Cyborg Superman vs. Silver Surfer

Originally posted by darthgoober
Ok.

It’s a standard weakness of kryptonian physiology(including Supes, who is the basis of Henshaw’s). Has Henshaw ever shown a resistance to it?

Not quite. The Eradicator doesn't have that weakness at all, and Borg is millenia more advanced than him.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Didn’t DS transmute him? Can Henshaw transmute tech from pure energy or air? And has the fortress ever shown a resistance to transmutation?

DS and Parallax have been able to do it. SS is nowhere near either's class.

SS isn't near skyfather power.

Originally posted by darthgoober
No matter how much energy Quasar absorbs from Surfer, he’s always got more
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/2526/quasar5038mh0.jpg

Classic case of Quasar jobbing, considering Quasar can actually absorb more energy than Surfer...and didn't he lose that fight on purpose anyway?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Resist life force absorption
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/6508/silversurfervol200140ovxb3.jpg
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/2637/silversurfervol200142ovur0.jpg

This is more of a willpower issue than anything else. MANY characters have done this type of thing.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Resist power absorption from Rouge
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/6002/xmenunlimited1324roguerm2.jpg
http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/5911/xmenunlimited1326roguesq8.jpg

Magneto has done the same...and SS is not a mutant.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Overloads energy absorber
http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/8799/silversurferv306209ar3.jpg

Superman Blue has done this many times, and wasn't able to disrupt Borg.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Retains powers after Doombot "steals" them
http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/8125/silversurfervol3012yp3.jpg

Yet after this, his powers were stolen again by TECH, and he was beaten by Black Panther. Yes...SS gets his powers back eventually..IF he's still alive.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Breaks out of Quasar’s construct
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/3683/cosmicpowersunlimited05zg6.jpg

Plenty of characters have broken out of wendells constructs.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Shatters mystic force field that keeping Dr. Strange and the Defenders captive
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/7154/defenders00603mysticforwx9.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/4430/defenders00604mysticforrf6.jpg

Impressive, but he needed a head start (something he won't have in the fortress) and he wasn't being attacked. A small forcefield like what Dr Strange used that prevents the power cosmic from getting to him would be effective enough.

Originally posted by darthgoober
PLUS Surfer’s ability to phase…
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/1445/galactusthedevourer113ms9.jpg[/url]

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/3526/galactusthedevourer119xy5.jpg

http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/2893/galactusthedevourer206gh3.jpg

http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/9529/galactusthedevourer316kp0.jpg

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/6663/galactusthedevourer504qz8.jpg

http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/8774/homecoming06phasingyv9.jpg

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/3603/silversurfer199612310ue8.jpg

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/8205/ssenslavers43phasingwn5.jpg

He could simply make it so Surfer can't phase through the fortress.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y112/avalonofthewind/cyborgphase.jpg

Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer doesn’t breath…

Originally posted by darthgoober
Can travel to any dimension he’s been to
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/7988/thor44322zs5.jpg

IF he retains his powers...which doesn't happen in the zone......

Originally posted by darthgoober
Retains that ability in the Soul World(where most lose their powers) and escapes Soul World
http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/5941/silversurfer198800821esvf7.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/7686/silversurfer198800822eslx8.jpg

This is not the same as the phantom zone...for one...it's more of a will issue...almost dreamlike. In the zone, he won't have powers, he won't will them back on, and he will be a powerless wraith...period.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Brings Puppet Master back from the Astral Plane against the wishes of Mephisto…
http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/3465/silversurfer199713312fj9.jpg

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/9347/cabledeadpool102005street5.jpg
http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/3355/cabledeadpool102005streux2.jpg

[QUOTE=9469390]Originally posted by darthgoober
[B]Multiple energy blast…

Which can be absorbed, and won't do much in the 1st place.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Shuts down every machine on Earth
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/4130/silversurfer03p07globalcr0.jpg
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/3654/silversurfer03p08globalsa2.jpg

Henshaw learned how to do this before he even turned evil and left earth.

Reactivates the Earth’s machinery
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/9160/silversurfer03p16yy3.jpg[/B][/QUOTE]

Henshaw has become one with planets before.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Planet wide transmutation…
http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/5927/silversurferv3104p16li9.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/3162/silversurferv3104p19fd5.jpg
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/4633/silversurferv3104p20cv7.jpg
http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/1791/silversurferv3104p21do2.jpg

Impressive, but the Eradicator has done the same thing...and Henshaw is more advanced...and those are still lower beings.

He's also been able to manipulate what god's can't understand. Surfer can't touch that.

Originally posted by darthgoober
And they’ve all proven ineffective as well(as I just showed). So now prove that Henshaw’s falls under the “effective” category.

Cosidering Henshaw has absolute control of the complete environment, and more weapons attacking at more angles that Surfer can handle at once. It's still a needle in a haystack for Surfer.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Aren’t you wagering that Henshaw will be doing all that while Surfer’s taking similar steps? I’ve shown Surfer’s level of ability, so why don’t you show some of Henshaw’s?

I'm not wagering anything...you are.

Surfer will be busy trying to stay alive while being attacked from all angles. Not too much different than Neo fighting the dude on the train...his environment, his rules..Neo's powers (like Surfers) won't do him much good...especially being attacked from so many angles at once.

P.S. The OLD fortress had the Eradicator program running through it, which already had Surfers powerset. The NEW fortress as per up up and away is INFINITELY more advanced can properties used on it are absorbed. So if SS tries to use power cosmic on it... the crystals will be able to mimic that as well.

As programmable as they are...they also can't be transmuted, especially under borgs control...and the other tech that henshaw has can't be messed with by surfer either...unless you're ready to debate that SS can transmute GL rings, Motherboxes, and magical items.

and lastly, to do half of the stuff you're proclaiming...Surfer needs his board. Phantom zone or the source wall with no board? Boom tube into a black hole boardless? It's a wrap.

And I think this is enough...these posts are getting FAR too long.

SS vs Borg = Stalemate.

SS vs Borg with Kryptonian/OAN/Apokalyptan/Earth/Martian/Warworld/B13 tech plus magic artifacts curbstomps SS.

Not arguing, but the Surfer can instantly recreate his board without missing a beat.

Taking it away from him really doesn't make a bit of difference.

When they break it..he recreates it..for some reason when they take it away..he doesn't seem to do so.

And in the middle of a battle or already transported somewhere where he needs it and he's powerless...it's not likely to happen.

I'm done for tonight. Time for the more important things...wifey and some Metroid Prime 3. 🙂

Wow Avy you actually brought something resembling proof to the table I’m proud of you. Anyway…

Originally posted by Avlon
Not quite. The Eradicator doesn't have that weakness at all, and Borg is millenia more advanced than him.

Originally posted by Avlon
DS and Parallax have been able to do it. SS is nowhere near either's class.

[QUOTE=9471271]Originally posted by Avlon
[B]SS isn't near skyfather power.

Originally posted by Avlon

Originally posted by Avlon
Classic case of Quasar jobbing, considering Quasar can actually absorb more energy than Surfer...and didn't he lose that fight on purpose anyway?

Originally posted by Avlon
This is more of a willpower issue than anything else. MANY characters have done this type of thing.

Originally posted by Avlon
Magneto has done the same...and SS is not a mutant.

Originally posted by Avlon
Superman Blue has done this many times, and wasn't able to disrupt Borg.

Originally posted by Avlon
Yet after this, his powers were stolen again by TECH, and he was beaten by Black Panther. Yes...SS gets his powers back eventually..IF he's still alive.

Originally posted by Avlon
Plenty of characters have broken out of wendells constructs.

Originally posted by Avlon
Impressive, but he needed a head start (something he won't have in the fortress) and he wasn't being attacked. A small forcefield like what Dr Strange used that prevents the power cosmic from getting to him would be effective enough.

Originally posted by Avlon
He could simply make it so Surfer can't phase through the fortress.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y112/avalonofthewind/cyborgphase.jpg

Originally posted by Avlon

Originally posted by Avlon
IF he retains his powers...which doesn't happen in the zone......

Originally posted by Avlon
This is not the same as the phantom zone...for one...it's more of a will issue...almost dreamlike. In the zone, he won't have powers, he won't will them back on, and he will be a powerless wraith...period.

Originally posted by Avlon
Which can be absorbed, and won't do much in the 1st place.

Originally posted by Avlon
Henshaw learned how to do this before he even turned evil and left earth.

Originally posted by Avlon

Henshaw has become one with planets before.

Originally posted by Avlon
Impressive, but the Eradicator has done the same thing...and Henshaw is more advanced...and those are still lower beings.

Only instead of a plaque, he’ll convert it all to energy and then…
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/3950/fantasticfour4911matteruj2.jpg

Originally posted by Avlon
He's also been able to manipulate what god's can't understand. Surfer can't touch that.

Originally posted by Avlon

Cosidering Henshaw has absolute control of the complete environment, and more weapons attacking at more angles that Surfer can handle at once. It's still a needle in a haystack for Surfer.

Originally posted by Avlon

I'm not wagering anything...you are.

Surfer will be busy trying to stay alive while being attacked from all angles. Not too much different than Neo fighting the dude on the train...his environment, his rules..Neo's powers (like Surfers) won't do him much good...especially being attacked from so many angles at once.

Originally posted by Avlon

P.S. The OLD fortress had the Eradicator program running through it, which already had Surfers powerset. The NEW fortress as per up up and away is INFINITELY more advanced can properties used on it are absorbed. So if SS tries to use power cosmic on it... the crystals will be able to mimic that as well.

Originally posted by Avlon

As programmable as they are...they also can't be transmuted, especially under borgs control...and the other tech that henshaw has can't be messed with by surfer either...unless you're ready to debate that SS can transmute GL rings, Motherboxes, and magical items.

Originally posted by Avlon

and lastly, to do half of the stuff you're proclaiming...Surfer needs his board. Phantom zone or the source wall with no board? Boom tube into a black hole boardless? It's a wrap. .
[QUOTE=9471271]Originally posted by Avlon
[B]

Originally posted by Avlon

And I think this is enough...these posts are getting FAR too long.

SS vs Borg = Stalemate.

SS vs Borg with Kryptonian/OAN/Apokalyptan/Earth/Martian/Warworld/B13 tech plus magic artifacts curbstomps SS.

Just saying, goob, making the veiled attack at Avalon 'finally' posting some proof isn't needed.

Be civil, you two!

Originally posted by Soljer
Just saying, goob, making the veiled attack at Avalon 'finally' posting some proof isn't needed.

Be civil, you two!

Yeah, yeah. I'm not trying to reprimand you and not him.

And it's not like I have any authority to really reprimand.

I just like this debate, want to see it continue, and don't need to see it devolve into a flame war - even a veiled one.

🙂.

Originally posted by Soljer
Yeah, yeah. I'm not trying to reprimand you and not him.

And it's not like I have any authority to really reprimand.

I just like this debate, want to see it continue, and don't need to see it devolve into a flame war - even a veiled one.

🙂.

Much thanks, my friend.

Why do people keep bringing up Henshaw and the Source Wall. It wasn't like C. Supes actually overpowered the wall completely and utterly taking control of it. He managed to gain a little portion of movement and place to live and as he said the only reason he was allowed to do so was because he was being quiet.

Anytime the Source wanted to it could easily put Henshaw back into the wall and there wouldn't be anything he could do about it. So he was still a prisoner just one that could move.

Plus people keep trying to act like Surfer doesn't have any crazy high level feats against things. For instance Surfer manipulated energy that was sufficient to destroy two beings capable of beating Galactus. You know the Crunch basically the energies of the Big Bang. Let's see C. Supes do something like that.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Wow Avy you actually brought something resembling proof to the table I’m proud of you. Anyway…

Now we wait for you to validate your claims. I wish I had a borg respect thread I could just grab scans from. 😉

Originally posted by darthgoober
But unless I’m mistaken, Henshaw doesn’t base his organic components on Erads, he basis them on Supes who IS vulnerable to it. Your own scan later even says that he incorporates Supes DNA.

He can change his composition at will. It hasn't been shown to affect borg..and even if it did...Supes recently fought a sun eater who was using red sunlight just fine.

Originally posted by darthgoober
If the only two beings to try it were successful and he’s never shown a resistance to it remains a viable tactic whether or not he’s at their “level”.

So since Warlock transmuted Thanos...then Surfer can too? Surfer can transmute any herald he's fought?

Surfers skin is still a lot more vulnerable to Henshaw than the other way around.

Originally posted by darthgoober
That’s nice now show him creating matter from energy.

The recent GL issues. He was a head in space while the guardians spoke to him, and he was reforming his body.

Originally posted by darthgoober
MANY characters have resisted absorption from a sky father level being? How many can you name off the top of your head?

Superman, WW, GL, Etc. No matter how much trickery Mephisto uses, he can't actually just take SS soul...so that example is moot.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Mags did it by creating a skintight energy field so they weren’t ACTUALLY touching, she actually touched SS. And Thor’s not a mutant either, but Rogue still absorbed his powers.

In the AOA instance...he's resisted before without such a plot device being stated.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Did he actually try? Also, was it ever established that Blue Supes energy output was so great that it was capable of creating a Black Hole?

He's created wormholes to other galaxies. Superman has held black holes in his hand, survived them just fine (as has borg) and SS won't be making a black hole on earth. Try to stay somewhat in character. I know you want to have your boy have a chance...but seriously...

Originally posted by darthgoober
And IF they’re stolen in the first place, which(as I’ve just demonstrated) is a feat in and of itself.

It's happened a few times. He's vulnerable to it, and if it happens here, he will be destroyed. No PIS to keep him alive until his powers return.

Originally posted by darthgoober
And what’s the greatest force that Henshaw’s have withstood?

Black holes, the OE, the source wall, 200x amped gl blasts, and even now it's stated that only the anti monitor can kill him.

Originally posted by darthgoober
True on both counts, but then again Henshaw’s no Dr. Strange.

Magic isn't needed to block out cosmic rays. A quick and easy forcefield can do the job.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Is there a reason why Henshaw would start the fight with Surfer’s DNA incorporated in him? Because according to that scan that’s the only reason Henshaw was able to hold Supes.

Henshaw is bragging about how invulnerable Supes DNA is and how he can easily recreate it.

He simply made it so phasing through him is not possible...

And if a human scientist can recreate Surfers dna...Henshaw should have no problem at all.

Originally posted by darthgoober
So there’s what, one or two instances from 30 years ago that go against the entire rest of Surfer’s career? Yeah that’s valid…

Yes...let's just disregard everything that we don't like.

Originally posted by darthgoober
He’s retained his powers in other universes and dimensions(like Mephisto’s and the Soul World) so I don’t know why he wouldn’t since not EVERYONE that goes there loses their powers.

Surfer can't will his powers in the zone...AND there's no cosmic energy there even if he could.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Because EVERYONE that goes to the Phantom Zone loses their powers right?

There is a reason it's called the PHANTOM zone...and yes...everyone does lose their powers there. SBP changes time with his fists, so SS is in no way comparable.

Originally posted by darthgoober
I’m sure a blast that’s capable of creating a black hole as a side effect will do plenty.

So Surfer is going to destroy Earth to try and beat cyborg? Try again.
Not like a black hole will do anything to henshaw anyway.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Not saying he didn’t, just demonstrating Surfer’s counter measures.

Henshaws mastery over tech>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>surfer.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer’s blown up planets before…

Henshaw has stated the same.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Just showing the number of things he can simultaneously transmute. You’re acting like Surfer will have to transmute things as they’re thrown at him, but I’m talking about him transmuting them all out at once like he does with this house and all it‘s contents…
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/2637/silversurfer198700220vf5.jpg
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/7621/silversurfer198700221dn9.jpg

Only instead of a plaque, he’ll convert it all to energy and then…
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/3950/fantasticfour4911matteruj2.jpg

Still speculation considering you haven't shown that SS can do this to the various techs that I've mentioned.

And yes, Brainiac 13 was transmuting Earth, and the only thing that stopped it and was not able to be transmuted? The fortress.

Originally posted by darthgoober
What Gods are they talking about, and have they ever demonstrated Cosmic Awareness? Besides you're acting like Surfer has to understand the tech to manipulate it, which is simply not the case...
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/9470/silversurfer04103zy6.jpg

What gods are they talking about?

You're comparing a run of the mill PC to the source wall?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Again you’re assuming that Surfer transmutes them one at a time rather than transmute the lot of them all at once.

Again, you're assuming SS can do any of that over henshaws, or the fortresses natural design...considering all the weapons that I've mentioned. In less than the blink of an eye, SS can be in the phantom zone or embedded in the source wall.... See "Supernova" for what I'm talking about.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Except that he won’t be getting attacked from all angles because Surfer will transmute the fortress in one shot.

Speculation on your part. You still have to show valid proof on Surfers part being able to transmute the fortress...and since it's already been tried and failed. His chances grow slimmer and slimmer.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Show me it mimicking something like the Power Cosmic.

Show me Surfer transmuting kryptonian or Oan tech. See? We can play this silly game. If it's stated that the sunstone can do it... that's all that is needed.

Originally posted by darthgoober
He’s transmuted the Nega Bands with no problems.

Sounds like the negas need an upgrade.

Originally posted by darthgoober
He can summon his board from pretty much anywhere, and if all else fails he could create another. He was pissed at Warlock and wanted to go with Pip after that.

Agreed. IF he has access to his power...which he won't.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Show me the tech that’s actually available in the fortress as well as its resistance to transmutation and you may have a case.

The fortress itself. I already named a good example. The fortress was also immune to a plague from the 1M timeline.

Surfer for the win

Regarding Superman's DNA: Henshaw had access to the pod that brought Supes to earth. And from that, he was able to create his first cyborg body (with kryptonian DNA). And ever since, he can recreate bodies with Superman's DNA anytime he wants.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Regarding Superman's DNA: Henshaw had access to the pod that brought Supes to earth. And from that, he was able to create his first cyborg body (with kryptonian DNA). And ever since, he can recreate bodies with Superman's DNA anytime he wants.

👆 It's not just that either. Henshaws computerlike mind remembers everything from birth to present in perfect clarity. Events, tech, and anything he's encountered is stored in perfect detail...and can be recreated as needed.

Originally posted by Avlon
👆 It's not just that either. Henshaws computerlike mind remembers everything from birth to present in perfect clarity. Events, tech, and anything he's encountered is stored in perfect detail...and can be recreated as needed.

So we got strongest DC cyberpath with database full of handy stuff in the surrounding of advanced tech.
Surfer can't just transmutate anything with a fingerclick (at least not a thing as advanced as Fortress of Solitude, he can do that with less advanced things without any effort). Transmutation needs concentration, especially if it's high level one...
And Henshaw won't be just standing there and watching the show. So Surfer probably won't have an opportunity to concentrate on such an advanced transmutation- he'll get his ass kicked in the process.

Originally posted by starlock
Surfer for the win

Care to explain why?

You complain about speedblitz unrealistical overuse but go the same road with transmutation, it seems.

Originally posted by Avlon
Now we wait for you to validate your claims. I wish I had a borg respect thread I could just grab scans from. 😉

Originally posted by Avlon
He can change his composition at will. It hasn't been shown to affect borg..and even if it did...Supes recently fought a sun eater who was using red sunlight just fine.

Originally posted by Avlon
So since Warlock transmuted Thanos...then Surfer can too? Surfer can transmute any herald he's fought?

Originally posted by Avlon
Surfers skin is still a lot more vulnerable to Henshaw than the other way around.

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/8415/silversurferv3139p06aa2.jpg

Originally posted by Avlon
The recent GL issues. He was a head in space while the guardians spoke to him, and he was reforming his body.

Originally posted by Avlon
Superman, WW, GL, Etc. No matter how much trickery Mephisto uses, he can't actually just take SS soul...so that example is moot.

Originally posted by Avlon
In the AOA instance...he's resisted before without such a plot device being stated.

Originally posted by Avlon
He's created wormholes to other galaxies. Superman has held black holes in his hand, survived them just fine (as has borg) and SS won't be making a black hole on earth. Try to stay somewhat in character. I know you want to have your boy have a chance...but seriously...

And I’m not saying that Surfer will create a black hole that will suck up the Earth(though I wouldn’t put it past him to create a small one now that his conscience is gone) I’m saying that his energy output is great enough TO create a black hole, which means that unless Blue Supes ever demonstrated that level of output, his inability to overload Henshaw doesn’t really mean anything. That is of course assuming that Supes even tried, which you never answered.

Originally posted by Avlon
It's happened a few times. He's vulnerable to it, and if it happens here, he will be destroyed. No PIS to keep him alive until his powers

Originally posted by Avlon
Black holes, the OE, the source wall, 200x amped gl blasts, and even now it's stated that only the anti monitor can kill him.

Originally posted by Avlon
Magic isn't needed to block out cosmic rays. A quick and easy forcefield can do the job.

Originally posted by Avlon

Henshaw is bragging about how invulnerable Supes DNA is and how he can easily recreate it.

He simply made it so phasing through him is not possible...

And if a human scientist can recreate Surfers dna...Henshaw should have no problem at all.

And it makes a lot more sense for a human scientist to reproduce Surfer’s DNA given sufficient prep than it does for Henshaw to just HAPPEN to have it lying around.

Originally posted by Avlon
Yes...let's just disregard everything that we don't like.

Originally posted by Avlon

Surfer can't will his powers in the zone...AND there's no cosmic energy there even if he could.

Cont. on next post...

Originally posted by Avlon

There is a reason it's called the PHANTOM zone...and yes...everyone does lose their powers there. SBP changes time with his fists, so SS is in no way comparable.

Surfer looks into the past
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/6102/fantfour26107hs3.jpg

More of the same
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/2984/silversurferv3138p06wx2.jpg

Travels to the past
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/480/fm198000606ed7.jpg
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/5622/fm198000607wt9.jpg

Travels from the past to the present
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/7909/silversurfer199713119ui8.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/9039/silversurfer199713120fw1.jpg
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/8928/silversurfer199713121ja1.jpg
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/9526/silversurfer199713122tf3.jpg

BFR’s Durok into the far future
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/2946/thor19327zt8.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/9743/thor19328hv7.jpg

Surfer rides the “Cosmic Swell”, which is some kind of rift in the fabric of time and space
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/3846/silversurfer199611205yh6.jpg
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/7621/silversurfer199611206ri8.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/757/silversurfer199611207tv9.jpg
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2481/silversurfer199611208zu9.jpg
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/1231/silversurfer199611209up9.jpg
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/3843/silversurfer199611210ll1.jpg
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/5879/silversurfer199611211dz2.jpg

Warps time and space to send a woman home
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/6481/silversurferv3minus1p23sj7.jpg

Uses spatial energy to create a “Floating Cosmic Limbo”
http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/3371/silversurfer0223xl0.jpg

Uses cosmic energy to bend space
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/3701/galactusthedevourer215sli0.jpg

Originally posted by Avlon

So Surfer is going to destroy Earth to try and beat cyborg? Try again.
Not like a black hole will do anything to henshaw anyway.

Originally posted by Avlon

Henshaws mastery over tech>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>surfer.

Originally posted by Avlon

Henshaw has stated the same.

Originally posted by Avlon

Still speculation considering you haven't shown that SS can do this to the various techs that I've mentioned.

And yes, Brainiac 13 was transmuting Earth, and the only thing that stopped it and was not able to be transmuted? The fortress.

Originally posted by Avlon

What gods are they talking about?

You're comparing a run of the mill PC to the source wall?

And I didn’t compare anything, I just demonstrated that Surfer’s ability to manipulate tech isn’t hampered by his own personal knowledge of it because you kept going on about how “advanced“ Henshaw‘s tech is.

Originally posted by Avlon

Again, you're assuming SS can do any of that over henshaws, or the fortresses natural design...considering all the weapons that I've mentioned. In less than the blink of an eye, SS can be in the phantom zone or embedded in the source wall.... See "Supernova" for what I'm talking about.

Originally posted by Avlon

Speculation on your part. You still have to show valid proof on Surfers part being able to transmute the fortress...and since it's already been tried and failed. His chances grow slimmer and slimmer.

Originally posted by Avlon

Show me Surfer transmuting kryptonian or Oan tech. See? We can play this silly game. If it's stated that the sunstone can do it... that's all that is needed.

And even though he’s never manipulated Oan tech, he HAS manipulated Oan Energy(though again its non canon)…
http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/8051/glssua0046ox1.jpg
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/4622/glssua0047bu0.jpg
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/3004/glssua0048ik1.jpg

And now that I think about it, there IS a canon instance of Oan tech being manipulated by a Marvel character. The instance of course is when Captain Marvel was able to drain the power from Kyle‘s ring.

Originally posted by Avlon

Sounds like the negas need an upgrade.

Originally posted by Avlon

Agreed. IF he has access to his power...which he won't.

Originally posted by Avlon

The fortress itself. I already named a good example. The fortress was also immune to a plague from the 1M timeline.

Come on Goober. Stop trying to use SBP to justify Surfer getting out of the PZ. srsly SBP PUNCHED his way out of the Phantom Zone, he retconed history, he got out of the speed force. He had pre-crisis level wackiness, Surfer doesn't. 😛

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Come on Goober. Stop trying to use SBP to justify Surfer getting out of the PZ. srsly SBP [b]PUNCHED his way out of the Phantom Zone, he retconed history, he got out of the speed force. He had pre-crisis level wackiness, Surfer doesn't. 😛 [/B]