Originally posted by Robtard
Edit: Then "in the movies" is how you should always debate, not matter how illogical or stupid a certain scene/instance might be compared to the rest of the film.I dropped the 'flies wings' as just went with the dodging of the punch, as Spider-man having 5-times the reaction speed of a human is fairly reasonable compared to the rest of the film, while the wings bit was a bit too much. You should accept that fly scene as the 'greatest feat' though; logic be damned.
Well, why didn't you say so? I think we can come to a middle ground here. However, five times is still too much if the median reactions are measured (yes, that can be done). But I'll budge and give you five times.
Now, there's no way an choregraphed fight like the saber duels can be considered human reaction. They were choreographed and performed many many times to get right. We are supposed to interpret those fights as being normal fighting ability straight out of the gate for Jedi and Sith. If we do that, the saber fighting, a RJ pointed out, is much faster paced than Spiderman's fighting.
No we can move on from that.
The Jedi obviously trains for years with katas and sparring to yet to that point. Watch two lightweight boxers go at it at speed. Its fast as any light sabre battle, in places when the flurries start opening up.
And like in boxing (as I guess many other fighting styles)(The movements originally based on sword movements) in a fight you dont focus on the guys fists only as by the time you see movement from the fist, they've hit you, missed the other clues as to what is coming next.
So you dont look at/fix on the sword, you fix on the opponents body positioning and posture a whole at all times, that gives the 'tell' on whats coming next. (EX: where their legs/feet are positioned, as that will dictate their full extend range, how they are will dictate the types of attack that they can achieve from their current postion...)
This after training is all driven by the subconscious then rather than the slower conscious mind which is more inhibited by process and logic.
With all this and the fact that Anakin and Obiwan knew each other inside out, its not hard to see how intergrated, pitched and intense that duel in particular was.
I bet those lightsaber battles werent that fast or long against the Jedi he slaughtered in the temple, for example.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Wait wait wait wait wait.Lucas is behind CG clonewars too.
I think you misinterpreted what I stated. I specifically said:
Originally posted by dadudemon
No apologies are needed. As far as I'm concerned, the CG series is Cannon. It is/was being done under the direction and writing of GL, so it is Cannon. The CW series was a collaborative 3rd party effort where artistic license was used. (The tattoos is evidence of that.)
In fact, I would consider the CW cartoon to be EU material and nothing in the series is cannon except that 2 or 3 little tidbits snuck in there for a tie in to Ep. III.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
While imperfect, (as was cartoon CW) its in many ways better than the cartoon, you should check it out. Especially before decrying it.
I never once decried it. I simply pointed out that if what I was thinking you were saying, it was stupidity on the part of the writers.
However, I really look forward to watching the CG series. I really love anything star wars. I thought the CG movie was lame but had some great action sequences (making up for the lameness).
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
And why is it to you that you degree some bits as the artistic licence that they are, yet claim other obvious flourishes/last minute tying ups as uber canonical...?
Not uber canonical. Here's what I said verbatim:
Originally posted by dadudemon
Since episode III is cannon, and GL and Tartakovsky made a collaborative effort to INCLUDE that [the force crush causing Grievous his physical ailments] in Chapter 25 and continue it in Episode III, what happened to Grievous would have to be semi-cannon, at the least. That was my only point. I do NOT want to continue to talk about something that was an aside that was only intended as an FYI.
However, the whole point is moot as RJ pointed out. Vader used force crush on a grand scale right after being revived into black suite Vader. Force crush is cannon...but for Vader, and if Imp wants to allow it, for Mace. However, for the sake of avoiding confusion, only Vader can use it, imo. I was just making it a point to show that Force Crush was used in the movies, indirectly. More on this later.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
It was a design issue on the CW cartoon that Grievous wasnt developed as a character at that point.
What are you talking about? Quote what you're responding to. I can't follow what you're referring to. I am assuming that you're trying to claim that Grievous as supposed to have his cough the whole time and he CW cartoon writers got it wrong. Amirite?
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
(Before the movie was finalised, so they altered his appearnce, body posture/cough at the last minute with that little device.)
Okay. I think I see what you're saying.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
As it was obvious last minute add on stuff, it will be deemed as relevant now as that 1st EU book with the kaiburr crystal as Grievous is clearly shown to be as Grievous appears in ROTS throughout the clone wars..
Ah. I see what you're saying. The fans are now saying his body hadn't agreed with his Cyborg implants to explain his coughing in the new CG series...this comes from the EU expanded story...but I can't remember...was it Unknown Soldier: The Story of General Grievous or Labyrinth of Evil? But, anyway, before the CG series, that (force crush) was used to explain his cough in Ep. III. No doubt you read the Wikipedia article on that as I just read it and what your saying matched that.
On Wookiepedia, the force crush by Mace is listed as aggravating the situation that already existed as a means of reconciling the differences between the two stories. In fact, there is speculation that Obi defeated Grievous because he was still weakened by Mace's force crush...this is an explanation being put forth to silence the Star Wars fans who were upset that Grievous was defeated by Obi so easily (I was one of those. I thought it was lame that Grievous was defeated so fast by Obi Wan). Some say that this is rubbish as Obi defeated Anakin later in the movie and Anakin is supposed to be very close in Saber technique to Sidious and Yodi when III rolls around. (This is from the lightsaber fight choreographer for the Star Wars movies...he rated the duelists on a scale of one to ten and he gave Anakin, Yoda, and Sidious a 9 for Ep. III. He called Mace "a special case"...due to his form VII, no doubt...but he never gave Mace a 1-10 rating. I am assuming it is 10 since he defeated Sidious.)
In conclusion, it is just another symptom of stupidity on the writer's end. Or maybe not. It could be each group trying to throw in their own artistic expression into each iteration of Grievous and the fans are just coming up with justifications for those miss- continuities. I will go back and post up, verbatim, what was said in the commentary for Volume II of the CW cartoon. I could have sworn is was a special deal GL worked out with the CN team for the fans.
On a side note, I have no idea how many times I've misspelled Grievous's name. But I think it's spelled Grievous.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Well, alright.... 🙂
😆
Anti-Climatic. However, really the only point worthy of slight discussion is what Genndy really said in the commentary for Chapter 25...since I don't have it, there's really nothing to discuss. RJ already pointed out what all of us forgot: Vader used force crush.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Dont worry....no spelling nazi penalties round here.
I was expecting Bardock to beat me down. 🙁