Who is more powerful, Thor or the Silver Surfer?

Originally posted by Naija boy
Okay, to compare who is more "powerful" (which is a pretty ambiguous term) i think wed have to compare them in different aspects and weigh the different advantages they have over each other. So ill start with POWER OUTPUT:

-Thors best power output showings-would have to be from his Godblasti. against galactus,Exitar,Dark Gods. Then aside those, his showing againt durok which wasnt a godblast was also extremely imprdessive

-Surfers best output feats would have to be his surpassong mephistos output in his own dimension and Creating a blackhole casually with his output in annnihilation. Aside that we also have him apparently almost felling thor with a warning blast by thors own admission.

In this area they are prety even with the Godblast giving thor the edge.

ENERGY ABSORPTION:

-Thors best absorption feat i think woould be his absorption of the galaxy wrecking nullbomb.

-Surfers best absorption feat i think would be the absorption of souls in the unilord saga. But that did have some circumstance surrounding it

In this area definitely advantage thor

ENERGY/MATTER MANIPULATION:

-THors best energy/matter manip feat is probably his shrinking of Hyperion to the size of an ant.

-Surfers got a whole lot of feats here ,his evolution of a planet by billions of years, trasnmuting the deviant lord ghaur from bacteria to his bodily form,converting a universes worth of psychic/soul energy into cosmic energy,channeling the crunch,sealing away the oldpower, synthesizing the odinforce etc. All extremely extremely impressive

Definitely advantage surfer here.

Further in regards to the numerous other esoteric capabilities (which are ttoo many to name) both have. Surfer also has the advantage as he has a wider range of abilities than thor does.

Physically they are also dead even with surfer having the advantage in durability and speed and with thor having the advantage in strength and fighting skills.

Therefore when we compare advantages and feats they are still pretty even imo with no real clear cut winner.

Thor's more powerful.

Originally posted by darthgoober
If you think about it, another feat for Surfer is the fact that he's pretty much ALWAYS portrayed as being more powerful than the Hulk by a fair amount in their encounters(he even one shotted the guy with his surf board when the first met). Seriously, how many heroes can say the same?

True surfer does better against hulk than even thor. (though that could be attributed to their different fighting styles)

http://img42.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc81&image=82724_all9.jpg
http://img140.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc137&image=82728_all10.jpg

Originally posted by psycho gundam
http://img42.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc81&image=82724_all9.jpg
http://img140.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc137&image=82728_all10.jpg

morg ...not so much

Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer not being as vicious as Thor most of the time doesn't make him a pacifist. Not everyone who's less violent than Thor is a pacifist. And Surfer has just as much spine as Thor. Hell Surfer's the one who jumpted in to take on Durok and Millinius when they were trouncing Thor as well as being the one to take down T&A.

No, not really. Surfer is a true hero and isn't a coward, but he's not even close to Thor and the resolve he brings to the table imo.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I never said that it did, but I gave a few examples of why he is still a pacifist.

No, not really. Surfer is a true hero and isn't a coward, but he's not even close to Thor and the resolve he brings to the table imo.

Would you like to compare feats of "resolve" between the two? You already mentioned Exitar and I countered with T&A so what else do you got?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Your examples don't point to him being a pacifist. They just point to his preferring violence to non violence. Captain America is no different but that doesn't make him a pacifist. Hell Thor's got instances of his looking for a better solution than swinging his hammer too.

Would you like to compare feats of "resolve" between the two? You already mentioned Exitar and I countered with T&A so what else do you got?

Surfer manipulated the crunch which is entirely different than the godblast. Surfer also would have died had it not been for Galactus' interference. How is that impressive? The feat would have killed him.

Grog the godcrusher couldn't even make a depowered Thor scream out in pain while he was torturing him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor also has examples of trying to kill the Hulk and losing it on more than one occasion to battle lust.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Surfer manipulated the crunch which is entirely different than the godblast. Surfer also would have died had it not been for Galactus' interference. How is that impressive? The feat would have killed him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Grog the godcrusher couldn't even make a depowered Thor scream out in pain while he was torturing him.

Originally posted by darthgoober
And? Again, Surfer not being as violent as Thor doesn't make him a pacifist. I'm not saying that Thor's not more violent, I'm saying that Surfer's no pacifist.

I'm not comparing the crutch to the Godblast, I'm comparing the resolve involved. Was Thor at risk of dying from using the Godblast?

Mephisto couldn't shatter Surfer's resolve when they were in Hades and he'd absorbed Surfer into his mind.

Thor was at risk the entire time against overwhelming odds. Exitar is a much bigger threat than T and A as well which he took on under his own power. Like I said Thor is much more powerful. Just concede and we can just focus on our little mini debate here already.

Thor broke free from the goddess' control due to a battle with Drax.

All my points still stand. Thor is more powerful, is a better warrior, fights with more ferocity, and looks for fights while the Surfer seeks to avoid them. One lives for conflict and one doesn't.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Surfer not beating his enemies into submission has cost him before and will do so again. Skaar is the example. he ended up taking orders from Hulk's son due to his stupidity and his power weakening due to separating the old power. Not looking impressive in any regards in that arc imo.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor was at risk the entire time against overwhelming odds. Exitar is a much bigger threat than T and A as well which he took on under his own power. Like I said Thor is much more powerful. Just concede and we can just focus on our little mini debate here already.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor broke free from the goddess' control due to a battle with Drax.

Originally posted by quanchi112
All my points still stand. Thor is more powerful, is a better warrior, fights with more ferocity, and looks for fights while the Surfer seeks to avoid them. One lives for conflict and one doesn't.

Originally posted by darthgoober
The same can be said of most heroes, including Thor. If he hadn't been a dumbass and brought Loki back with the other Asgardians then Loki wouldn't be plotting on him right now.

Surfer was also at risk the entire time, so it's still not a better showing of resolve.

Surfer broke free of the Goddesses control without needing a battle with Drax.

Not really. He's definitely a better and more ferocious warrior MOST of the time(not that it matters in forum fights since the rules stipulate that everyone's bloodlusted), but he's not more powerful and he DOES seek to avoid fights when possible.

Both put their asses on the line many, many times. Thor stood against a Celestial while 100 issues back even his father couldn't so much as put up a respectable fight against the 4th host.

So both did so. Thor did it in the heat of battle showing he won't listen to anyone in the midst of battle. He lives for it. Thor was also mentally unbalanced at the time and that was the only reason imo that he was with her even momentarily.

I am not saying he doesn't avoid some battles, but that he really enjoys going at it. How many times has he lost his cool in the middle of a battle and endangered innocents while the Surfer wouldn't even kill Morg after he killed Nova.

Thor is hands down a better warrior and don't even try to deny it. He is also a lot more powerful and their battle showed it as well. The Surfer fled like a coward against an all out Thor. The comics back me up, sport.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am referring to an in the battle moment. Loki hasn't done anything overtly hostile to Thor yet and has been doing it all behind the scenes. Loki is also ten times the manipulator Skaar is while a teenager subjugated the Surfer to his whims as his submissive.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Both put their asses on the line many, many times. Thor stood against a Celestial while 100 issues back even his father couldn't so much as put up a respectable fight against the 4th host.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So both did so. Thor did it in the heat of battle showing he won't listen to anyone in the midst of battle. He lives for it. Thor was also mentally unbalanced at the time and that was the only reason imo that he was with her even momentarily.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am not saying he doesn't avoid some battles, but that he really enjoys going at it. How many times has he lost his cool in the middle of a battle and endangered innocents while the Surfer wouldn't even kill Morg after he killed Nova.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor is hands down a better warrior and don't even try to deny it. He is also a lot more powerful and their battle showed it as well. The Surfer fled like a coward against an all out Thor. The comics back me up, sport.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Loki's been doing crap to Thor for thousands of years, but Thor still made the dumbass mistake of resurrecting him

And Surfer took on T&A. We've covered those. What ELSE do you have to support your claim that Thor has a greater resolve?

Why do you think that's the only reason he was with her in the first place, do you really think that's the only time he's been mind controlled... 😂 . Thor's head has been screwed with by Moondragon WITHOUT the Mind Gem a couple of times(in his defense he's also broken free and resisted). I didn't say that Surfer's feat was more impressive, I just matched the feat you listed.

Surfer doesn't condone cold blooded murder(even against a villain), but then again neither does Thor. Otherwise Loki probably would have died a thousand years ago. Surfer's more than willing to kill if it's necessary, otherwise he wouldn't have used time travel to prevent Overmind from even being born.

Depends on what you mean by "better". He most likely is more skilled, but Surfer's far more effective in combat. Also, he's not obviously more powerful and has even admitted that a warning blast from Surfer would have killed him.

I already told you. You have yet to speak about Grog the godcrusher. Bout time you conceded to Thor's overall power level being much higher than one of the Surfer's greatest feats which would have killed him if not for Galactus' intervention.

I never said it was the only time he was mindcontrolled. I merely stated that in this specific example that he wouldn't have followed her in his proper state of mind. He wanted to burn down asgard and crush his father.

His insanity actually was so strong it took physical manifestation in the story due to the events of the story.

Matched the feat? What are you talking about. The Surfer has been doing Galactus' dirty work for years and after all the pain and suffering he put him through he is actually dumb enough to service him again as his complete and utter lackey.

Thor would never follow around someone like Galactus as his peon like the Surfer is.

Thor has tried to kill the Hulk before and he isn't a bloodthirsty villain. Surfer just doesn't have the ferocity of Thor and the killer instinct. It's in his dna I am afraid.

No, the Surfer really isn't. Points to the Skaar fight where he lost too much power by separating the old power and his initial battle with Morg. The only reason the Surfer beat Morg is because he heals while Morg hasn't honed his skills yet and based on brutality and ferocity he wins hands down against Norrin. It's not in Norrin's dna.

Thor went all out against the Surfer and when the Surfer did the same he easily got pwned. The Surfer and Warlock couldn't even put up a decent defense against Thor two on one. Very rarely does a top tier handily decimate another one in the manner Thor had against Norrin. The funny thing is he did so again with Warlock at his side.

Nothing you say can take away from this and you will try and fail at distancing yourself from Thor owning the Surfer, twice.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It's his step brother. Loki is also a clever, insidious being who will always find a way to manage.

I already told you. You have yet to speak about Grog the godcrusher. Bout time you conceded to Thor's overall power level being much higher than one of the Surfer's greatest feats which would have killed him if not for Galactus' intervention.

I never said it was the only time he was mindcontrolled. I merely stated that in this specific example that he wouldn't have followed her in his proper state of mind. He wanted to burn down asgard and crush his father.

His insanity actually was so strong it took physical manifestation in the story due to the events of the story.

Matched the feat? What are you talking about. The Surfer has been doing Galactus' dirty work for years and after all the pain and suffering he put him through he is actually dumb enough to service him again as his complete and utter lackey.

Thor would never follow around someone like Galactus as his peon like the Surfer is.

Thor has tried to kill the Hulk before and he isn't a bloodthirsty villain. Surfer just doesn't have the ferocity of Thor and the killer instinct. It's in his dna I am afraid.

No, the Surfer really isn't. Points to the Skaar fight where he lost too much power by separating the old power and his initial battle with Morg. The only reason the Surfer beat Morg is because he heals while Morg hasn't honed his skills yet and based on brutality and ferocity he wins hands down against Norrin. It's not in Norrin's dna.

Thor went all out against the Surfer and when the Surfer did the same he easily got pwned. The Surfer and Warlock couldn't even put up a decent defense against Thor two on one. Very rarely does a top tier handily decimate another one in the manner Thor had against Norrin. The funny thing is he did so again with Warlock at his side.

Nothing you say can take away from this and you will try and fail at distancing yourself from Thor owning the Surfer, twice.

Yes I did, I brought up Mephisto. And I conceded no such thing. I never use the Crunch as a power output feat, I just use it as a channeling feat(and in this case, a resolve feat).

What makes you think it wouldn't have happened otherwise? You keep saying that, but why?

You mentioned him breaking out of the Goddess's mind control as a resolve feat(at least that's what I thought it was) and I brought up Surfer doing the same.

😂

That's in the heat of combat, he's never tried to kill him when he was beaten and helpless. Sure he is. You said it yourself, Thor mixes it up with the Hulk and has massive problems because of it. Surfer ends the fight early via gamma draining and such. And of course Morg's more ferocious than Surfer 🤨 .

PIS plain and simple. Surfer jumped off his board like a moron and gave up his massive mobility advantage. But you can look to their first fight to see that it's not his standard strategy. I'm calling PIS on one fight, you're trying to ignore every fight Thor's had with Hulk, Wonder Man, and Firelord.

And he obviously wasn't going all out, because according to Thor a warning blast from Surfer can kill him. 😉

Originally posted by darthgoober
Another possibility is that he was commenting on the way Thor's hammer was able to absorb his cosmic bolts early in the fight but Surfer was still able to keep it away from him with a forcefield.

Seriously, those two things(the "return effect" and absorption) are pretty much all the magic from Thor's hammer that Surfer had seen at that point so it doesn't really make sense for Surfer to say that.

I mean Thor's damaged an EXTREMELY weakened Galactus with his Godblast, but then again Surfer's casually created a blackhole with his energy discharge(which kinda implies a blast on par with a super nova). I have a hard time crediting Thor's feat as being outright more impressive given some of Galactus's low showings and his occasional difficulties with magic.

Originally posted by leonidas
you can't seperate thor/mjollnir.

Originally posted by Mindship
Conceptually, functionally, no. But the fact is, Thor is much more dependent on Mjolnir than Soarin' Norrin is on his board. Heck, when Surfer separated Thor from Mjolnir in their first fight, Surfer wasn't even on his board.

Why do you use that fight? 🙂

Fighting with Loki's power added onto his own, it's just not a scenario that's possible to replicate.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer not being as vicious as Thor most of the time doesn't make him a pacifist. Not everyone who's less violent than Thor is a pacifist. And Surfer has just as much spine as Thor. Hell Surfer's the one who jumpted in to take on Durok and Millinius when they were trouncing Thor as well as being the one to take down T&A.

You make it sound as if Surfer did better than Thor when actually Thor had been fighting Durok for many hours and Surfer was knocked unconscious much faster....

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Why do you use that fight? 🙂

Originally posted by Mindship
You know why I think that, as we've discussed it in another thread. ✅

Surfer was somewhat depowered yes, but Loki gave him all of his power.During Thor's imprisonment by Seth, Loki was able to restore him by giving him HALF of his own strength. It's impossible to tell how strong that Surfer was in comparison to his usual self, thus it's pure speculation.

I don't use Blood and Thunder as a way of gauging their power levels.