Revan & Malak vs Obi-Wan & Anakin

I don't want to get into another argument about this, Nebaris, but the Visual Guide seems to think that Palpatine was the most powerful Sith Lord by Attack of the Clones, and yes, an argument could be made for it, and the Visual Guide is very much canon.

1. Any PT incarnation of Sidious being the most powerful sith ever just plainly makes no sense. It contradicts in-story evidence, and is therefor retconned. You know this, I have seen posts of your's indicating such, otherwise I would elaborate.

2. The quote is in no way conclusive. There's not just one interpretation, and I personally think it's idiotic to go with the interpretation that doesn't makes sense. Again, I would elaborate, but we've already argued the topic to death.

Even if we were to discard that, however, we have depictions of his raw power in the Force (which exceeds any Sith Lord prior - to the point that it was killing him).

So basically, your argument is that because Sidious' strength in the force was so strong that it was nearly killing his physical body, his raw power is therefor beyond any other sith lord, correct? Your argument fails, when considering other variables.

1. How strong was Sidious' body compared to the other sith lords? Surely you would agree that a stronger physical body would better withstand the deterioration cause by darkside energies, yes? Sidious was pretty old, and his body was pretty weak, so naturally it would be weaker and more vulnerable to the deterioration caused by darkside energies. Now in comparison to a sith lord such as Exar Kun (I'm not saying Exar is more powerful than Sidious, I'm just making a comparison), Sidious is well past his physical prime, and was pretty old, whereas Exar was young and in his physical prime. So surely you would agree that it would take much more power to weaken a physically strong body such as Exar Kun's than it would to weaken a physically weak body such as that of Sidious. So you see, stating that Sidious' raw power is beyond Exar Kun, and anybody else based on that one piece of evidence is 100% fallacious.

2. How great was Sidious' willpower in comparison to the other Sith Lords? Sion, for instance, had a will so strong that he was able to keep his physical body alive, and together, when it should have died and fallen apart years beforeso. Surely, you would agree that how great one's will is would factor in on whether they would be able to contain their power within themselves, yes? Now I'm not saying Sidious has a low willpower or anything, but I'm just saying that it would factor in, and that those with a higher will would have greater resistance.

3. How can you be so certain that it was purely his strength in the force that was killing his physical body? The degree to which Sidious had employed and used the darkside in his entire lifetime would surely factor in, yes? I mean, the same thing was said to have briefly happened to Luke, however it wasn't specifically his strength in the force, but the product of using the force to such an exponential degree. Sidious had been studying and employing the darkside for decades. In comparison to people like Bane, Revan, and Exar Kun who only studied and used it for a few years, the darkside would have been slowly weakening Sidious' body for far longer than it would have for sith lords such as those mentioned.

4. You seem to be ignoring people such as Darth Andeddu, or Darth Nihilus, who's physical bodies were already dead. So how would they apply? There was no physical body to be weakened by their strength in the force. Or people such as Bane, who has orbalisks constantly strengthening his body. Or Sion, who as I mentioned, can keep his body alive when it should have been dead through sheer willpower alone.

Really, that piece of evidence alone in no way indicates that his strength in the force is beyond any other sith lord, and depending on how you look at it, it may even speak badly for Sidious.

Originally posted by allfg
1. Any PT incarnation of Sidious being the most powerful sith ever just plainly makes no sense. It contradicts in-story evidence, and is therefor retconned. You know this, I have seen posts of your's indicating such, otherwise I would elaborate.

2. The quote is in no way conclusive. There's not just one interpretation, and I personally think it's idiotic to go with the interpretation that doesn't makes sense. Again, I would elaborate, but we've already argued the topic to death.

So basically, your argument is that because Sidious' strength in the force was so strong that it was nearly killing his physical body, his raw power is therefor beyond any other sith lord, correct? Your argument fails, when considering other variables.

1. How strong was Sidious' body compared to the other sith lords? Surely you would agree that a stronger physical body would better withstand the deterioration cause by darkside energies, yes? Sidious was pretty old, and his body was pretty weak, so naturally it would be weaker and more vulnerable to the deterioration caused by darkside energies. Now in comparison to a sith lord such as Exar Kun (I'm not saying Exar is more powerful than Sidious, I'm just making a comparison), Sidious is well past his physical prime, and was pretty old, whereas Exar was young and in his physical prime. So surely you would agree that it would take much more power to weaken a physically strong body such as Exar Kun's than it would to weaken a physically weak body such as that of Sidious. So you see, stating that Sidious' raw power is beyond Exar Kun, and anybody else based on that one piece of evidence is 100% fallacious.

2. How great was Sidious' willpower in comparison to the other Sith Lords? Sion, for instance, had a will so strong that he was able to keep his physical body alive, and together, when it should have died and fallen apart years beforeso. Surely, you would agree that how great one's will is would factor in on whether they would be able to contain their power within themselves, yes? Now I'm not saying Sidious has a low willpower or anything, but I'm just saying that it would factor in, and that those with a higher will would have greater resistance.

3. How can you be so certain that it was purely his strength in the force that was killing his physical body? The degree to which Sidious had employed and used the darkside in his entire lifetime would surely factor in, yes? I mean, the same thing was said to have briefly happened to Luke, however it wasn't specifically his strength in the force, but the product of using the force to such an exponential degree. Sidious had been studying and employing the darkside for decades. In comparison to people like Bane, Revan, and Exar Kun who only studied and used it for a few years, the darkside would have been slowly weakening Sidious' body for far longer than it would have for sith lords such as those mentioned.

4. You seem to be ignoring people such as Darth Andeddu, or Darth Nihilus, who's physical bodies were already dead. So how would they apply? There was no physical body to be weakened by their strength in the force. Or people such as Bane, who has orbalisks constantly strengthening his body. Or Sion, who as I mentioned, can keep his body alive when it should have been dead through sheer willpower alone.

Really, that piece of evidence alone in no way indicates that his strength in the force is beyond any other sith lord, and depending on how you look at it, it may even speak badly for Sidious. [/B]

You have the debating skills of a 9 year old autistic girl. Please don't waste anymore space.

No it doesn't contradict anything. I guess you didn't notice when Lucas said he wanted to make it as realistic as possible without overpowering his characters?

You would have a point if my only evidence was what the movie characters didn't show, but that's not the case here. The movie characters actually displayed pure incompetence, so the whole 'absence of proof isn't proof of absence' excuse doesn't work here. Now if Yoda was so strong with the force, then why did he struggle like a b1tch with using the force to lift something as light (in comparison) as the crane in AotC at the end of his duel with Dooku? His whole body was shaking, he almost lost balance and fell over, he had to put on his mean face to pull off such a feat, and he was only just able to stop the crane from falling on Anakin and Obi-Wan. That scene quite clearly makes it clear that in the force, Yoda was nothing compared to people such as Bane, Exar, Nihilus etc. RotS proved that Sidious and Yoda were pretty much pure equals in the force, so Sidious sucks just as much. Now that's how the quote contradicts in-story evidence.

Not to mention the comics in between that fully cement Sidious' status as #1 sith lord.

Not really, and again, even if they did, they contradict the movies.

Not to mention that Sidious, by PT, is already the most opwerful of bane's order.

We're already arguing the validity of these blanket statements, so why the feck are you bringing up another?

There are MORE than enough canon sources to make it conclusive, you just choose to argue with facts as usual, so you are wrong as usual.

Sidious can have 100 source claiming that he's the most powerful sith ever, but when it contradicts the highest canon source, it's plain wrong. Accept that.

The quotes are conclusive, again because it doesn't fit in with your beliefs its somehow ambiguous. Stop embarassing yourself.

Oh my days, you were also arguing against the quote, you fricking dumbass.

Actually his argument succeeds and your fails, as well as your bullshti about "other variables" you can't even list.

Someone needs to learnt to read. The variables are listed below.

It's a completely 100% logical argument that the power Sidious wielde was too great for a human body. This kind of power was never seen from any other sith lords so without any quotes, this is pretty conclusive.

WRONG!!
By your logic, Sidious is stronger than Luke as well.
Now it wasn't that the power that Sidious wielded was too strong for any human body, but specifically his human body.

Oh wow.. A human body is a human body. Sidious was what, 42 when he was already deteriorating? Yea he's totally old.

Are you actually denying that a 42 year old body is not physically past its prime?

And your argument dies yet again when we see a 15 year old Sidious clone deteriorate with ONE year. I shouldn't have to add anything else since you don't have an argument.

No, my argument doesn't die you freaking dumbass, because that clone body was no normal 15 year old body, but an inherently weak 15 year old body. Know what you're talking about.

Yet another irrelevant post but I'll address this crap anyways. Sidious' willpower was so great that he was able to conjure up force storms that rip apart the fabric of space. You picked the wrong irrelevant topic to argue, because there is no SW character that has more willpower than Sidious.

Listing one great feat of willpower doesn't prove that his willpower is beyond anybody else's. By your logic, I can say that because Sion's will was so great that he was able to hold his entire body together, and keep himself alive when he should have died years ago, his willpower is therefor greater than everyone else's. See how dumb that is without proof that the willpower of everyone else isn't as great as his?

Translation: I dislike Sidious so I will make up as much bullshit as I possibly can to discredit facts and canon sources.

Translation: ... Wait, I can't translate this, I'm not familiar with the whole looser/geek style of speech.

Completely irrelevant.

How the fvck is it irrelevant, you dumbass. Gideon's comparison doesn't apply to those people that I mentioned, so he can't use that piece of evidence to place Sidious above them. You're dumb.

You have the debating skills of a 9 year old autistic girl. Please don't waste anymore space.

That's great, I don't even know what's worse, your debating skillz, or your insulting skillz. Seriously man, stick to arguing against Kadesh and Legend.

No Lightsnake, GL's intentions were never to make the jedi godlike, as can be seen at the end of AotC, when he has Yoda, who also happened to be the most powerful jedi at the time struggle with lifting a relatively light pillar. Now in comparison to people like Nihilus who could use the force to move entire fleets, or Bane who could use the force to move an entire moon, or Luke and Kyp Durron who could manipulate Black Holes, that's virtually the opposite of godlike.

Originally posted by allfg
You would have a point if my only evidence was what the movie characters didn't show, but that's not the case here. The movie characters actually displayed pure incompetence, so the whole 'absence of proof isn't proof of absence' excuse doesn't work here. Now if Yoda was so strong with the force, then why did he struggle like a b1tch with using the force to lift something as light (in comparison) as the crane in AotC at the end of his duel with Dooku? His whole body was shaking, he almost lost balance and fell over, he had to put on his mean face to pull off such a feat, and he was only just able to stop the crane from falling on Anakin and Obi-Wan. That scene quite clearly makes it clear that in the force, Yoda was nothing compared to people such as Bane, Exar, Nihilus etc. RotS proved that Sidious and Yoda were pretty much pure equals in the force, so Sidious sucks just as much. Now that's how the quote contradicts in-story evidence.

Not really, and again, even if they did, they contradict the movies.

We're already arguing the validity of these blanket statements, so why the feck are you bringing up another?

Sidious can have 100 source claiming that he's the most powerful sith ever, but when it contradicts the highest canon source, it's plain wrong. Accept that.

Oh my days, you were also arguing against the quote, you fricking dumbass.

Someone needs to learnt to read. The variables are listed below.

[b]WRONG!!
By your logic, Sidious is stronger than Luke as well.
Now it wasn't that the power that Sidious wielded was too strong for any human body, but specifically his human body.

Are you actually denying that a 42 year old body is not physically past its prime?

No, my argument doesn't die you freaking dumbass, because that clone body was no normal 15 year old body, but an inherently weak 15 year old body. Know what you're talking about.

Listing one great feat of willpower doesn't prove that his willpower is beyond anybody else's. By your logic, I can say that because Sion's will was so great that he was able to hold his entire body together, and keep himself alive when he should have died years ago, his willpower is therefor greater than everyone else's. See how dumb that is without proof that the willpower of everyone else isn't as great as his?

Translation: ... Wait, I can't translate this, I'm not familiar with the whole looser/geek style of speech.

How the fvck is it irrelevant, you dumbass. Gideon's comparison doesn't apply to those people that I mentioned, so he can't use that piece of evidence to place Sidious above them. You're dumb.

That's great, I don't even know what's worse, your debating skillz, or your insulting skillz. Seriously man, stick to arguing against Kadesh and Legend. [/B]

Aww how cute! The little ****** just repeated everything I said to him, back to me. Self pwnage as usual francine?

Right, because I was totally talking like some kind of loser and telling you to stop embarrassing yourself and that you're in denial and all the other lame shit you say. 🙄

Seriously man, why the fvck did you even decide to post? My argument was addressed to Gideon, now as if hijacking other people's arguments isn't bad enough, you didn't even do a good job of it, and only answered about half of my points.

You don't have an argument and whatever was left of your useless text was defeated. Be lucky anyone even addresses you anymore.. Tool..

Ok, I'm done with you, go back to debating SW Legend and Kadesh and others on your level.

Originally posted by Kadesh
no it is not according to insider, wookie is shit on that part

Originally posted by Kadesh
possible but i highly doubt it is revans form yet

- Form I (Shi Cho) [Mastered it]
- Form III (Soresu) [Practised it]
- Form IV (Ataru) [Practised it]
- Form V (Djem So) [Probably Mastered it] Reason: Revan was indeed an aggressive fighter.

Now after mastering Niman, Revan went on to practise and mastered Jar Kai Combat Style.

Now you see? things have gotten more clear as I consulted an expert on this issue.

Originally posted by Kadesh
I can refute that by saying it has no strenghts either. And cant find a weakness? Apparantly all masters of niman died in the battle of geonosis when using niman and anakin pwning cin drallig who used niman to its highest degree against anakin

It is not necessary that Revan used Form VI when facing heavy odds. He practised and mastered several Saber styles. Remember that Drew also said that Revan was a skilled swordsman.

Now we have a more clear picture of Revan's Saber skills.

Originally posted by Kadesh
No, what he gave was his opinion which has yet to be approved, until then, malaks form will still be unknown.

I would believe what Drew said. Malak used Juyo according to him and I will accept it because we have no other official sources to tell us about Malak's Saber skills.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Bane nearly died, he was lucky to back a distance away to unleash a force attack, and bane was lucky to have kasim under a structure. Not impressive

Originally posted by Kadesh
And you should notice cin drallig mastered niman to its highest degree and got killed by anakins djem so. Again niman IS NOT jarkai

Originally posted by Kadesh
Once again niman and jarkai ARE NOT related, why are you so stupid? Insider stated that they have no relations, IDK if revan mastered form 6 or not but the point is JK and NM have absolutely no relations.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Bullshit, tell me where excactly you got this nonsense from, insider certeinly doesnt say so, and just because drew knows the database doesnt mean he can pull things from his arse until A-P-R-O-V-E-D by lucasarts. The point is with any form you can unleash force attacks, The highest form of canon prove this

Revan mastered more then a single Saber Form because he faced many hard challenges and to succeed in them, it was a necessary requirement. You should note that mastering Niman is not at all an easy task and required more then 10 damn years and study of several other Saber Forms.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Yup, dooku unleashed it on obiwan during a saber lock, regardless of what form you cannot unleash attacks while defending or striking

Force attacks can be unleashed during any form of fighting but it becomes easier to unleash them when using Niman. This is a simple point.

Originally posted by Count Makashi
In an all out fight Revan and Malak win, they have better Force powers, but if this was lightsaber only then Obi-Wan and Anakin would win.

Revan was a skilled swordsman and practised/mastered several Light Saber Forms. he was number 1 in an order of thousands. Mastering of Niman and Jar Kai Combat styles is a very difficult thing and it takes over a decade to achieve this.

Malak was also a master swordsman and Drew said that he used Juyo.

This will be a hard fight indeed but both Revan and Malak can win even in a pure dueling contest.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
I said it never stated Revan was a saber prodigy. If you're going to try and make someone else look stupid, don't embarass yourself with your piss poor reading comprehension skills.

This statement alone is sufficient answer.

Originally posted by allfg
Ok, I'm done with you, go back to debating SW Legend and Kadesh and others on your level.

You really have a bad case of denial for someone that's never come close to winning an argument. If I am on the level of Legend and Kadesh(yea right, no offense to them), you are somewhat below Numan. But please keep lying to yourself, you ARE the forum joke.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
It is indicated that to practise and master Jar Kai, mastering of Form VI is necessary.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

To master Niman to its highest degree, Revan indeed practised following Saber Forms:

- Form I (Shi Cho) [Mastered it]
- Form III (Soresu) [Practised it]
- Form IV (Ataru) [Practised it]
- Form V (Djem So) [Probably Mastered it] Reason: Revan was indeed an aggressive fighter.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Now after mastering Niman, Revan went on to practise and mastered Jar Kai Combat Style.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Now you see? things have gotten more clear as I consulted an expert on this issue.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

It is not necessary that Revan used Form VI when facing heavy odds. He practised and mastered several Saber styles. Remember that Drew also said that Revan was a [b]skilled swordsman.
[/B]

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Now we have a more clear picture of Revan's Saber skills.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

We got a hint about Malak's Saber Form. Remember that Juyo is designed to suit aggressive fighters and Malak was one very aggressive fighter. He used to recklessely charge in to dangerous fights and win (as indicated in SW Databank).

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

I would believe what Drew said. Malak used Juyo according to him and I will accept it because we have no other official sources to tell us about Malak's Saber skills.

According to c-a-n-o-n sources, malaks saber form is unknown, and if drew wants to make malak use juyo, it will have to be submitted for approval which has yet to be done friend. we cannot say "o malak uses juyo cuz DK says so which hasnt been approved"

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Then you should note that Kas'im was a skilled swordsman and also adept in Jar Kai combat style. And you should also note that Revan was also a skilled swordsman and an adept Jar Kai user.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Well mastering Niman is necessary before moving towards Jar Kai because several Jedi did so. This is the reason that Revan mastered Niman before mastering Jar Kai and it makes sense to me.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Jar Kai and Niman are related because several sources point out that mastering Niman is necessary before mastering Jar Kai. You are making no sense here.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Stop acting like an idiot or a child. Mastering Niman is not a bad thing and it is just one of the Saber Forms that Revan mastered and Drew hinted on it. You are not an expert and nor anybody to trash an expert's opinion.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Revan mastered more then a single Saber Form because he faced many hard challenges and to succeed in them, it was a necessary requirement. You should note that mastering Niman is not at all an easy task and required more then 10 damn years and study of several other Saber Forms.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Obi-Wan got distracted by Magnaguards and Dooku got time to over-power him when he was blocking Obi-Wan's move. And Obi-Wan was not all over him when this happened.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Force attacks can be unleashed during any form of fighting but it becomes easier to unleash them when using Niman. This is a simple point.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
You really have a bad case of denial for someone that's never come close to winning an argument. If I am on the level of Legend and Kadesh(yea right, no offense to them), you are somewhat below Numan. But please keep lying to yourself, you ARE the forum joke.

was that sarcasm?

That was towards Noobaris

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
That was towards Noobaris

Enough.

Nebaris, we've started off so nicely since my return here, so do not ruin it. You will not tell me that I am wrong when you have nothing to back it up with. We have argued to death on the subject, and all of your arguments about that damn quote have been very nicely dealt with and rendered invalid. Mine have not. You do not dictate "what is retconned" and what is not. You are not Lucas or a member of the Holocron. Remember that.

Enough.

Nebaris, we've started off so nicely since my return here, so do not ruin it. You will not tell me that I am wrong when you have nothing to back it up with. We have argued to death on the subject, and all of your arguments about that damn quote have been very nicely dealt with and rendered invalid.

Ok, I'll admit that maybe the whole accomplishments argument was a little off, but seriously, even you must admit that having Sidious by AotC being the most powerful sith ever a little odd.

Really, IIRC, the quote was something like "The Greatest Master of Evil to ever use Sith Power." I really don't see how you get power from that.

Mine have not. You do not dictate "what is retconned" and what is not. You are not Lucas or a member of the Holocron. Remember that.

Right, so you're basically saying that even if a statement from a Reference Guide doesn't make sense in the setting that the guide is based from, it still remains valid? So if the next edition of the Essential Chronology states that 2 + 2 = 5, you will therefor accept it as SW fact?

Oh and you don't need to be Lucas or a member of the holocron to spot contradictions. Remember that.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Prove it and quit making shit up, Firstly no where it states you have to learn Niman to learn jarkai because sora bulq asaji ventress and komari vosa are all jar kai users and they have never mastered the art of niman. Reading on their background simply pwns what ever shit you pull out from your ass

The Sources:

A) Jar'Kai is the traditional name applied to the style of lightsaber combat that uses a blade in each hand, frequently called Niman (the name for Form VI) by savvy modern practitioners since that form is the current Jedi standard. - Dark Forces

B) However, there is one saving grace to this form: Niman is the stepping stone to the dual lightsaber form, known as Jar'Kai - no one who has successfully mastered Jar'Kai has done so without first mastering Niman - Hero's Guide Web Enhancement 3 (Saber Forms and Fallanassi)

C) Many Jedi Knights and Sith Lords trained to use the Niman style in the hopes of gaining a basic knowledge of the dual-bladed attack. - Wookieepedia

Now you think that all these sources are lying? Stop acting like an idiot.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Problably but the point is that im pointing out we-dont-know-revans-main-form. So why keep telling me the same thing which is irrelevant?

Consider these two examples:

Revan's case: Revan mastered Form I, possibly Form V, Form VI and Jar Kai Form. So he can use any of these Saber Forms in combat situations. There is no restrictions imposed on him to just use Form VI.

Kas'im case: He mastered all 7 Saber Forms and also the Jar Kai Form. Thus he can use any Saber Form in combat. There is no restrictions imposed on him to just use a single Saber Form because he is good in all Saber Forms.

Originally posted by Kadesh
So? What who gives? We know revan is a prodigy at lightsaber skills but do we ever know whats his main form? WE DONT KNOW so why the hell are you telling me "he m astered this he mastered that" when we dont even know which form he uses? I told you time and again drews opinion has-yet-to-be-approved

The concept of main Saber Form applies to those Jedi who mastered only a single Saber Form like Anakin mastered Djem So, so it is his main Saber Form.

Originally posted by Kadesh
No you did not, you just made things worse,
First you claim niman is a sub form of jar kai
then you say that you must master niman to master jarkai. And i have refuted that by pointing out characters who use jar kai YET never learnt niman

I posted what was mentioned in wookieepedia. It is stated in wookieepedia that Jar Kai is sub-form of Niman.

Why don't you go and edit its profile and mention the reasons that why these two Saber Forms are not related in there discussion section?

Secondly, several sources that I mentioned above indicate that Jar Kai is related to Niman. Now so many sources are saying the same thing and this is giving us a strong indication.

And prove that several Jar Kai users never even practised Niman?

Originally posted by Kadesh
Exactly but we do not know which form he would use

Now Jar Kai is related to Niman. A connection has been established here.

Now to master Niman, Revan had to practise and even probably mastered several other Saber Forms. Drew said that Revan was a skilled swordsman, so it means that he was a great fighter and duelist.

I think that this entire picture has made us clear for us that what Revan probably practised and mastered. So stop being an @ss and try to understand a bigger picture here. No one said that Niman was his main Saber Form. All I am saying that it is just one Saber Form that Revan mastered apart from others.

Originally posted by Kadesh
It is still the same, all we know he is a great duelist and a superb one

K2 is a canon source. Drew is a SW Author and writes canon materials. What they indicate, it gets accepted so stop acting like a child and understand the bigger picture that I provided above.

Originally posted by Kadesh
So? Anakin is extremely agressive and he doesnt use juyo, The "hint" again has-yet-to-be-approved by LFL thus cannot be taken into consideration. By the way revan > malak in saber combat so why is malak using a better form than what revan is using? Juyo is stated to be the best form behind vaapad.

Malak was also aggressive in dueling. But he lacked Jedi discipline and his masters were afraid to unleash him in combat situations. Juyo is a type of Saber Form that suits reckless and aggressive Jedi.

Form VII draws upon a deeper well of emotion than even Form V. - SW insider 62

Malak had no proper control over his emotions and he was aggressive. Juyo suits him best and accordintg to Drew he used it. I will agree with what Drew says. Stop being a dolt once again.

Originally posted by Kadesh
see the above, drews opinion has yet-to-be-approved, If he says malak is the most powerful sith, i bet you will believe him and i garentee you will also agree when he makes shit up to put revan above sidious.

Do you know that Drew was once asked a question that who is more powerful among these characters? Darth Revan, Darth Bane & Darth Vader. Drew refused to answer this question and said that Star Wars is a dynamic world and out-come of fights in Star Wars depend on several factors.

Drew is a sensible man and I can safely trust his views.

Originally posted by Kadesh
According to c-a-n-o-n sources, malaks saber form is unknown, and if drew wants to make malak use juyo, it will have to be submitted for approval which has yet to be done friend. we cannot say "o malak uses juyo cuz DK says so which hasnt been approved"

Drew gave us a hint about what Saber Form Malak used and it suits his personality. You have trouble in accepting this then STFU or don't reply to my post.

Originally posted by Kadesh
So? Just because bane got shitted does it mean anakin will?

Originally posted by Kadesh
Sorry legend, that assumption of yours just got shitted when i mentioned the few characters who used jar kai without learning niman
Name your sources please, wookie right? Sorry but it is not accurate because according to novels and the insider magazine. niman is not related to jar kai. Again komari vosa, asaji ventressm general grievious, sora bulq all mastered jar kai without learning niman

Originally posted by Kadesh
Did i say it was a bad thing? maybe i did, i was simply pointing out the fact that drews opinion hasnt been approved and thus we cannot use it in debate, for revan using jarkai we can because WE SEEN revan wielding 2 sabers in K2

Originally posted by Kadesh
Apparantly drallig also mastered this form as did colemen trebor and please tell me who said niman takes 10 years? vaapad was mastered shorter than that and vaapad is hell alot better than niman is

Young Jedi spend their first few years studying Form I and then a year or two with each additional Form before completing their training. By comparison, a Form VI master will spend at least ten years studying only that Form after completing the basic Form I training. - Star Wars insider 62

Now STFU.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Or when vader lifted the tree to smash the dark lady in a middle of a duel... go on

And Revan can defeat him.

Originally posted by Kadesh
Remember kavar stating it has no strengths? If niman makes it easier by striking with the force, that means thats a strength of niman which contradicts what official sources stated, sorry but you failed again [/B]