FF8 Party v.s. Ganondorf

Originally posted by Nephthys
That was just his invincibility to anything that doesn't rhyme with Barster hoard. Which is disabled in the thread. He still gets a sword through his chest.

YouTube video

5:50 and 7:20

Stabbed in the skull with the barster hoard, and then perfectly fine.

Angelo makes them invincible to status effects or they brake the damn crystals and I don't know whether teh Dark World will do anything, does he go with them. They have methods (magic, mostly) of dealing with intangibilty.

The crystal held Zelda and some maidens, so breaking them could be possible. Dark World is a polymorph effect and in a different dimension. What can they do about intangibility?

Am I right in assuming that thsi was done off-screen and we have no clue of how long it took him? Heck, it could have just have been on his orders.

It was confirmed he did it himself but we're not sure how long it took. It was said to have been fairly quick, though.

No it doesn't, we've discussed this.

It was still the Master Sword.

Perhaps this is toonforce, in the days before it was feasible to animate cuts and slashes. Either way could you show it to me or direct me to it?

I've got it above. He bleeds.

Well, neither is his. 😬

Magic, TK, what's the difference?

On screen? Quantifiably?

Not on screen, don't know about quantifiability.

Originally posted by TacDavey
None of that magic is going to hurt, sadly. [SPOILERS AGAIN] Midna was using an ancient dark power that was greatly feared and extremely powerful and it didn't even scratch him. [SPOILERS END]

It's not even shown what even happened in the castle. From what it looked like, they clashed causing the place to explode. That doesn't mean it's more powerful than Ultima or Apocalypse (which was invented by Ultimecia in her final form). And the castle explosion put both Ganondorf and Midna out of their spiritual forms. It's also worth noting that Midna was unharmed as well. Does that mean she's uber too?

Rinoa's spells aren't going to do crap. Her friggin dog is stronger than she is.

Only before she became a sorceress and before she had Adel's power.

As for Ganon being lower in power from Adel, there is simply nothing to suggest this. You say, well, GF's couldn't stop her. But your are presupposing that GFs COULD stop Ganon. Where is your evidence? What makes you think that if Ganon was placed in Adel's shoes, he wouldn't be able to do the same or better? You CAN'T provide evidence for that, thus you can't make the claim the Adel is above Ganon. You just can't.

The GFs are stronger than those weak light beasts and the knights of Hyrule who had no Master Sword. GFs make ordinary people into superhumans by giveing them magic.

Then you say that Ganon was sealed by the sages, and the FF8 party is stronger than the sages, thus they are stronger than Ganon. But again, that's just not true. The sages aren't warriors. They don't fight, otherwise Zelda should have joined the fray. That doesn't mean they aren't powerful. I could be a wicked powerful white mage and know nothing but healing spells.

The FF8 party conists of a group of mercenaries (one of them who has superstrength and another that's a blue magician), a sharpshooter, and a sorceress with a powerful dog. They all have GFs on their side and can use magic. That's a lot better than a group of sages that only has a minority with any combat experience (assuming you're talking about the OoT sages).

The sages aren't stronger than Ganon, they simply possess the ability to counter some of his magic and seal him away when they all work together. None of the FF8 party can do that. None.

The FF8 party have way more than that. They couldn't even seal Ganon without Link giving him a beating.

They are different.

You also made the claim that there existed weapons stronger than the Master Sword in other games, but since none of the FF8 party have them, in the end it's all irrelevant.

The GFs are stronger than the Master Sword. The only thing the Master Sword has over it is reflecting magic and protection from curses and TK.

Oh, and Holy wouldn't do anything. I see no reason whatsoever to consider it more powerful than the Light Arrows.

Oh it would do something: stun Ganondorf with enough time for anyone to unleash a Limit Break.

Originally posted by The Scenario

I doubt this. Please provide evidence in the future.

They fought some of Ultimecia's minions with their abilities sealed (no magic, no GFs, just the weapons they hold). There's also Omega Weapon and Ultimecia herself.

Which he used across dimensions. It wasn't his body, it was done across a dimension. Details.

No different from Ultimecia possessing Edea and Adel across time.

Regardless, this opens up the possibility of Ganondorf attacking the party from another dimension, as he is obviously capable of it.

Reflect solves the problem.

It is entirely possible to retrieve the Master sword without using either of those weapons. Link still has the Light Arrows during this part, and can use them. Further, those arrows do not harm him (and he just ignores them after a few shots), and Wolf Link is an empowered being.

Light Arrows do no damage to Ganon in OoT. They just blind him.

Irrelevant. Not stronger than Ganondorf.

Ganon never fought people wielding magic from summoned creatures.

Which nonetheless kill/seal Ganondorf in 3 hits or less.

Only after Ganon was shown kneeling down in pain.

Couldn't? Anyway, Zant was there for the Twilight group. Yet, Zelda passively defeated a group of monsters in Minish Cap.

When? Or did you mean Spirit Tracks?

Light Arrows.

They only blind.

The MS and LA switched roles. He had to be stunned by the Master Sword before the Arrows would even scratch his skin. In OoT, they seemed to cause him some great pain.

Not as much as the Silver Arrows would do.

Prooooooooooof.

Power of GFs + Power of Adel > Ganon

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
His durability that allows him to tank castle busting strikes unhurt, and in OoT shows him surviving 4 slashes to the face from the master sword in the hands ofan incredibly strong Link.

Is their TK capable of supporting a castle casually? No? Then no.

City freezing, island busting. Dude broke an island in Wind Waker. He's capable of city level destruction, and has shown it on many occasions.

Ultimecia was absorbing all of reality.

Ultimecia was absorbing all of reality.

The rest of your post is a bunch of assertions lacking any evidence or basis in fact.

Originally posted by Sin_Volvagia
It's not even shown what even happened in the castle. From what it looked like, they clashed causing the place to explode. That doesn't mean it's more powerful than Ultima or Apocalypse (which was invented by Ultimecia in her final form). And the castle explosion put both Ganondorf and Midna out of their spiritual forms. It's also worth noting that Midna was unharmed as well. Does that mean she's uber too?

Midna wasn't seen again until the end, and was lying unconcious in a field somewhere. She very well could have been uber in her Fused Shadow form. Still, the clash of power destroyed a castle. Don't ignore this.

Only before she became a sorceress and before she had Adel's power.

Ganondorf can possess her.

The GFs are stronger than those weak light beasts and the knights of Hyrule who had no Master Sword. GFs make ordinary people into superhumans by giveing them magic.

This doesn't mean they could beat Ganon. You are aware the Knights of Hyrule did not actually fight Ganon, right?

The FF8 party conists of a group of mercenaries (one of them who has superstrength and another that's a blue magician), a sharpshooter, and a sorceress with a powerful dog. They all have GFs on their side and can use magic. That's a lot better than a group of sages that only has a minority with any combat experience (assuming you're talking about the OoT sages).

The Sages needed a ton of time to put together that sealing spell, and it required all seven of them. The Knights of Hyrule protected them from Ganon's army while they closed the door to the Sacred Realm while Ganon happened to be inside it. At no point did anyone confront Ganon directly.

The FF8 party have way more than that. They couldn't even seal Ganon without Link giving him a beating.

They are different.

Because it takes time.

The GFs are stronger than the Master Sword. The only thing the Master Sword has over it is reflecting magic and protection from curses and TK.

And breaking barriers and ignoring evil defenses.

Oh it would do something: stun Ganondorf with enough time for anyone to unleash a Limit Break.

Don't think that's harm him much.

They fought some of Ultimecia's minions with their abilities sealed (no magic, no GFs, just the weapons they hold). There's also Omega Weapon and Ultimecia herself.

Are her minions supposed to be powerful?

No different from Ultimecia possessing Edea and Adel across time.

Exactly. So why's it important?

Reflect solves the problem.

He hits it back.

Light Arrows do no damage to Ganon in OoT. They just blind him.

You played it recently? Shoot his tail.

Ganon never fought people wielding magic from summoned creatures.

Summoning in Zelda lasts longer and calls weaker monsters.

Only after Ganon was shown kneeling down in pain.

Not in Wind Waker.

When? Or did you mean Spirit Tracks?

Early in Minish Cap. Vaati opens the chest, and Zelda's aura BFRs the monsters.

They only blind.

Tail.

Not as much as the Silver Arrows would do.

Had to be stunned for the Silver Arrows to do anything.

Power of GFs + Power of Adel > Ganon

This is worthless to me. I don't think you ever said what a GF was.

Ultimecia was absorbing all of reality.

With a spell designed to do so.

Are Adel and Ultimecia even in this fight? If not, this is pointless.

Originally posted by TacDavey
Oh, and Holy wouldn't do anything.

Holy's power isn't specified, you can't say is weak, it can be more powerful than those Light Arrows or maybe not, at least it looks more powerful. Also, how can you prove this...? I can say the same. I could say The Light Arrows wouldn't anything to the Final Fantasy party, however they can hurt Ganon. Also, Ganon can use that sword? If he can't then brining that sword is irrelevant.

Originally posted by TacDavey
What makes you think that if Ganon was placed in Adel's shoes, he wouldn't be able to do the same or better? You CAN'T provide evidence for that, thus you can't make the claim the Adel is above Ganon. You just can't.

What makes you think that if Adel was placed in Ganon's shoes, she wouldn't be able to do the same or better? That's a pointless question. What Sin was probably saying is that the GFs proves how strong Adel is. Not that the GFs can stop Ganon. Correct me if I'm wrong, Sin...

Originally posted by TacDavey
You also made the claim that there existed weapons stronger than the Master Sword in other games, but since none of the FF8 party have them, in the end it's all irrelevant.

That weapon is only useful against Ganon though, that weapon is nothing special outside that Universe, therefore it can be useless against Selphie. Sin posted a lot of good weapons that are more powerful, Odin's sword, Zantetsuken automatically kills all the enemies, not only one (For example), still the party defeated Odin.

Holy's power isn't specified, you can't say is weak, it can be more powerful than those Light Arrows or maybe not, at least it looks more powerful. Also, how can you prove this...? I can say the same. I could say The Light Arrows wouldn't anything to the Final Fantasy party, however they can hurt Ganon. Also, Ganon can use that sword? If he can't then brining that sword is irrelevant.

What makes you think that if Adel was placed in Ganon's shoes, she wouldn't be able to do the same or better? That's a pointless question. What Sin was probably saying is that the GFs proves how strong Adel is. Not that the GFs can stop Ganon. Correct me if I'm wrong, Sin...

That weapon is only useful against Ganon though, that weapon is nothing special outside that Universe, therefore it can be useless against Selphie. Sin posted a lot of good weapons that are more powerful, Odin's sword, Zantetsuken automatically kills all the enemies, not only one (For example), still the party defeated Odin.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
This isn't how it works. No showings of power = no quanitfiable power.

Her total lack of feats.

Not only is it highly debatable whether any of those swords are more powerful than the master swor,d the master sword is not specificly for just Ganondorf, he's just weak to it.

Holy does have power though, but like I said it is not specified because, I guess, is irrelevant to the main plot, unlike those arrows that are like part of the plot or something, I don't really know.

Yeah, I suppose, we don't see much from Adel, I'd say... We don't see literally anything.

Is irrelevant if Ganon can't use that sword though.

Is irrelevant if Ganon can't use that sword though.

Just to smite evil < Other swords.

Imo holy would be bad for Ganon.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Just to smite evil < Other swords.

Imo holy would be bad for Ganon.

Also, Holy is just good. It doesn't actively smight evil. Would rubbing a well loved puppy on Ganondorf kill him? 😛

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
What is relevant, is that he survives that very sword, his own anathema, being stabbed into his face in the hands of a character with 4.5 gigajoules of strength.

That does not mean he can't be stabbed with other swords though.
The only thing is, that he can be defeated only with it, that's why, I repeat, this is pointless.

That does not mean he can't be stabbed with other swords though.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Other swords would have to work much harder. Most would break first.

Maybe, maybe not.

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
Maybe, maybe not.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
To quote Jack Skellington: "At what I do, I am the best!" in terms of scale of power, the master sword is very high up there.

Also, Holy is just good. It doesn't actively smight evil. Would rubbing a well loved puppy on Ganondorf kill him? 😛

Should make a sword war mmm still dont see the MS near the top.

Holy/sacred things are more effective to Ganon.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
There is no maybe. 4.5 gigajoules of energy behind a swing will reduce most swords to dust. This is the strength behind the master sword, which is super effective, to use a pokemon term, against Ganondorf because it actively smites evil, and in terms of power is on the level of the triforce itself. Ganondorf can survive [b]that. Nothing the FF8 party has can hurt him.[/B]

Well, maybe. I don't know anything from Zelda, so you may be right.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Should make a sword war mmm still dont see the MS near the top.

Holy/sacred things are more effective to Ganon.

If I jump into this I may derail the thread more.. I'll wait until a sword war comes along to address that. ^^

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
So? This didn't matter at all in the final battle because it was her only powerful ability.

The rest of your post is a bunch of assertions lacking any evidence or basis in fact.

Thundaga, Blizzaga, Tornado, Maelstrom (Tornado that critically injures foes), Quake, Meltdown (Fire attack that destroys defenses), Thundaga, Bio (magic that inflicts poison), Great Attractor (crashes planetoids and a meteor on the party), Meteor, Ultima, Apocalypse (her own creation and most powerful magic in the game), Flare, Holy, and Hell's Judgment (put's the party near death) are part of her arsenal.

Originally posted by The Scenario
Midna wasn't seen again until the end, and was lying unconcious in a field somewhere. She very well could have been uber in her Fused Shadow form. Still, the clash of power destroyed a castle. Don't ignore this.

It destroyed the castle but put both out of their forms and no signs of harm.

Ganondorf can possess her.

Maybe.

This doesn't mean they could beat Ganon. You are aware the Knights of Hyrule did not actually fight Ganon, right?

They had to if they were buying the sages' time for the seal magic.

Because it takes time.

They had enough time to do that. They only performed the seal after Link delivered the finishing blows.

And breaking barriers and ignoring evil defenses.

Dispel does the same thing except in Ultimecia's castle but that's because she can seal powers.

Don't think that's harm him much.

It will when coming from a GF-enhanced mercenary.

Are her minions supposed to be powerful?

Sphinxaur uses powerful elemental magic

Krysta counters anything and uses Ultima

Tri-Point is made out of a dragon and is weak against fire and ice but tends to swap weaknesses (I guess he sucks)

Catoblepas is a strong monster that uses thunder magic and Meteor

Trauma is a robot from the future with a Pulse Cannon and drains health

Red Giant is a magic-powered robot that is resistant to physical attacks but vulnerable to magic and GFs

Gargantua is some giant undead thing with status effect magic and Quake.

Tiamat is a former GF and pretty much a sister Bahamut.

Omega Weapon is strongest of the minions and equipped with powerful attacks including Ultima and a death spell.

There's also small fries like Tonberries and some Bad Breath users.

He hits it back.

Reflect

[QUOTE]
You played it recently? Shoot his tail.

I no longer have OoT. Also my N64 is in another state.

Summoning in Zelda lasts longer and calls weaker monsters.

Too bad for the Hylians.

This is worthless to me. I don't think you ever said what a GF was.

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_Force

With a spell designed to do so.

Ganon uses the Triforce of Power which is not something he made or was born with.

Are Adel and Ultimecia even in this fight? If not, this is pointless.

I'm just showing what the FF8 party has faced.

Would rubbing a well loved puppy on Ganondorf kill him? 😛

Holy is not the power of love as even Ultimecia use it. Regardless, that would be funny as hell.

Ganondorfs twilight and possession are his only cards he can play, his physical and magical powers are inferior from the few spells listed for the FF party, little bolts wont help him. If one of the party slice him up or blast him to bits with their larger scale spells hes doomed, considering there are many of them its not likely hes going to escape.