Superman Vs Wonderwoman

Jovian weightlifting challenge.
Image 3 success.

This showing notable for several reasons.

One is that, just the previous issue, Diana was on Jupiter with NO difficulty with the gravity.

Two, we see here Wonder Woman doing something MORE difficult and strength demanding than standing alone to get AROUND the supposed difficulty of standing on Jupiter.

Three, this parallels the difficulty Superman had with high gravity environments, namely Krypton, or even Braniac's original bottle of Kandor.

I have to check the dates to see which happened first, though.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Might be common to most superheroes.
Do have to say, I understand what you mean.

Having said that, though, I also have to say that you used 2 poor examples.

Near perfect example? Superman tanking Hulk's punches in the first Marvel/DC crossover. Hulk getting stronger and stronger, Superman having doubt about whether he can keep weathering the storm, but managing to do so, almost unflinchingly, until the moment he pinpoints the device angering Hulk, catches said device, and destroys it, whereupon Hulk's rage and attack immediately subside.

THAT would be a near perfect illustration of what you're trying to tell me in your previous post above.

These two? Hmm... not so much.

I don't know what happens in the first story you showed.
In your images, though, Superman is thinking too himself that Rock is ready to go, and, indeed, a reader can observe by the style of the thought balloons, the slowing halted speech, that Rock is weakening; is figuratively at the end of his rope.
Relatively unimpressive; "tanking" in that instance;
Spider-man does as much with the Lizard in one encounter.

Doomsday? Better, but still has a similar problem: Superman TELLS us that Doomsday is getting weaker, that is strength and invulnerability have been affected for the worse.

One last thing is that KC Superman has, of course, the very noticeable difference of age on "our" Superman.
In other words, extra long-term yellow sun exposure. Which means more strength and invulnerability.

Again, I understand the point you're trying to make perfectly.
But you're not accounting for the biggest and most note-able conceptual reason KC Superman can be EXPECTED to do what he does with Herc, while our Superman cannot be.

And, like the Hulk showing in the Marvel/DC crossover, there ARE better things to use to illustrate.

This was to show HOW this power works and how I attributed KC Superman not moving to Hercs punch.

You cannot tell our Superman was ready to take the punch, yet KC seems ready, yet for many this is proof KC is stronger, well is not proof, is just KC Superman ready to tank a punch while Superman got an elbow in the nose while distracted.

And if You don't think DD showing is good or the Rock showing is good, well.... You should notice how they are causing earthquakes as a side effect of their fight.

Has WW tanked those kind of punches?

Originally posted by bluewaterrider

One last thing is that KC Superman has, of course, the very noticeable difference of age on "our" Superman.
In other words, extra long-term yellow sun exposure. Which means more strength and invulnerability.

Again, I understand the point you're trying to make perfectly.
But you're not accounting for the biggest and most note-able conceptual reason KC Superman can be EXPECTED to do what he does with Herc, while our Superman cannot be.

And, like the Hulk showing in the Marvel/DC crossover, there ARE better things to use to illustrate.

I thought I'd bring-up that you think the KC Superman/New Earth Superman example with Hercules proves anything. This is the only actual example I've seen beyond statements that would indicate KC Superman is actually stronger/more powerful than New Earth Superman. You make a deal out of KC Superman tanking Hercules' punch. Problem with that? I'd say it's more of a case of New Earth Superman simply wasn't ready for the punch that knocked him back like it did, and as I pointed-out about Hercules drawing blood, the elbow is a harder, smaller surface than the fist and the nose is a more vulnerable area of the body.

You yourself believe Supergirl is stronger than Hercules(I believe your claim was Supergirl>Superman>Hercules) but here Superman tanks 3 of her punches before being knocked back by the fourth.

And for KC Superman catching Hercules' punch, well, Wonder Woman is stronger than Hercules, and New Earth Superman did this.

And the one time I'm aware of where the New Earth and KC counter-parts actually had a significant fight, while Superman's narration box states KC Superman might be stronger, it doesn't look like you're trying to imply. And he also wonders if he's still weak from the Kryptonite that was just in him, that that could be the reason his counter-part seems stronger.

http://s1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Superman%20VS--/Heroes/Miscellaneous/KC%20Superman/

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Jovian weightlifting challenge.
Image 3 success.

This showing notable for several reasons.

One is that, just the previous issue, Diana was on Jupiter with NO difficulty with the gravity.

Two, we see here Wonder Woman doing something MORE difficult and strength demanding than standing alone to get AROUND the supposed difficulty of standing on Jupiter.

Three, this parallels the difficulty Superman had with high gravity environments, namely Krypton, or even Braniac's original bottle of Kandor.

I have to check the dates to see which happened first, though.

Still pales in comparison to the fact that Golden Age Superman created a star via strength. But what does this have to do with 2003-2011? Oh yeah, nothing. It's producing reasoning that doesn't have anything to do with the relevant subject, because reasoning is all you've ever argued, not presented evidence.

Also, I should note, that you make such a big deal about "character limitations," "plot limitations," "how powers work," "power sources" and "origins." Well, from the mid-Golden Age and in fact into the early years of the Silver Age, Superman's powers were derived from a combination of Earth's(and other planets) weaker gravity and thinner atmosphere.

http://superman.kinlok.nu/theages/Encyclopaedia/powers.php

So this would of course explain away your argument, unless you can provide examples of Superman doing the same on another planet that wasn't described as having Krypton-like gravity and atmosphere. 'Cuz, ya know, he created a star and all that, which blows-away towing the Sun.

Why is this thread still open with this level of trolling and spamming?

Originally posted by Delta1938

pales in comparison to the fact that Golden Age Superman created a star via strength ... he created a star and all that, which blows-away towing the Sun.

Someday you'll have to explain to me how this works in your mind.

It's like arguing a man who could move an entire HOUSE by himself is less impressive than one who merely uses five thousand bricks, transported one by one, or even up to fifty at a time, to merely build that same house; a more or less everyday occurence.

Perhaps I'm decidedly unimpressed because I've seen Golden Age images of Wonder Woman catching, throwing, and/or slinging around meteors, islands, and planets.

Incidentally, I was told before I showed such things that Diana never had the strength to do anything of that sort.
Not ever.

Told for page upon page, month upon month, with just about all the invective people could muster.

I'm not told that anymore, though.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Someday you'll have to explain to me how this works in your mind.

It's like arguing a man who could move an entire HOUSE by himself is less impressive than one who merely uses five thousand bricks, transported one by one, or even up to fifty at a time, to merely build that same house; a more or less everyday occurence.

.....

Yeah, creating a "blaze of atomic power" powerful enough to produce extremely large-scale nuclear fusion, by throwing "lifeless worlds"(so he threw PLANETS together with enough force to produce nuclear fusion) is an every day occurrence.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Perhaps I'm decidedly unimpressed because I've seen Golden Age images of Wonder Woman catching, throwing, and/or slinging around meteors, islands, and planets.

Incidentally, I was told before I showed such things that Diana never had the strength to do anything of that sort.
Not ever.

Told for page upon page, month upon month, with just about all the invective people could muster.

I'm not told that anymore, though.

Superman still created a star.

Originally posted by Delta1938

Superman still created a star.

So'd pre-Crisis Supergirl.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Story Title: "Superman's Death Sentence"

Source: Superman vol1. #156
Writer: Edmond Hamilton
Penciller: Curt Swan
Inker: George Klein
Date: October 1962
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

... who had greater invulnerability than physical strength even during her planet-moving heyday ...

Source: Action Comics #285, Volume 1
Writer: Jerry Siegel
Penciller: Jim Mooney
Date: February 1962

I believe that is an official Silver Age showing, I mean the one of Supergirl. There are even more impressive feats in the Silver Age for Superman than that.

But the one Delta is showing is a Golden Age feat.

Two different eras, I just check and Golden age goes up tp 1956

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
So'd pre-Crisis Supergirl.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Story Title: "Superman's Death Sentence"

Source: Superman vol1. #156
Writer: Edmond Hamilton
Penciller: Curt Swan
Inker: George Klein
Date: October 1962
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
... who had greater invulnerability than physical strength even during her planet-moving heyday ...

Source: Action Comics #285, Volume 1
Writer: Jerry Siegel
Penciller: Jim Mooney
Date: February 1962

And what's your point, exactly? You posted Supergirl feats from the Silver Age. My scan's of Golden Age Superman, in 1949, in response to you posting the scans of Golden Age Wonder Woman weight lifting on Jupiter or whatever it was.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Superman_Vol_1_58

It was a backup story, though, not the main tale. Also, worth noting. My scan has Superman THROWING one planet into another to create a star. Your scan of Supergirl seems that she's pushing it. Still impressive of course, one of those whacky Silver Age feats, but Superman's is more impressive. Which is saying something because you would think creating a star by throwing planets at each other would come from the Silver Age, not mid-ish Golden Age.

... and Wonder Woman could apparently overcome both if the following story is any indication...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Wonder Woman #177, Volume 1
Writer: Bill Finger
Penciller: Win Mortimer
Date: July 1968
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Wonder_Woman_Vol_1_177

(But we'll get to that later.)

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
... and Wonder Woman could apparently overcome both if the following story is any indication...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Wonder Woman #177, Volume 1
Writer: Bill Finger
Penciller: Win Mortimer
Date: July 1968
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Wonder_Woman_Vol_1_177

(But we'll get to that later.)

Actually, looking at your scan of Supergirl's invulnerability allegedly being greater than her strength doesn't really prove your argument. But even if it did, is still irrelevant considering that A: Your scan of Wonder Woman punching Supergirl isn't even KOing her, just stunning her and knocking her down, and B: my scan of star-making was from the Golden Age, as Salsa and myself have already mentioned.

Originally posted by Delta1938
And what's your point, exactly? You posted Supergirl feats from the Silver Age. My scan's of Golden Age Superman, in 1949, in response to you posting the scans of Golden Age Wonder Woman weight lifting on Jupiter or whatever it was.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Superman_Vol_1_58

It was a backup story, though, not the main tale. Also, worth noting. My scan has Superman THROWING one planet into another to create a star. Your scan of Supergirl seems that she's pushing it. Still impressive of course, one of those whacky Silver Age feats, but Superman's is more impressive. Which is saying something because you would think creating a star by throwing planets at each other would come from the Silver Age, not mid-ish Golden Age.

Right.

And that's exactly what you DID think, if your previous post a few pages was truthful ... until you did some research.

And that's actually what I thought would be the case for Wonder Woman several years ago ... until I came across the following.

Very interesting that you encountered that Superman planet-pushing feat in 1949, by the way. Probably earlier that year?

Notice what year THIS showing is from?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Wonder Woman # 38 volume 1
Writer: Robert Khanigher
Artist: HG Peters
Date: November/December 1949
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by Delta1938

KC Superman/New Earth Superman example with Hercules ...
only actual example I've seen beyond statements that would indicate KC Superman is actually stronger/more powerful than New Earth Superman...

And the one time I'm aware of where the New Earth and KC counter-parts actually had a significant fight, while Superman's narration box states KC Superman might be stronger, it doesn't look like you're trying to imply. And he also wonders if he's still weak from the Kryptonite that was just in him, that that could be the reason his counter-part seems stronger...

Seen the following?

(five images)

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Right.

And that's exactly what you DID think, if your previous post a few pages was truthful ... until you did some research.

And that's actually what I thought would be the case for Wonder Woman several years ago ... until I came across the following.

Very interesting that you encountered that Superman planet-pushing feat in 1949, by the way. Probably earlier that year?

Notice what year THIS showing is from?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Wonder Woman # 38 volume 1
Writer: Robert Khanigher
Artist: HG Peters
Date: November/December [B]1949
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [/B]

What the Hell's your point, still? You tried presenting scans of Wonder Woman in the Golden Age lifting weights on Jupiter to try and argue she's stronger than Superman. Which, by the way, has nothing to do with the 2003-2011 period you claim, and have been proven wrong, that she's stronger than him in.

Then I present a scan of Superman creating a star in the Golden Age, and you try to discredit or counter or whatever you're attempting by showing scans of SILVER Age Supergirl performing a similar but less impressive feat, making a claim that her durability is greater than her strength with questionable evidence to back it, and show an example of Wonder Woman stunning, but not KOing, Supergirl of that era.

Then you get it pointed-out that my scan was from the Golden Age, not Silver Age. And you respond with a scan of Golden Age Wonder Woman throwing a planet with her lasso? What is this supposed to prove? The explosion has nothing indicating it's on the level of mine. Or are you trying to prove that Wonder Woman could throw planets in the Golden Age? If that's it, what exactly is your point? I was pointing-out that Golden Age Superman's star-making feat was more impressive than Silver Age Supergirl's similar feat, because he threw the planet at another to produce his "atomic blaze." Nothing to do with Wonder Woman's feats.

Originally posted by Delta1938

KC Superman/New Earth Superman example with Hercules ...
only actual example I've seen beyond statements that would indicate KC Superman is actually stronger/more powerful than New Earth Superman...

And the one time I'm aware of where the New Earth and KC counter-parts actually had a significant fight, while Superman's narration box states KC Superman might be stronger, it doesn't look like you're trying to imply. And he also wonders if he's still weak from the Kryptonite that was just in him, that that could be the reason his counter-part seems stronger...

Seen the following?

(Image 2 of 5)

Originally posted by Delta1938

KC Superman/New Earth Superman example with Hercules ...
only actual example I've seen beyond statements that would indicate KC Superman is actually stronger/more powerful than New Earth Superman...

Image 3 of 5.

Originally posted by Delta1938

KC Superman/New Earth Superman example with Hercules ...
only actual example I've seen beyond statements that would indicate KC Superman is actually stronger/more powerful than New Earth Superman...

And the one time I'm aware of where the New Earth and KC counter-parts actually had a significant fight, while Superman's narration box states KC Superman might be stronger, it doesn't look like you're trying to imply. And he also wonders if he's still weak from the Kryptonite that was just in him, that that could be the reason his counter-part seems stronger...

Image 4 of 5.

Originally posted by Delta1938

he also wonders if he's still weak from the Kryptonite that was just in him, that that could be the reason his counter-part seems stronger...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Justice Society of America. Kingdom Come Special #1, Volume 1
Writer: Alex Ross
Penciller: Alex Ross
Date: January 2009
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http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Justice_Society_of_America_Kingdom_Come_Special_Superman_Vol_1_1