Omnipotence,Omniscience,Omnipresence

Started by Creshosk9 pages
Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by Supermanluv
Your resorting to twisting my words, how childish !
How was I twisting your words if you said those two statements? Hell I even cropped it to you stating those two exact statements.

"your failing miserably."
and
"I agree with you."

😐

Originally posted by Supermanluv
You know very well the two statements where made in a different context, don't suggest otherwise !
And yet you put them right next to each other...

Originally posted by Supermanluv
Statement 1.:

You are taking the piss now, for no reason please stop !

Actually the part of the statment inquestion is

"Because your{sic} failing miserably."

Not the fact that I was getting on your case about a mistake you made.

Originally posted by Supermanluv
Statemenet 2:

I was agreeing with you in the first place, so why take the piss !

Because my bladder was full? ermm

Originally posted by Supermanluv
Don't start having a go at my inability to comphrehend what you are writing, becasue it would take a ****ing KMC enigma code to try and translate some of the stuff you have posted on the last couple of pages !
I understood him perfectly. You'll note how I avoided this sort of "go" with him over a misunderstanding that I noticed.

Supermanluv Restricted

Originally posted by Newjak
Really because I had three people understand it perfectly

Digi did, Cresh did, and willrules did. Apparently you were the only one not getting it. Why do you think that I kept replying to it as the Paradox of the Rock. Oddly enough because that is what it is called. I think I even put Paradox in quotations in you actually take the time to read it.

So I guess maybe we should get you a Decoder so you can read big boy talk and just so you don't get mad that was a joke 😬

So they All believe the Rock paradox doesn't exist and has therefore resolved itself because it has two equally resolvable outcomes that contradict one another ?

Some how I doubt it. Do you even understand the word paradox ?

Have you not heard of the 'Chicken and the Egg' before?

Guess what that has two equally valid explanaitions that contradict one another, doesn't mean Digi, Will Rules and Cresh dont think that the paradox DOESN't exists. Your the only one who does !

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by Supermanluv
You still don't get it do you ?

All paradoxs have two exactly viable outcomes, thats why their frigin paradoxes in the first place ! This Rock scenario isn't unique, and its doesn't prevent it from existing !

Then I'm affraid I'm going to have to call what I see, and that calling the rock scenerioa paradox is a fallacy.

I'll even do one better for you than you are for Newjak and tell you which one.

"False dilemma"

A situation in which only two options are given where a third option is omitted.

Newjak I am Beyond Power

Originally posted by Supermanluv
So they All believe the Rock paradox doesn't exist and has therefore resolved itself because it has two equally resolvable outcomes that contradict one another ?

Some how I doubt it. Do you even understand the word paradox ?

Have you not heard of the 'Chicken and the Egg' before?

Guess what that has two equally valid explanaitions that contradict one another, doesn't mean Digi, Will Rules and Cresh dont think that the paradox DOESN't exists. Your the only one who does !

I wasn't saying what their beliefs were just that they actually understood what was being said unlike you who apparently isn't?

And as you said the chicken and the egg have two viable outcomes because guess what there are not an infinite amount of possibilities or intervals going on. 😬

Air Legend Moderat0r

What the **** guys. God can create a rock so heavy that not even he can lift.

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by Supermanluv
So they All believe the Rock paradox doesn't exist and has therefore resolved itself because it has two equally resolvable outcomes that contradict one another ?

Some how I doubt it. Do you even understand the word paradox ?

Have you not heard of the 'Chicken and the Egg' before?

Guess what that has two equally valid explanaitions that contradict one another, doesn't mean Digi, Will Rules and Cresh dont think that the paradox DOESN't exists. Your the only one who does !

The egg came before the chicken. Even if we exclude the idea of dinosaur eggs being viable options that existed long before chickens did, the chicken evolved from the red jungle fowl which was also a bird.

The first chicken was born from an egg laid by a red jungle fowl.

Though I suppose it could be subjective depending on how an individual defines what a chicken egg is.

If "An egg that a chicken is hatched from." the egg came first.
If "An egg that a chicken lays" then its the chicken.

But once again, its a matter of semantics and thus limited by the way a person defines an event, rather than the event itself.

Gecko4lif Senior Member

Omnipotence - I would do horrible and twisted things with this. It is better for everybody if i dont have it.

omniscience - Would be useful but my brain would exsplode

omnipresence- I would want this the most so i could be like my hero KC flash or the shrike

SnazzySmurph tu quoqumber

Originally posted by Newjak
How can you postpone a Paradox either it is taking place or it isn't no in between. If the Paradox isn't happening at that time or any subsequent encounter since it keeps going the Paradox can never take place.
Correct, but even if it's imbossible to live to that point in time where the rock will be created that God cannot lift, it doesn't dissolve the possibility.

Even if the limit is imbossible to reach, the limit still exists, and the paradox is still a possibility.

It means that the paradox will never take place, but only due to immeasurable time constraints... besides that, an omnipotent would be granted omniscience, and would therefore know exactly when this failure could occure, thus negating the need for an experiment in the first place... so, could God create this rock?

Air Legend Moderat0r

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
so, could God create this rock?

Yes there are many ways God can create this rock. One way is he can create a duplicate of himself, one of them not capable of lifting the rock, and therefore be able to satisfy both states simultaneously. The definition of omnipotence people are going by is being able to do anything right? So if God can do anything he can take away his omnipotence can he not? Therefore he can create that rock.
However this is all inconsequential because the word omnipotent is not found in the Bible. God has been reffered to as the Almighty but not as "omnipotent". God cannot do everything; for example he cannot sin or lie, it is against His nature.

Also, nonsense is nonsense even when talking about God. Just because you put the word "God" in front of the question doesn't make it logical, it will still be nonsense. Can God exist and not exist at the same time? Stupid question huh, but it makes the point that nonsense is still nonsense even when talking about God.

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
Correct, but even if it's imbossible to live to that point in time where the rock will be created that God cannot lift, it doesn't dissolve the possibility.

Even if the limit is imbossible to reach, the limit still exists, and the paradox is still a possibility.

It means that the paradox will never take place, but only due to immeasurable time constraints... besides that, an omnipotent would be granted omniscience, and would therefore know exactly when this failure could occure, thus negating the need for an experiment in the first place... so, could God create this rock?

Being omnipotent doesn't automatically give you omniscience.

Though Omniscience is another fun little semantic device.

Someone who's omniscient would know how to solve every paradox. thus negating them.

Newjak I am Beyond Power

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
Correct, but even if it's imbossible to live to that point in time where the rock will be created that God cannot lift, it doesn't dissolve the possibility.

Even if the limit is imbossible to reach, the limit still exists, and the paradox is still a possibility.

It means that the paradox will never take place, but only due to immeasurable time constraints... besides that, an omnipotent would be granted omniscience, and would therefore know exactly when this failure could occure, thus negating the need for an experiment in the first place... so, could God create this rock?

The problem is that God will never reach an ending point to determine. That is the point. With Infinity no Limit does exist thus a Limit can not be placed which is what the Paradox needs for it to work a measurable, limited outcome.

SnazzySmurph tu quoqumber

Originally posted by Newjak
The problem is that God will never reach an ending point to determine. That is the point. With Infinity no Limit does exist thus a Limit can not be placed which is what the Paradox needs for it to work a measurable, limited outcome.
If he's omniscient, he'll already know the ending point.

He can skip the in between, and create the rock that he cannot lift with the almighty, incomprehensible equivalent of a snap of his fingers.

Correct?

There is no need for it to take an eternity... that really avoids the question anyhow. The question is about the potential to do so.

In any case, the only correct response to these questions is a solid defense of "Omnipotence is ineffable. I win."

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
If he's omniscient, he'll already know the ending point.

He can skip the in between, and create the rock that he cannot lift with the almighty, incomprehensible equivalent of a snap of his fingers.

Correct?

Did you see my solution to this "paradox"?

SnazzySmurph tu quoqumber

Originally posted by Creshosk
Did you see my solution to this "paradox"?
Yes, but that requires a base human POV. It still doesn't eliminate the potential to do so...

It's Ineffable.

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
Yes, but that requires a base human POV. It still doesn't eliminate the potential to do so...

It's Ineffable.

So you're saying that its possible for him to be unable to do something we define based on things other than the way we define them?

SnazzySmurph tu quoqumber

Originally posted by Creshosk
So you're saying that its possible for him to be unable to do something we define based on things other than the way we define them?
Not neccessarily.

I'm saying simply eliminating the physical nature of the task doesn't eliminate the potential.

It's ineffable, I tell you.

Supermanluv Restricted
Originally posted by Newjak
The problem is that God will never reach an ending point to determine. That is the point. With Infinity no Limit does exist thus a Limit can not be placed which is what the Paradox needs for it to work a measurable, limited outcome.

And yet with his limitless powers he can place a limit on infinity !

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
Not neccessarily.

I'm saying simply eliminating the physical nature of the task doesn't eliminate the potential.

It's ineffable, I tell you.

So you can create and be unable to lift a rock without "creating" a "rock" or attempting to "lift" it?

Supermanluv Restricted

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph

It's Ineffable.

Exactly !

Suggesting its resolved by placing human terms such as Infinity into the mix, is a fallucy becasue these terms break down and contradict themselves when up against the power of Omnipotence !

Newjak I am Beyond Power

Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
If he's omniscient, he'll already know the ending point.

He can skip the in between, and create the rock that he cannot lift with the almighty, incomprehensible equivalent of a snap of his fingers.

Correct?

There is no need for it to take an eternity... that really avoids the question anyhow. The question is about the potential to do so.

In any case, the only correct response to these questions is a solid defense of "Omnipotence is ineffable. I win."

Except once again there is no ending. there is no final rock all he can do is just keep making a rock that is bigger and bigger thus where does the experiment end? Where is the question solved? How do we represent the data?

All things that can not be done when talking about Infinite.