Jiraiya Vs. Pein, the rematch

Originally posted by dadudemon
Jiraiya was his young self, not his "learned and wise" Sage self, when he fought Hanzo. He came a long way since his days of fighting Hanzo.

Pain is definitely formidible in his own form, for sure. However, an enraged sage mode Naruto resisted Pain's body control technique.

I was thinking more along the lines of Jiraiya summoning a giant massive toad, then have the toad jump super high in the air and land right on top of Pain. The aind.

He's had a lot of practice with Kyuubi. Jiraiya had to get Pa Frog to get out the rod that was in him.

How is that going to stop Shinra Tensei? lol

Originally posted by Kento
And Nagato was his young self not his super body puppet, dispel any move self when he killed Hanzo and a bunch of others by ripping out their soul.

He's had a lot of practice with Kyuubi. Jiraiya had to get Pa Frog to get out the rod that was in him.

How is that going to stop Shinra Tensei? lol

Originally posted by dadudemon
Pain is definitely formidible in his own form, for sure. However, an enraged sage mode Naruto resisted Pain's body control technique.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/444/04/

Obviously an ability that Jiraiya lacks.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I was thinking more along the lines of Jiraiya summoning a giant massive toad, then have the toad jump super high in the air and land right on top of Pain. The aind.

The toad probably won't even fit in the building... and even then shinra tensei will stop it.

Originally posted by dadudemon
But that's not what Pain meant when he said Jiraiya could beat him if he knew his secret.

Originally posted by King Kandy
No, it was kyuubi sage mode that did that and we see the kyuubi's chakra overpowering Pein's there.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/444/04/

Obviously an ability that Jiraiya lacks.

The toad probably won't even fit in the building... and even then shinra tensei will stop it.

What exactly did he mean, then?

that was narutos will power the fox part was shown to demonstrate naruto's rage because that only comes out when he is mad

Originally posted by yungz22
thats not fair jiraiya had one arm how cold he have taken it out

Originally posted by yungz22
that was narutos will power the fox part was shown to demonstrate naruto's rage because that only comes out when he is mad

Originally posted by King Kandy
That is not even remotely implied... Naruto's eyes turned into his fox form eyes and we clearly see kyuubi chakra in Nagato the same way we saw Rinnegan chakra in the people Pein stabbed.

Originally posted by Kento
Which side did it hit him on?

Originally posted by King Kandy
No, it was kyuubi sage mode that did that and we see the kyuubi's chakra overpowering Pein's there.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/444/04/

Obviously an ability that Jiraiya lacks.

I'm aware of this: ergo my saying enraged sage-mode (which is an incompatible dichotomy as I remember papa toad sage saying he couldn't mix the two because the fox's chakra was too volatile or something.)

And, there's nothing that says that it takes the enraged sage-mode to resist Pain, at all. Seems more of a willpower thing, something naruto and Jiraiya have common.

Originally posted by King Kandy
The toad probably won't even fit in the building... and even then shinra tensei will stop it.

What exactly did he mean, then?

Oh, so now this toad, which jumps out of the sky to an unwitting Pain, and falls on him, and crushes him, is all of a sudden trying to walk into the building? That doesn't really fit well with what we were talking about.

He meant exactly as I have been describing it: if he knew his secret, he would have definitely pursued other methods of getting at Pain instead of his bodies. Remember that he bodies were almost all in these coffin type thingies with one or two, at most, being up and about. Drop a giant toad on the bodies: they are done. The other one or two go to investigate, another toad drops on the distracted Pain. The aind.

Like I said, there's a million and one ways Jiraiya could execute Pain, if he knew his secret. We could script this all day with many different things simply because Jiraiya has tons of chakra and a sage-mode.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Like I said, there's a million and one ways Jiraiya could execute Pain, if he knew his secret. We could script this all day with many different things simply because Jiraiya has tons of chakra and a sage-mode.

Originally posted by Kento
Yea if you simply forget all of the bodies abilities. Or Animal Realm is the girl version, and Pain is severely weakened.

How are the bodies supposed to do anything while they are in their suspended state? I really believe Pain when he says Jiraiya could have killed him if he had known his secret. I seems everyone is hung up on the fact that Jiraiya has to start the fight with all the bodies active and aware of Jiraiya. That's not the case, nor would it be: Jiraiya is an effin' ninja...you know....the most highly trained assassin/combat units in their world? Jiraiya was one of their strongest (at the time). At the very least, he was top 5.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that a fully "awakened" Pain is really the strongest character in the series. Would I be wrong in assuming that?

Originally posted by dadudemon
How are the bodies supposed to do anything while they are in their suspended state? I really believe Pain when he says Jiraiya could have killed him if he had known his secret. I seems everyone is hung up on the fact that Jiraiya has to start the fight with all the bodies active and aware of Jiraiya. That's not the case, nor would it be: Jiraiya is an effin' ninja...you know....the most highly trained assassin/combat units in their world? Jiraiya was one of their strongest (at the time). At the very least, he was top 5.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that a fully "awakened" Pain is really the strongest character in the series. Would I be wrong in assuming that?

Originally posted by dadudemon
I'm aware of this: ergo my saying enraged sage-mode (which is an incompatible dichotomy as I remember papa toad sage saying he couldn't mix the two because the fox's chakra was too volatile or something.)

And, there's nothing that says that it takes the enraged sage-mode to resist Pain, at all. Seems more of a willpower thing, something naruto and Jiraiya have common.

iirc, in that instance, Pa was talking about why he could not help Naruto enter Sage Mode as was the case with Jiraiya. Hence Naruto had to leave behind clones, or perfect his Sage mode or something.

Originally posted by Kento
As soon as Jiraiya steps into Rain Village he is known about. No sneaking around is going to help. Also knowing Nagato's secret doesn't suddenly equal knowing where the bodies are. or where Nagato is. And the only body really needed is always up and running with knowledge of where Jiraiya is at all times because of the rain.

I disagree. Jiraiya enters the belly of a toad, the toad enters, covertly, and Jiraiya does some searching until he finds Pain. Summon, splat. done.

He can also Summon the toad outside the village, once he finds Pain, and then have the gigantic toad....or two, jump from outside the village, right into it.

Should I go on?

I mean, we can script out tons of different ways for Jiraiya to kill an unsuspecting pain.

There's also the fact that Kishimoto made it a canon statement. That means that if Jiraiya had known, Kishi would have written it to be so. It is up to us to figure out ways for it to happen...just for fun.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
iirc, in that instance, Pa was talking about why he could not help Naruto enter Sage Mode as was the case with Jiraiya. Hence Naruto had to leave behind clones, or perfect his Sage mode or something.

Knew I wasn't crazy.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I disagree. Jiraiya enters the belly of a toad, the toad enters, covertly, and Jiraiya does some searching until he finds Pain. Summon, splat. done.

He can also Summon the toad outside the village, once he finds Pain, and then have the gigantic toad....or two, jump from outside the village, right into it.

Should I go on?

I mean, we can script out tons of different ways for Jiraiya to kill an unsuspecting pain.

There's also the fact that Kishimoto made it a canon statement. That means that if Jiraiya had known, Kishi would have written it to be so. It is up to us to figure out ways for it to happen...just for fun.

And that gets pass Shinra Tensei how when its gravity control? It's not like they won't be seen coming down. Summons really aren't the way to go as Pain laid out the strongest Toad without using his strongest attack.

🤨 Kisame said Jiraiya would beat both Itachi and Kisame together. Does that make it true? Not a chance.

Originally posted by Kento
Jiraiya has to get out of the toad to search.

No he doesn't. The toad goes where he wants it to.

Originally posted by Kento
And that gets pass Shinra Tensei how when its gravity control? It's not like they won't be seen coming down. Summons really aren't the way to go as Pain laid out the strongest Toad without using his strongest attack.

False premise lead to the wrong conclusion. How can Pain get out a Shinra Tensei if he's dead? An alternate route: how can Deva path do anything if he's dead?

Originally posted by Kento
🤨 Kisame said Jiraiya would beat both Itachi and Kisame together. Does that make it true? Not a chance.

I don't believe that at all. Jiraiya could have killed them, no problem. 😉

Originally posted by dadudemon
No he doesn't. The toad goes where he wants it to.

False premise lead to the wrong conclusion. How can Pain get out a Shinra Tensei if he's dead? An alternate route: how can Deva path do anything if he's dead?

I don't believe that at all. Jiraiya could have killed them, no problem. 😉

How would Pain get killed? Not by jumping frogs thats for sure. And not by anything Jiraiya can do.

😆

Originally posted by Kento
Yes, but Jiraiya doesn't even know where to go, and wouldn't even begin to know. And searching something without even knowing what you're searching is going to fail.

How do you know? There's nothing to suggest that Jiraiya would have failed. He could have created a clone to draw out Pain...while staying in the toad. 🙂

And, Jiraiya DOES know where to go...that's why he ended up in the village. 😄

Originally posted by Kento
How would Pain get killed? Not by jumping frogs thats for sure. And not by anything Jiraiya can do.

😆

lulz

I think so. Pain is frail. He wouldn't suspect it until he was a mashed meat-tatos.

And...a gigantic toad is not the same thing as a little frog. 😆

Originally posted by dadudemon
I'm aware of this: ergo my saying enraged sage-mode (which is an incompatible dichotomy as I remember papa toad sage saying he couldn't mix the two because the fox's chakra was too volatile or something.)

And, there's nothing that says that it takes the enraged sage-mode to resist Pain, at all. Seems more of a willpower thing, something naruto and Jiraiya have common.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Oh, so now this toad, which jumps out of the sky to an unwitting Pain, and falls on him, and crushes him, is all of a sudden trying to walk into the building? That doesn't really fit well with what we were talking about.

Originally posted by dadudemon
He meant exactly as I have been describing it: if he knew his secret, he would have definitely pursued other methods of getting at Pain instead of his bodies. Remember that he bodies were almost all in these coffin type thingies with one or two, at most, being up and about. Drop a giant toad on the bodies: they are done. The other one or two go to investigate, another toad drops on the distracted Pain. The aind.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Like I said, there's a million and one ways Jiraiya could execute Pain, if he knew his secret. We could script this all day with many different things simply because Jiraiya has tons of chakra and a sage-mode.

Originally posted by dadudemon
And...a gigantic toad is not the same thing as a little frog. 😆