Silver Surfer vs Beta Ray Bill

A offensive forcefield ala the type surfer used to trap thors hammer in their first encounter. Thats an example of efficient use of forcefields that could be useful against BRB.

And for all that is holy if u keep asking me that inane question of whether i think surfer can use his matter manip in battle against BRB, then walk to the nearest mental institution and lock urself up. Either that or go and take elementary english classes to improve ur kindergarten level comprehension skills. I have answered that question MULTIPLE times. Heck would i claim that he could if i believed the he couldnt? . Here are the numerous times ive replied ur question.

-Me claiming that matter manip will be a useful method of attack

-Me replying u again and once again mentioning how it is a good and viable method of attack

And here i reply u ONCE AGAIN. Clearly indicating my stance and what its based on. and u still manage to miss it.This is just sad

Can u see it now? Or are u somehow still blinded? YES surfer can apply his manipulation to bill in this match seeing as he has shown he is capable of manipulating bills body structure already

If I come across a force field, ala trapping Thor mallet I will post it.

I don’t understand why you are so cryptic around answering the question. After all, the circumstances of how Surfer previously applied them, are not available ATM. Meaning he is not laying un defensive and unconscious. All it took, was a simple yes or no answer for me gauge where you stood.

Are we back to this again? I have already explained why this left in the dust logic is trash. It doesnt apply because no herald he has fought has made use of superspeed while engaging him. Ur doublestandard occured when u asked for "fluid movements" to justify surfers speed and attempted to use the exact opposite(scan of a simple rush) to justify BRBs

What a bloody fool. Please show me where in my previous post u managed to get this assumption from. I dare u to find it. The whole point of the post was to point out that Galactus coming to consume the korbinite planet(the most obvious thing in the freaking comic but which for some reason u think is an astounding discovery) didnt at all have any bearings on ur claims in regards to the nature of that blast. Galactus had beenusing the exact same type of energy beamthat hit the planet while fighting the korbinites trying to defend their planet. And its effect were like that of a regular energy blast. The energy beam galactus used did not destroy the planet because it was not powerful enough to do so. It wasnt a planet level destroying blast as it was the same type which Galactus had been using to destroy ships. The korbinites say that all hope is lost not only because of the damage to the planet but also because their two last hopes Beta ray bill and alpha ray are floating helplessly. Infact, two pages after galactus blasts Beta ray bill, he is still seen blasting ships and also attempts to blast Beta ray(with the exact same type of blasts). He begins to focus on the remains of the planet(damaged by the beta ray blast) close to six pages after the beta ray blast in between which the page that shows him attacking ships is shown.

Great strategy when ignoring arguments and p fails resort to laughable personal attacks .I see that in ur deluded mind great writing skills are determined and portrayed on internet comic forums! eek! Your pathetic personal attacks are almost as bad as ur pathetic arguments. They only contribute the image of foolishness which u are painting of urself. Dont stop on my account. Lets see how far u can go. Maybe u could even put some wit into it next time

Are you done?

this will be an interesting thread to refer to once BRB: Godhunter is released

on the whole BRB has cracked Galactus' armor and Surfer hasn't argument...that's irrelevant. Surfer has never had any intention, whatsoever, of ever trying to deliver his most desperate, intense shot at Galactus.

We can readily infer that BRB was trying his best to heavily damage Galactus in anyway possible. It's even likely that BRB was even trying to kill Galactus (I don't have stormbreaker #1 with me). And we can infer and logically conclude this because nothing less than BRB's home planet was at stake. BRB could not fail, so he directed his most poweful bullrush at Galactus. The same bullrush which shattered a planet, and which he incidentally, also used against Stardust.

The only time Sufer was just as desperate as BRB was, in terms of personal stake?

Yeah, the time Surfer became the Sufer.

Originally posted by id369
If I come across a force field, ala trapping Thor mallet I will post it.

I don’t understand why you are so cryptic around answering the question. After all, the circumstances of how Surfer previously applied them, are not available ATM. Meaning he is not laying un defensive and unconscious. All it took, was a simple yes or no answer for me gauge where you stood.

You wont come across a forcefield like that because BRB hasnt been shown to make use of them in that manner. If in ur idiocy u had actually read my posts and not simply equated both surfer and BRBs use of forcefield as "run of the mill abilities" that both have, thenperhaps u would have come to this realization a few posts ago.

And seriously if u think i was cryptic in my repeated answers of ur question then u obviously have a learning disability. I made my stance clear many times. If u didnt have to tendency to dodge posts then maybe u would have seen such. Further BRB lying unconscious did NOT influence surfers ability to manipulate him at all. If his struture was unable to be manipulated, his being conscious or unconscious would matter little since the resistance would be inherent in his makeup. Please try and read this post and dour best before u respond, i have no time for more of ur retarded questions.

Its brought back again, because your redundancy forces me to go back and re establish a previous claim. If a history of said character, does not make use of an ability guess chances are he wont do so here and now if the rules state its in character.

Is something wrong with u? Once again u ignore the the part of my post where ur argument was refuted. The only one redundant here is u. This ridiculous double standard of urs has been pointed out and u still decide to toe that same line. BRB has NEVER made use of speed in battle so in fact there is no proof he has such an ability in the first place. Surfer on the other hand has used his superspeed in battle numerous times and we know it is within his abiility and a viable tactic under the full capacity rules. Go read the freakin forum rules for heaven sake. Surfer having used it in battle numerous times makes it "in character" for him here.Therefore the times in which he seemingly forgot about the presence of this ability are PIS under forum rules and DO NOT apply here. Its simply inane and recalcitrant for u to ignore said rules and try to argue BRBs speed by saying that BRB has kept up with surfer and other heralds evry time he has fought with or against them, even when its is apparent to all who can read that heralds were NOT making use of their "fluid movement" speed at the time. facepalm

Just because, the energy is the same color does not mean it’s the same type of attack. Again, why would Galactus endanger his food? We know he will not willing do so, he even brought this up when Surfer blew a planet in Annihilation? If you actually take the time, too look at Annihilation, the planet resembles the effect of the initial part of the cauterization.

Actually all indications tell us it was the same kind of attack. Not only that in the comic, it was never said to be that type of blast u claim and that it exactly resembled his normal blast, bu even after Galactus blasted BRB he still continued fighting ships and didnt focus on the planet until quite a while later. Galactus wasnt endangering his food because the blasts he was using werent powerful enough to destoy the planet only to scorch it. So surfer blwoing up a planet in annihilation has no bearing here. Further the annihilation blast was clearly a continuous stream of energy which went through all the processes of cauterization of the entire planet,the break down of the planets atomic structure, matter to energy conversion and finally absorption into galactus. The blast he used against BRB wasnt a continuous stream of energy but was rather a one of blast that initiated none of these processes. Further proof that they werent the same kind blast. Really u have nothing to go off here.

Are you done?

Oh what? No more attacks on writing skills and law school? damn i was hoping u would come up with something remotely good this time. lulz.

Surfer might be more powerful, but against the hammer he loses the edge, since his mo of zip and shoot is countered by absorbtion.

Bill is more battle oriented, and has dropped Surfer before.

@Naija boy

I am out of time, and I only really post seriously one day out of the week. However, its becoming clearly impendent that our continuing argument would be filled with circular logic, and AD HOMINEM’s.

So I am going to round this up vary nicely.

Matter Manipulation.
I don’t believe Surfer can manipulate Beta Ray Bill on the fly, the enchantments placed on Stormbreaker would protect Bill just as much as Mjolnir does towards Thor.

Speed
Speed wise, Surfer has the advantage for demonstrating upper highs, and sparsely applying them in combat. Despite the fact, his on going showings with both Surfer and Bill. It seems to suggests that Bill’s reflex and battle experience is enough to keep up with characters of the same tier. Surfer has the advantage but not enough to overwhelm, Bill.

Durability.
This is a hard call. Surfer may have one or two incidents with upper highs. But they are placed into question or round down because of his lower lows. However Bill durability surprises me, because he is generally seen as a tank, and its not a single but a string of instances within an arc, where he shows the ability take punishment and walk it off.

Energy Output
I would give the nod to Surfer, for his energy discharge creating a black hole. However, Bill is not to far behind for out gunning a herald tug of war. Its difficult to judge energy output when one is based on a feat, while the other is referenced from a showing. Usually I favor a showing, then a feat.

Strength.
Clearly Bills advantage, for demonstrating more feats regarding strength.

State of mind.
Battle Experience, will to fight, ruthlessness etc.. it evens out, maybe a slight advantage towards Bill because his state of mind is more consistent then Surfers. He is after all, a worrier and this character trait has remain relatively intact since its introduction.

Overall
I generally see Bill as Classic Thor..only a bit more ruthless. Surfer would have as much trouble with Bill as he would with Thor. If Surfer decides to play it smart keeping his distance, apply energy blasts, at an elevated speed. Bill would be hard pressed to garnish a victory. But if Surfer decides to go ruthless on him, and stand up toe to toe, Bill is the physical superior and at close quarters is where he specializes in.

Originally posted by Naija boy

Oh what? No more attacks on writing skills and law school? damn i was hoping u would come up with something remotely good this time. lulz.

Originally posted by Naija boy
And seriously if u think i was cryptic in my repeated answers of ur question then u obviously have a learning disability. I made my stance clear many times. If u didnt have to tendency to dodge posts then maybe u would have seen such. Further BRB lying unconscious did NOT influence surfers ability to manipulate him at all. If his struture was unable to be manipulated, his being conscious or unconscious would matter little since the resistance would be inherent in his makeup.

Originally posted by UniOmni
Surfer might be more powerful, but against the hammer he loses the edge, since his mo of zip and shoot is countered by absorbtion.

Bill is more battle oriented, and has dropped Surfer before.

I don't recall this.

This is a good fight and people fail to realize that almost any attack that surfer dishes out beta ray bill will absorb it quite easily.

The thing that changes this fight is that beta ray bill doesnt hold back. The power he possess you see the full extenct of it. Surfer would be getting hit with planet destroying hits like he has never been hit before and I dont think that he could shrug off those.

I'm giving this a 5/5 split. I love surfer but i just dont see him doing so well in this fight and by the way, didnt bill shrug off some galactus blast and hits (not saying that galactus was giving it his all).

Originally posted by id369
Matter Manipulation.

I don’t believe Surfer can manipulate Beta Ray Bill on the fly, the enchantments placed on Stormbreaker would protect Bill just as much as Mjolnir does towards Thor.

Sorry it took so long to reply...

Originally posted by id369
Yes I stated, its bad enough Thor under his own power, gives Surfer a hard time. Bill is not to far from Classic Thor, since his portrayal are consistently high. However worrier madness Thor is a bigger dog, that neither can handle.

And even if we decided to take that showing at face value, it's offset by the encounter in which Surfer almost killed Thor with a warning blast.

Originally posted by id369
Alight point acknowledged.

Originally posted by id369
Durability wise, he was at the heart of an exploding sun. But we do not have a good idea for how long, and if it was risking his life. Since he was basically K”Oed by Galactus actions, and once he was up he simply flew out of it.

And its back to back damage soak, he took a planet buster from Galactus, then a Hand Clap from Galactus, gets caught up in an exploding sun, gets pilled drive into the core of the planet right before it explodes. And yet he still survives, the entire ordeal. Its not a single instance but a string of instances following up one after another.

That is why I have such high regard towards Bill durability.

Originally posted by id369
Battle initiative and combat aggression are hard to gauge as well. That is why, I had them in the undecided section. Problem is, Beta Ray Bill personality has not changed over the course years. Its bin intact for the most part. You start to question, who really has it more to gather out of the two.

Originally posted by id369
Well the mallets have bin known to traverse across space and time. Or at least Thor mallet has, I would think Bills would as well.

Originally posted by id369
I think flying in circles at the c, is a poor tactic. All he needs to do is make a direct swing, and lights out.

Fluid movements to me would be, something like this.
Coeus intercepting (a billions streams of light per second, at the speed of light), from Leo. And returning it back to Leo with on arm!

Its in Japanese, but the character perceives ever action, and react speeds faster then light at all times.

I wasn't pitching the tactic for Surfer, I was pointing out the error in this statement...

Originally posted by id369
I said, I have never seen him use transluminal speed in combat. As in fluid movements, portrayed at light speed or greater. Never denied he used super speed, but those instances are hard to quantify just how fast he was going.

A smart Surfer WOULDN'T just fly around BRB in a tight circle, he'd keep a small distance between them and dodge and weave between hammer throws and energy blast just as he did when he fought Thor the first time, but at lightspeed.

Your scans feature a nice indication of combat speed but now you're ignoring each characters style. Surfer isn't the type to throw a bunch of punches and/or series of blocks when he decides to get serious and the writers drop the PIS because he doesn't HAVE to, he just uses blasts and dodges...

I'd give the nod to Surfer, personally.

Originally posted by darthgoober
(such as his his blocking/dodging various energy blast after they're fired or grabbing/throwing Nova) are decent indications of lightspeed movement in combat as well.

😂

Originally posted by darthgoober
And even if we decided to take that showing at face value, it's offset by the encounter in which Surfer almost killed Thor with a warning blast.

😆 😂

You don't actually believe that the blast would have killed Thor do you?

Lol!

^ Why not?

Tough fight but Surfer wins 6-7/10

Originally posted by Philosophía
😂

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
😆 😂

You don't actually believe that the blast would have killed Thor do you?

Lol!

Originally posted by darthgoober
Can you think of a better indication of FTL reflexes(other than them outright stating it that is) than reacting to a beam of light after it's fired?

streetlevelers block or dodge lasers and bullets all the time, but none of them are close to bullet or light speed

Originally posted by Starscream M
I personally don't think deflecting/blocking feats are the best indication of speed

streetlevelers block or dodge lasers and bullets all the time, but none of them are close to bullet or light speed

Originally posted by Mindset
Streetlevelers however do have bullet speed reflexes, which is what I believe he is talking about.

goober seems to be saying if someone can block a lightspeed attack...that means they should be able to attack at lightspeed as well which i dont think is the case

Originally posted by darthgoober
Can you think of a better indication of FTL reflexes(other than them outright stating it that is) than reacting to a beam of light after it's fired?

When you have Surfer blocking light after it's fired, let me know. Until then, randomly blocking energy blasts, and assuming they all go lightspeed, is rather stupid.

Your face is rather stupid.