effect adds up until we reach ko. I don't care if it takes a million blows to put Thanos down, Superman will achieve that million in a combo that doesn't stop until Thanos is koed.
Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Thanos has been able to fight Surfer who is >>> Sups in speed.And Sups doesn't have the strenght to put down somone who can fight with Odin himself.
How many people do I have to educate in 1 da? I already teach during the week. Geez!
Again, for the hundredth time!
Fighting someone with speed means nothing if they don't use their top speed on you.
Superman>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>SS in speed within battle distance. Both can reach anyspeed they desire provided they accelerate to that speed. SS has never been able to reach light speed within the first 3m of battle. I once did a calculation of some of his best travel feats to prove this.
Energy projection durability is not physical blunt durability.
The Odin Thanos fight was PIS just like the Spider-man Firelord fight was.
Anyone can put anyone else down provided they accumulate the stun effect. I explained this above.
Imagine someone throwing a punch in slow motion at your head. You both move at the same time. But the moment they land their fist on your face you only manage to move a half of inch. You saw the punch coming (you had the reflexes) but you didn't have the speed to defend against the punch.
After the first hit you are momentarily stunned. Before you can recover from the stun another punch lands and renews the stun. More hits are landed in this continued fashion until you are koed. Congratulations! You have just experienced the COMBO TO KO.
Originally posted by h1a8
How many people do I have to educate in 1 da? I already teach during the week. Geez!Again, for the hundredth time!
Fighting someone with speed means nothing if they don't use their top speed on you.Superman>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>SS in speed within battle distance. Both can reach anyspeed they desire provided they accelerate to that speed. SS has never been able to reach light speed within the first 3m of battle. I once did a calculation of some of his best travel feats to prove this.
Energy projection durability is not physical blunt durability.
The Odin Thanos fight was PIS just like the Spider-man Firelord fight was.
Anyone can put anyone else down provided they accumulate the stun effect. I explained this above.
Imagine someone throwing a punch in slow motion at your head. You both move at the same time. But the moment they land their fist on your face you only manage to move a half of inch. You saw the punch coming (you had the reflexes) but you didn't have the speed to defend against the punch.
After the first hit you are momentarily stunned. Before you can recover from the stun another punch lands and renews the stun. More hits are landed in this continued fashion until you are koed. Congratulations! You have just experienced the [b]COMBO TO KO
. [/B]
Just out of curiosity, did you calculate SS's accelaration when he made a grab for the IG from half a universe away? If someone crosses hundreds of thousands of light years in mere seconds, is he still slower than lisghtspeed in the first 3 meters? Your calculations on a single one of his feats proves nothing about an uper acceleration limit. I am sure that SM has more acceleration feats below insta-lightspeed than not, taking the ones where such calculations are possible.
Also, as everyone else realizes, SS has the reaction time to activate his powers before SM closes in on him. and to, at least, keep up with him in terms of reaction. That is all that matters for this fight. He goes intangible and turns SM inside out with his 3000 superpowers.
Believing SM can take a majority on SS, let alone thanos, is just as absurd as believing the Hulk can take a majority on SM.
Even assuming thanos does not have reaction times on par with SM or SS, how many punches would SM deliver before Thanos activates his powers? and How many punches do you see taking thanos down for the count?
Originally posted by Juntai
Surfer is most definitely not a good deal above Superman. Better at certain things because of power-set, sure. I'd take my chances with Superman against more powerful villains though. His record against them is flat out more impressive from what I've seen.
Take the pis, jobbing, cis and plot devices away and I wouldn't say that. SM is a lot more popular and known than SS, that's all. The big heroes need to save the day.
Also, SM can be hit by area attacks that swallow the battlefield even if he is blitzing arround. He wont get past the shields. Thanos has forceblock, energy manipulation and teleportation. He is durable enough to soak the pounding (assuming SM closes in and starts hitting before Thanos can so much as think, which I doubt). SM is still a hit and miss with TP. Thanos has too much going on for him.
And yes, most showings of DS against SM in later years, the ones designed to show that SM is closing the gap between them, require you to throw your brain away. In fact, most DS defeats at the hands of lesser beings are pure unadulterated PIS.
Originally posted by h1a8Shields, reflexes.
I would tend to agree with you if it wasn't for one thing. SPEED!You said you take power/skill set strongly into consideration and that it should trump all. That means you have to take Superman's speed into consideration.
Imagine someone throwing a punch in slow motion at your head. You both move at the same time. But the moment they land their fist on your face you only manage to move a half of inch. You saw the punch coming (you had the reflexes) but you didn't have the speed to defend against the punch.
After the first hit you are momentarily stunned. Before you can recover from the stun another punch lands and renews the stun. More hits are landed in this continued fashion until you are koed. Congratulations! You have just experienced the [b]COMBO TO KO
. [/B]
Originally posted by h1a8You just proved you don't read surfer. Well done. If you claim surfer is this slow you obviously don't know what he's capable of.
How many people do I have to educate in 1 da? I already teach during the week. Geez!Again, for the hundredth time!
Fighting someone with speed means nothing if they don't use their top speed on you.Superman>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>SS in speed within battle distance. Both can reach anyspeed they desire provided they accelerate to that speed. SS has never been able to reach light speed within the first 3m of battle. I once did a calculation of some of his best travel feats to prove this.
Energy projection durability is not physical blunt durability.
The Odin Thanos fight was PIS just like the Spider-man Firelord fight was.
Anyone can put anyone else down provided they accumulate the stun effect. I explained this above.
Imagine someone throwing a punch in slow motion at your head. You both move at the same time. But the moment they land their fist on your face you only manage to move a half of inch. You saw the punch coming (you had the reflexes) but you didn't have the speed to defend against the punch.
After the first hit you are momentarily stunned. Before you can recover from the stun another punch lands and renews the stun. More hits are landed in this continued fashion until you are koed. Congratulations! You have just experienced the [b]COMBO TO KO
. [/B]
Originally posted by manx422Based on?
Superman stomps thanos
Originally posted by h1a8
There are at least millions of levels of Superspeed.I just use logic. If someone can move 5ft before you can move 1in then you have no defense.
If someone can avoid or dodge all your attacks then you have no attack.
If someone can achieve the combo to ko on you then you LOSE.
Originally posted by The Nuul
= Superman >>>>> Galactus.
Originally posted by The Nuul
With help from Superman's best friend, PIS. On KMC where PIS is off, Supes loses.
Originally posted by 753SS was only a light year away. I calculated the acceleration of all of SS's top quantifiable feats, not just one.
Just out of curiosity, did you calculate SS's accelaration when he made a grab for the IG from half a universe away? If someone crosses hundreds of thousands of light years in mere seconds, is he still slower than lisghtspeed in the first 3 meters? Your calculations on a single one of his feats proves nothing about an uper acceleration limit. I am sure that SM has more acceleration feats below insta-lightspeed than not, taking the ones where such calculations are possible.
No he doesn't. Reaction time is nothing when one doesn't have the proper acceleration to go with it. This is not SS vs. Superman. Stop trolling the thread.
Also, as everyone else realizes, SS has the reaction time to activate his powers before SM closes in on him. and to, at least, keep up with him in terms of reaction. That is all that matters for this fight. He goes intangible and turns SM inside out with his 3000 superpowers.
I didn't claim Superman can take a majority from SS these days (maybe in the past yes). Yes he can from Thanos though.Believing SM can take a majority on SS, let alone thanos, is just as absurd as believing the Hulk can take a majority on SM.
You fail to understand the combo to ko principle. No being can act when they are stunned, otherwise they wouldn't be stunned. Thanos will be re-newly stunned with each successive hit. The stun effect adding up until Thanos is koed.Even assuming thanos does not have reaction times on par with SM or SS, how many punches would SM deliver before Thanos activates his powers? and How many punches do you see taking thanos down for the count?