Despero vs Thanos

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Haha, what?

First of all, Orb of Power only enchanced the intensity of his blasts, hence he fired them through it. It did not affect his strength or his durability.

Second of all, WM increases Thor's power. And you really don't know what Power Gem is, do you? It gives the wearer UNLIMITED strength. It has been made to power the other gems with its UNLIMITED power. With WM and Power Gem, Thor was able to defeat Doctor Strange, Silver Surfer, Adam Warlock, Gamora, Maxam and Drax ON THE SAME TIME. Insane Savage Hulk could not do that, no matter how you try to bullshit your way out of it.

Well, they attacked him one at a time. Not en masse.

And saying things like "unlimited" means nothing because its all based on state of mind. Drax had the gem, and couldn't increase his strength past Thor or Professor Hulk levels...and he was already, at base, a class 100 brick.

Thus far, Despero's durability seems to suck. Tear gas, Superman's heat vision, spear thrown by Aquaman, sharks, Hawkman's blow...all those have hurt him.

Hawkman's blow isn't so bad. Nth metal, remember? Fundamental forces of the universe, and all that...

And Thanos has done all his feats with nothing more then his usual equipment and powers. His bionics are part of him.

Maybe pre-ressurection. Post, it was said that he would never use bionics to enhance himself (When they saw the body of "Thanos", and it turned out to be Gaetar).

He fought Odin without anything, defeated Thor with two blasts without anything, fought WM/PG Thor without anything, defeated Kosmos without anything, absorbed Universe level power without anything, owned Silver Surfer without anything, downed Drax with one blast without anything...want me to go on?

I agree with you in spirit, but "absorbing universe level power" is really not a good example of this. Its not like he used energy absorbing powers to do this, after all.

Thanos simply is more powerful then Despero. A simple fact that you can't change. Not only he is stronger and WAY more durable then Despero, he only needs couple of blasts to finish him off, or just matter manipulate him to something. Or absorb his life force.

I'd argue that Despero has, at least in Virtue and Vice, demonstrated greater strength than anything Thanos (Or Darkseid, before anyone else jumps in) has demonstrated.

Durability, no argument.

The rest though, thats suspect. Matter manipulate him into something? He's done that once, 3 decades ago, to a skrull. This was Pre-Ressurection...from what we've seen, he doesn't have the ability Post-Ressurection.

Absorb his life force? I can't remember him doing that. Hope you're not talking about the priest in Celestial Quest, since that wasn't Thanos.

I don't think its a good idea to compare when Superman's heat vision has done, in terms of raw feats, to what Thanos has done if only because Superman has so many more appearances.

Remember, they powered the engines that moved a massive planet, sealed holes in reality, destroyed Blackrock (who was physically more powerful and impressive than Superman himself), etc.

In terms of what they've done against individuals, there can be no argument that Thanos' eye blasts are the more impressive.

I'd be interested to see what Despero's mind powers would allow in this case. He's much more powerful than any telepath Thanos has gone up against thus far, turning Martian Manhunter into goo and all that.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Despero telekinesis isn't going to stand against blasts that downed Galactus.

Thor drove off Galactus. I haven't seen Thanos doing that (Thor also sent Thanos flying, and knocked him down with Mjolnir).

Hell, even Aquaman was able to knock Despero over.

If you want to discuss fights, discuss the whole fights, and not only the parts that make Thanos look cool. Why don't you mention the fact that Wolverine was able to stab Thanos without difficulty ?

Because anyone with half a brain can tell you that panel was blatent PIS. Odin can't pierce his hide with Gungnir, AND LOGAN CAN SOMEHOW DO IT WITH ADAMANTIUM?! PIS.

Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Downed Galactus ? As far as I can remember, the best Thanos did, was knock Galactus backwards (surprise attack, not exactly the strongest Galactus ever...). After that, he begged Galactus to let him live.

He wasn't begging for his life either, he was begging for Galactus not to use the Infinity Gems and release the Hunger, just read the actual dialogue, the gems were all Thanos cared about, not beating Galactus.

No one in the Justice league is herald level except the Green Lanterns, and even they lack in the speed department.

Desespero is strong and hand to hand is a good match in strenght for Thanos, but the mad titan is an expert tactician and experienced fighter; Desespero h2h goes down for the same reason Darkseid would go down: In the end Thanos is the better fighter.

Originally posted by Bentley
In the end Thanos is the better fighter.

Based on what ?

He trained Gamora who is one of the best h2h fighters in MU. Desespero has power in spares, but fighting skills? I dont see where you would get that.

I don't care about Gamora. I am talking about Thanos, you know, the big purple dude.

It's very simple : everybody claims Thanos has Superior Fighting Skills, but I am still waiting for some proof to back that up.

A few scans of Thanos doing some back flips would be nice, or Thanos fighting Bruce Lee-style, or Thanos doing a flying throat kick, or whatever.

We never see that. Never.

Typical Thanos fight : Thanos stands there, waits until the enemy comes close enough, and blasts him into a thousand pieces.

Some impressive fighting skills.

Thanos flipping around like Spider-Man and doing Bruce Lee kicks would look stupid and be incredibly out of character.

Fighting skills doesn't have to be flips and kicks, it can also be things like dodging Champion's attacks and using his head to cause Champion to lose his balance, things like that.

Originally posted by Desaad
Well, they attacked him one at a time. Not en masse.

And saying things like "unlimited" means nothing because its all based on state of mind. Drax had the gem, and couldn't increase his strength past Thor or Professor Hulk levels...and he was already, at base, a class 100 brick.

Thor was considerably stronger with Power Gem then he was before. Did not show any limit there, really. He was basically one-shotting heralds right and left.

Originally posted by Desaad
Hawkman's blow isn't so bad. Nth metal, remember? Fundamental forces of the universe, and all that...

Still...Thanos would not have even budged from a hit like that.

Originally posted by Desaad
Maybe pre-ressurection. Post, it was said that he would never use bionics to enhance himself (When they saw the body of "Thanos", and it turned out to be Gaetar).

Cool, that just proves that he doesn't have any bionics now. He does it all through his own strength.

Originally posted by Desaad
I agree with you in spirit, but "absorbing universe level power" is really not a good example of this. Its not like he used energy absorbing powers to do this, after all.

Then what did he do? Sure looked like containing the power and then releasing it for me.

Originally posted by Desaad
I'd argue that Despero has, at least in Virtue and Vice, demonstrated greater strength than anything Thanos (Or Darkseid, before anyone else jumps in) has demonstrated.

No...I don't think so. Maybe if Superman and Captain Marvel had actually fought for real, but they just punched him one time and then started hanging from his neck. Hardly going all-out on Despero. They did not use speed or anything. Thanos would have been easily capable of doing the same.

Wrestling the Gugnir and moving it while Odin is holding it, with ONE hand is defenitely more impressive.
http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/7219/fight1213gr7.jpg

So is this.
http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/6338/strength9fg3.jpg

Originally posted by Desaad
Durability, no argument.

The rest though, thats suspect. Matter manipulate him into something? He's done that once, 3 decades ago, to a skrull. This was Pre-Ressurection...from what we've seen, he doesn't have the ability Post-Ressurection.

Absorb his life force? I can't remember him doing that. Hope you're not talking about the priest in Celestial Quest, since that wasn't Thanos.

Clearly seems matter manipulation here, creating the house as it was from nothing.
http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/3589/energy27an2.jpg

Celestial Quest was confusing, so I'm not sure if this Thanos or not, but...
http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/5064/energy21vd1.jpg

All of this still doen't change the fact that Thanos will atomize Despero with his blasts, EASILY, Despero can't do ANYTHING to hurt Thanos, Thanos is, at the very least, equal to Despero's physical strength, and Despero's telepathy or telekinesis don't help him at all here.

Originally posted by Wally West
Thanos flipping around like Spider-Man and doing Bruce Lee kicks would look stupid and be incredibly out of character.

Fighting skills doesn't have to be flips and kicks, it can also be things like dodging Champion's attacks and using his head to cause Champion to lose his balance, things like that.

Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
I don't care about Gamora. I am talking about Thanos, you know, the big purple dude.

It's very simple : everybody claims Thanos has Superior Fighting Skills, but I am still waiting for some proof to back that up.

A few scans of Thanos doing some back flips would be nice, or Thanos fighting Bruce Lee-style, or Thanos doing a flying throat kick, or whatever.

We never see that. Never.

Typical Thanos fight : Thanos stands there, waits until the enemy comes close enough, and blasts him into a thousand pieces.

Some impressive fighting skills.

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/8524/fight81ph1.jpg
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/3087/fight82od2.jpg
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/7371/fight85ns8.jpg
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/1909/fight86yk9.jpg

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7479/fight131fe5.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/3051/fight132vi6.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/3244/fight133cc6.jpg
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/3456/fight134ja4.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/5728/fight135bb6.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/4823/fight136gd5.jpg
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7043/fight137vq3.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/6325/fight138ah0.jpg
http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5638/fight139as8.jpg
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/1299/fight1310pj9.jpg

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/9264/fight142ll2.jpg
http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/7346/fight143jw3.jpg
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/8537/fight144vk3.jpg
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/1222/fight145tb7.jpg

There is some.

Even though it was apparantly a clone in Celestial Quest, absorbing the Rot's energy I think is perfectly within the capabilities of the real Thanos (it was intended to be the real Thanos anyway, prior to the retcon), it is how he tried to merge with the HOTU. "Physically they could not directly accept such naked energies. I, on the other hand had spent my entire life housing massive stores of might within my physical self":

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Ixion83/MarvelTheEnd4i.jpg

I think this could be an example of matter manipulation as well, although some might argue its some sort of healing spell or something:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Ixion83/Thanos8i.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Ixion83/Thanos8ii.jpg

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/8524/fight81ph1.jpg
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/3087/fight82od2.jpg
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/7371/fight85ns8.jpg
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/1909/fight86yk9.jpg

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7479/fight131fe5.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/3051/fight132vi6.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/3244/fight133cc6.jpg
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/3456/fight134ja4.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/5728/fight135bb6.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/4823/fight136gd5.jpg
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7043/fight137vq3.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/6325/fight138ah0.jpg
http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5638/fight139as8.jpg
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/1299/fight1310pj9.jpg

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/9264/fight142ll2.jpg
http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/7346/fight143jw3.jpg
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/8537/fight144vk3.jpg
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/1222/fight145tb7.jpg

There is some.

Look Thanos uses a sword ! Yeah, so ? Every single character has used a sword from time to time. Does that make him a swordsman ?

Look Thanos beats Champion ! Yeah so ? Everybody beats Champion, he's the most overrated Marvel character ever. Thanos hid behind his shields, and punched him a bit.

Look Thanos beat an entire army. Well that's within his powers of course, I never argued about that. Too bad 99 pct of the fight was off panel, hm ?

It also shows Thanos can exaggerate quite a bit : he was bleeding. I seriously doubt that Superman would have been bleeding if he were in the place of Thanos.

Maybe Thanos' durability isn't all that after all ?

You can't use Thanos getting cut against him becase a) you don't know the strength of the warrior facing him b) you don't know the material of the weapon c) cutting Thanos doesn't matter, I've seen two occasions where someone cut him/made him bleed and hes smiled after both. You can't kill an Eternal by just cutting them.

And can you please stop replying to every argument with comments like "Oh Superman could do that only better", or "Anyone in Marvel could do that". Its tiresome as you don't actually back up your points, you just make broad exagerrating statements and expect people to accept them. I'm still waiting for that list of 100 women in Marvel more dangerous than Gamora by the way.

Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Those are "Great Fighting Skills" ? Okay lol, whatever you say. It seems we have a different opinion about Great Fighting Skills.

Look Thanos uses a sword ! Yeah, so ? Every single character has used a sword from time to time. Does that make him a swordsman ?

Look Thanos beats Champion ! Yeah so ? Everybody beats Champion, he's the most overrated Marvel character ever. Thanos hid behind his shields, and punched him a bit.

Look Thanos beat an entire army. Well that's within his powers of course, I never argued about that. Too bad 99 pct of the fight was off panel, hm ?

It also shows Thanos can exaggerate quite a bit : he was bleeding. I seriously doubt that Superman would have been bleeding if he were in the place of Thanos.

Maybe Thanos' durability isn't all that after all ?

*sigh*

You asked me to show skills, I showed you skills. I never said that he was Iron Fist or Shang-Chi, but in those examples he shows more skill then Despero has ever shown. The point is, HE CAN DO MORE THEN JUST BLAST PEOPLE, and I proved it.

Oh, and Thanos wasn't bleeding, that was the blood of his enemies, considering that the blood in his face and clothes is the same. Good try, though.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
*sigh*

You asked me to show skills, I showed you skills. I never said that he was Iron Fist or Shang-Chi, but in those examples he shows more skill then Despero has ever shown. The point is, HE CAN DO MORE THEN JUST BLAST PEOPLE, and I proved it.

Oh, and Thanos wasn't bleeding, that was the blood of his enemies, considering that the blood in his face and clothes is the same. Good try, though.

Originally posted by Juntai
Thanos did get messed up and almost died because of a black hole though. Something that Superman has little problems with.

Which issue?

I'd really put that aside as low showing, compared to rest of his durability showings which are far above Supes.