Ultimate Cap vs 616 Spider-Man

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Since the only time a single person has said 10-15 ton strength was me in my previous two posts on this page... and not a single person has quoted me... or even referenced that... pretending that you can't see my posts is pretty lame.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Dude, if you want to pretend like you're completely ignoring me, that's fine. But it's painfully obvious you're choosing the option that allows you to look at my posts individually. Get a life, please. This is worse than trolling.

I have a life thank you for your concern.

The whole board sees your logic for what it is.

Rivals Spiderman strength. Yeah......sure. 😮‍💨

I was mimicking your bias with the Daredevil comment. It still stands that a normal human's strength was sufficient to knock out Spiderman. But I'm sure you'll try to explain it as if Spiderman's strength and durability was sucked away by his mind being out of whack.

Spiderman's strength is not vastly superior to Ult. Cap's. What's wrong with a statement like that? 10-15 vs 20-25? I've never once stated that Ult. Cap was stronger than 616 Spidey. He is superior in strength from what we've seen. And you've shown scans that show he is superior. But vastly superior? As in... Ult. Cap would never stand a chance against 616 Spidey's strength? No. You've never proved it. And from the very beginning, that's what I've been asking for. Reread every single one of my posts if you have to. We've gone over ad nauseam about how Ult. Cap has fought foes stronger than 616 Spidey. 616 Spidey's level of strength is not going to overwhelm Ult. Cap. Heck, it doesn't even overwhelm weaker foes.

Rolling with the blow means that you move your head or body along with the momentum of whatever is hitting you. That presupposes you can move your head or body in the direction the blow's force is taking you. Iron Man punches Cap in the face in 'Civil War.' There's obviously space where his head can move. In the Ult. Abom double-fist piledriver, there's nowhere for Ult. Cap's body to go. He gets pummeled straight into the ground. What don't you get?

You said I haven't shown any Spidey strength feats. And you would be wrong.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
You think U.Cap's strength feats are comparable to Spiderman is even laughable at best.

Show me U.Cap doing something like this.

http://img61.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spideyliftstrain15mmhi5.jpg

Or knocking something over thats insanely "heavy" with just a "flick" of his finger.
http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/Amazing_Spider-Man_32-03.jpg

To throwing a jeep towards the top of a building.

http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jeepxm7.jpg

All you have for lifting on U.Cap is a tree and some weights and lets face it. Those pale before Spiderman strength feats.

Spiderman has lifted even Tanks completely off the ground.

But........but........the tree. LOL

Originally posted by Battlehammer
I can’t see them unless I choices to, which I never do ecpt on this one page, becauses I wanted to know who was the one thinkg ultimate capt is spidermans level of strength which is retarded.

Wait I can ignore them completely? I never new I had the option of getting rid of the click here. Dam how do you do that, becuases I have been wanting to for a while. Tp tell you the truth I don’t even know how to unblock lol.

I have a life thank you for your concern.

Do me a favor. If you're reading this post. Make it the absolute last post you ever read of mine. Your original intention was on the mark, troll.

Spiderman lifts a subway train.

Shot at 2008-06-09

The fact that you still think U.Cap rivals Spiderman is ludicrous.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
You said I haven't shown any Spidey strength feats. And you would be wrong.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Dude. You said you were ignoring me and couldn't see my posts and I shouldn't respond to yours since you can't see them.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Now you're choosing to see some of my posts and are actively responding to mine. That's called trolling. I can't imagine a worse kind of trolling where you lead everyone to believe you're completely ignoring me and have no care in what I say, then you go ahead and look at one of my posts, respond to it in a ridiculing manner, then try to cover up that you read it by saying you can't read my response, then finally admitting to it. You have a life, and your behavior just now is quite indicative of how awesome that life must be.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Do me a favor. If you're reading this post. Make it the absolute last post you ever read of mine. Your original intention was on the mark, troll.

lol and what I am doing can not be consider trolling and if you think it does warn me and I bet not a dam thing will happen to me.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
10-15 vs 20-25? I'd say that rivals. Spiderman's strength is not vastly superior to Ult. Cap's. If 616 Spidey was say... class 40-50, I'd say that was vastly superior. But finally! Spiderman scans. Do you want me to accept that scan as it's depicted or shall I spout off some bias like, "No. He only supports it! It's not that heavy! That's a bs high-end feat! I've seen Spidey struggle with less! Spidey gets knocked out by Daredevil! Lololololololololol!!!!111" It's wonderful to see that you can easily and completely endorse that Spiderman can lift the Daily Bugle building, but you completely disbelieve that Ult. Cap gets pounded on by Ult. Abom here:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=10341029

It must be nice to be as biased as you are. And although it's off-topic, I'd hardly equate a depowered King Thor, having battled Hulk and Thing for hours and losing his arm, to the Ult. Hulk vs. Ult. Cap tussle. You want to keep ignoring that Ult. Hulk was still strong enough to rip through a tank (twice the size of those in your scans) like it was paper and compare that to the King Thor scan? Please. Now that's just foolish, kid. 616 Spidey is not vastly superior to Ult. Cap in terms of strength. As far as I've shown, Ult. Cap is superior to Ult. Spidey in durability. And with the sheer amount of punishment necessary to take down Ult. Cap, combined with his strength, weapons use, superior tactical mind and arguably better fighting skills? He can take 616 Spidey.

6/10. Ult. Cap.

P.S. I'm repeated it ad naueseam. I don't really care about 616 Cap. This thread is about 616 Spidey vs Ult. Cap, k? Get it through your head.

The fact that you also think there not superior strength feats like the subway train or flicking with just his finger. Then you sure have a skewed way of judging scans.

Shooot I'll even take the Jugg hits on Spidey over the U.Abom hits on U.Cap Since well Juggernaut is a real class 100 unlike U.Abom. But feel free to think otherwise.

by the way spiderman wins.............

can any one show me theses feats of strength that make some one believe ulitmate capt has 15 ton strength

I been checking the respect thread and have not seen anything other then a few good durability feats

Good riddance. I wouldn't waste my time on a report for a troll like that anyway. The burning of calories from clicking the report button would actually legitimize the absolute waste of time he just demonstrated.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
The fact that you also think there not superior strength feats like the subway train or flicking with just his finger. Then you sure have a skewed way of judging scans.

Shooot I'll even take the Jugg hits on Spidey over the U.Abom hits on U.Cap Since well Juggernaut is a real class 100 unlike U.Abom. But feel free to think otherwise.

Ult. Cap 6/10.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
PS. Yeah King thor was hurt and back to his original powers but even so he showed he could put his energy through Cap's unbreakable shield which even Hulk and gladiator couldn't dent.

So I find it more impressive then U.Hulk. "shruggs"

and spiderman clearly has an agility advantage not to mention his webbing more then able to contain Ultimate capt

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Um. Look. I know it's an honest mistake, but the weight class is not actually the weight of the truck. If you look further down in the wiki article you provided, you'll see the actual weight: "[b]The curb weight of an M35 is between 13,000 and 16,000 pounds empty, depending on configuration (cargo, wrecker, tractor, etc.)" So that truck is actually 7-8 tons at least (assuming it's empty).

And on this topic, throwing 7-8 tons at someone means you can probably max lift a lot more. I mean... if I can max lift 180 lbs... do you really think I can throw it at someone? You have worked out with weights before right? I can max lift 180 lbs. But I can't even throw a 20 lbs dumbell very far with both of my hands. I might be able to throw a 10 lbs weight. So you're talking... what? Maybe a 1:20 ratio between your ability to throw something that far and your max lifting ability? Let's just vastly diminish that and argue 1:10 to compensate for scale economics. So for Herr Kleiser, it'd be 7 tons throwing : 70 tons max lifting. Makes sense to me that he is that strong, considering he can survive being impaled by a crashing fighter jet, fights with Ult. Hulk, etc.

Remember that Spiderman scan of throwing a jeep? A Jeep Grand Cherokee is what... 2 tons? Taking a 1:10 ratio to account for scale economics, that puts him at 2 tons throwing : 20 tons lifting. Now I know he can lift 25 tons. I'm just illustrating a point.

And even past that, we don't even know if that's Herr Kleiser's limit. Who knows how far he could throw the damn thing. Remember how you guys jump all over me about how Ult. Hulk was taking a beating and was "supposedly weaker?" Yeah well... Herr Kleiser had already took one hell of a beating when he managed that throw. So when he was fighting Ult. Cap, he must have been stronger by your standards, right? [/B]

Yes but one thing we do know is that he has a HF that regnerates his injuries. I would not expect him to be at his peak but at the same time he didn't seem particularly bothered. Its like Wolverine, Wolverine fans ***** about how he got injured before fighting such and such but quiet frankly we can see it didn't make that much of a difference. He also stated that hes fought him before and quite frankly he wasn't even impressed and could well be argued that if the explosion had weakened him severaly Ult Cap would have done better.

Also bare in mind that HK didn't put up any fight at all again'st Ult Hulk he just got mullered. I don't that he was weakened that much and if they were in comparable in power he should have at least put up some sort of a fight Ult Hulk used him as a punch bag.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

I mean... look here too. He completely wrecks and sends this reinforced steel door flying with his two bare hands from a standing position like it's nothing. He's pretty strong man, he is definitely not a mere 4-5 tonner:

The door proves nothing 616 Cap buckled a door like that and one of his arms was injured but I see what you mean about jeep im not sure if that makes him 70 tons though. Anyway like I said Spiderman is still alot faster is strong enough to hurt him and can web him up.

I know about 616 Cap's door feat. But they are distinguishable, I think. That door was only reinforced with steel. He also only knocked it down from simple nut and bolt hinges. He also had to hit it with all his strength and weight half a dozen times:
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/3251/camedusaeffect048ru4.jpg
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/1717/camedusaeffect049cm8.jpg
http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/6880/camedusaeffect050rx9.jpg

Whereas Herr Kleiser from a standing position, completely crumples this door by pushing against it with his hands. And it's not held up through simple nuts and bolts, but by solid bars built into the surrounding walls:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=10653628

I'm not sure he's 70 tons either. I tried my best to deal with scale economics, but I agree it's speculative. I was only illustrating a point. Because he has to be definitely stronger than class 7-8 tons to throw that military truck at Ult. Hulk. He was also obviously more durable than 616 Spidey. If you really think that he wasn't weakened much because of his healing factor, then you recognize how impressive it was for Ult. Cap to be goin toe-to-toe with the guy.

I'm not arguing that Spiderman couldn't hurt Ult. Cap with his superior strength. That's just ridiculous. But Ult. Cap's durability let's him take dozens of shots from someone like Herr Kleiser and fight, let's him survive shots from Ult. Hulk and Ult. Abom and has only been knocked unconscious once in a straight-up fight. That's when he was poisoned 1,000,000X the lethal dose, ambushed by SHIELD supersoldiers and had to get speedblitzed by a Rocketman in a huge crash:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=10654163

616 Spidey's strength is not the huge problem that I think most of you guys are making it out to be. If it was vastly superior, yes. he could pummel him like Ult. Hulk was and grab him and Ult. Cap could never wrestle away. But he isn't on that level and Ult. Cap is no slouch in the strength department either.

616 Spidey's agility and webs would be a nuisance. But Ult. Cap's agility ain't that bad either. It's at the very least on par with the usual I-can-dodges-bullets level. He's dodged dozens of people firing bullets at him and dodged lasers and junk. But let's not forget Ult. Cap's advantages. Because when you recognize his durability and throw in a vastly superior tactical mind, arguably better fighting skills, weaponry and his shield and a ruthless attitude, I think Ult. Cap can take him. Not easily. But he wouldn't be overwhelmed.

Ult. Cap 6/10. I can live with a split. But I'm arguing for the underdog here.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I know about 616 Cap's door feat. But they are distinguishable, I think. That door was only reinforced with steel. He also only knocked it down from simple nut and bolt hinges. He also had to hit it with all his strength and weight half a dozen times:
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/3251/camedusaeffect048ru4.jpg
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/1717/camedusaeffect049cm8.jpg
http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/6880/camedusaeffect050rx9.jpg

Whereas Herr Kleiser from a standing position, completely crumples this door by pushing against it with his hands. And it's not held up through simple nuts and bolts, but by solid bars built into the surrounding walls:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=10653628

.....ok. Anyway the Cap feat is not that important to the discussion really.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

I'm not sure he's 70 tons either. I tried my best to deal with scale economics, but I agree it's speculative. I was only illustrating a point. Because he has to be definitely stronger than class 7-8 tons to throw that military truck at Ult. Hulk.

Yeah he could be class 25. 😐

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

He was also obviously more durable than 616 Spidey. If you really think that he wasn't weakened much because of his healing factor, then you recognize how impressive it was for Ult. Cap to be goin toe-to-toe with the guy.

Ok i'll try to deal with this point later because if I bring it up now i'll just be repeating myself.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

I'm not arguing that Spiderman couldn't hurt Ult. Cap with his superior strength. That's just ridiculous. But Ult. Cap's durability let's him take dozens of shots from someone like Herr Kleiser and fight, let's him survive shots from Ult. Hulk and Ult. Abom and has only been knocked unconscious once in a straight-up fight. That's when he was poisoned 1,000,000X the lethal dose, ambushed by SHIELD supersoldiers and had to get speedblitzed by a Rocketman in a huge crash:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=10654163

616 Spidey's strength is not the huge problem that I think most of you guys are making it out to be. If it was vastly superior, yes. he could pummel him like Ult. Hulk was and grab him and Ult. Cap could never wrestle away. But he isn't on that level and Ult. Cap is no slouch in the strength department either.

Nah man im not saying that Spiderman strength is a big deal im just arguing that if you combine it with other factors it becomes a serious problem.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

616 Spidey's agility and webs would be a nuisance. But Ult. Cap's agility ain't that bad either. It's at the very least on par with the usual I-can-dodges-bullets level. He's dodged dozens of people firing bullets at him and dodged lasers and junk. But let's not forget Ult. Cap's advantages. Because when you recognize his durability and throw in a vastly superior tactical mind, arguably better fighting skills, weaponry and his shield and a ruthless attitude, I think Ult. Cap can take him. Not easily. But he wouldn't be overwhelmed.

Ult. Cap 6/10. I can live with a split. But I'm arguing for the underdog here.

Well ok lets analyse this:

Agility. Yes Ult Cap is fast but to be quite frank 616 Spiderman is still alot faster. Bare in mind we are talking about an upgraded Spiderman who is even faster. Ive seen Ult Cap dodge gunfire but to be quite frank it did not seem impressive. Hell ive seen scans of an upgraded Spiderman putting Wolverine to shame and I dont even think Ult Cap is as fast as Wolverine either.

Durability. To be quite frank its impressive but since he sees much slower than Spiderman this is what going to keep him in the fight, even if he takes alot of punches his determination and durability could get him some wins.

Tactical mind. Yeah he is smart but to be quite frank I haven't seen anything from him thats gonna give him a huge advantage. Spiderman is also tactically minded.

Fighting skills. This is why I think hes going to lose the majority, not only is he slower than Spiderman but his fighting skills are not enough to give him an advantage. Again they don't seem that impressive.

I know Ult Cap could beat Shin Kuei but in terms of H2H Shin is obvoulsy better. If Spiderman can treat Shin like hes nothing whats Ult Cap gonna do? Sorry but the conclusion is that alot of the fight would involve Ult Cap getting punched in the face. What happens if Ult Cap tries to pick his game up? Spiderman is gonna web him up. Ult Cap is not skilled enough with his shield to stop it from getting webbed. What happens if Spiderman decides to web up his eyes, or do what he did to Wolverine? Ult Cap is not skilled enough or fast enough to stop that from happening. Spiderman could literially just web him up and punch him until hes Koed.

Sorry mate. Spiderman 7/10. 😬

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I know about 616 Cap's door feat. But they are distinguishable, I think. That door was only reinforced with steel. He also only knocked it down from simple nut and bolt hinges. He also had to hit it with all his strength and weight half a dozen times:
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/3251/camedusaeffect048ru4.jpg
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/1717/camedusaeffect049cm8.jpg
http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/6880/camedusaeffect050rx9.jpg

Whereas Herr Kleiser from a standing position, completely crumples this door by pushing against it with his hands. And it's not held up through simple nuts and bolts, but by solid bars built into the surrounding walls:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=10653628

I'm not sure he's 70 tons either. I tried my best to deal with scale economics, but I agree it's speculative. I was only illustrating a point. Because he has to be definitely stronger than class 7-8 tons to throw that military truck at Ult. Hulk. He was also obviously more durable than 616 Spidey. If you really think that he wasn't weakened much because of his healing factor, then you recognize how impressive it was for Ult. Cap to be goin toe-to-toe with the guy.

I'm not arguing that Spiderman couldn't hurt Ult. Cap with his superior strength. That's just ridiculous. But Ult. Cap's durability let's him take dozens of shots from someone like Herr Kleiser and fight, let's him survive shots from Ult. Hulk and Ult. Abom and has only been knocked unconscious once in a straight-up fight. That's when he was poisoned 1,000,000X the lethal dose, ambushed by SHIELD supersoldiers and had to get speedblitzed by a Rocketman in a huge crash:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=10654163

616 Spidey's strength is not the huge problem that I think most of you guys are making it out to be. If it was vastly superior, yes. he could pummel him like Ult. Hulk was and grab him and Ult. Cap could never wrestle away. But he isn't on that level and Ult. Cap is no slouch in the strength department either.

616 Spidey's agility and webs would be a nuisance. But Ult. Cap's agility ain't that bad either. It's at the very least on par with the usual I-can-dodges-bullets level. He's dodged dozens of people firing bullets at him and dodged lasers and junk. But let's not forget Ult. Cap's advantages. Because when you recognize his durability and throw in a vastly superior tactical mind, arguably better fighting skills, weaponry and his shield and a ruthless attitude, I think Ult. Cap can take him. Not easily. But he wouldn't be overwhelmed.

Ult. Cap 6/10. I can live with a split. But I'm arguing for the underdog here.

Thing is, dude, it's not just Spidey's superior strength that gives him the win here. It's the amazing combination of other abilities that he has, working together in unison, that give him the advantage over Ult. Cap. Cap couldn't dare touch Spidey in the speed/reflexes/agility/coordination/equilibrium department.

Don't get me wrong. Ult. Cap is hella durable and very strong. And his fighting skills are obviously superior to Spidey. But 616 Spider-Man has greater durability feats. He has greater strength feats. And his other abilities give him various other advantages.

Spidey wins 8-9/10.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
you're well aware of just how tough Ult. Juggernaut is, you recognize how impressive kicking Ult. Juggernaut and sending him flying sideways through a wall is in the first place. You go ahead and think about the strength required for that feat alone and you'll probably find that we're not too far apart.
I disagree with you on Ult. Cap's strength. He's easily above 2 tons as even the most fervent of Ult. Cap haters can acknowledge that he is at least 4-5 tons. I happen to think he's around 10-15 for him to be able to do all the things he's done. Skill and will can only account for so much when you start piling up the list of things he has accomplished; toppling Ult. Hulk briefly, holding up a multi-ton tree, sending Ult. Juggernaut flying through a wall, goin toe-to-toe with Herr Klesier, punking SHIELD supersoldiers while poisoned 1,000,000X the lethal dose and wrestling free from Chinese supersoldiers who toppled the Statute of Liberty. If you want to equate all those things with pure skill and will, I think that's stretching a lil bit. Much more easily explained with strength. And Ult. Cap's durability is well above 616 Spidey's. The level of damage necessary to knock him out is nothing short of ridiculous.

Originally posted by K3VIL
Fighting Herr Kleiser doesn't require physical strength above Class 2 Tons.Kleiser major advantage was his healing factor and superior strength, which outmatched Cap's own, wasn't for Hulk, he would've been dead.He was struggling to hold the tree, and was aided by his shield surface.Ult. Jugg's capture in that storyarc is a piece of Crap.SHIELD foot soldiers weren't stronger than him, the suits provided flight, a bit of enhanced durability, and their physical strength was in question, cause the foot soldiers of the liberators with Class 3 strength, owned them badly.It took a lot of those soldiers to topple the statue.Also, they were able to pass through the Giant-Men like they were made of butter, when the GM were showed fighting that huge radioactive monster in THE RESERVES storyline.So Cap survived in the Liberators arc also thank to being a main character.The GM formula lately developed was better than Pym's one, so the whole thing of foot soldiers killing them but Cap owning them gives you the equation.

What issues did this happen in?