Originally posted by Darth Truculent
I'd seriously like to see a stormtrooper take an Army Ranger, Green Beret, A Delta Force or a Navy SEAL in hand to hand combat. Come on guys, a stormtrooper is no match for a marine or the special forces. Even with Vader leading there is no way in hell they would be able to defeat the corp.
I'd love to see a Ranger, Green Beret, Delta Force or Navy SEAL jumping to semi-automatic blaster fire from a stormtrooper and try to close into hand to hand combat. I really can't see that happening.
Everyone is screaming about AT-AT - try a submarine firing a Tomahawk or a Harpoon Missile? Now a Harpoon is anti-ship missile, but re-calibrate that son-of-a-bitich and you've got yourself an AT-AT killer. TOW missile will do the same thing. A Walker would be a bit more difficult, but drop some artillery on that ***** and it's dead. Artillery is a hell of a lot more accurate that a mere laser cannon.
Okay. Somebody here has no idea about SW technology. The lasers mounted to the SW universe starfighters unleash firepower equivalent to that of a small nuclear bomb - with each shot. Yet, as we clearly see, that doesn't even remotely touch an AT-AT. So...unless you directly hit it with a nuclear bomb, I don't see anybody doing much against that things.
Forgot - an M1A2 Abrams main battle tank will take out an AT-AT or AT-ST easily. The M1A2 can destroy a target over 2 km away while moving at 45 mph due to it's laser sighting and infrared targeting systems.
See above. The AT-ATs are constructed out of space-age material that has been shown to survive physical stress equivalent of several million G, heat equivalent to that of a sun and so on. There is nothing on earth that would be able to damage those things. It's really that easy.
Almost forgot, try getting a an AT-AT or a Walker across the Sierra Nevada or Rocky Mountains. IMPOSSIBLE!
They have been shown to walk up 90° walls with motifications so I really don't see the Rocky Mountains or the Sierra Nevada being impossible to cross for them.
@Blax:
An AT-AT can be toppled over with enough concussive force to the side. It weighs... what? maybe a few hundred tons maximum?Enough missiles/heavy artillery would knock it over for sure, because of how top heavy it is.
Yeah. Right. You have to hit that thing multiple times on a top spot from the side with enough force to destabilize it. I'd love to see somebody attempting to hit that precisely with heavy atillery - especially against a moving target that is going to obliterate any enemy force with a single shot. And I really don't think that this plan would work at all.
"I'd love to see a Ranger, Green Beret, Delta Force or Navy SEAL jumping to semi-automatic blaster fire from a stormtrooper and try to close into hand to hand combat. I really can't see that happening."
Stormtroopers got knocked out by rocks.
So, obviously they could get knocked out by a gun.
Their semi automatic blasters are powerful, but a squad of stormtroopers couldn't hit Han at close range. You can't kill what you can't hit.
So, all the Ranger/Green Beret/etc has to do is to hit the stormtrooper once in a solid hit, and the stormtrooper goes down. Sure, the stormtrooper only needs one hit too, but
1. he'll be outnumbered (only 500,000 of them)
2. he can't hit some guy at close range
Borbarad, Abrams tanks fire uranium depleted rounds that burn through any and I mean any type of armor. The rounds are radioactive. A TOW missile is an anti-tank weapon so yeah, that'd blow straight through virtually any armor including an AT-AT or AT-ST. Modern weaponry isn't contact explosives - they're armor piercing. Say a couple of Walkers are threatening your position - a few Harpoons will take it out.
Special Forces strike hard and fast. They're quick, mobile and a stormtrooper squad would be dead before they knew they were even there. Most of all, they fight mostly at night. I have a friend who is a Ranger and he says that a stormtrooper wouldn't stand a chance. Besides, they can't kill with their hands because they're wearing too much armor!
Blasters lack ironsights and laser sighting that are standard on the M16 & M4 Carbine. A Blaster also lacks the rate of fire of an M60 or a SAW heavy machine gun. A Blaster sniper rifle can't kill over a mile away that .50 caliber or the Remington 700 (standard sniper rifle - 308) can. Simply put, Earth infantry weapons are far more deadly than anything Star Wars can think of - save the lightsaber.
Marines vs Stormtroopers? Hands down Marines. Even against the 501st, a Marine brigade will emerge victorious. When was the last time the Empire fought urban warfare? The only nation that has the ability to stop a Marine brigade is the Mandos.
Sorry, but Earth would be bloodied, but victorious.
Originally posted by Borbarad
[B]Yeah. Right. You have to hit that thing multiple times on a top spot from the side with enough force to destabilize it.
Considering the side is about 50 feet tall and we have missiles accurate enough to hit tanks from 20,000 feet without disrupting the water statue next to it, that's really not a problem.
I'd love to see somebody attempting to hit that precisely with heavy atillery - especially against a moving target that is going to obliterate any enemy force with a single shot.
The same AT-At that moves at about 10 miles an hour?
Seriously?
The same vehicle that was barely able to hit the snow speeders that were a hundred feet in front of it and moving at a slower speed than most of our jets today? It's going to be blasting F-22's and Mach 3 jet fighters out of the sky?
Seriously?
And I really don't think that this plan would work at all.
The Imperials ground forces are primitive in comparison with even today's technology. Show some faith!
Even with just one military they'll still be outnumbering them.
But it honestly makes a lot of sense for there to be most of the world at once.
How long do you think the fight would last in America before Britain and Canada, the latter of which shares the same continent with America, would jump into the fray?
Considering the Imperials would be a global threat with their technology, it wouldn't make sense for most of the world to NOT get involved.
And if you include countries like Russia, China, Australia.. you've got at least 10 to 1 odds.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Just out of curiosity, why do you think all the world's soldiers will be ganging up all at once?
ONE army would outnumber them.
Originally posted by Darth Truculent
Borbarad, Abrams tanks fire uranium depleted rounds that burn through any and I mean any type of armor. The rounds are radioactive. A TOW missile is an anti-tank weapon so yeah, that'd blow straight through virtually any armor including an AT-AT or AT-ST. Modern weaponry isn't contact explosives - they're armor piercing. Say a couple of Walkers are threatening your position - a few Harpoons will take it out.Special Forces strike hard and fast. They're quick, mobile and a stormtrooper squad would be dead before they knew they were even there. Most of all, they fight mostly at night. I have a friend who is a Ranger and he says that a stormtrooper wouldn't stand a chance. Besides, they can't kill with their hands because they're wearing too much armor!
Blasters lack ironsights and laser sighting that are standard on the M16 & M4 Carbine. A Blaster also lacks the rate of fire of an M60 or a SAW heavy machine gun. A Blaster sniper rifle can't kill over a mile away that .50 caliber or the Remington 700 (standard sniper rifle - 308) can. Simply put, Earth infantry weapons are far more deadly than anything Star Wars can think of - save the lightsaber.
Marines vs Stormtroopers? Hands down Marines. Even against the 501st, a Marine brigade will emerge victorious. When was the last time the Empire fought urban warfare? The only nation that has the ability to stop a Marine brigade is the Mandos.
Sorry, but Earth would be bloodied, but victorious.
QFT
I just did some of the math.
On Wookiepedia, it states that the Snowspeeder's top attack speed is 374 MPH and its top speed total is 683 MPH.
An F-22's attack speed is 700 MPH and it's top speed total is 1,317 mph
So... yeah. It's twice as fast, has twice as much attack range, and is more heavily armed.
"In testing, an F22 dropped a 1,000 lb (450 kg) JDAM from 50,000 feet (15,000 m), while cruising at Mach 1.5, striking a moving target 24 miles (39 km) away."
AT-AT's will last maybe half an hour at best.
Out of curiousity first - what is QFT?
Considering air support too, an AT-AT would be chewed up by an A-10 firing Hellfire anti-tank missiles. Oh yeah, the 30mm Vulcan cannon on an A-10 also fires uranium depleted rounds. The Imps not only would have to deal with the F-22, but also the F/A-18C, F-15C & F-16C. I'm only scratching the surface - MiGs and British fighters are also just as deadly.
The Empire would suffer horrendous casualties in the U.S - simply put our military has better training and equipment than the stormtrooper. Where in SW canon state that the Empire has special forces? An AT-AT is a slow easy target therefore easy to kill. A 5.56mm round from an M16 or an M4 Carbine would pierce stormtrooper armor and kill the man inside. 7.62mm from an AK-47 or AK-74 would do the same.
Sorry I had to go into the technical aspect of modern Earth based weaponry.
Thank you Final Blaxian - I think that some in here forget that modern Earth based weaponry is sometimes more destructive than SW.
The modern soldier can easily carry up to 1500 rounds of ammunition at any given time including six or eight grenades. They're not piss-poor shots like a stormtrooper. Sure a Blaster is a good weapon, but it can overheat and malfunction. Unlike a rifle, you can't unjam an E-11.
Here's something cool.
http://gizmodo.com/351467/navy-rail-gun-test-destroys-everything-it-touches-at-5640-mph
5,640 mph. Really?
That's insane. I read in another article that the force upon impact would be similiar to egtting hit by a minivan moving at Mach 5. That's... hundreds of thousands of poudns of force I'm sure.
Nice stuff on the earth-based tech specs there.
The problem I see in here is, we don't know if the people here on earth would even band against the Imps. I mean, there might be lots willing to join them, and also there is a possible problem of countries turning against each other in the conquest of power (and joining the Empire and cooperating with them).
We're not exactly like the SW worlds, in which almost always the whole world is united under one body of leadership (or something like that), and would have to follow the said leadership rules. We have different countries here, and different interests. Some countries might just surrender to the Emp. so it wouldn't get massacred and give away supplies as tribute or something, and even join in the fight against other countries.
Earth-based tech might possibly beat the Empire, but if our people defect and stuff anyway, then we would prolly just lose to the Empire.