Goober: Has anything happened that you know of where Surfer's expended his personal stores of cosmic energy all at once?
'Cause that's what Thor's godblast is. If there was something similar from Surfer, might be a cool comparison. ATM, I don't think anything in Surfer's arsenal can compete with the Godblast's raw power.
Originally posted by Enyalus
Goober: Has anything happened that you know of where Surfer's expended his personal stores of cosmic energy all at once?'Cause that's what Thor's godblast is. If there was something similar from Surfer, might be a cool comparison. ATM, I don't think anything in Surfer's arsenal can compete with the Godblast's raw power.
The closest I've ever seen that springs to mind is when he evolved a dying planet and all life on in millions of years in a matter of seconds, and that's kinda tough to translate into blasting power.
*Edit*
Just looked again and it wasn't millions of years in seconds, it was billions of years in moments.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Not that I can think of off the top of my head, but if you give me a while I might think of something.The closest I've ever seen that springs to mind is when he evolved a dying planet and all life on in millions of years in a matter of seconds, and that's kinda tough to translate into blasting power.
Edit.
Just looked again and it wasn't millions of years in seconds, it was billions of years in moments.
Well, he exhausted himself forcing the Old Power back into Sakaar. Still hard to translate to blasting power. Hehe.
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Did you people read Blood and Thunder? I'll give you a quick recap. Scans will be up later.
- BRB knock the crap out of Thor, then both SS and BRB talk while
Thor lay semi conscious on the ground.. Thor # 468
- Thor's about to kill BRB
- Surfer stops by and tries to help
- Thor beats Surfer unconscious, BRB wakes up
- BRB puts Thor down and helps Surfer up
- Thor gets up, puts down BRB and fights Surfer
- Surfer sends away his board w/BRB
- Surfer's board returns to save him
- Thor and Surfer fight properly
- Surfer is beaten down and Warlock rescues him
Originally posted by quanchi112
He wasn't physically amping himself through her. Never was this described. You are interpreting the scan incorrectly. He amped himself later through the power gem.BrB confirmed he was mad and that he was figuratively drawing strength from her. His madness couldn't physically amp him only the power gem in this story could do so in a literal fashion.
Got the beatdown (draw strength) and proceeded to wipe the floors of BRB, SS, Warlock and the Infinity Watch.. BRB stated he was amping, i mean how else was he able to take out all this top tiers chars. all at once when he lost to one <<< stronger than the others? Like i said, the insanity was the result of Odin's manipulation of Thor's Spirit, Odin's magic.. Heck before blood and thunder this Valkerie showed up in Infinity crossover and went up against the goddess herself, its freak'n more than hallucination... It's my take...
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Warlock even states that Valkyrie is a figment of Thor's imagination and that she does not exist. That's why the soul gem didn't work on her. Why cannot people understand this?
Getting late, nightynight..lol
The more I look at this (I do have the Thor/Surfer/BRB battle comic but unfortunately not the whole arc), the more I'm thinking that perhaps "strength" shouldn't be taken so literally here (ie, how much Thor could've lifted). "Strength" in this instance might very well mean rapid recuperation...still, something good to have in a fight.
It should also be noted that, while Thor is down, Surfer and BRB are allowing Thor that recup time.
Yeah but i take it as some kinda boost on top of own abilities..
If BRB could done that by himself, imagine what the 3 of them could do blood lusted... Side the point, the other char. cept Thor were written poorly in that arc to a point where 3 top tier and the inf. Watch lost to some lowly Asgardian thugs who couldn't even fly...
Now you are completely misunderstanding me, Ambient. You attempted to counter the wrong argument. Let me make it a bit clearer.
Warlock could not detect or affect Valkyrie with the soul gem because she was not real. To which you proceeded to say
Originally posted by Ambient
It didn't work because of Thor's Asgardians physiology (mentology.. Whatever) they're soul better protected than humans..
I was referring to Valkyrie, not Thor. Warlock could not affect Thor because of his warrior spirit or physiology or whatever, that's granted. Warlock even said so himself. He could not affect Valkyrie for a whole nother reason though, because she did not exist. She existed solely within Thor's mind. That's why he is so surprised later, when Thor gets a hold of the power gem and makes her real. BEFORE that, she does not have a soul, she exists ONLY in Thor's mind.
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e156/marvelkris/Thor%20comics/WarlockInfinity-23-03.jpg
"The woman is a mental construct"
Originally posted by darthgooberI haven't refused to discuss anything. It's you who refuses to answer the topic's thread question. Who is more powerful and what are you basing this off of?
And you refused to discuss it beyond bringing up B&T.It gets the point across nicely though.
Since the thread is about who's more powerful between the two and the thread starter keeps on citing the same fight as evidence for one side, whether or not that fight is accurate has everything to do with the thread topic.
Would you like to put it to a test? I have a little free time coming up so we could have a Battlezone over whether or not B&T is an accurate reflection on how a match between the two would go in a forum fight.
You're ignoring the concept of PIS and trying to debate like your at herochat.
The validity of the evidence your presenting for Thor is right on topic. You really think accepting an imaginary concession makes you look like you're ahead in the debate?
No, it doesn't. You gave one of the examples this board uses as absolute pis which I completely agree with and therein draw a false comparison between Thor and Norrin. Thor and Norrin have always been in the same class while Spiderman and Firelord have not. That's the difference.
The fight being brought up proves even without the godblast Thor has proven to be more powerful than the Surfer in direct conflict. Thor didn't even use his most powerful attack while it seems the Surfer doesn't even have a most powerful attack. This fight in and of itself doesn't prove Thor's superiority in power but the godblast does.
No, I don't care to waste my time over whether this constitutes as pis. I will do a regular battlezone with you representing Thor vs. the Surfer though in combat. I remember the time you actually got trick to stack the odds in your favor representing Thanos and used a crossover as evidence when it's against the rules. You are a hypocrite.
No, I am not. I am simply saying it isn't pis because it isn't. You are trying to excuse two showings like we are on cbr and going by the highest feats alone which Thor still wins in this particular thread. We don't debate based on powersets alone and what you would do with the pc, friend. You should know this by now.
What does the Surfer have at his disposal that is as powerful or more so than the godblast?
Originally posted by AmbientNo, this has already been explained to you. He was drawing inner strength and self belief as he thought like always he was righteous. He wasn't literally amping himself. She wasn't even real at this point.
Fixed...Context... Pretty clear to me..
Got the beatdown (draw strength) and proceeded to wipe the floors of BRB, SS, Warlock and the Infinity Watch.. BRB stated he was amping, i mean how else was he able to take out all this top tiers chars. all at once when he lost to one <<< stronger than the others? Like i said, the insanity was the result of Odin's manipulation of Thor's Spirit, Odin's magic.. Heck before blood and thunder this Valkerie showed up in Infinity crossover and went up against the goddess herself, its freak'n more than hallucination... It's my take...
It didn't work because of Thor's Asgardians physiology (mentology.. Whatever) they're soul better protected than humans..
Getting late, nightynight..lol
The only time he literally amped himself was with the power gem when he literally stomped the infinity watch, strange, and the surfer.
Originally posted by MindshipExactly, it shouldn't be literally taken. Ambient is interpreting it wrong. They gave Thor enough recovery time.
The more I look at this (I do have the Thor/Surfer/BRB battle comic but unfortunately not the whole arc), the more I'm thinking that perhaps "strength" shouldn't be taken so literally here (ie, how much Thor could've lifted). "Strength" in this instance might very well mean rapid recuperation...still, something good to have in a fight.It should also be noted that, while Thor is down, Surfer and BRB are allowing Thor that recup time.
Originally posted by quanchi112I want to make sure I'm being clear here. They gave Thor the time to regain whatever strength he was drawing from his mental state, not just that they gave him time to recover. His mental state (whatever it was) was also a factor in that strength. BRB does say, "Nay. This battle is anything but done. He draws strength from the madness," not, "Nay. This battle is anything but done. His strength returns as we speak." One could even infer that had Thor's mental state been otherwise, the battle would've been over.
Exactly, it shouldn't be literally taken. Ambient is interpreting it wrong. They gave Thor enough recovery time.
Plus, Ambient does brings up a good point: what if Thor had not been given that time, especially if either Surfer or BRB (or both!) were as bloodlusted as he was.
Originally posted by Mindship
Plus, Ambient does brings up a good point: what if Thor had not been given that time, especially if either Surfer or BRB (or both!) were as bloodlusted as he was. This is not unlike the first Surfer/Thor fight, where Surfer drops into monologuing mode.
That works both ways. If Surfer had not interfered then BRB would be dead. Had BRB not interfered then the Surfer would be dead. The only reason why Thor was down was because BRB was able to get the jump on him from behind. Also note that Thor got up immediately from the pounding that BRB gave him. BRB was down for a long time.
Originally posted by MindshipHe was drawing inner strength to continue to fight on. He always thought his ways were just and that he was in the right here.
I want to make sure I'm being clear here. They gave Thor the time to regain whatever strength he was drawing from his mental state, not just that they gave him time to recover. His mental state (whatever it was) was also a factor in that strength. BRB does say, "Nay. This battle is anything but done. He draws strength from the madness," not, "Nay. This battle is anything but done. His strength returns as we speak."Plus, Ambient does brings up a good point: what if Thor had not been given that time, especially if either Surfer or BRB (or both!) were as bloodlusted as he was. This is not unlike the first Surfer/Thor fight, where Surfer drops into monologuing mode.
If they would have capitalized when he was off being crazy then maybe they could have beaten him. One on one and despite all the fighting he had been doing he beat them all one on one. They aided each other against him and at the end of the day it wasn't enough to stop his rampage.
Originally posted by Mindship
Indeed. But Bill's statement does implicate Thor's mental state as a factor.
To put it simply.
It is not something Thor could replicate in a friendly battle against the Surfer. The madness or will to fight on which he relied on there would only reappear in a scenario where they fight to the death or Surfer has gravely injured someone Thor cares for.
Originally posted by Kris BlazeI think the latter more likely, as I see Thor fighting harder to save someone he cares for than for himself (though couldn't one say that about most superheroes?)
It is not something Thor could replicate in a friendly battle against the Surfer. The madness or will to fight on which he relied on there would only reappear in a scenario where they fight to the death or Surfer has gravely injured someone Thor cares for.
