Gorgon vs. Gamora

Originally posted by jinzin
okay let's see...

he's trained blindfolded to fight multiple opponents.... that's just for skill.
he's faster in combat then wolverine or elektra.
he's been able to deflect automatic gunfire from 10 feet away.
he's broken a sword to pieces by biting on it.
he's manhandled elektra without losing his advantage or taking one hit whatsoever.
he KOed elektra, killed 12 shield agents, and temporarily dropped logan all at the same time before any of them could react.. AFTER he'd been hit with multiple smart rockets and had his house torched.
he got right up immediately after being dropped 20 stories and being knocked out a window by wolverine coming at him 100 mph.
he took multiple stabbings, cuts, lacerations without registration of them.
he's got a healing factor that allowed him to continue to cloober wolverine after being gutted.. he didn't have cut marks on his stomach seconds later.

that's all i can think of for now..

see the thing is, his feats don't need to be overly impressive..

his skills are obviously enough to at least contend with gamora if not completely stalemate or defeat her.

and his damage soak, healing factor, and undead nature allow him to take anything she's got in stride..

again, she only need make one mistake.. considering she's made that mistake against maxim, and wolverine.. thinking her to do that against gorgon isn't a stretch imo.

Been training to combat multiple opponents far superior to humans since she was a child.
Fast enough to speedblitz Ronan(and I believe all Kree are notably faster than humans, and even if not, this was an amped up Ronan the Accuser).
Has dodged nearly every shot that's been taken at her since her inception(except for cheapshots, of course).
Knocked the Power Gem out of Drax.
Manhandled Terrax
Taken down an entire UN platoon in 8 minutes, without a scratch on her.
Taken shot from Ronan the Accuser
Got a healing factor equal to Wolverine's in the 90's, which is still impressive.

So yeah, I think Gamora has been more impressive overall.

But the DO need to be more impressive for him to be considered in Gamora's league. The fact of the matter is that at this point Gamora ranks somewhere on the bottom rungs of a herald level character, and nothing you've said indicates that Gorgon is on that level.

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
Perhaps, and I take back the head-out-of-your-ass comment.

But it wasn't because I can't follow a train of thought. You've been arguing the useless point of Wolverine's healing factor right now being a bit better then back then (good job 👆 ), and you only now decided to make the point at all considerably relevant by saying that Wolverine couldn't handle it with a better healing factor. But that is STILL, for all purposes, a waste of time to post, because we're not dealing with Wolverine here. We're dealing with a much, much better fighter. It still helps Gamora, as she will assuredly be getting owned by him MUCH less then Wolverine.

I made the second point about the SHIELD agents not in reference to your off-panel hyperbole-of-a-feat, but instead to the fact that, as I right this post, I have not yet seen a single feat from any of you, accept for retracted claims that he is impossible to damage.
How about next time you actually read the post, and THEN make an ass of yourself? Mkay, thanks. 😉

😕 You don't believe Cap displays more skills on average, you just think he displays skills more in general. 🤨

Good job, ace 👆

And yet it was still all real battling... only Drax was more powerful... so.... what's your point? 😕

again the hf does matter...

if one stab to the gut puts gamora down.. then she's not ready to fight this war.. if gorgon starts to hurt her she's not gonna bounce back up from it.. she'll go down and she'll stay down.. there was a point to that.. one stab to the gut is apparently all it will take... 😕

dude i really don't know why you're being such a dick right now.. you're given the feats and you call them hyperbole? isn't hypoerbole spoken? this was DISPLAYED.... and again no one's saying he's invulnerable.. but these feats did happen.. swallow them..

the only one here making an ass out of themselves is you, you obviously have nothing more to fall back on in this argument, I stop you and crush you at every turn and so you become angry and throw around unprovoked insults..

it's sad. I'm trying to be civil here..

you downplayed what happened to gorgon because it happened by shield agents.. my point: it doesn't matter who hit him, but WHAT it was they hit him with...

uhhhhggg... okay... look, cap displays skills MORE OFTEN.. that doesn't mean his skills are MORE IMPRESSIVE, or MORE COMPLEX then what wolverine has shown he can do...
cap doesn't appear to have superior skill, he just uses the skills he has more often.. why is that hard to follow?

It was real battling in a non coporial realm where powers were assessed and distributed differently then in the 616 world.. it doesn't account for anything here as far as I'm concerned.. you may as well post up stuff from the manga verse to prove a point like that.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Ok now let's compare....

Been training to combat multiple opponents far superior to humans since she was a child.
Fast enough to speedblitz Ronan(and I believe all Kree are notably faster than humans, and even if not, this was an amped up Ronan the Accuser).
Has dodged nearly every shot that's been taken at her since her inception(except for cheapshots, of course).
Knocked the Power Gem out of Drax.
Manhandled Terrax
Taken down an entire UN platoon in 8 minutes, without a scratch on her.
Taken shot from Ronan the Accuser
Got a healing factor equal to Wolverine's in the 90's, which is still impressive.

So yeah, I think Gamora has been more impressive overall.

But the DO need to be more impressive for him to be considered in Gamora's league. The fact of the matter is that at this point Gamora ranks somewhere on the bottom rungs of a herald level character, and nothing you've said indicates that Gorgon is on that level.

well I'm just going to say I don't hold most of those feats in as high reguard as you do since half of them are skewed.... but that nowithstanding..

gorgon doesn't have to be.. look.. gorgons attacks are going to be effective reguardless of her "level"
her attacks on the other hand will be for the most part unnoticed...

how will she put gorgon down?
punches and nerve strikes are useless.. grappling only gets her stabbed..

gorgon can damage her, she can't damage him... gorgon's punishment will last a while. her's won't last seconds..

their skills are comparible, and the only way we're even debating this now is by stripping gorgon of the more powerful half of his powers.. 😬

Originally posted by jinzin
well I'm just going to say I don't hold most of those feats in as high reguard as you do since half of them are skewed.... but that nowithstanding..

Originally posted by jinzin
gorgon doesn't have to be.. look.. gorgons attacks are going to be effective reguardless of her "level"
her attacks on the other hand will be for the most part unnoticed...

Originally posted by jinzin
how will she put gorgon down?
punches and nerve strikes are useless.. grappling only gets her stabbed..

Originally posted by jinzin
gorgon can damage her, she can't damage him... gorgon's punishment will last a while. her's won't last seconds..

Originally posted by jinzin
their skills are comparible, and the only way we're even debating this now is by stripping gorgon of the more powerful half of his powers.. 😬

Originally posted by jinzin
again the hf does matter...

if one stab to the gut puts gamora down.. then she's not ready to fight this war.. if gorgon starts to hurt her she's not gonna bounce back up from it.. she'll go down and she'll stay down.. there was a point to that.. one stab to the gut is apparently all it will take... 😕

you downplayed what happened to gorgon because it happened by shield agents.. my point: it doesn't matter who hit him, but WHAT it was they hit him with...

uhhhhggg... okay... look, cap displays skills MORE OFTEN.. that doesn't mean his skills are MORE IMPRESSIVE, or MORE COMPLEX then what wolverine has shown he can do...
cap doesn't appear to have superior skill, he just uses the skills he has more often.. why is that hard to follow?

*sigh* First off, let's stop the insults, bashing and whatnot. I know full well it wasn't only me, but I was certainly a perpetrator. So, let's agree to act like adults? Good.

Then I'll take out the insulting parts of your post because I'm not going to respond to them...
(Though... for the record... crushing me at every turn? Yeah... 🙄 )

As proven, she clearly has higher durability now, and the PIS aura of Wolverine isn't a factor here, so the hf will at least contribute. And she DID heal from that wound, in the comic.

Again, I was reffering to feats of on-panel people-unable-to-hurt him durability. Which, I concluded, would have to be all done by Elektra, Wolverine and SHIELD agents. I thought most of the 'thrown everything they could at him' WAS a stated comment, which was what the hyperbole thing was about. Regardless, let's carry on.

Well, the comment "I don't think Cap shows skills more on average, he just shows skills more often", seemed to me like "I don't think apples are usually red, they are just normally red" 😛 I guess I misunderstood... 😕

Anyways, I'm not trying to make an enemy here Jinzin, so I'll personally back off with all the insulting comments. Sorry again.

Originally posted by darthgoober
What's skewed about them?

What makes you think her attacks are going to be ineffective? (You never answered about all the times he's been beaten in the past other than the once).
Are you kidding? Your talking about shots from arguably the best fighter in the Marvel Universe, who also approaches class 100 in terms of strength.
And she can heal. Your going on the assumption that he's armed with his sword, while she's weaponless. But I'm pretty sure this is a h2h situation, and nothing you've said indicates that he's in league with Ronan in terms of strength. So she'll be able to take all the damage he deals, and probably hand out quite a bit more.
And she's been stripped of the Godslayer too. I'm pretty sure that the Godslayer would take Gorgon out no problem(even Thanos fears that dagger).

that's because after his ressurection he was never beaten any "other times"... 😕
they are, if you wish to discuss why I think they are feel free to PM me as i don't think my personal opinion on the matter.. well.. matters.. lol.

and again, what is she going to do to him?
blunt force won't work, grappling won't work, explosives and projectiles won't work...
what else does she got?
I also haven't seen evidence that she's anywhere NEAR class 100 strength.. but if you've got scans I've got the time...

sword's his standard weapon.. h2h is her standard style.. of course I would assume that.. 😐

the godsayer would work if she touched him with it, wih tp and his stare... she won't...

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
[BAs proven, she clearly has higher durability now, and the PIS aura of Wolverine isn't a factor here, so the hf will at least contribute. And she DID heal from that wound, in the comic.

Again, I was reffering to feats of on-panel people-unable-to-hurt him durability. Which, I concluded, would have to be all done by Elektra, Wolverine and SHIELD agents. I thought most of the 'thrown everything they could at him' WAS a stated comment, which was what the hyperbole thing was about. Regardless, let's carry on.

Well, the comment "I don't think Cap shows skills more on average, he just shows skills more often", seemed to me like "I don't think apples are usually red, they are just normally red" 😛 [/B]

I don't see how her durability is proven whatsoever.. she can take blunt force trauma.. okay that's fine..
"as proven" she can't take stabs to the gut.. she has wonder woman sydrome simple as. She can heal fine, but if one strike drops her for any amount of seconds.. her hf is a virtual non factor.. she still loses.

well, it's no some to disregard.. those are the feats he has..

well, your perception of my statment should be cleared up now..

Originally posted by jinzin
that's because after his ressurection he was never beaten any "other times"... 😕
they are, if you wish to discuss why I think they are feel free to PM me as i don't think my personal opinion on the matter.. well.. matters.. lol.

Originally posted by jinzin
and again, what is she going to do to him?
blunt force won't work, grappling won't work, explosives and projectiles won't work...
what else does she got?
I also haven't seen evidence that she's anywhere NEAR class 100 strength.. but if you've got scans I've got the time...

Originally posted by jinzin
sword's his standard weapon.. h2h is her standard style.. of course I would assume that.. 😐

Originally posted by jinzin
the godsayer would work if she touched him with it, wih tp and his stare... she won't...

Here lets just clear up the whole matter of armament now. Smurf, does he have his sword or is it h2h?(If he gets his sword, she should get her dagger.)

Originally posted by darthgoober
No come on. Do you think the feats are inaccurate? Am I lying or exaggerating or something?

Well, the UN soldier suggested that they classify her strength at the level of Ironman. And she's far more physically powerful now than she was then. I don't think she IS class 100, but she's probably somewhere in the area(seeing as how she was able to take on the likes of Terrax and Ronan physically).

Actually, her dagger IS part of her standard weaponry. That's why I'm assuming it's h2h, and that's what I've been debating.

It would work if she threw it at him(she's skilled enough that it would likely hit.)

if you want to discussed the skewed perspective pm me..

moving on..

see. scewed.. she avoided terrax, and then got in his face when he.. wasn't quite himself.

she has the dagger, but her standard style of fighting is in h2h engagment.. hell it even was during her fight with ronan...
h2h isn't a question here.. I just thought I'd point out that gorgon is severly depowered to make this interesting.. and he is.

unfortunately, he's skilled enough and fast enough to dodge... also, how will she land her target when she can't look to where she is throwing without turning to stone, how will she land her target when he can read her mind and know's what she's doing before she does it?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Here lets just clear up the whole matter of armament now. Smurf, does he have his sword or is it h2h?(If he gets his sword, she should get her dagger.)

if she should get her dagger he should get his stone gaze.. 🙂

Originally posted by darthgoober
Here lets just clear up the whole matter of armament now. Smurf, does he have his sword or is it h2h?(If he gets his sword, she should get her dagger.)

Well, she normally would have Godslayer, however that would create a whole 'nother argument. I've barely seen Gamora fight without a secondary weapon on hand (be it sword, extra dagger, gun, etc.)

Since he has his sword, shall we assume that she has her sword?

(As depicted here)

Would that not work for the purposes of the debate?

If so, assume for the purpose of the fight, all material weapons are unbreakable

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
Well, she normally would have Godslayer, however that would create a whole 'nother argument. I've barely seen Gamora fight without a secondary weapon on hand (be it sword, extra dagger, gun, etc.)

Since he has his sword, shall we assume that she has her sword?

(As depicted here)

Would that not work for the purposes of the debate?

If so, assume for the purpose of the fight, all material weapons are unbreakable

then give her a sword.. she'll still lose.

Originally posted by jinzin
if you want to discussed the skewed perspective pm me..

Originally posted by jinzin
she has the dagger, but her standard style of fighting is in h2h engagment.. hell it even was during her fight with ronan...
h2h isn't a question here.. I just thought I'd point out that gorgon is severly depowered to make this interesting.. and he is.

Originally posted by jinzin
unfortunately, he's skilled enough and fast enough to dodge... also, how will she land her target when she can't look to where she is throwing without turning to stone, how will she land her target when he can read her mind and know's what she's doing before she does it?

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
Well, she normally would have Godslayer, however that would create a whole 'nother argument. I've barely seen Gamora fight without a secondary weapon on hand (be it sword, extra dagger, gun, etc.)

Since he has his sword, shall we assume that she has her sword?

(As depicted here)

Would that not work for the purposes of the debate?

If so, assume for the purpose of the fight, all material weapons are unbreakable

While we're there, the next scan is a definite strength feat, seeing as she is able to lock blades and hold her ground against a charging Ronan, and the result creates huge noise and vibrations

Originally posted by darthgoober
Fine.

Wolverine's standard style of fighting doesn't really utilize much in the way of martial arts skills, so should he be assumed to be without them for tread purposes?

not necassarily.. we say that the fighters fight to the best of their abilities...

we assume this to be true for cap: but we don't take away his shield...

Originally posted by darthgoober
So it's a crap shoot. If she manages to hit him(possible, since her speed/reflexes are arguably better) he dies, if not and he catches her with the stone gaze she dies.

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
While we're there, the next scan is a definite strength feat, seeing as she is able to lock blades and hold her ground against a charging Ronan, and the result creates huge noise and vibrations

I don't know.. amazons have been able to do the same with supergirl.. amazonns are nowhere near class 100.

Originally posted by jinzin
I don't know.. amazons have been able to do the same with supergirl.. amazonns are nowhere near class 100.

And create vibrations that cause people more then fifty feet away to fall to the ground, cause the ground is shaking to much to keep their footing?

ahh i missed that part.