Originally posted by iChaos
Yeah...no. Him being able to die like anyone else any irrevelant.Meh, I didn't recall her being made of rocks inside, but meh.
Yeah, I'm sure that bolt killed him (@1:34).
-Going in circles with this. Moving on.
-You can't recall what you haven't seen can you? Yes, Gaia is shown to be made of rock inside and out, I'll say no more.
-Thank you for posting the video, now you can understand why I was laughing. See, you are indirectly trying to make a faulty negative assessment of the power of a Zeus lightning bolt because you claim the last spartan 'shrugged one off', but then in that very scene we see that lightning bolt crumble the building that the last spartan and a couple of others were standing on. (how many actual lightning bolts have you seen do that?)
How then does an ordinary human survive that? Choose one:
1.Wasn't point blank. (most likely)
2.P.I.S.
3.Perhaps he wasn't a completely ordinary human? Those other spartans didn't survive.
4.A faulty retelling of the event by the Spartan. (least likely)
Originally posted by Allankles
First of all Ryu is not a normal human, second no one is saying Kratos isn't durable. He has fairly good durability against blunt force trauma but he is just as vulnerable to sharp point trauma as all the gods and titans he kills.It's a bit far fetched to say that Ryu couldn't tear up Kratos' flesh. He's done it to greater fiends who have more dense muscle than Kratos.
-Firstly, I never said Ryu was a normal human. Like I said in this thread, I put him at well over peak human levels. Probably around Spiderman levels.
The reason I brought up a human wielding a blade being ineffective against Kratos' skin is because I was trying to gauge what your assessment of 'remarkable sharp durability' is, and whether you'd agree with me saying Kratos was invulnerable to a human swinging a sword.
-Secondly...*FACEPALM*. Did you read anyone of my other posts in this? I already addressed this BS conception of 'blunt force durability only'. Is Kratos made of rubber? No? Then stop compartmentalizing the damage types for him. PSI is PSI, whether its from blunt force or a sword, and Kratos has shown even in GOW1 higher PSI durability than what a man wielding a sword can logically output.
-Now, as for why I said Ryu himself isn't strong enough to hurt Kratos, as I said, its because of his GOW3 feats. He has shown a couple of slashing and piercing durability feats in GOW3 from beings a million times physically stronger than Ryu.
Kratos has shown slashing, piercing, explosion, and even burn tanking feats in GOW3.It's funny because looking at the feats I've seen so far in GOW3, it almost seems like Sony Santa Monica was reading boards like this and wanted to address BS concepts like 'Kratos is not bulletproof etc.'
Originally posted by Allankles
First of all Ryu is not a normal human, second no one is saying Kratos isn't durable. He has fairly good durability against blunt force trauma but he is just as vulnerable to sharp point trauma as all the gods and titans he kills.It's a bit far fetched to say that Ryu couldn't tear up Kratos' flesh. He's done it to greater fiends who have more dense muscle than Kratos.
-Firstly, I know Ryu isn't a normal human. I said in this thread that I put him well above peak-human levels. I'd say about Spiderman levels.
I made the statement of a human wielding a sword being ineffective against Kratos' skin because I was trying to gauge what your assessment of 'remarkable sharp edge durability' is by going to the lowest common denominator, and to see whether you'd agree with my statement or not.
-Secondly...*facepalm*. You didn't read any of my other posts in here dude? I thoroughly addressed the BS concept of 'blunt force durability only'. PSI is PSI, (note force is different, force has nothing to do with area) regardless of if a boulder or a sword is generating it, and Kratos has shown remarkably high PSI durability, even in GOW1 he has taken things with much higher PSI output than a normal man wielding a sword can logically generate. Again, is Kratos made of rubber? No? Then stop trying to compartmentalize his durability levels for this.
-Finally, as for why I said Ryu himself is not strong enough to hurt Kratos? Again, its by GOW3 feats. Kratos has shown a couple of slashing and piercing durability feats from beings a million times stronger than Ryu.
Kratos thus far that I've seen, has shown slashing, piercing, explosion, and even burn tanking feats. Which is funny to me, because looking at those feats it almost appears to me that Sony Santa Monica was reading forums like this and wanted to put to rest BS concepts like 'Kratos is not bulletproof!' and what not. 😂
Originally posted by iChaos
Yeah...no. Him being able to die like anyone else any irrevelant.Meh, I didn't recall her being made of rocks inside, but meh.
Yeah, I'm sure that bolt killed him (@1:34).
Her flesh is rock, she still has cavities and stuff. Her veins are made of wood.
Hit the building most likely i.e. didn't hit him head on. Though the Last Spartan was caught in the radius of the blast, that I'll agree.
Besides, the Last Spartan is a dude who can somewhat fight with Kratos, and someone who was able to make it to the Palace of the Fates from Sparta 😐. He isn't an ordinary human or Spartan 😐.
Finally, the bolt that hit the building was not as charged as the one Zeus used in 3. Deny or argue this all you like, you cannot change those facts.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
-Firstly, I know Ryu isn't a normal human. I said in this thread that I put him well above peak-human levels. I'd say about Spiderman levels.I made the statement of a human wielding a sword being ineffective against Kratos' skin because I was trying to gauge what your assessment of 'remarkable sharp edge durability' is by going to the lowest common denominator, and to see whether you'd agree with my statement or not.
-Secondly...*facepalm*. You didn't read any of my other posts in here dude? I thoroughly addressed the BS concept of 'blunt force durability only'. PSI is PSI, (note force is different, force has nothing to do with area) regardless of if a boulder or a sword is generating it, and Kratos has shown remarkably high PSI durability, even in GOW1 he has taken things with much higher PSI output than a normal man wielding a sword can logically generate. Again, is Kratos made of rubber? No? Then stop trying to compartmentalize his durability levels for this.
-Finally, as for why I said Ryu himself is not strong enough to hurt Kratos? Again, its by GOW3 feats. Kratos has shown a couple of slashing and piercing durability feats from beings a million times stronger than Ryu.
Kratos thus far that I've seen, has shown slashing, piercing, explosion, and even burn tanking feats. Which is funny to me, because looking at those feats it almost appears to me that Sony Santa Monica was reading forums like this and wanted to put to rest BS concepts like 'Kratos is not bulletproof!' and what not. 😂
So Kratos' flesh is bullet proof? As far as the PSI argument, two words "Wonder Woman". She can take all sorts of blunt force trauma, but sharp point trauma is another issue, sharp projectiles shot at her with speed only approaching mach 1, will penetrate her flesh.
And of course there's a difference between blunt and sharp point durability, the kind of damage a blunt instrument deals is differnt from what a sharp point deals, that's common sense. If I jab a person with a wooden baseball bat, they'll be hurt but their flesh will remain in tact, jab the same person with the same baseball bat that has its top sharpened to a spear point, and watch it tear the flesh.
Sharp point trauma is an entire different kettle of fish, a blunt instrument isn't going to cut through tissue, muscle fibers and all.
Also I think Ryu is far beyond peak human in terms of his physical abilities. He seems to have Action Man type awareness, combined with Spiderman level agility.
EDIT: I think this vid confirms that Ryu can indeed pierce Kratos' flesh.
YouTube video
Splitting an entire air craft in two with the dragon sword, that feat speaks to both his strength and the power of the dragon blade. Not to mention crazy awareness in avoiding a missile while in mid air as well as the high powered fire.
Originally posted by Allankles
So Kratos' flesh is bullet proof? As far as the PSI argument, two words "Wonder Woman". She can take all sorts of blunt force trauma, but sharp point trauma is another issue, sharp projectiles shot at her with speed only approaching mach 1, will penetrate her flesh.And of course there's a difference between blunt and sharp point durability, the kind of damage a blunt instrument deals is differnt from what a sharp point deals, that's common sense. If I jab a person with a wooden baseball bat, they'll be hurt but their flesh will remain in tact, jab the same person with the same baseball bat that has its top sharpened to a spear point, and watch it tear the flesh.
Sharp point trauma is an entire different kettle of fish, a blunt instrument isn't going to cut through tissue, muscle fibers and all.
-Yes dude. Kratos' flesh is well beyond bulletproof. You wouldn't even need to see the GoW3 feats that I have to come to that conclusion.
-Wonder Woman? Heh. You bring up another fictional character that has suffered from crappy logic in her writing as some sort of debating point? What does the flawed laws of one fictional universe have to do with another? I'm talking actual physics here. Surviving a punch from Superman, who can at the very least, can cause a crater in the ground, logically makes Wonder Woman immune to a bullet as well. Supes produces more PSI than any bullet. And last I recall, recently DC has realized the stupidity of her vulnerability to sharpness anyway. Was she not recently only cut by a magic blade, and then she was surprised that it cut her at all in the first place?
-Of course there is a difference. But PSI, (which already stands for pounds per square inch), means its already measuring force applied within the area of a square inch. Which means surface area is already accounted for. Which means its redundant saying PSI from a blade vs PSI from say a hammer, as they both generate PSI. Which means that if a blunt option produces more PSI than a sharp option, then the blunt option has more cutting potential too.
Falling so far than you generate a crater upon landing >>> normal guy swinging a sword.
Again, force is different as it has nothing to do with area, all other things being equal, the hammer will generate more force as its heavier, but the sword will generate more PSI. But I'm not talking about force, I'm talking about PSI.
Originally posted by Allankles
Also I think Ryu is far beyond peak human in terms of his physical abilities. He seems to have Action Man type awareness, combined with Spiderman level agility.EDIT: I think this vid confirms that Ryu can indeed pierce Kratos' flesh.
YouTube videoSplitting an entire air craft in two with the dragon sword, that feat speaks to both his strength and the power of the dragon blade. Not to mention crazy awareness in avoiding a missile while in mid air as well as the high powered fire.
Spiderman is far beyond peak human too, which is where I put Ryu at. So we already agree.
But sorry dude, that video doesn't do it. Ryu cuts a moderately sized aircraft in half by slicing through a very thin section of it. I think it was the wing? 😬
Kratos is far more durable than that aircraft. 😬
I like Ryu a lot, and of the big three; Kratos, Dante(hate admitting this douche is anything important at all), and himself, he's clearly the most skilled, but he doesn't have the stopping power to beat Kratos.
I think he does, and I can't change your opinion. As for the PSI argument you realize the PSI from a sharp point is directed at an incredible small surface area, that's why it will pierce flesh in a situation here a cinder block might not.
As for the Jet, Kratos' limbs would survive a collision with a high powered fighter plane now?
-A square inch is already a fairly small area, but if something already produces more PSI (measure of pressure) than a sword swing, it should produce more pressure within the area size of the sword swing impact too. Pressure is just force over a unit of area after all.
-If Kratos and that aircraft were shot at each at the same speed, Kratos' body would prevail.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
-Yes dude. Kratos' flesh is well beyond bulletproof. You wouldn't even need to see the GoW3 feats that I have to come to that conclusion.And last I recall, recently DC has realized the stupidity of her vulnerability to sharpness anyway. Was she not recently only cut by a magic blade, and then she was surprised that it cut her at all in the first place?
I don't think regular guns are what a mordern WW would be worried about, and the projectiles that get thrown her way are moving much faster than any of the blows she receives. And of course sharp points bring more PSI.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Of course there is a difference.
I'm glad you at least recognized there's a difference. There's also the Moh's scale to consider, the dragon blade is much harder than Kratos' flesh. If Kratos had Colossus level durability I might agree that Ryu wouldn't be able to pierce him. But he's already pierced Fiends who have denser muscle than Kratos.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Falling so far than you generate a crater upon landing >>> normal guy swinging a sword.
I agree, but Ryu is not a normal guy. Fiends have way more robust physiologies than humans, essentially they're demi gods yet Ryu has no problems tearing them apart.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
If Kratos and that aircraft were shot at each at the same speed, Kratos' body would prevail.
So basically Kratos would be killed by that impact. I don't even know how you can argue that Ryu's dragon blade would bounce of Kratos. That air craft is way more robust than Kratos, as are all the giant Fiends he fights.
-There isn't a bullet out there that travels faster than a Superman punch that I can recall in the DCU. :/
-Interesting that you'd bring up the Moh's scale, but again...have you not been reading anything I've said about his GoW3 feats? This Moh's scale point was trumped before you even brought it up. And please, enough with this muscle density business, you don't know how dense they are. Hell, Superman's body is supposedly super dense, yet on Earth he weighs no more than a normal man his size. :/
-See above. No need to talk about robusticity, it isn't a proper measure of their durability when they have no real feats for their durability. Certainly, logically, they'd have to be more durable than a human. But then again Kratos is far above that level himself.
Moving on.
So basically Kratos would be killed by that impact. I don't even know how you can argue that Ryu's dragon blade would bounce of Kratos. That air craft is way more robust than Kratos, as are all the giant Fiends he fights.
Umm no, basically what would happen is the impact would leave a huge hole through the aircraft courtesy of a 7 ft mega durable demi-god flying through it.
Again, I really really will not be specifically spoiling what happens in GoW3 in this thread, but you obviously can't know where I get the idea of Ryu's blade 'bouncing off' Kratos' skin if you haven't seen the feats I'm talking about. Demonic Phoenix will agree, hell he already has.
Originally posted by BloodRain
The same force behind the strike and a bladed object creates alot more psi then a blunt one. Ryu is strong enough to slash him.Also a few other people have taken strong blunt force but are not bullet proof.
-I already said that all things being equal, a hammer will produce more force but a sword will produce more psi. But if the blunt force produces more force than the cutting action can make up for with its smaller area, then the blunt force will be producing more psi too. No, Ryu isn't even a fraction of the necessary strength needed to slash Kratos.
-What few other people and what do their feats in another universe with differing logic have to do with God of War's universe? Kratos is bullet proof. Play God of War 3, when it comes out this Tuesday, and after the first level, none of you will question that again.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
-I already said that all things being equal, a hammer will produce more force but a sword will produce more psi. But if the blunt force produces more force than the cutting action can make up for with its smaller area, then the blunt force will be producing more psi too. No, Ryu isn't even a fraction of the necessary strength needed to slash Kratos.-What few other people and what do their feats in another universe with differing logic have to do with God of War's universe? Kratos is bullet proof. Play God of War 3, when it comes out this Tuesday, and after the first level, none of you will question that again.
I don't care about spoilers since I already have assumptions of how the story ends. Use the spoiler function, if you must.
So what type of attack did Kratos take? Also, you clearly admit that a sword has more PSI, meaning you need a lot less force to use compared to a blunt force implement like a hammer. In some universes swords have been created that can split atoms, imagine how little force such a sword requires to be effective?
The Dragon Sword has its own high level magic imbued into it, allowing it to be even more efficient than a carbon copy made with the finest mundane workmanship.