Originally posted by quanchi112
Vos doesn't have the resume to compete with Windu.
Of course he does. Beating Dooku (something Kenobi seems incapable of) gives him the resume "compete" against Windu. And Lucas never gave any special criteria to compete against Windu. Only Sidious had been given that special criteria.
Originally posted by quanchi112
1) when Sidious isn't expecting it right after he let up.2). It is about timing.
Windu beat Sidious Vos didn't. Vos doesn't have the resume to compete with Windu. He can however defeat Dooku.
1) He let up once the transmission ended.
2) There was no timing for Dooku and Sidious is way to powerful.
Defeating Dooku is more than enough to put you on or above Windu level seeing as Dooku and are equals.
Also https://youtu.be/wh01SWVYyNU watch the entire thing and concession accepted on points 1 and 2.
Originally posted by Darth ThorWindu went toe to toe with Talzin, killed Fett, and beat Sidious.
Of course he does. Beating Dooku (something Kenobi seems incapable of) gives him the resume "compete" against Windu. And Lucas never gave any special criteria to compete against Windu. Only Sidious had been given that special criteria.
Dooku is a far cry from Sidious.
Originally posted by Darth ThorHe is more powerful and his timing is greater to he's just better than Maul is. But he needs to find the right timing just as Yoda needed to force push Sidious.
LOLSidious's right moment comes Awfully easily against Maul doesn't it TROLL?
Originally posted by EmperorSidious21. Iyo not mine.
1) He let up once the transmission ended.2) There was no timing for Dooku and Sidious is way to powerful.
Defeating Dooku is more than enough to put you on or above Windu level seeing as Dooku and are equals.
Also https://youtu.be/wh01SWVYyNU watch the entire thing and concession accepted on points 1 and 2.
2. Yes, there was. Anakin is more powerful than Ventress but can still be taken off guard by force choke to a weaker opponent.
Nothing to substantiate that.
Windu's track record is unmatched.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Windu went toe to toe with Talzin, killed Fett, and beat Sidious.
Dooku's beaten Anakin, Stomped Kenobi 3/3 times, Stomped Ventress, Stomped Opress, even beaten Jedi Vos, and even fought off Yoda (Mace and Sidious's superior in Sabers at least).
Originally posted by quanchi112
He is more powerful and his timing is greater to he's just better than Maul is. But he needs to find the right timing just as Yoda needed to force push Sidious.
He owned him every time he wanted to. Beginning of the fight he pinned them both (let them go on purpose), middle of the fight he first tossed them both off a balcony, then later he KO'd Maul. And that was all 2 v 1 😂
At the end of their 1 v 1 the ownage was just utterly embarrassing for Maul. It was sheer humiliation.
Dooku's never been owned to that degree.
Originally posted by Darth ThorSo Dooku did nothing remotely as impressive as stalemating Talzin or defeating his master Sidious.
Dooku's beaten Anakin, Stomped Kenobi 3/3 times, Stomped Ventress, Stomped Opress, even beaten Jedi Vos, and even fought off Yoda (Mace and Sidious's superior in Sabers at least).He owned him every time he wanted to. Beginning of the fight he pinned them both (let them go on purpose), middle of the fight he first tossed them both off a balcony, then later he KO'd Maul. And that was all 2 v 1 😂
At the end of their 1 v 1 the ownage was just utterly embarrassing for Maul. It was sheer humiliation.
Dooku's never been owned to that degree.
Mace successfully deflected fl Yoda dropped his saber. 🙂
When the opening was there. Sidious was greater but he had to work for it unlike against the Jedi council masters who accompanied Mace.
Dooku was owned by Vos and Anakin.
Originally posted by quanchi112
1. Iyo not mine.2. Yes, there was. Anakin is more powerful than Ventress but can still be taken off guard by force choke to a weaker opponent.
Nothing to substantiate that.
Windu's track record is unmatched.
1) What? Make sense.
2) Due to him having a weak force wall.
Yoda dark rendezvous, Dooku along with Yoda is the only being to ever best Windu in a sparring match, them fighting to a standstill in Obssesion, Dooku was able to contend with Yoda and that Vos is supposedly better than Dooku in speed, Dooku was also known as the most agile swordmaster in the order of his tenure, and many more accolades, so yea beating Dooku does put you on or above Windu level.
Irrelevant as Sidious and Yoda could take Windu for a majority in a saber duel, Dooku could as well with a slight less majority, and Anakin and Vos could even take a majority or make it a hell of a fight.
Originally posted by EmperorSidious2I did make sense.
1) What? Make sense.2) Due to him having a weak force wall.
Yoda dark rendezvous, Dooku along with Yoda is the only being to ever best Windu in a sparring match, them fighting to a standstill in Obssesion, Dooku was able to contend with Yoda and that Vos is supposedly better than Dooku in speed, Dooku was also known as the most agile swordmaster in the order of his tenure, and many more accolades, so yea beating Dooku does put you on or above Windu level.
Irrelevant as Sidious and Yoda could take Windu for a majority in a saber duel, Dooku could as well with a slight less majority, and Anakin and Vos could even take a majority or make it a hell of a fight.
Prove it.
Is any of this canon ?
In the film Windu bested Sidious and successively blocked the fl while Yoda was disarmed.
The film says otherwise.
Speculation.
Originally posted by quanchi112
I did make sense.Prove it.
Is any of this canon ?
In the film Windu bested Sidious and successively blocked the fl while Yoda was disarmed.
The film says otherwise.
Speculation.
The fact Ventress and Barris both not known for their force powers I suppose while not weak could break through the chosen ones guard at apparently any time?
Yea and the ones that aren't still admissible.
Again under specific circumstances that will never happen again. Also Sidious also has TK as well to push Windu back.
No this is all backed by evidence. You're either ignorant or biased. Most likely both.
Originally posted by EmperorSidious2I said it has to be at key moments just like anyone.
The fact Ventress and Barris both not known for their force powers I suppose while not weak could break through the chosen ones guard at apparently any time?Yea and the ones that aren't still admissible.
Again under specific circumstances that will never happen again. Also Sidious also has TK as well to push Windu back.
No this is all backed by evidence. You're either ignorant or biased. Most likely both.
Why not ?
It did happen and their only fight had Windu win.
It's backed by conjecture and twists the facts into these conspiracy theories.
Originally posted by quanchi112
I said it has to be at key moments just like anyone.Why not ?
It did happen and their only fight had Windu win.
It's backed by conjecture and twists the facts into these conspiracy theories.
Again key timing isn't necessarily needed. So you're saying that if maul and Sidious compleltely locked in their duel, Maul is guarding himself with his sabers with force defenses up in stationary position are you saying Sidious couldn't lift maul or choke him? Maul is in the defensive position with all his basis locked?
I said they are. I said the ones that aren't are still admissible. I meant the ones that aren't canon are still admissible as evidence.
Appear to win. Remember the word Appear? The novelization and the movie make it pretty clear there were circumstances that surrounded that fight.
So the novelization compleltely explicitly saying he used Vaapad to make himself half of a superconducting loop that allowed him to stalemate Sidious is conjecture?
Originally posted by EmperorSidious2I am saying he needs to have an open just like Yoda did. Sidious can shoot fl but if Yoda is ready he can defend himself. If he isn't he gets hurt. Simple.
Again key timing isn't necessarily needed. So you're saying that if maul and Sidious compleltely locked in their duel, Maul is guarding himself with his sabers with force defenses up in stationary position are you saying Sidious couldn't lift maul or choke him? Maul is in the defensive position with all his basis locked?I said they are. I said the ones that aren't are still admissible. I meant the ones that aren't canon are still admissible as evidence.
Appear to win. Remember the word Appear? The novelization and the movie make it pretty clear there were circumstances that surrounded that fight.
So the novelization compleltely explicitly saying he used Vaapad to make himself half of a superconducting loop that allowed him to stalemate Sidious is conjecture?
Not here in a canon thread.
The site made it clear Windu won and Yoda was unable to best him. Love my Disney site.
That's his own ability so it isn't an amp, sport.
Originally posted by quanchi112
I am saying he needs to have an open just like Yoda did. Sidious can shoot fl but if Yoda is ready he can defend himself. If he isn't he gets hurt. Simple.Not here in a canon thread.
The site made it clear Windu won and Yoda was unable to best him. Love my Disney site.
That's his own ability so it isn't an amp, sport.
Well I'd have to disagree. That's when power comes into play. Sidious could make his own opening. He doesn't need timing agaisnt people like Maul.
This is an expanded universe thread actually. Canon only hurts you because going by the movies and books since this is before the clone wars, Dooku has defeated jedi and went toe to toe with Yoda and was said to be the greatest saber duelist by Christopher Lee, while Windu defeated Jango fet and survived the,battle of geonosis.
The site also says Windu appeared to win and that this battle is debatable. You must have missed that part.
So you concede to my point since all you can do is correct the name calling.
Originally posted by EmperorSidious2No, no, no. He is more powerful but not to the extent Yoda was over Ventress. Maul was a rival.
Well I'd have to disagree. That's when power comes into play. Sidious could make his own opening. He doesn't need timing agaisnt people like Maul.This is an expanded universe thread actually. Canon only hurts you because going by the movies and books since this is before the clone wars, Dooku has defeated jedi and went toe to toe with Yoda and was said to be the greatest saber duelist by Christopher Lee, while Windu defeated Jango fet and survived the,battle of geonosis.
The site also says Windu appeared to win and that this battle is debatable. You must have missed that part.
So you concede to my point since all you can do is correct the name calling.
Default rules state it's canon unless otherwise stated. Chris Lee is just an actor. Dooku has been shamed by Vos and crushed by Anakin. Both hands and he stood over him like a submissive victim.
No, the site says he won.
If you can do something under your own ability that isn't an amp.
Originally posted by quanchi112
No, no, no. He is more powerful but not to the extent Yoda was over Ventress. Maul was a rival.Default rules state it's canon unless otherwise stated. Chris Lee is just an actor. Dooku has been shamed by Vos and crushed by Anakin. Both hands and he stood over him like a submissive victim.
No, the site says he won.
If you can do something under your own ability that isn't an amp.
Yoda was aiming to hurt Ventress as seen he only took her sabers. Sidious showed that the difference between maul and Ventress wasn't a problem as he did ragdoll him before and after the battle started with ease. Not in force power or as a deulist.
It's a expanded universe forum so need in even debating what duels they are. Christopher Lee is a renowned actor and the actors are responsible for their characters and Lee has actually given insight about the character and if he can go into a commentary that will go world wide then Lucas must have thought he was certified to say that.
The site also says he appeared to win, meaning it's not concrete.
Concession accepted.
Originally posted by EmperorSidious2He used his force powers to make combat impossible. Due to the right opening. Combat continued.
Yoda was aiming to hurt Ventress as seen he only took her sabers. Sidious showed that the difference between maul and Ventress wasn't a problem as he did ragdoll him before and after the battle started with ease. Not in force power or as a deulist.It's a expanded universe forum so need in even debating what duels they are. Christopher Lee is a renowned actor and the actors are responsible for their characters and Lee has actually given insight about the character and if he can go into a commentary that will go world wide then Lucas must have thought he was certified to say that.
The site also says he appeared to win, meaning it's not concrete.
Concession accepted.
The default rules says canon only unless otherwise specified. Lee gave his opinion and based off the evidence he's wrong.
No, it said he won and Yoda did not.
My point remains that Windu used his own abilities while Sidious used his and still lost.
Originally posted by quanchi112
He used his force powers to make combat impossible. Due to the right opening. Combat continued.The default rules says canon only unless otherwise specified. Lee gave his opinion and based off the evidence he's wrong.
No, it said he won and Yoda did not.
My point remains that Windu used his own abilities while Sidious used his and still lost.
No answer my question. Do you honestly believe that Maul with all his defenses up both force and lightsnaers that Sidious still couldn't ragdoll him?
This is an expanded universe forum. Expanded universe material is the default. Canon must be specified. Go back to the movie versus forum if that's your game. Lee gave the assessment of his character in is in a way correct. While he's not the best in terms of overall combative ability he actaully may have the best technical mastery and refinement than even Yoda or Sidious in those areas.
Again the site also says he appeared to win.
His own abilities that he can't call on to that level ever again not even if he fought Sidious again.
Originally posted by EmperorSidious2No.
No answer my question. Do you honestly believe that Maul with all his defenses up both force and lightsnaers that Sidious still couldn't ragdoll him?This is an expanded universe forum. Expanded universe material is the default. Canon must be specified. Go back to the movie versus forum if that's your game. Lee gave the assessment of his character in is in a way correct. While he's not the best in terms of overall combative ability he actaully may have the best technical mastery and refinement than even Yoda or Sidious in those areas.
Again the site also says he appeared to win.
His own abilities that he can't call on to that level ever again not even if he fought Sidious again.
Default rules are explained as canon unless otherwise stated.
This is what the site says. Mace Windu is one of the most important Jedi to ever live. He and Yoda clearly have a mutual respect, with both valuing the tenets and ideals of the Jedi Order over any personal matter (see their rejection of Anakin’s entrance into the Order in The Phantom Menace). An expert swordsman with a grim nature, Mace kills Jango Fett in the Battle of Geonosis and defeats Darth Sidious in combat (until Anakin arrives…) — something that not even Yoda could accomplish. His death in Revenge of the Sith is a tragic, point-of-no-return moment for Anakin and the saga, illustrating the weight he carried as a Jedi.
Says you but it's still his own abilities. He won as proven by Disney's site.
That's ludicrous. Sidious has far more power enough to overwhelm his opponents. Only the likes of Yoda Dooku and mace could block that with their force walls. Maul can't. Right timing doesn't necessarily play a roll in this as the opponent can have all of thier force defenses up, but a more powerful opponent can break through them.
Expanded universe forum. Canon would have to be speciffacly stated for this to be canon only.
I have seen that. I'm very impressed by that. However how about you post where it's says he APPEARED to win the fight showing its more than meets the eye? You can't ignore the other sides evidence just because it challenges what you believe.
The novelization pretty much shows it was a boost that he received due to the Sidious rage and his trust and love being destroyed, watching his brothers die over a war manipulated by the very person he sought to destroy, and the person leading the republic was the Sith. All of that fueled it and after that he was still only able to stalemate Sidious. So really no matter what nothing proves mace was a better deulist or,anything. Due to common sense and I believe psychology, mace wouldn't receive that same boost if he ever fought Sidious again since his own end of inner darkness would be less.