No, really, my point is that using this train of thought, anyone could argue that their favorite character could solo the DCU merely by saying that they like the character's backstory more.
Look at the forum rules, for example:
"Batman can beat Thor because he's cooler!" That's an example of how not to debate.
What you're saying is that in this case, such an argument would actually be valid
Originally posted by Endless Mike
No, really, my point is that using this train of thought, anyone could argue that their favorite character could solo the DCU merely by saying that they like the character's backstory more.Look at the forum rules, for example:
What you're saying is that in this case, such an argument would actually be valid
No, because then that argument would be based on my own personal opinion and not what went down in the comic. Superman was chosen in Beyond for a reason. That's the only argument one can use when debating Mandrakk 😐
Originally posted by SoulDevourertrying to, in some way, quantify the primal monitor's power by comparing it to beyonder is full of fail.
basicaly u think Prime Monitor is more like PR Beyonder or somethin?
understand that the primal monitor was responsible for creating the very first monitor, dax novu [aka. mandrakk], as well as creating anti-monitor *by necessity* to balance dax out. understand that these beings were created as nothing but insignificant 'probes' in which to examine what the primal monitor considered a microscopic flaw within itself [the original multiverse.]
when you begin to realize the fact that beings like dax novu [mandrakk] and anti-monitor were absolutely nothing in comparison to the primal monitor, you will begin to realize that trying to quantify the primal monitor's power is... moot. it would be like trying to count to infinity.
Originally posted by theICONiac
...and Superman with his 'origin story' beat the biggest, baddest omnipotent evil the DCU has ever/will ever see. 😮
Originally posted by Endless Mikewhat don't you fellas understand?
He was chosen because he had a better story. All you have to do is argue that your character's story is even better.
our own personal opinion(s) regarding which character's story is better means absolutely NOTHING in regards to who could defeat mandrakk. within DC comics, the story of superman is > ALL others - why do you think the friggin' cosmic armor was modeled after him in the first place?
you also need to understand a fact that i've mentioned SEVERAL times now... superman's story alone WAS NOT what beat mandrakk. superman/his story had to first be mega-amped by the cosmic armor, which is capable of adapting instantly to combat ANY threat, even the 'eternal' power of mandrakk - and even that was BARELY enough. in fact, had the battle lasted any longer, superman would NOT have won [as the armor was nearly destroyed.]
in short, it took THE most powerful plot device i've seen [which was, ironically enough, created BY mandrakk himself] + the best story within DC comics, just to scantily pull out the win.
if you'd like to argue any of the facts i mentioned, i suggest you first reread "superman beyond". 🙂
Originally posted by Galan007yeah and PR Beyonder bearly noticed the OMNIverse 😐 it wuz like a microbe under microscope or somethin
trying to, in some way, quantify the primal monitor's power by comparing it to beyonder is full of fail.understand that the primal monitor was responsible for creating the very first monitor, dax novu [aka. mandrakk], as well as creating anti-monitor *by necessity* to balance dax out. understand that these beings were created as nothing but insignificant 'probes' in which to examine what the primal monitor considered a microscopic flaw within itself [the original multiverse.]
when you begin to realize the fact that beings like dax novu [mandrakk] and anti-monitor were absolutely nothing in comparison to the primal monitor, you will begin to realize that trying to quantify the primal monitor's power is... moot. it would be like trying to count to infinity.
btw the omniverse is more then billions of universes so thats a bit more then 52 lol
Originally posted by SoulDevourerfacepalm
btw the omniverse is more then billions of universes so thats a bit more then 52 lol
it was the original multiverse that the primal monitor sent his 'probes' to explore. the original multiverse = an infinite number of universes, buddy.
oh and just so you know, the current DCU links directly to companies like wildstorm [which is a multiverse in itself.] ie. the current DCU is MUCH more than 52 universes, all things considered.
Originally posted by Galan007
what don't you fellas understand?our own personal opinion(s) regarding which character's story is better means absolutely NOTHING in regards to who could defeat mandrakk. within DC comics, the story of superman is > ALL others - why do you think the friggin' cosmic armor was modeled after him in the first place?
you also need to understand a fact that i've mentioned SEVERAL times now... superman's story alone WAS NOT what beat mandrakk. superman/his story had to first be mega-amped by the cosmic armor, which is capable of adapting instantly to combat ANY threat, even the 'eternal' power of mandrakk - and even that was BARELY enough. in fact, had the battle lasted any longer, superman would NOT have won [as the armor was nearly destroyed.]
in short, it took THE most powerful plot device i've seen [which was, ironically enough, created BY mandrakk himself] + the best story within DC comics, just to scantily pull out the win.
if you'd like to argue any of the facts i mentioned, i suggest you first reread "superman beyond". 🙂
Still waiting to hear what feats Mandrakk has that would show he would decimate the Ultimator... 😛
Originally posted by jalek moyeSince there is only one Livivng Tribunal,
and that is an established universe and not a what if.
It might be canon for Living Tribunal
'What ifs' are more canon than that garbage,
at-least they're referenced in the officially Marvel sponsored 'What If' Bio site,
that story concerening the LT & Reed isn't recollected in any bio, of any kind.
It's not even acknowledged in the MC2 Universe Handbook bio,
which does reference every story that ever took place in the MC 2 reality,
well, every story except for the LT joint,
and the one where Spiderman defeats the Hulk hand to hand. 😂
btw. It's also ignored in the Living Tribunal's bio as well (even the updated 08)
while every other appearance
the LT has ever made (including 'What ifs'😉 is.
Originally posted by SoulDevoureryeah and PR Beyonder bearly noticed the OMNIverse
it wuz like a microbe under microscope or somethin
Yea, the Primal Monitor is like DC's version of pre-retcon Beyonder imo.
Actually, it's almost the same shit with a twist.
btw. For the record:
The infinite Marvel Omniverse compared to Beyonder
was like a drop of water next to an ocean.
Originally posted by SoulDevourerbtw the omniverse is more then billions of universes so thats a bit more then 52 lol
So instead of billions, it's simply an infinite number of realities.
(infinite > billions - or whatever other number you can think of)
Originally posted by Galan007
[B]trying to, in some way, quantify the primal monitor's power by comparing it to beyonder is full of fail.understand that the primal monitor was responsible for creating the very first monitor, dax novu [aka. mandrakk], as well as creating anti-monitor *by necessity* to balance dax out.
Then that shows a limit. If he was truly omnipotent he wouldn't need to do anything, he could just say "balance him out? Screw that, I don't have to if I don't want to".
understand that these beings were created as nothing but insignificant 'probes' in which to examine what the primal monitor considered a microscopic flaw within itself [the original multiverse.]
If he was omnipotent he would not have any flaws. If he was omnipotent he would not mistake the multiverse for a flaw. If he was omnipotent he could fix it instantly. If he was omnipotent, he wouldn't need to send probes into it, he could know everything about it just by willing to know.
when you begin to realize the fact that beings like dax novu [mandrakk] and anti-monitor were absolutely nothing in comparison to the primal monitor, you will begin to realize that trying to quantify the primal monitor's power is... moot. it would be like trying to count to infinity.
Except your own posts show he clearly has limits, making him inferior to a True Omnipotent being.
what don't you fellas understand?our own personal opinion(s) regarding which character's story is better means absolutely NOTHING in regards to who could defeat mandrakk. within DC comics, the story of superman is > ALL others - why do you think the friggin' cosmic armor was modeled after him in the first place?
Exactly - Within DC Comics. But the vs. forum involves putting characters from DC comics against characters from other fictional works. Just because Superman's story is the best in DC Comics doesn't mean it's the best in Marvel Comics or Image Comics.
Then that shows a limit. If he was truly omnipotent he wouldn't need to do anything, he could just say "balance him out? Screw that, I don't have to if I don't want to".
If he was omnipotent he would not have any flaws. If he was omnipotent he would not mistake the multiverse for a flaw. If he was omnipotent he could fix it instantly. If he was omnipotent, he wouldn't need to send probes into it, he could know everything about it just by willing to know.
Except your own posts show he clearly has limits, making him inferior to a True Omnipotent being.
Exactly - Within DC Comics. But the vs. forum involves putting characters from DC comics against characters from other fictional works. Just because Superman's story is the best in DC Comics doesn't mean it's the best in Marvel Comics or Image Comics.
Originally posted by xJLxKing
No, he noticed something inside him. He didn't know what it is. He viewed it as a flaw, and a germ. It was nothing to him. So he sent monitors there.
Except if he was omnipotent, there would be nothing he wouldn't notice.
What if he doesn't want to will it.
Then he's an idiot.
The second Mandrakk entered the void, it was forgotten. Void=primal monitor
How does that contradict anything I said?
Why do you think people don't want to use Mandrakk in a vs thread. Also, if you are going to use him in a VS then use him correctly. It was stated that only Superman's story is better. When in a VS topic, you have to apply that rule. There is nothing in marvel to say that they have the best story. Nothing was ever stated about a character having the best story in Marvel. Even then, you are going to need a weapon that adapts so a threat ASAP.
Okay so if we have one story where we have an unbreakable shield that can only be broken by one weapon, it doesn't mean that it's unbreakable to anything from any other fictional story, it just means it's unbreakable to anything from that particular story except that weapon.
And apparently people are using Mandrakk in the vs. forum, this thread is an indication of that.
Except if he was omnipotent, there would be nothing he wouldn't notice.
Then he's an idiot.
Okay so if we have one story where we have an unbreakable shield that can only be broken by one weapon, it doesn't mean that it's unbreakable to anything from any other fictional story, it just means it's unbreakable to anything from that particular story except that weapon. And apparently people are using Mandrakk in the vs. forum, this thread is an indication of that.