Solid Snake vs Sam Fisher

Originally posted by FeelGood
No the skills don't but the skills stop Sam from ever having the chance to fire.

To be honest you just seem to be ignoring everything Snake has done and can do and just go back to the bullet again and again. Who's to say Snake will let Sam get close enough.

You need to play at least one of them to get a good idea of these two.

How exactly will his skills detect Sam in a possible 1:00 scenario from my video?

Who has said anything about being close? Have you seen Sam's accuracy?

So watching a friend play them in my place isn't enough to give me an idea?

Originally posted by FeelGood
Well who's to say that guy isn't better than Sam.

But you are certain Sam is but its not definite is it.

The fight against that guy says it. The guy relied more on his techn than his actual skills.

Sam has showings that put his technique above that particular foe as well. There's little special about that fight other than the invisibility device.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Cowgirl is correct, A>B>C logic doesn't work because of the difference in characters.

Snake's ridiculous jobber aura isn't a part of vs matches.

Indeed. They both use stealth. The difference would be that Sam uses technique, and Night Fright (S?) tech and basic survival arts.

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
[b]How exactly will his skills detect Sam in a possible 1:00 scenario from my video?

Who has said anything about being close? Have you seen Sam's accuracy?

So watching a friend play them in my place isn't enough to give me an idea? [/B]

He will react fast enough for starters. Snake dodges bullets up close, Sam's nothing to bullets.

Watching someone and playing gives people different perspectives I think.

Originally posted by FeelGood
He will react fast enough for starters. Snake dodges bullets up close, Sam's nothing to bullets.

Watching someone and playing gives people different perspectives I think.

Snake dodges bullets he can see are coming. Like Sam, Snake is nothing if the bullet comes from a silencer from behind.

Are you serious? 😛

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
[b]The fight against that guy says it. The guy relied more on his techn than his actual skills.

Sam has showings that put his technique above that particular foe as well. There's little special about that fight other than the invisibility device.

Indeed. They both use stealth. The difference would be that Sam uses technique, and Night Fright (S?) tech and basic survival arts. [/B]

Lets see some of these showings. So far you showed him hiding in snow. Wow, I'm waiting to be impressed, especially when your trying to compare him to a guy who has harder guys to sneak past and just relies on his own skills.

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
[b]Snake dodges bullets he can see are coming. Like Sam, Snake is nothing if the bullet comes from a silencer from behind.

Are you serious? 😛 [/B]

So you have watched every single cutsene and moment from all the games?

Eh Snake has a good chance fo hearing Sam behind him and then dodging.

Originally posted by FeelGood
Lets see some of these showings. So far you showed him hiding in snow. Wow, I'm waiting to be impressed, especially when your trying to compare him to a guy who has harder guys to sneak past and just relies on his own skills.

Have you been averting Sam Fisher videos and accomplishments? You can pick any one game in the Splinter Cell serie and Sam Fisher is already beyond Snake and Night Fright in terms of technique. I'm not asking you to be impressed. All I'm saying, and has been saying, is that Snake is inferior Sam in terms of technique. So are Snake's enemies.

I guess you want me also to repeat that Sam: Is not only an adept parkour artist, but he's an elite commando that's been trained by the top forces of the world (Navy Seal among other), nigh superhuman acrobatic skills and a lifetime of experience in stealth (A lifetime longer than Snake).

Originally posted by FeelGood
So you have watched every single cutsene and moment from all the games?

Eh Snake has a good chance fo hearing Sam behind him and then dodging.

😐 What a ridiculous question. Have you paid any attention to what I've been saying?

If a tree falls in the forest and no one is there, does it make a sound? It does, but not to the human ear. What will Snake be hearing? Snow dropping to the ground? It's not like Sam will reveal himself in front of Snake.

How is he inferior? Just because he doesn't need them doesn't mean he's inferior.

I've saw 2 videos so far and nothing has impressed me when I compare it to what Snake does.

You list things and what have you but still compare any of it to Snake and its nothing special.

Example, Snakes not trained in Parkour or whatever but he does more impressive stuff without that skill.

Sorry boys. Never a days rest.

🙄

I just don't find the things Sam does impressive, Snake does things like that to but can't do them in game, like for example someone quickly turned out in a cutscene once and Snake has a split second to hide.

We then saw Snake was gone but dropped down from the ceiling. A split second and he was gone. Snake once had to avoid walking past a doorway so he jumped over it. Snake has the ability to do all this stuff but just because its not put into the gameplay you assume he doesn't do it.

If Sam sneaks up on Snake, Snake will turn around before Sam can shoot, disarm him, have him on the ground, and kill him.

I don't like it, but Snake's feats are consistent. Snake was able to with H2H do the same to Gray Fox, who was completely invisible, and possesses superhuman attributes.

Originally posted by NemeBro
If Sam sneaks up on Snake, Snake will turn around before Sam can shoot, disarm him, have him on the ground, and kill him.

I don't like it, but Snake's feats are consistent. Snake was able to with H2H do the same to Gray Fox, who was completely invisible, and possesses superhuman attributes.

Exactly right.

Originally posted by FeelGood
🙄

I just don't find the things Sam does impressive, Snake does things like that to but can't do them in game, like for example someone quickly turned out in a cutscene once and Snake has a split second to hide.

We then saw Snake was gone but dropped down from the ceiling. A split second and he was gone. Snake once had to avoid walking past a doorway so he jumped over it. Snake has the ability to do all this stuff but just because its not put into the gameplay you assume he doesn't do it.

They don't need to be impressive. They only need to be adequate.

Originally posted by NemeBro
If Sam sneaks up on Snake, Snake will turn around before Sam can shoot, disarm him, have him on the ground, and kill him.

I don't like it, but Snake's feats are consistent. Snake was able to with H2H do the same to Gray Fox, who was completely invisible, and possesses superhuman attributes.

Where does everyone get the whole "sneak up on" idea from? 😛

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
[b]Where does everyone get the whole "sneak up on" idea from? 😛 [/B]

He could not sneak up on Snake.

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
[b]They don't need to be impressive. They only need to be adequate.

Where does everyone get the whole "sneak up on" idea from? 😛 [/B]

They need to be allot more than adequete. 😐

Originally posted by NemeBro
Gray Fox moves silently, while invisible, and has superhuman attributes to back him up.

He could not sneak up on Snake.

He's not. He's given a gun, so sneaking up is an unnecessary risk. And the 1st battle is in a winterscape. I'm guessing that even Snake leave footprints, even when he's virtually invisible. Given Fisher's accuracy and mind, footprints is all he needs to put one through the noggin.

So how would he detect Sam if he hid much like how he did in that video? He doesn't give out sound, heat or motion. The snow and suit takes care of that.

Originally posted by FeelGood
They need to be allot more than adequete. 😐

😐

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
Gear is gear. Technique is technique. Having awesome gear doesn't automaticly make your technique awesome. Judging by all that I've seen of Snake, his stealth technique is inferior that of Sam.

Indeed. The Splinter Cell focuse more on stealth than Snake, which is my repeating point in this thread: The reason he win the 1st fight. Like I said, Snake is a seek-and-destroy. For as long as Sam apply his superior technique, chances are greater that Sam discovers Snake before vice versa.

Snake is more physically fit than Sam. Snake has better gear than Sam. Snake has better DNA than Sam. Snake has better experience than Sam. Sam has better technique than Snake. Sam > Snake. All your accomplishments means nothing when you're on the recieving side of a bullet.

Putting superior gear to a technique apllies more to Snake than it does Sam. I have doubt that you've seen very much of Snake. A FeelGood stated, the fact that he doesn't even need to resort to means such as hiding in the shadows to remain in stealth just shows another reason why his sheer stealth is better all around.

The higher focus on stealth is based on gameplay function and nothing else. In a debate like this, gameplay tends to be one of the last means to turn to unless spoken otherwise. Snake has canonically shown better means of stealth than Sam based on the fact that, again, he doesn't rely first and foremost on shadows like Sam does in and out of gameplay, and the scene where he first meets Big Mama in MGS4 is a prime example of superior combat technique, as well as a lack of the need for any particular means of terrain for an advantage; Snake was following a soldier, and before he could turn around, Snake was gone from sight.

All those superiorities adhere to a better technique. Even with inferior technique, these superior statistics of Snake make it so that he'd be the last one between the two to have a bullet anywhere in his person. Not to mention feats like his first tussle with the cybernetic Gray Fox, his ability to dodge a bullet from Ocelot a few moments prior, and dodging Olga's surprise attack with her knife, are all examples of superior awareness as well, which contributes to rendering superior technique moot in the first place.

Where does everyone get the whole "sneak up on" idea from?

Now that HAD to be sarcasm.

I give up. I like my hair too much to tear it loose.

Sam doesn't need the shadows for stealth, play DA or read the novels, he doesn't need shadows to get about.

He can use whatever terrain he's on to his advantage, and his satcom would even out the odds on Snake's invisible suit.

And of course if it came to gameplay Sam takes it, but we're basing this on overall stealth ability.

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
[b]He's not. He's given a gun, so sneaking up is an unnecessary risk. And the 1st battle is in a winterscape. I'm guessing that even Snake leave footprints, even when he's virtually invisible. Given Fisher's accuracy and mind, footprints is all he needs to put one through the noggin.

Based on Sam's experience with using snow and ice terrains to his advantage (Iceland and Serbia missions) he probably takes scenario 1.