Silver Surfer (Exiles) vs Superman Prime

Originally posted by llagrok
He married Manta.....

But apart from that looks exactly like Gladiator. Talks and behaves like Gladiator. Can fly through outer space and is most likely capable of interstellar travel and implied that his power is connected to his confidence. Is head of The Imperial guard

...but because he married Manta all that goes out of the window.....brilliant.

Hell its not even out of characters for Glads to marry manta. Shes a mmber of the imperial guard and so is he, the fight together and they fell in love..big deal.

Originally posted by Kutulu
Oh and thanks for reminding me earlier about the Exiles showing Maestro's war room, I went back and re-read those issues. I saw: Thor's hammer, Surfer's Surfboard (with a big hole in it 😂 ), Dr. Octopus' adamantium arm (ripped off of course), and some other cool stuff.

I'm going to look for a good image host tonight to try and post up the scans.

Originally posted by llagrok
According to Kutulu's logic, King Hyperion should be able to beat the Hulk, Thor and all the heroes on earth...

So, with both of them having a tough time with King Hyperion, YES. He would probably be able to take out Hulk and Thor.

Who knows what else was involved in KH's past. Why he got so powerful. How he was able to beat all the heroes AND Galactus.

But, you can't just write him off.

Originally posted by Rewmac
Nope I read one part of it, and since the post isn't worthy of cutting it I just answered to specific part. But again why am I explaining myself to you...Guess I don't have to. You go by a logic which full of crap, you see facts and the way you want.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Thor killed Hulk in a What-If. No different powers were shown between the two. And Thor did it with raw strength.

Wolverine also killed Hulk in a What-If.

Let me sum up and clarify what I am saying, to lessen the confusion here:

* Exiles have interacted with characters from MU-616. X-men Die by the Sword is one instance. This makes them canon.

* The way Exiles is written is such that a character generally remains as they are, unless specified otherwise by the writer. So for example, Silver Surfer written as ruthless, and Galactus giving life. Those are instances of characters being far different than their 616 counterparts. Those characters you can logically make an argument that they act different in battle and have different powersets, etc..

In the instance of Thunderbird punching a hole in Galactus' armor, causing Galactus to retreat, the writer made extra attempts to illustrate that this version of Galactus was for most purposes as powerful as his 616 counterpart. So logically you could conclude that if that specific version of Thunderbird were to come to MU-616 and try and fight off Galactus, he would stand a very high probability of piercing Galactus' armor in a similar fashion.

In the instance of Gladiator, he looked exactly the same and acted exactly the same as his his 616 counterpart as far as his powers go. So if that instance of Gladiator was to fight 616's Gladiator, then most likely they would stalemate.

Originally posted by Alfheim
But apart from that looks exactly like Gladiator. Talks and behaves like Gladiator. Can fly through outer space and is most likely capable of interstellar travel and implied that his power is connected to his confidence. Is head of The Imperial guard

...but because he married Manta all that goes out of the window.....brilliant.

Hell its not even out of characters for Glads to marry manta. Shes a mmber of the imperial guard and so is he, the fight together and they fell in love..big deal.

That Exiles Silver Surfer also had no feats.

And also the fact that 616 Silver Surfer has many feats better than Exiles SS even the implied ones like destroying Earth.

Originally posted by Newjak
No what sends him out the window is that he has no feats.

I disagree, but as I was saying earlier he most likely has the same powerset as 616 Glads. It not certain but I think that is the most logical conclusion.

Originally posted by Newjak
No what sends him out the window is that he has no feats.

That Exiles Silver Surfer also had no feats.

And also the fact that 616 Silver Surfer has many feats better than Exiles SS even the implied ones like destroying Earth.

Feats is not the only thing that makes a character. This circles back to the point I was making earlier - the writer is essentially using the feats of the 616 counterpart when using an alternate version of a character, by illustrating the character to be close to the 616 character as possible.

If you only went by feats, then it would greatly lengthen the time of each comic, and the Exiles would have to have 1000 issues just to have the same storline they have now, just to go over character's feats in each universe. That takes away from the storyline and makes it boring. Nobody is going to buy a comic that only shows feats for 5 issues or what-not to establish that they have the same exact powers as their 616 counterpart.

Originally posted by Kutulu
Let me sum up and clarify what I am saying, to lessen the confusion here:

* Exiles have interacted with characters from MU-616. X-men Die by the Sword is one instance. This makes them canon.

* The way Exiles is written is such that a character generally remains as they are, unless specified otherwise by the writer. So for example, Silver Surfer written as ruthless, and Galactus giving life. Those are instances of characters being far different than their 616 counterparts. Those characters you can logically make an argument that they act different in battle and have different powersets, etc..

In the instance of Thunderbird punching a hole in Galactus' armor, causing Galactus to retreat, the writer made extra attempts to illustrate that this version of Galactus was for most purposes as powerful as his 616 counterpart. So logically you could conclude that if that specific version of Thunderbird were to come to MU-616 and try and fight off Galactus, he would stand a very high probability of piercing Galactus' armor in a similar fashion.

In the instance of Gladiator, he looked exactly the same and acted exactly the same as his his 616 counterpart as far as his powers go. So if that instance of Gladiator was to fight 616's Gladiator, then most likely they would stalemate.

Yes Exiles is in some fashion cannon.

But unless you have the feats to back it up you can not try and imply just because they look similar they are similar.

I'll even use your example of Galactus.

Galactus armor was broken by a shot from T-Bird when he was supposedly well fed. 616 Thor has hit Galactus with his Hammer yet has never been shown to crack Galactus' armor. Unless you are going to try and say T-Bird is stronger than 616 Thor.

Face it you need feats to start to make large assumptions like that.

All we really know is that Glads looked like his 616 Counterpart not that he was as strong as his 616 counterpart. Why because he has no feats. No if we saw him actually do something like destroy a planet then yes I would say he in the same range as Glads but he never did.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Thor killed Hulk in a What-If. No different powers were shown between the two. And Thor did it with raw strength.

Wolverine also killed Hulk in a What-If.

What fun would it be to read a comic if that stuff never happened to your favorite character? It would suck.

Originally posted by Kutulu
What-If's are not canon, last time I checked. The Exiles are different than the What-If storylines, as they have actually had crossovers which put them in continuity with marvel-616.

What-If's for all intensive purposes could be taking place in an entirely different multiverse.

Originally posted by Newjak

All we really know is that Glads looked like his 616 Counterpart not that he was as strong as his 616 counterpart. Why because he has no feats. No if we saw him actually do something like destroy a planet then yes I would say he in the same range as Glads but he never did.

Yes were aware of that but because of his appearance, behaviour and his role (head of the imperial guard), the most liekly conclusion is that the storywriter is implying that he has the same powerset as the 616 version.

Of course feats clarify that more clearly but if thats all we have to go on im voting exiles glads is the same as 616.

Originally posted by Kutulu
Feats is not the only thing that makes a character. This circles back to the point I was making earlier - the writer is essentially using the feats of the 616 counterpart when using an alternate version of a character, by illustrating the character to be close to the 616 character as possible.

If you only went by feats, then it would greatly lengthen the time of each comic, and the Exiles would have to have 1000 issues just to have the same storline they have now, just to go over character's feats in each universe. That takes away from the storyline and makes it boring. Nobody is going to buy a comic that only shows feats for 5 issues or what-not to establish that they have the same exact powers as their 616 counterpart.

Exiles Silver Surfer would do the same thing to 616 Glads that he did to his version.

No you can not say that because besides look their is no factual basis on which to say they are the same person. In fact they are not the same person.

Once again you've got to have actual feats before you start to make comparisons like that. And no you don't have to go Feat crazy with someone to give them good feats or accountable feats. Just look at Exiles Hyperion. Limited appearances but enough feats to make conclusions not based on beating Alternate Reality people.

Originally posted by Newjak
And you see none of that matters.

Yes Exiles is in some fashion cannon.

But unless you have the feats to back it up you can not try and imply just because they look similar they are similar.

I'll even use your example of Galactus.

Galactus armor was broken by a shot from T-Bird when he was supposedly well fed. 616 Thor has hit Galactus with his Hammer yet has never been shown to crack Galactus' armor. Unless you are going to try and say T-Bird is stronger than 616 Thor.

Face it you need feats to start to make large assumptions like that.

All we really know is that Glads looked like his 616 Counterpart not that he was as strong as his 616 counterpart. Why because he has no feats. No if we saw him actually do something like destroy a planet then yes I would say he in the same range as Glads but he never did.

That version of Thunderbird did have a stronger hand to hand attack than Thor's hammer. It's on-panel, if you take the time to read the story you would see just how powerful they made him. That attack also came close to killing him from the backlash of energy that Galactus emitted from the breach in his armor.

only read a couple of pages so far and most of you are absolute idiots. surfer would get destroyed. he stood and told that golden sabretooth that he never knew how to use the power and that he was just a savage brute. sabretooth smiled, ripped his chest open and said.... sometimes thats just enough

no fancy comics just savage brute power. and if done it..... you better recognize that prime will. he's take them both out together thats what this thread should be about

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Prime has surfer beat in speed,strength and durability. Surfer can chanel as many energies as he wishes but it wont do a damn thing to prime who was able to withstand a guardian suicide explosion at point blank range. Prime takes this 10/10.

Superman Prime with relative ease.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes were aware of that but because of his appearance, behaviour and his role (head of the imperial guard), the most liekly conclusion is that the storywriter is implying that he has the same powerset as the 616 version.

Of course feats clarify that more clearly but if thats all we have to go on im voting exiles glads is the same as 616.

Why because that writer isn't writing 616 Glads he is writing an alternate version. Anything he may imply has no bearing on the 616 version, or vice-versa. Or let me put it this way. 616 Glads will constantly be getting feats does that mean the alternate reality version would also get those future feats?

No it doesn't because they aren't the same person or written by the same person.

Or let me phrase this another way for you.

If the alternate reality version of Glads say lifted the Universe would you say 616 Glads could also lift a Universe?

Originally posted by Alfheim
I disagree, but as I was saying earlier he most likely has the same powerset as 616 Glads. It not certain but I think that is the most logical conclusion.

Originally posted by Kutulu
That version of Thunderbird did have a stronger hand to hand attack than Thor's hammer. It's on-panel, if you take the time to read the story you would see just how powerful they made him. That attack also came close to killing him from the backlash of energy that Galactus emitted from the breach in his armor.

Or that he can hit harder than 616 Thor. The same Thor that cracked a celestial's armor?

And the only evidence that you would be willing to except is that T-Bird broke through an Alternate Reality Galactus' armor?

think the word you're looking for is immortal, unless you really do see "hulk fanboys" everywhere (and pretty soon "Reds under the beds" 🙂).

Hulk does rise from the dead though, so perhaps not conventionally immortal but still, functionally not very different.

anyway, back to Exiles Surfer. He seemed to have the same blummin' powers, rode around on a surfboard, fired blasts, used the Power Cosmic - explicitly made mention of it - and did pretty much normal Surfer things, aside from killing superheroes left right and center.

it's the ruthless martial mind and battle-ready, aggressive personality that really are the visible indications that Exiles SS is different from regular Surfer.

and because the PC can be used to amp and enhance Surfer's abilities to an unknown extent, and because Exiles looked like he was wearing some form of cosmic armour, I think it's fair to say that Exiles SS was somewhat more powerful than regular SS. also the size and potency of his regular blasts seemed greater.

I want to know why it would not be feasible for Surfer to just alter SMP's dna or cellular structure (by introducing a cancer for example) such that the solar energies can no longer be stored in them?

Originally posted by Newjak
Listen it doesn't matter how much a writer implies the similarities between two alternate reality versions. The fact remains they are not the same person and one has feats the other doesn't.

Why because that writer isn't writing 616 Glads he is writing an alternate version. Anything he may imply has no bearing on the 616 version, or vice-versa. Or let me put it this way. 616 Glads will constantly be getting feats does that mean the alternate reality version would also get those future feats?

No it doesn't because they aren't the same person or written by the same person.

Or let me phrase this another way for you.

If the alternate reality version of Glads say lifted the Universe would you say 616 Glads could also lift a Universe?

Once again you are circling back to the initial point of contention in the discussion.

What you ask for can simply not be done without having the comic turn to garbage. Mr. Master himself posted a pretty thorough explanation on how the alternate universes within the multiverse containing MU-616 work. They are basically ripples outwards from what happens in MU-616 for the most part, with minor changes in some, and major changes in others. This is on-panel, and it's why if MU-616 falls, so does the rest of the universes in a cataclysmic chain reaction of events.

If any writer wrote a comic in the way that you suggest they would have to in order for a non-616 character to have any power (by having on-panel feats), he would literally have to write anywhere from a few to a several hundred comics going over the history of each character one by one that would appear in an issue or two of the main storyline.

It makes it a lot simpler for the writer, and the reader, if they can simply say "look, here's a version of Wolverine, except that he has just left the lab from weapon-X". You know from them saying that and / or showing that, that he has all of Wolverine's attributes. An example is they literally had a vast quantity of alternate versions of Wolverines in one of the Exiles books, and all of them had claws, all of them could regenerate, etc.. The only differences were with their physical appearance, attitudes, and history, but all of their powers were the same.