Who is more powerful, Thor or the Silver Surfer? · Comic Book 'Versus' Forum

D_Dude1210 Doink!

Originally posted by quanchi112
The thread isn't about who can cause more massive destruction, but who is more powerful.

W/c isn't clear on what the correct criteria would be about what "powerful" is.

An extremely powerful laser could cut thru even the strongest alloys like butter, but a typhoon would be able to cause more wanton destruction but be unable to even scratch it, w/c is more powerful?

Kris Blaze Restricted

It'll be impossible to reach a proper conclusion here. They're both very powerful and they both have their own strengths and weaknesses. Though both have very few of the latter. 🙂

I'll upload some scans where Thor chooses not to harm innocents who attack.

Mindship Snap out of it.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
"Enow" doesn't really indicate that he's losing....

Not losing: stalemating. Maybe Loki figured he'd get as far with Surfer, if he continued, as you and I get in always debating that fight.

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As for Juggs handling the Godblast (and so easily): the writers should never have thrown it in in the first place, IMO. For Galactus, it was an acceptable option, all things considered. But for Juggs...the fight could've been just as exciting, I bet, with other options (Thor didn't use it on Mangog, did he?). If you bring up something special too often, it ceases to be special.

Kris Blaze Restricted

Originally posted by Mindship
Not losing: stalemating. Maybe Loki figured he'd get as far with Surfer, if he continued, as you and I get in always debating that fight.
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As for Juggs handling the Godblast (and so easily): the writers should never have thrown it in in the first place, IMO. For Galactus, it was an acceptable option, all things considered. But for Juggs...the fight could've been just as exciting, I bet, with other options (Thor didn't use it on Mangog, did he?). If you bring up something special too often, it ceases to be special.

Loki discovered that Surfer was powerful enough for the task 🙂

Thor didn't use it against Mangog. And it DID serve it's purpose against Juggernaut, forcing him back and into the ground so that he could be BFR'D.

D_Dude1210 Doink!

To be fair, Thor was weakened at the time, so the Godblast might not have been full strength either.

psycho gundam The Nightmare of Solomon

Originally posted by quanchi112
Who cares if it leaves him vulnerable afterwards. It proves he is more powerful. That is what this thread is all about.
You know comics don't have to make sense, right?

don't be stupid.

if the blast misses or doesn't work, he's gambled and lost a lot of energy and vitality he normally would have had. basically it's like cashing in most of your chips on a roulette table.

it matters.

Kris Blaze Restricted

Thor can harm Surfer using regular attacks, why the fudge would he use a Godblast? He used it against Galactus, Exitar, One of the Enchanters and Juggernaut. All of whom are either much more powerful than him or obscenely difficult to injure.

darthgoober Senior Member

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor ended asgard including Loki at the end of his run. Again, Loki is a clever manipulator and they weren't in the midst of a battle. Surfer just tried to leave town after he told everyone on planet Sakaar they were all doomed. He's an idiot and shouldn't have left himself so vulnerable to Skaar. He paid for it.
When has Thor ever given up to Mephisto? Hela also wants his soul badly. Thor is more sought after than even the Silver Surfer. Mephisto backed down to Hela too by the way when she threatened to invade his realm. Food for thought.
This is why pis is a bad rule. You are handicapping Thor while dismissing a direct confrontation. I can call pis on his fight with the Hulk because he trades blows for blow while ignoring his hammer's exotic abilities that could get him the win every time. You cannot dismiss one while not calling pis on the other.
We have two direct fights. Thor won decisively in both of them. Warlock had to save the Surfer's ass by using his board to flee.
Because he was mentally unstable and looking for another cause since he turned his back on Odin and asgard.
Yes, I did so to show the resolve he has during battle which the Surfer does not have. Surfer battles as a last resort while Thor and all asgardians live to test themselves.
I understand this, but the fact remains the Surfer will avoid killing someone at all costs even during the heat of combat while the Surfer won't. He won't even take the life of someone who will continue to murder over and over again while just butchering Nova.
Thor was probably going to kill the red hulk as well while he was stunned and at his mercy prior to Rulk interfering. Surfer couldn't even beat Thanos in Strange's scenario even after he had the advantage. The guy is weak and always will be.
Yes, thor and Hulk have one heckuva rivalry but the Surfer and Thor don't. Thor has dominated him twice in one story under his own power. ABC logic won't save you here. Yes, and like I said the only reason Morg didn't defeat the Surfer is due to Surfer healing himself which Morg hasn't shown the ability to do. That's it.
What are you talking about? Thor almost killed the Surfer twice. Thor going all out>>Surfer going all out with Warlock at his side. The comic showed us how a fight goes down and it wasn't even close. Surfer fled from thor's wrath.

We weren't comparing Loki to Skaar, we were comparing Thor's capacity to let evil villains off the hook without killing them to Surfers. They both do it.

I never said that he did. I just pointed out a resolve feat from Surfer that's just as impressive as your feat from Thor.

Hey you're the one who thinks Hulk vs Thor confrontations are valid, I'm more than willing to admit that Thor not using his powers is PIS. But Surfer's portrayed as being outright more powerful than Hulk in most of their encounters, there's always a question in regards to Thor though.

Surfer has just as much resolve as Thor, which is why I've been able to match feats.

"Surfer will avoid killing someone at all costs even during the heat of combat while the Surfer won't."... 😂 Surfer's more than willing to kill in the heat of combat.

Surfer didn't want to die because he took out Thanos. Thor wouldn't have finished him off either.

What the Hell does Morg have to do with this thread? And what makes you think he only won because he healed himself? I don't remember that being shown at all in their fight.

I'm talking about Thor saying in another encounter that a warning blast from Surfer nearly killed him.

Kris Blaze Restricted

Originally posted by darthgoober
We weren't comparing Loki to Skaar, we were comparing Thor's capacity to let evil villains off the hook without killing them to Surfers. They both do it.
I never said that he did. I just pointed out a resolve feat from Surfer that's just as impressive as your feat from Thor.

They both like to do the right thing and avoid combat.

But when it gets down to it, Thor's much easier to goad into a fight. Partially because he actually enjoys it and partially because his asgardian heritage demands that he honours a challenge.

darthgoober Senior Member

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
They both like to do the right thing and avoid combat.
But when it gets down to it, Thor's much easier to goad into a fight. Partially because he actually enjoys it and partially because his asgardian heritage demands that he honours a challenge.

I never said otherwise. I'm just addressing Quan's claims that Surfer is a pacifist who avoids combat at any cost. But like I said not everyone who's less violent than Thor is a pacifist. When you get right down to it, Surfer's no more a pacifist than Captain America(especially since Annihilation).

Kris Blaze Restricted

Thor vs Mephisto and the legions of hell

Thor vs Loki's minions and eventually Loki. (Thor is weakened here and Loki beats him)

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e156/marvelkris/Thor%20comics/Thor206-12.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e156/marvelkris/Thor%20comics/Thor206-13.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e156/marvelkris/Thor%20comics/Thor206-14.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e156/marvelkris/Thor%20comics/Thor206-17.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e156/marvelkris/Thor%20comics/Thor206-18.jpg

We also see that Thor tries to avoid harming the dogs.

Originally posted by darthgoober
I never said otherwise. I'm just addressing Quan's claims that Surfer is a pacifist who avoids combat at any cost. But like I said not everyone who's less violent than Thor is a pacifist.

Yup, I'm agreeing with you 🙂

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by darthgoober
We weren't comparing Loki to Skaar, we were comparing Thor's capacity to let evil villains off the hook without killing them to Surfers. They both do it.
I never said that he did. I just pointed out a resolve feat from Surfer that's just as impressive as your feat from Thor.
Hey you're the one who thinks Hulk vs Thor confrontations are valid, I'm more than willing to admit that Thor not using his powers is PIS. But Surfer's portrayed as being outright more powerful than Hulk in most of their encounters, there's always a question in regards to Thor though.
Surfer has just as much resolve as Thor, which is why I've been able to match feats.
"Surfer will avoid killing someone at all costs even during the heat of combat while the Surfer won't."... 😂 Surfer's more than willing to kill in the heat of combat.
Surfer didn't want to die because he took out Thanos. Thor wouldn't have finished him off either.
What the Hell does Morg have to do with this thread? And what makes you think he only won because he healed himself? I don't remember that being shown at all in their fight.
I'm talking about Thor saying in another encounter that a warning blast from Surfer nearly killed him.

I am not saying they both don't do it from time to time as they are both heroes I am saying the Surfer does it ninety nine point nine percent of the time.

Surfer did it during a battle which got him serviced by Skaar. He left himself vulnerable. That is the difference between the Surfer and Thor. Surfer isn't even smart enough to beat his opponent into submission when he has the upper hand.

Because of Thor's warrior like mentality. If Surfer had Thor's hammer Hulk couldn't goad him into tossing it aside like he does against Thor. Thor's vanity as a warrior has him meet Hulk blow for blow refusing to give in. Surfer doesn't have the warrior mentality. If you want to argue powerset vs. powerset Thor crushes the Hulk but they fight in character. So we also accept the Surfer's battle against Thor as he was dominated in character and it's a legitimate showing you want to ignore because your poster boy got crushed.

Nope. I don't see him as having as much resolve as Thor.

You really haven't matched feats. You have given a few examples of him battling unto death, but Thor would do the same thing. Surfer also ran like a coward from Thor in a direct confrontation. Such resolve.

He didn't do so against Ravenous or Morg who just killed Nova.

He was screaming at Terrax to stop while Terrax just basically did what needed to be done. Surfer's mentality is too merciful even when someone he cares for gets killed right in front of him.

I disagree. Had Thor been in that situation he would have defeated Thanos. Didn't he kill the Thanos clone? What the hell is your point?

Yes, Surfer said that Morg only relies on brute force and what not while the Surfer healed himself during this fight making it the determining factor.

That has what to do with them going all out in blood and thunder? The Surfer could barely phase him let alone kill him.

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa41/quanchi112/Thor_vol2-521-019-20.jpg

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa41/quanchi112/Thor_vol2-522-020-09.jpg

Ambient MAJIN_OVERLORD

Originally posted by quanchi112
Mindship, one quick thing in response to your post. It wasn't warrior's madness. They thought it was, but it wasn't. There was no amp in strength making it perfectly within the realm of an all out Thor with no additional amps until later on when he acquired the power gem.

Ohh dont know about that, take a look at this scan..

It might not be WM but its similar.. He draws strength from it..

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by Ambient
Ohh dont know about that, take a look at this scan..
It might not be WM but its similar.. He draws strength from it..

Later it was decided by Odin not to be warrior's madness. He was just crazy. he wasn't amped at all until he got the power gem.

darthgoober Senior Member

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am not saying they both don't do it from time to time as they are both heroes I am saying the Surfer does it ninety nine point nine percent of the time.
Surfer did it during a battle which got him serviced by Skaar. He left himself vulnerable. That is the difference between the Surfer and Thor. Surfer isn't even smart enough to beat his opponent into submission when he has the upper hand.
Because of Thor's warrior like mentality. If Surfer had Thor's hammer Hulk couldn't goad him into tossing it aside like he does against Thor. Thor's vanity as a warrior has him meet Hulk blow for blow refusing to give in. Surfer doesn't have the warrior mentality. If you want to argue powerset vs. powerset Thor crushes the Hulk but they fight in character. So we also accept the Surfer's battle against Thor as he was dominated in character and it's a legitimate showing you want to ignore because your poster boy got crushed.
Nope. I don't see him as having as much resolve as Thor.
You really haven't matched feats. You have given a few examples of him battling unto death, but Thor would do the same thing. Surfer also ran like a coward from Thor in a direct confrontation. Such resolve.
He didn't do so against Ravenous or Morg who just killed Nova.
He was screaming at Terrax to stop while Terrax just basically did what needed to be done. Surfer's mentality is too merciful even when someone he cares for gets killed right in front of him.
I disagree. Had Thor been in that situation he would have defeated Thanos. Didn't he kill the Thanos clone? What the hell is your point?
Yes, Surfer said that Morg only relies on brute force and what not while the Surfer healed himself during this fight making it the determining factor.
That has what to do with them going all out in blood and thunder? The Surfer could barely phase him let alone kill him.
http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa41/quanchi112/Thor_vol2-521-019-20.jpg
http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa41/quanchi112/Thor_vol2-522-020-09.jpg

Yeah Surfer does it more often which is why Thor's more violent. But the fact that Thor does it too means that it's not the trait of a pacifist unless you consider Thor one.

Which supports the notion that Surfer's more effective in combat, because he's not goaded into rash action nearly as often. No I accept neither because of PIS(and in the case of Blood and Thunder, an inconsistent portrayal of the characters).

Of course he has as much resolve and of course I've matched feats. You brought up his standing his ground in the face of near certain death against the Celestials, I brought up Surfer doing the same against T&A. You brought up him breaking free of the Goddess, I brought up Surfer doing the same. You brought up his resolve during torture, I brought up Surfer's resolve while trapped in the mind of Mephisto.

He's still done it. Just because there are instances of him not killing it doesn't mean that he refuses to kill. Do you have any idea how many times Thor's let his opponent go without killing them?

Surfer seeks justice, not vengeance. That doesn't make him a pacifist.

If Thanos had been killed the Universe would have been doomed(this was specifically covered towards the end of the fight from what I remember). Thor wouldn't sacrifice the universe just to sate his desire for vengeance, that's why he's a hero.

Again, when was Surfer stated to be healing himself during their fight?

Because Thor's statement points to B&T being BS. As does Thor's previous fights with guys like Firelord.

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by darthgoober
Yeah Surfer does it more often which is why Thor's more violent. But the fact that Thor does it too means that it's not the trait of a pacifist unless you consider Thor one.
Which supports the notion that Surfer's more effective in combat, because he's not goaded into rash action nearly as often. No I accept neither because of PIS(and in the case of Blood and Thunder, an inconsistent portrayal of the characters).
Of course he has as much resolve and of course I've matched feats. You brought up his standing his ground in the face of near certain death against the Celestials, I brought up Surfer doing the same against T&A. You brought up him breaking free of the Goddess, I brought up Surfer doing the same. You brought up his resolve during torture, I brought up Surfer's resolve while trapped in the mind of Mephisto.
He's still done it. Just because there are instances of him not killing it doesn't mean that he refuses to kill. Do you have any idea how many times Thor's let his opponent go without killing them?
Surfer seeks justice, not vengeance. That doesn't make him a pacifist.
If Thanos had been killed the Universe would have been doomed(this was specifically covered towards the end of the fight from what I remember). Thor wouldn't sacrifice the universe just to sate his desire for vengeance, that's why he's a hero.
Again, when was Surfer stated to be healing himself during their fight?
Because Thor's statement points to B&T being BS. As does Thor's previous fights with guys like Firelord.

Thor is a warrior and it has nothing to do with him being more violent. he doesn't go around killing anyone but he will kill a beaten opponent which you disputed. The Surfer is too weak to do what must be done at time so Terrax helped him out.

That's because you disagree with the outcome. That's why pis drives me crazy and be used sparingly. You are basically saying the writer's stuff doesn't cut it and you will ignore it and write it off basically as the Surfer got crushed. That's essentially what you are doing.

Once again the Surfer fled from the Thor therefore in direct comparison Thor has a greater resolve. Thor wouldn't stop battling Drax even when he was told it was pointless as long as Drax had the power gem he was physically unbeatable.

I provided a nearly identical situation to the one the Surfer was in. Thor wanted to kill a defeated opponent while the Surfer protested at Terrax doing so to Morg. The guy just butchered Nova and he didn't have the stones to let someone else do it.

His mentality makes him a pacifist. The guy wanted to give up his power cosmic before.

Surfer wouldn't kill Thanos, ever. Thor has done just that. It was later retconned into a clone, but it doesn't change the fact that Surfer wouldn't do so. It's not in him.

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa41/quanchi112/SilverSurferAnnual07_29-1.jpg

Quit running from their direct confrontations in blood and thunder.

Kris Blaze Restricted

Originally posted by Ambient
Ohh dont know about that, take a look at this scan..
It might not be WM but its similar.. He draws strength from it..

We can't see the picture.

Enyalus MALE DOMINANCE!!!

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
We can't see the picture.

I can. 😛

darthgoober Senior Member

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor is a warrior and it has nothing to do with him being more violent. he doesn't go around killing anyone but he will kill a beaten opponent which you disputed. The Surfer is too weak to do what must be done at time so Terrax helped him out.
That's because you disagree with the outcome. That's why pis drives me crazy and be used sparingly. You are basically saying the writer's stuff doesn't cut it and you will ignore it and write it off basically as the Surfer got crushed. That's essentially what you are doing.
Once again the Surfer fled from the Thor therefore in direct comparison Thor has a greater resolve. Thor wouldn't stop battling Drax even when he was told it was pointless as long as Drax had the power gem he was physically unbeatable.
I provided a nearly identical situation to the one the Surfer was in. Thor wanted to kill a defeated opponent while the Surfer protested at Terrax doing so to Morg. The guy just butchered Nova and he didn't have the stones to let someone else do it.
His mentality makes him a pacifist. The guy wanted to give up his power cosmic before.
Surfer wouldn't kill Thanos, ever. Thor has done just that. It was later retconned into a clone, but it doesn't change the fact that Surfer wouldn't do so. It's not in him.
http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa41/quanchi112/SilverSurferAnnual07_29-1.jpg
Quit running from their direct confrontations in blood and thunder.

Wait so your one example proves that Thor's willing to kill in cold blood? In that case, Surfer "killed" a beaten and helpless Mephisto at one point(it turned out Meph faked his death, but Surfer didn't know that at the time).

And you're saying that all the writers who've written Thor vs Hulk, Wonder Man, or Firelord as well as the writer who had Thor admit that Surfer nearly killed with a warning blast don't cut it and you will ignore all of it and write all of it off. Who's trying to throw out more evidence?

Thor was insane at the time. That's not a reflection of his resolve in a normal state.

Hasn't Thor given up the power of the Runes and the Odin Power?

Sure he would. He even commented on how he would enjoy nothing more than killing Thanos, but without Thanos the universe would be destroyed.

He fixed his board he didn't heal himself. Fixing his board is what Surfer illustrated the distinction between them. Morg destroys things, Surfer can fix things.

I'm not running, I'm countering it with everything else about both characters.

Kris Blaze Restricted

Originally posted by Enyalus
I can. 😛

Try enlargening it.