Silver Surfer vs Beta Ray Bill

Originally posted by id369
My point is;

http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/ll121/kingaholu/Thor%20feats/Thorimmunetoagingattack.jpg?t=1239860685
Rays meant to progressed a natural age, will not work on an immortal.

http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/ll121/kingaholu/Thor%20feats/Thorresistsbeingsenttolimbo.jpg
Space Phantom ability to imitate only works on Humans. Bill is an artificial Karbonite life form.

http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/ll121/kingaholu/Thor%20feats/Thorresistshismoleculesbeingfrozen.jpg?t=1239860864
Freezing the molecules, is not matter manipulation.

My point is, when you actually have a basis to draw a comparison from. Do so, preferably one where Surfer has applied it on both consciously.

Rays meant to progress natural age will not work on thor precisely because of his molelcular structure being that of an immortal. His hammer had nothing to do with it.

Also freezing a persons molecular structure is matter manipulation. That is as clear as day an not even debatable. In that scenario as well it was thors Asgardian immortality that protected him. Ur supposed "point" is based on nothing. U have absolutely nothing to go off. You dont even have an example of bills hammer protecting him from matter manip. All ur doing is make weak reaching attempts by trying to use thor as a basis for bill when its clear that thor has inherent protection from matter manip and hence is not an applicable example to use here in the first place. Bill doesnt have any inherent protection from matter manip or at least not on surfers level as surfer has shown he can manipulate him already. Until u can show Bill using his hammer to protect him from such then ur entire argument holds no weight.

Actually, it was never stated rotation was being redirected. Not that it matters, it does not change the nature of the black hole, which is to pull in. Obviously its pulling with greater intensity then the later. Yet your are wrong, take a good look at the pick before and after Asteroth. You will notice that the black hole is rotating, in the same direction. Emphasizing again, that the twisting effect was meant to intensify the Even Horizon. Your quick to jump boat, and point out that Galactus Attack did not destroy the Planet for dead obvious reasons. Yet the shoots from Aegis and Tenebrous can not necessarily be quantified. Other then the fact that Surfer was nearly put down by 4 shoots, one energy blast barely made a dent in on a small satellite. And look at Surfer utterly shattered. While Bill took A Blast and Hand Clap from Galactus, a Super Nova at its core, and the destruction of a planet…badly hurt but not shattered.

Twisting is not a synoym for intensifying. From the use of that word all we can infer is that Asteroth manipulated the pull of the Blackhole so that it would bypass her and instead afect BRB and stardust.Further Even if Asteroth we make the leap of logic and assume intensified the event horizon, a clear indication was already given that Bill couldnt survive the center of a blackhole(let alone fight iinside it for prolonged periods like surfer) before that hence the reason he attempted to stay out of its event horizon in the first place.
In addition, the point with the galactus blast isnt just that it didnt destroy the planet. In an of itself that detail doesnt prove much because collateral damage isnt a great indicator o blast/attack strength when it omes to concentrated attacks. It is therefore just a suporting detail.The main point is that it was one of Galactus minor blasts, the same type he used when fighting pesky ships and such.. The fact that, the blast looked exactly the same as the blasts he used to fight ships, was performed during the same continuous battle as when he fought the ships, nothing was mentioned about him changing the type of blast he was using, continued using those same blasts even after the BRB blast, andthen the fact that it didnt destroy the planet all support the argument that it was the same type of minor blast he had been using previously. True the Tenebrous an Aegis blasts cant be precisely quantified but we do know that they were engaging surfer in direct combat and aiming to kill him. Therefore there mindsets were certainly not the same as that of galactus when he blasted BRB and the potency of their blasts would indeed be higher. Taking a minor blast and clap from galactus , a supernova and the destruction of a planet is certainly impressive but not as impressive as taking multiple aimed to kill attacks from two near Galactus level beings in direct combat.

Yes, some diversity took place. But in all instances the matches took place at close range, with moments where Surfer attempted to physically overpower its opponents. The point is, Surfer likes to take fights up close and personal. A clear no no, against Bill.

A match taking place at close range isnt the problem. Its surfer attempting purely to physically overpower bill without using any of his other powers. If surfer mixes the his physical attacks with energy attacks,forcefields and speed like he did in most of the scenarios u mentioned he will still win the fight.

What’s inaccurate is me attempting to base all of my argument on how Surfer handles Thor. And for all the specifics you bring up, that set apart Bill from Thor. They where not direct factors, when seen on panel

Attempting to base ur entire argument on how surfer handles thor is innaccurate. The specifics i mentioned wouldnt play a huge role in a Bill vs Thor match but would play a role in their respective matches against surfer. Thats the point.

Originally posted by Naija boy
Rays meant to progress natural age will not work on thor precisely because of his molelcular structure being that of an immortal. His hammer had nothing to do with it.

Also freezing a persons molecular structure is matter manipulation. That is as clear as day an not even debatable. In that scenario as well it was thors Asgardian immortality that protected him. Ur supposed "point" is based on nothing. U have absolutely nothing to go off. You dont even have an example of bills hammer protecting him from matter manip. All ur doing is make weak reaching attempts by trying to use thor as a basis for bill when its clear that thor has inherent protection from matter manip and hence is not an applicable example to use here in the first place. Bill doesnt have any inherent protection from matter manip or at least not on surfers level as surfer has shown he can manipulate him already. Until u can show Bill using his hammer to protect him from such then ur entire argument holds no weight.

Hahahahaha. Your argument is as baseless, as the scans brought up. I already brought why they hold no face value in actual matter manipulation. But be my guest, and continue with your circular logic.

Originally posted by Naija boy

Twisting is not a synoym for intensifying. From the use of that word all we can infer is that Asteroth manipulated the pull of the Blackhole so that it would bypass her and instead afect BRB and stardust.Further Even if Asteroth we make the leap of logic and assume intensified the event horizon, a clear indication was already given that Bill couldnt survive the center of a blackhole(let alone fight iinside it for prolonged periods like surfer) before that hence the reason he attempted to stay out of its event horizon in the first place.
In addition, the point with the galactus blast isnt just that it didnt destroy the planet. In an of itself that detail doesnt prove much because collateral damage isnt a great indicator o blast/attack strength when it omes to concentrated attacks. It is therefore just a suporting detail.The main point is that it was one of Galactus minor blasts, the same type he used when fighting pesky ships and such.. The fact that, the blast looked exactly the same as the blasts he used to fight ships, was performed during the same continuous battle as when he fought the ships, nothing was mentioned about him changing the type of blast he was using, continued using those same blasts even after the BRB blast, andthen the fact that it didnt destroy the planet all support the argument that it was the same type of minor blast he had been using previously. True the Tenebrous an Aegis blasts cant be precisely quantified but we do know that they were engaging surfer in direct combat and aiming to kill him. Therefore there mindsets were certainly not the same as that of galactus when he blasted BRB and the potency of their blasts would indeed be higher. Taking a minor blast and clap from galactus , a supernova and the destruction of a planet is certainly impressive but not as impressive as taking multiple aimed to kill attacks from two near Galactus level beings in direct combat.

By Odin! Your still arguing the entire black hole scenario?

Storm Breaker #4 page 21.
http://i43.tinypic.com/21myd21.jpg

Stay out of the event horizon, if you are pulled into it, there is no escape! - Stardust.

Stardust only claims, he would not be able to escape it. Not that he risks destruction. Not that Stardust would know, that willingly Bill does have a means of escape.

===================
Storm Breaker #20-21
http://i43.tinypic.com/2i768w9.jpg

Karbinite! I don’t know how, but Asteroth is twisting the gravity from the black hole! Fight, Korbinite, fight harder than you ever fought before! - Stardust.
===========================

Storm Breaker #22
http://i41.tinypic.com/34pi2j5.jpg
I cant resist it - Bill
No! its too late! We’re being pulled into the event horizon. Well be crushed into subatomic dust!
===========================

Forget Naija boy, its clear that he is to far gone into fan boy nerd rage, to make an clear distinction. But the members can clearly see, that previously according to Stardust Statements, Bill was not endangered by the Black Hole until Asteroth tempered with it. Which also happens to be the means of how Asteroth physical form perished!

Oh so NOW we are going to set apart that Galactus blast where only minor, yet A&T where concentrated blast due to the fact; A&T had the intent to kill. Yet Galactus blasts where anything but warning blasts, since they where obliterating the opposition! Come on now, give credit where its due.

You had your chance to point out Surfers best showings. Everyone on this forum has read them, and they certainly don’t imply the superiority you claim he has. Lets move on, if not be my guest and continue with your circular logic.

Originally posted by Naija boy

A match taking place at close range isnt the problem. Its surfer attempting purely to physically overpower bill without using any of his other powers. If surfer mixes the his physical attacks with energy attacks,forcefields and speed like he did in most of the scenarios u mentioned he will still win the fight.

No the problem is taking the fight at close quarters, he exposes himself to the exchange where Bill. Bill mixes up physical attacks, with energy, and shields as well, only one is battle honed since birth.

Originally posted by Naija boy

Attempting to base ur entire argument on how surfer handles thor is innaccurate. The specifics i mentioned wouldnt play a huge role in a Bill vs Thor match but would play a role in their respective matches against surfer. Thats the point.

Look how much emphasis I place on Thor/Surfer match up. It’s a factor, to consider given their respective showings.

You bring up unique aspects, that separate Thor from Bill. Yet NONE played a factor in their match ups. That much everyone here KNOWS.

Originally posted by id369
Sure originally Stardust created the black hole, and warns Bill not to get pulled in in the event horizon or else there is no escape.
http://i43.tinypic.com/21myd21.jpg

Then Asteorth tempers with it. Stardust then implies if they are pulled in the would be rendered into sub atomic particles.
http://i43.tinypic.com/2i768w9.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/34pi2j5.jpg

Originally posted by id369
Sure, the recent post Skrull Invasion.
http://i41.tinypic.com/9zudqh.jpg

Originally posted by id369
If that’s how you equate the match coming down to. After 6 pages, of debating their isn’t much for me to point out otherwise that will change your mind. Personally I don’t think, speed is going to be a heavy factor to determine such results. Don’t get me wrong, it’s a factor but not a heavy factor that Bill could not compensate with battle honed reflex.

Originally posted by id369
Other then keeping up with Stardust. No I cant say, I have seen him utilize super speed in a battle.

...Bill's never shown super speed. At all. There's literally NOTHING to justify him landing anywhere near as many hits as Surfer if Norrin uses his speed defensively. And since this is a forum fight, Surfer WILL be using his speed so I fail to see how anyone could think that it WOULDN'T be a pretty major factor in the fight 😕 .

Originally posted by darthgoober

I don't get the relevance, where was Stormbreaker being kept when Bill called it?

He tossed it and called it back. If your asking if someone has ever tried to isolate his Hammer, I cant remember an actual incident. Though I do remember bill stating; “Stormbreaker and Bill are bonded by an irresistible force“, no different then Thor and his mallet.

Originally posted by darthgoober

But the thing is, you're basing your opinion about Bill being able to compensate on nothing essentially. As you yourself admit...

...Bill's never shown super speed. At all. There's literally NOTHING to justify him landing anywhere near as many hits as Surfer if Norrin uses his speed defensively. And since this is a forum fight, Surfer WILL be using his speed so I fail to see how anyone could think that it WOULDN'T be a pretty major factor in the fight 😕 .

Battle reflex, is a factor. it’s a skill that determines when and how to act. Take a person that can catch an arrow, obviously humans can not move at the speed of an arrow. But because he honed his skill, he is capable of catching it.

Originally posted by id369
He tossed it and called it back. If your asking if someone has ever tried to isolate his Hammer, I cant remember an actual incident. Though I do remember bill stating; “Stormbreaker and Bill are bonded by an irresistible force“, no different then Thor and his mallet.

I don't doubt that BRB could get his hammer back EVENTUALLY, but until he managed to get his hands on it he wouldn't be able to attack or defend effectively against Surfer. After he got it back, it's a simple matter for Surfer to variation on the tactic or simply rinse and repeat.

Originally posted by id369
Battle reflex, is a factor. it’s a skill that determines when and how to act. Take a person that can catch an arrow, obviously humans can not move at the speed of an arrow. But because he honed his skill, he is capable of catching it.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Well I don't doubt that he'd call the adamantium box back to him, but wielding a large adamantium box isn't going to be anywhere near as effective as wielding Stormbreaker. As far as Thor and his hammer goes, as I already pointed out it took over 60 seconds for Thor's hammer to come back during the Infinity Gauntlet and when Thor and Surfer first fought and Surfer stuck it in a force field it didn't just automatically phase through or teleport into Thor's hand, he had to try to break through with his fists to get to it.

I don't doubt that BRB could get his hammer back EVENTUALLY, but until he managed to get his hands on it he wouldn't be able to attack or defend effectively against Surfer. After he got it back, it's a simple matter for Surfer to variation on the tactic or simply rinse and repeat.

I don’t recall, an encounter with Surfer and Thor during the Infinity Gauntlet Arc. And yes, I have checked the entire 31 issue arc. Can you be more specific for back reference?

Originally posted by darthgoober

I know how enhanced reflexes can help in a fight against someone using super speed, I've pointed that very thing out many times. But the fact of the matter is that Bill doesn't have the reflex feats to support his being able to tag a speeding Surfer anywhere near as often as Surfer can tag him. If Surfer's landing 3 or 4 shots for every shot that Bill lands, I think it's save to say that Bill's going down...

Originally posted by id369
I don’t recall, an encounter with Surfer and Thor during the Infinity Gauntlet Arc. And yes, I have checked the entire 31 issue arc. Can you be more specific for back reference?

Beta eats the board. Beta Ray FTW.

Originally posted by id369
Hahahahaha. Your argument is as baseless, as the scans brought up. I already brought why they hold no face value in actual matter manipulation. But be my guest, and continue with your circular logic.

facepalm. My God what kind of idiot is this. My argument baseless? I have shown examples of surfer actually manipulating Beta ray bills molecular structure. Your counter was that BRBs hammer would protect him from it. You tried to use thor as an example and I proved that thors resistance comes from his inherant physical structure. In ur idiocy what did u do? U dodged it and continued to press the same point which had become moot. I asked u to provide ONE freaking example of BRBs hammer protecting him from matter manip and such and yet u still ignored that as well! circular logic? Nonsense. Fool, stop using terms which u dont even know the damn meaning of!. You only succeed in further showing ur debating ineptitude and make an utter fool of urself. I DARE u to provide even one example of BRBs hammer shielding him from matter manip and point out where i applied circular in regards to surfer manipulating BRB. What a joke

By Odin! Your still arguing the entire black hole scenario? Storm Breaker #4 page 21. http://i43.tinypic.com/21myd21.jpg Stay out of the event horizon, if you are pulled into it, there is no escape! - Stardust. Stardust only claims, he would not be able to escape it. Not that he risks destruction. Not that Stardust would know, that willingly Bill does have a means of escape. =================== Storm Breaker #20-21 http://i43.tinypic.com/2i768w9.jpg Karbinite! I don’t know how, but Asteroth is twisting the gravity from the black hole! Fight, Korbinite, fight harder than you ever fought before! - Stardust. =========================== Storm Breaker #22 http://i41.tinypic.com/34pi2j5.jpg I cant resist it - Bill No! its too late! We’re being pulled into the event horizon. Well be crushed into subatomic dust!

lulz.Seriously what is wrong with u?
Stardust mentions that if u get pulled into it Bill there is no escape. And why do u suppose that is? Why do u think Stardust is worried about their being no escape? Because when he gets trapped in the event horizon, he will get pulled into the centre of the blackhole and then even u should know what happens.
You even posted the quote were stardust mentions the twisting of the gravity which implies that Asteroth made use of the already present gravity of the blackhole. Show me where it talks about Asteroth augmenting or enhancing the strength Blackhole in any way.

Forget Naija boy, its clear that he is to far gone into fan boy nerd rage, to make an clear distinction. But the members can clearly see, that previously according to Stardust Statements, Bill was not endangered by the Black Hole until Asteroth tempered with it. Which also happens to be the means of how Asteroth physical form perished!

Pitiful.Ur attempts to be witty are even more pathetic than ur argument. Nerd Rage? Did u really sit down, think and then type that?hysterical 😱 Soon u will start talking of ad hominem (another term which u have constantly misused) thinking that it somehow covers up the glaring holes in ur argument and sad attempts at doging. Hypocrite much?

Also what "members" are u talking about? Do u seriously think that citing support from imaginary members gives credibility to ur argument? facepalm. It is clear as day that Stardust statement indicated that both he and Beta ray bill wouldnt be able to survive the blackhole hence why he warned Bill not to get caught in its event horizon in the first place. Further Asteroth twisted the Gravity of the blackhole in such a way that it had no effect on her but had an effect on Bill and stardust. Ur claims of Asteroth somehow making it powerful enough to kill bill are supported by nothing but ur irrational delusions. Go find evidence of such and then ur argument may carry a little weight.

Oh so NOW we are going to set apart that Galactus blast where only minor, yet A&T where concentrated blast due to the fact; A&T had the intent to kill. Yet Galactus blasts where anything but warning blasts, since they where obliterating the opposition! Come on now, give credit where its due.

Damn even reading is a problem for u. Excluding the core points of the argument and using nonsensical generalizations is just more inept debating. Its not the fact that they were warning blasts. Its the fact that they were mild blasts which galactus was using to fight ships. Galactus has a history of using such mild blasts while fighting people that he considers insects to him and far below his notice. Even the hulk has taken one of such blasts to little ill effect. It is NOT even comparable to taking blasts from Galactus if he was fully dedicated and aiming to kill BRB in direct combat which is the situation that occured in the T&A fight.

You had your chance to point out Surfers best showings. Everyone on this forum has read them, and they certainly don’t imply the superiority you claim he has. Lets move on, if not be my guest and continue with your circular logic.

lol. where do i start with this. Does referencing imaginary support somehow make u feel superior? (funnily enough ur practically the only one arguing in favor of BRB🙄 ). Trying to base an argument of forum opinion in itself is fallacious but putting that aside do u want to take a poll in regards to whose feats indicate higher durability in regards to surfer and BRB? Then we will see what "evryone on this forum" really thinks. (lmao) Also by ur continuous referral to "circular logic" u are only making apparent ur absolute ignorance of the terms meaning. I beg of u to stop embarrasing urself.

Look how much emphasis I place on Thor/Surfer match up. It’s a factor, to consider given their respective showings. You bring up unique aspects, that separate Thor from Bill. Yet NONE played a factor in their match ups. That much everyone here KNOWS.

How u can keep dodging,ignoring entire posts, referencing imaginary support just so u can repeat the same things that have been countered numerous times is beyond reason. How could u not read any part of the post your stupid ass even quoted? Damn. Then lets look at it again

Attempting to base ur entire argument on how surfer handles thor is innaccurate. The specifics i mentioned wouldnt play a huge role in a Bill vs Thor match but would play a role in their respective matches against surfer. Thats the point.

1.Here i point out that the differences between bill and thor do not greatly affect the outcome of Bill vs Thor matches.

2.Why? Because matter manipulation never even comes into play in their fights. Therefore the whole point is that these differences while negligible in a Thor vs Bill match, would cause a Bill vs Surfer fight and a Bill vs Thor fight to play out very differently. This is all in regards to the fact that despite their similarities Surfer CANT manipulate but CAN manipulate bill(as he has already done before).

And after seeing this u come up with this in ur reply(and even have the audacity to capitalize this nonsense?lulz)

You bring up unique aspects, that separate Thor from Bill.Yet NONE played a factor in their match ups.That much everyone here KNOWS.

Despite it being clear that the unique aspects differentiating thor and Bill dont play a role in their matches against one another but certainly will in the outcomes of their matches against others u chose to ignore it and repeat the same thing.

Simply Disgraceful.

My God what kind of idiot is this. My argument baseless? I have shown examples of surfer actually manipulating Beta ray bills molecular structure. Your counter was that BRBs hammer would protect him from it. You tried to use thor as an example and I proved that thors resistance comes from his inherant physical structure. In ur idiocy what did u do? U dodged it and continued to press the same point which had become moot. I asked u to provide ONE freaking example of BRBs hammer protecting him from matter manip and such and yet u still ignored that as well! circular logic? Nonsense. Fool, stop using terms which u dont even know the damn meaning of!. You only succeed in further showing ur debating ineptitude and make an utter fool of urself. I DARE u to provide even one example of BRBs hammer shielding him from matter manip and point out where i applied circular in regards to surfer manipulating BRB. What a joke

Of course there is a case my little dummy. Stormbraker #1, Bill tanking initial scouring beam from Galactus.

lulz.Seriously what is wrong with u?
Stardust mentions that if u get pulled into it Bill there is no escape. And why do u suppose that is? Why do u think Stardust is worried about their being no escape? Because when he gets trapped in the event horizon, he will get pulled into the centre of the blackhole and then even u should know what happens.
You even posted the quote were stardust mentions the twisting of the gravity which implies that Asteroth made use of the already present gravity of the blackhole. Show me where it talks about Asteroth augmenting or enhancing the strength Blackhole in any way.

Only mentions he will be trapped not crushed. But I suppose Stardust is unaware that Stardust has other means of escape, or that a Black hole can lead you to another local.

Clearly the Black hole was intensified after Asteroth tempered with it, because moments later Bill and Stardust had big problem fighting against its pull. It is then, that Stardust mentions impending doom.

You see there is no need for statements, when its clearly shown.

Pitiful.Ur attempts to be witty are even more pathetic than ur argument. Nerd Rage? Did u really sit down, think and then type that? eek! Soon u will start talking of ad hominem (another term which u have constantly misused) thinking that it somehow covers up the glaring holes in ur argument and sad attempts at doging. Hypocrite much?

Also what "members" are u talking about? Do u seriously think that citing support from imaginary members gives credibility to ur argument? . It is clear as day that Stardust statement indicated that both he and Beta ray bill wouldnt be able to survive the blackhole hence why he warned Bill not to get caught in its event horizon in the first place. Further Asteroth twisted the Gravity of the blackhole in such a way that it had no effect on her but had an effect on Bill and stardust. Ur claims of Asteroth somehow making it powerful enough to kill bill are supported by nothing but ur irrational delusions. Go find evidence of such and then ur argument may carry a little weight.

What’s pitiful is an American attempting to go to law school, with poor writing habits and shitty debating skills. Seriously can you fix your sentence structure, I am not asking for perfection just proof read it. It becomes difficult to decipher this mess.

Stardust and Bill combined might, had no effect on Asteroth. FACT.
It took Asteroth own, tempered black hole to do any lasting Damage on its self. FACT.
You clearly see, Bill going from; holding his place with no effort -> TO INSTANTLY struggling avoid the pull from the same distance. FACT.

Overwhelming evidence points out, the black hole was intensified. But your own pride, keeps you from excepting the fact. Personally I don’t care, but the 1,938 views from members and lurkers will take notice.

Damn even reading is a problem for u. Excluding the core points of the argument and using nonsensical generalizations is just more inept debating. Its not the fact that they were warning blasts. Its the fact that they were mild blasts which galactus was using to fight ships. Galactus has a history of using such mild blasts while fighting people that he considers insects to him and far below his notice. Even the hulk has taken one of such blasts to little ill effect. It is NOT even comparable to taking blasts from Galactus if he was fully dedicated and aiming to kill BRB in direct combat which is the situation that occured in the T&A fight.

None sequential argument of mine.
Bill took, two attacks from Galactus, a Sun Going Nova at the Core, and radical planetary destruction at its core.

You bring up A&T and how he survived prolong battle which is really just 4 shots. One which barely made a dent on a vary SMALL satellite.

Look back at the condition both are left. One is clearly in better condition the later. Now you want to bring up the case, that A&T had the intent of kill and Galactus didn’t. Despite the fact, that his beam at minimum did more damage then what we see in the Satellite. Or the fact, that Galactus was disregarding life all to gather, because those so called warning shots where actually you know..killing.

But hey, thanks for pointing out. Before I deem them near equals in durability, now I give Bill the nod. Pat yourself in the back.

How u can keep dodging,ignoring entire posts, referencing imaginary support just so u can repeat the same things that have been countered numerous times is beyond reason. How could u not read any part of the post your stupid ass even quoted? Damn. Then lets look at it again

1.Here i point out that the differences between bill and thor do not greatly affect the outcome of Bill vs Thor matches.

2.Why? Because matter manipulation never even comes into play in their fights. Therefore the whole point is that these differences while negligible in a Thor vs Bill match, would cause a Bill vs Surfer fight and a Bill vs Thor fight to play out very differently. This is all in regards to the fact that despite their similarities Surfer CANT manipulate but CAN manipulate bill(as he has already done before).

And after seeing this u come up with this in ur reply(and even have the audacity to capitalize this nonsense?lulz)

Which is empty statement or a improper reference in your behalf. I pointed out, that Surfer vs. Thor. Thor has always given Surfer a hard time. And that Bill is practically a Classic Thor.

You then bring up specifics, that depart Thor from Bill. And for the most part I agree, on the specifics. Yet these specifics did not factor in Surfer vs. Thor. Do you understand that original point was not refuted? How you become steer yourself into pointless rant of frustration is beyond me. But you’re my little dummy, and I forgive you.

Despite it being clear that the unique aspects differentiating thor and Bill dont play a role in their matches against one another but certainly will in the outcomes of their matches against others u chose to ignore it and repeat the same thing.

Simply Disgraceful.

Say Bill and Surfer fight one another in Beta Ray Bill: God Hunter.

On the scale of 1-10. 10 being the highest, how pissed are you going to be, when you find out that Surfer speed, and matter manipulation wont mean much to Bill? 11.…ape shit 12?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Again it's a high end feat from a guy that creates blackholes with ease. No I don't think he'd kill Thor with one blast in a forum fight where averages are what counts, but it's just as valid as the the two's earlier encounter that people point to as proof of Thor's superiority to Surfer.

Creating black holes should be well within his power set but it doesn't mean, he has the power to one shot Thor etc. Stardust has easily created a black hole etc.

Lol. You honestly think that Silver Surfer can one shot Thor?

Thor has survived in the core of the Sun without so much as a tan, but when falling to lava, he has stated that the heat alone would be fatal. That obviously isn't true.

Thor has over exaggerated in the past. Silver Surfer has done it a few times too.

Seeing as how Silver Surfer has never shown that he can one shot Thor in anyway, I throw under the entire over exaggeration category.

Seeing as what Thor has survived, Silver Surfer is "not" one shotting him.

Going by statements alone, Thor has more strength/power than Silver Surfer has ever known, and going by that, he would rip Silver Surfer in too pieces. He basically admitted that Thor is his superior and by a margin it seems based on Silver Surfer's stated.

dur

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thor has survived in the core of the Sun without so much as a tan, but when falling to lava, he has stated that the heat alone would be fatal. That obviously isn't true.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I don't remember him stating that heat from the lava would be fatal to him at all. In fact, I've seen Thor be submerged in lava and he stands there completely unphased and comes out to the shock of Lavamen. I've also seen him jump into a firepit of the trolls and walk around at the bottom to regain Mjolnir. This is the same type of fire they used to forge their weapons. I've also seen several foes, e.g. Firelord, who use fireblasts on Thor and while it does hurt, he isn't burning. And yes, these are direct hits, not ones that are deflected by Mjolnir. Thor has monstrous durability that extends beyond blunt force.

I know all of that.

I know Thor has monstrous durability. In that same statement I have said he can survive in the core of the Sun without so much a tan. I have probably read every issue Thor has appeared in. I know what he is capable off.

I know that Thor can easily survive in Lava completely unhindered and that he is resistant to other attacks other than blunt force trauma. Thor is ridiculously durable all around.

My point was that, Thor has over exaggerated in the past about things, and has called them dangerous etc. when they aren't.

His done it more than once.

Originally posted by id369
Of course there is a case my little dummy. Stormbraker #1, Bill tanking initial scouring beam from Galactus.

These attempts get worse as they come. Im "ur little dummy"? Uve just gone from sounding simply sounding like an extremely dull person with little wit to a someone who is seriously sexually confused.

Anyways no evidence supports the fact that it was the same type of scouring beam as ive already shown). Continue in ur delusions. Oh and what of all the talk of "circular logic"? How ridiculous

Only mentions he will be trapped not crushed. But I suppose Stardust is unaware that Stardust has other means of escape, or that a Black hole can lead you to another local. Clearly the Black hole was intensified after Asteroth tempered with it, because moments later Bill and Stardust had big problem fighting against its pull. It is then, that Stardust mentions impending doom. You see there is no need for statements, when its clearly shown.

sigh......Stardust created the Blackhole. he would have known if it was a wormhole(shortcut thru time and space) which he created. Further, He wanted to destroy Asteroth NOT BFR her. The only reason that getting trapped in the event horizon of the blackhole was dangerous is that he would be subsequently pulled into the centre where he would be crushed. The blackhole wasnt intensified, its gravity was twisted. Asteroth twisted its gravity so that it would have no effect on her but would pull in stardust and Bill. Once they were affected by its gravity they were subsequently being pulled to its centre which was the initial danger in the first place.Fortunately your ignoring the obvious doesnt change what happened.

.What’s pitiful is an American attempting to go to law school, with poor writing habits and shitty debating skills. Seriously can you fix your sentence structure, I am not asking for perfection just proof read it. It becomes difficult to decipher this mess.

hystericalhystericalhysterical. Seriously if attacks on "sentence structure" (do people still use that?lulz) and my going to law school are the best personal attacks u can come up with then u should just give up.(especially with the structure of ur sentences 🙄 lmao ) Its definitely not ur thing. All it shows is ur hypocrisy and paints an even more pathetic image of you.

P.S- Im not sure if it was some inane attempt at a personal attack or if ur really that retarded but im definitely not American. The name says it all. Naija

Stardust and Bill combined might, had no effect on Asteroth. FACT. It took Asteroth own, tempered black hole to do any lasting Damage on its self. FACT. You clearly see, Bill going from; holding his place with no effort -> TO INSTANTLY struggling avoid the pull from the same distance. FACT. Overwhelming evidence points out, the black hole was intensified. But your own pride, keeps you from excepting the fact. Personally I don’t care, but the 1,938 views from members and lurkers will take notice.

When ur not dodging, ur bringing u irrelevant information. Doesnt help ur argument
Stardust and bill having no effet on Asteroth is irrelevant here.FACT
Asteroth being damaged by the blackhole is irrelevant here as well.FACT
Yes we do see bill going from holding his own to being pulled into the event horizon. We know this happened because Of Asteroths ability to twist the pull of the blackholes gravity in a way which it wouldnt affect her but would affect BRB and stardust. Overwhelming evidence points to Asteroths gravity manipulation abilities causing it. Your idiocy and to take a quote from ur book "Nerd Rage"(lmao) stops u from
accepting the fact. (And this is the guy attacking others writing skills?). Also, why do u keep trying to garner support from imaginary members? U dodged the question the last time, do u hve the guts to post a poll?

None sequential argument of mine. Bill took, two attacks from Galactus, a Sun Going Nova at the Core, and radical planetary destruction at its core. You bring up A&T and how he survived prolong battle which is really just 4 shots. One which barely made a dent on a vary SMALL satellite. Look back at the condition both are left. One is clearly in better condition the later. Now you want to bring up the case, that A&T had the intent of kill and Galactus didn’t. Despite the fact, that his beam at minimum did more damage then what we see in the Satellite. Or the fact, that Galactus was disregarding life all to gather, because those so called warning shots where actually you know..killing. But hey, thanks for pointing out. Before I deem them near equals in durability, now I give Bill the nod. Pat yourself in the back.

What? None sequential??

Regardless of what that means, collateral damage in regards to concentrated blasts such as those of T&A is indicative of nothing. T&A themselves said that they werent going to hold back against surfer unlike in their previous encounter. Using the logic of collateral damage, blasts from the likes of Asgardian destroyer,Odin and many other uber powerful beings hve had their attacks cause only small dents in the ground. Galactus has long history of using mild blasts and attacks while fighting those he considers below him. Beta ray bill was like the rest of the korbinites was a "small animal" far below his time. They were simply pests to him and though he could care less whether they lived or died. That is ENTIRELY diferent from him dedicating himself to murdering an opponent. I never described his attacks as "warning shots". They were mild blasts meant to casually eliminate the korbinites.(he was indifferent to whether they died or not as he almost always is in these kind of scenarios). If in ur backwardness u now deem bill who has inferior feats superior to surfer durability wise, good for u. It really has no bearings on anything.

It’s a redundant argument of your part, that really did not need much emphasis. You are overworking yourself, to sway a viable factor, for us to consider.

Claiming "it is a redundant argument" and continuously ignoring it while failing to refute its validity just shows the weakness of ur position.

Which is empty statement or a improper reference in your behalf. I pointed out, that Surfer vs. Thor. Thor has always given Surfer a hard time. And that Bill is practically a Classic Thor. You then bring up specifics, that depart Thor from Bill. And for the most part I agree, on the specifics. Yet these specifics did not factor in Surfer vs. Thor. Do you understand that original point was not refuted? How you become steer yourself into pointless rant of frustration is beyond me. But you’re my little dummy, and I forgive you.

facepalm. lol. Stop confusing urself. U pointed out that thor has always given surfer a hard time and tried to use that to argue for bill winning. I then brought up a valid strategy which surfer could use that WOULD work against bill but WOULDNT work against thor because of their unique differences. The specifics i brought up are exactly why it wouldnt against thor.If u agree with the specific differences, then u shud know "original point" was not valid in the first place. Your continuous dodging of the point do to ur inability to counter is getting more amusing.

And also please, Im not ur little anything. If u get feelings of satisfaction( 😘 ) from imagining that, then.................go get help.

Say Bill and Surfer fight one another in Beta Ray Bill: God Hunter. On the scale of 1-10. 10 being the highest, how pissed are you going to be, when you find out that Surfer speed, and matter manipulation wont mean much to Bill? 11.…ape shit 12?

lolwut?

facepalm

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
My point was that, Thor has over exaggerated in the past about things, and has called them dangerous etc. when they aren't.

His done it more than once.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
If I'm not mistaken, this instance would indeed have proven fatal to Thor because after falling, he'd sink to the bottom of the magma pit and drown in the magma. Not only that, he'd revert to Donald Blake unless Mjolnir was summoned to his hand and die even quicker then. Are there other instances you are reffering to?

Thor was falling for a great deal longer than 60 seconds at that moment and from what I read, Thor wasn't worried about him reverting back to Donald Blake, he was worried about the magma itself being fatal.

Thor can hold his breath for a great deal of time seeing as how long he has survived in space. Him falling and sinking to the bottom of that magma pit wouldn't be fatal at all. He has talked in the core of the Sun without any problem, survived at the bottom of the ocean and has spoken in a vacuum etc. without any hindrance.

That fall shouldn't be fatal at all. The time enchantment if thrown out the window, that fall shouldn't have been fatal, yet he said it would be, which isn't true.

The context of his words suggests that he was referring to the pit.

I'm not arguing about him being hurt with magma etc., the point I am trying to get across is that Thor has over exaggerated about things in the past.

He has done it in the past on different occasions

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
If I'm not mistaken, this instance would indeed have proven fatal to Thor because after falling, he'd sink to the bottom of the magma pit and drown in the magma. Not only that, he'd revert to Donald Blake unless Mjolnir was summoned to his hand and die even quicker then. Are there other instances you are reffering to?

I remember that, it's the incident with Algrim.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thor was falling for a great deal longer than 60 seconds at that moment and from what I read, Thor wasn't worried about him reverting back to Donald Blake, he was worried about the magma itself being fatal.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thor can hold his breath for a great deal of time seeing as how long he has survived in space. Him falling and sinking to the bottom of that magma pit wouldn't be fatal at all. He has talked in the core of the Sun without any problem, survived at the bottom of the ocean and has spoken in a vacuum etc. without any hindrance.

I pictured Thor sinking to the bottom without being able to get out of the magma, kind of like how Juggernaut can't get out of liquid cement. No footing. But I suppose Thor's not as heavy as Juggernaut and could swim.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
That fall shouldn't be fatal at all. The time enchantment if thrown out the window, that fall shouldn't have been fatal, yet he said it would be, which isn't true.

The context of his words suggests that he was referring to the pit.

I'm not arguing about him being hurt with magma etc., the point I am trying to get across is that Thor has over exaggerated about things in the past.

He has done it in the past on different occasions

Bcause I would rather distinguish this scene from some of those other-exaggerations he's made. And we're probably thinking the same thing, where he hangs off a building and exclaims that a fall from such a height might harm even him. That's just stupidity. Thor's got too many feats of falling from great heights, being violently flung from Asgard to Earth and crashing into mountains for those statements to hold any weight.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Creating black holes should be well within his power set but it doesn't mean, he has the power to one shot Thor etc. Stardust has easily created a black hole etc.

Lol. You honestly think that Silver Surfer can one shot Thor?

Thor has survived in the core of the Sun without so much as a tan, but when falling to lava, he has stated that the heat alone would be fatal. That obviously isn't true.

Thor has over exaggerated in the past. Silver Surfer has done it a few times too.

Seeing as how Silver Surfer has never shown that he can one shot Thor in anyway, I throw under the entire over exaggeration category.

Seeing as what Thor has survived, Silver Surfer is "not" one shotting him.

Going by statements alone, Thor has more strength/power than Silver Surfer has ever known, and going by that, he would rip Silver Surfer in too pieces. He basically admitted that Thor is his superior and by a margin it seems based on Silver Surfer's stated.

dur

Originally posted by darthgoober
You seem to be missing my point. People use Surfer's statements from his first fight with Thor as proof of Thor's superiority(just as you did in the final part of your post) so I point to later statement made by Thor that place Surfer as his superior. It's not about either encounter being "right", it's about the two characters relative power being up for debate and dependant on showings OTHER than their direct encounters. I don't cling to Thor's statement as being definitive otherwise you see me saying that Surfer pulls 10/10 from BRB with absolute ease rather than 7/10 that are all hardfought.