Originally posted by Robtard
I didn't claim you said: "people only do good things to get saved.". So moving on.
You really like to make these whacky assumptions about other people. Some people do "good" deeds just to do them and they're not Christians who are "saved" or expecting to be saved cos of said good deeds.
From what I'm reading here, you said I made a "wacky assumption" that people only do good deeds because 1) They're saved or 2) Are expecting to be saved by said good deeds, and you thereby "corrected" me that some people do them just because.
Seems kinda cut and dry to me.
And to comment on your story again, the whole point of bringing it up was to say, "I did it because I was being nice, not to please some deity."
You might not have meant it that way 2 years ago, but by bringing it up that way now, you fall into that category of being "seen among men".
At least, that's the way I see it.
Originally posted by Bat Dude
From what I'm reading here, you said I made a "wacky assumption" that people only do good deeds because 1) They're saved or 2) Are expecting to be saved by said good deeds, and you thereby "corrected" me that some people do them just because.Seems kinda cut and dry to me.
And to comment on your story again, the whole point of bringing it up was to say, "I did it because I was being nice, not to please some deity."
You might not have meant it that way 2 years ago, but by bringing it up that way now, you fall into that category of being "seen among men".
At least, that's the way I see it.
I was referring to this: "Good works are a wonderful thing to do, but you do them BECAUSE you're saved, not TO GET saved." specifically to the underlined part, since that is what I quoted and responded to of yours.
Correct in a sense, but more to the "I did it and I am not "saved" by your views". ie Not saved people can do good deeds.
I brought it up as an example to support the point I was making all along, people do good deeds just to do good deeds, not because they're "saved" or expecting something later. If you think that's bragging, oh well, no sweat off my ball-bag.
Originally posted by Robtard
I was referring to this: "Good works are a wonderful thing to do, but you do them BECAUSE you're saved, not TO GET saved." specifically to the underlined part, since that is what I quoted and responded to of yours.
I was referring to why a Christian does good deeds. A Christian does good deeds because they are saved, not to get saved.
Whether an atheist or a Hindu or whoever does good deeds or not is not the point of my statement. I was speaking specifically about Christians.
Bat Dude, a non-Christian can sincerely do good deeds and it is counted as righteousness for that person: no "Christian" requirement needed. Yes, I am talking about the Christian God considering those righteous works and those works helping them when they are judged. They can still be saved, also, contrary to what I think you believe about "salvation."
Get this: an atheist can still obtain salvation even if they did not accept "Christ as their personal Lord and Savior" while in the flesh. That judgement is up to God, not you. No interpretation of scripture will change that.
Originally posted by dadudemon
Bat Dude, a non-Christian can sincerely do good deeds and it is counted as righteousness for that person: no "Christian" requirement needed. Yes, I am talking about the Christian God considering those righteous works and those works helping them when they are judged. They can still be saved, also, contrary to what I think you believe about "salvation."Get this: an atheist can still obtain salvation even if they did not accept "Christ as their personal Lord and Savior" while in the flesh. That judgement is up to God, not you. No interpretation of scripture will change that.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
I'll be in the atheist section of Heaven, maybe we can knock back some brewksies in the afterlife while Batdude wastes away in the shabby part of Heaven reserved for overzealous pastors and others who think their interpretations of scripture are canonical fact.
I would be more than happy to knock back a few heavenly brewskies with the likes of you. You are certainly one cool mother ****er. I sure hope my life's journey and reconciliation with God results in how the afterlife will be (if such a thing exists). If it is the way I imagine, the afterlife will be a wonderful place.
Originally posted by Oliver NorthHeaven wouldn't have any knowledge of the going's on anywhere but in Heaven. Once you're in, you wouldn't be aware of Hell. Blissful ignorance.
So, if there is a Heaven, there is some type of hell, no?Could anyone honestly say they were in Heaven if they had the knowledge that people were suffering eternal torment?
That might bring the mood down for me.
Originally posted by Bat Dude
I was referring to why a Christian does good deeds. A Christian does good deeds because they are saved, not to get saved.Whether an atheist or a Hindu or whoever does good deeds or not is not the point of my statement. I was speaking specifically about Christians.
That really makes no sense. eg there are certainly people who have done good deeds and not been a [saved] Christian; then later became a Christian.
Fair enough, but you come as as almost a bit proud and arrogant, almost like: "Christian good deeds are superior to non-Christian good deeds". When a good deed is a good deed.
Originally posted by dadudemon
Bat Dude, a non-Christian can sincerely do good deeds and it is counted as righteousness for that person: no "Christian" requirement needed. Yes, I am talking about the Christian God considering those righteous works and those works helping them when they are judged. They can still be saved, also, contrary to what I think you believe about "salvation."Get this: an atheist can still obtain salvation even if they did not accept "Christ as their personal Lord and Savior" while in the flesh. That judgement is up to God, not you. No interpretation of scripture will change that.
"He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him." (John 3:36)
"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned." (Mark 16:16)
"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." (John 3:18)
"That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." (2 Thessalonians 2:12)
"He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son." (1 John 5:10)
"I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not." (Jude 1:5)
"Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved." (Luke 8:12)
"But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." (Isaiah 64:6)
"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" (Romans 3:23)
"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." (Romans 6:23)
"Her house is the way to hell, going down to the chambers of death." (Proverbs 7:27)
"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9)
"The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good." (Psalm 14:1)
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:" (Hebrews 9:27)
That's not my opinion. The Bible is very clear about this topic.
From the above verses, we can clearly see:
1) We all sin. No matter who we are, where we come from, what color our skin is, what gender we are, how much good things we do, etc. We all sin and are all unworthy of heaven.
2) The wages (or earnings) of sin is death, or hell. Hell is where we deserve to go and will go (if we don't get saved).
3) When we believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and that He is our perfect salvation because of His shed blood on the cross, we are saved. Remember that Jesus said the criminal on the cross next to Him would be with Him in heaven. What good deeds did he do? None, he simply believed that Jesus was King of kings and Lord of lords. He actually did the complete opposite of a good deed, he committed heinous crimes, that's why he was being put to death! Yet Jesus said he was going to heaven.
4) Those that do not believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and that He is our perfect salvation because of His shed blood on the cross, are not saved, but damned.
5) We live once on this earth. Once we die, we are judged. That's it. There is no second chance. When an atheist dies, as unfortunate as it is, they are lost forever in hell. They don't get a second chance to get saved. They had a chance (most likely multiple chances) but rejected it.
Again, that's not my opinion, that's what the Word of God says. If you disagree, your beef is with God, not me.
That really makes no sense. eg there are certainly people who have done good deeds and not been a [saved] Christian; then later became a Christian.Fair enough, but you come as as almost a bit proud and arrogant, almost like: "Christian good deeds are superior to non-Christian good deeds". When a good deed is a good deed.
What I meant by that is that the reasoning for a Christian to do good deeds is BECAUSE they are saved, not TO GET saved. A Christian's motivation for doing good works isn't to get saved, it's because it's the right thing to do, the godly thing to do. A Christian doesn't put their faith in their works for salvation ("Oh, I'll go to heaven because I'm generally a good person"😉, but rather their works (done in sincerity through the Holy Spirit) are to be a sign to others that they already are saved.
That was my meaning behind the statement. I didn't mean to come off as proud or arrogant. It was a slight misunderstanding on my part though, as I took what dadudemon said as "we can be saved by works" (which we can't) rather than "our works will be judged after death" (which they will).