Darth Maul vs. Lord Kas'im

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Yes but NEITHER had all the info my friend. They assumed (wrongly) that Sids beat all 4 jedi masters by himself. When in fact, Mace beat Sids by himself. So if you believe someone beat 4 masters, including one that is your peer... sure your views would be skewed as well. Don't you think?

...In my opinion, adding Obi-Wan to the Yoda/Sidious battle wouldn't have had much more of an effect then Kit, Agen, and Saesee had on the Mace/Sidious battle. /shrug

That's odd, Galan, 'cause I saw the Yoda/Sidious fight as being in Yoda's favor.

Originally posted by Galan007
Based on the novel's description + what was shown in the film, I don't think that Yoda was close enough to Palpatine (power/skill-wise) that adding Obi-Wan into the mix would have done much good. That said, I could completely buy Obi-Wan's comment that Sidious was >> he and Yoda combined.

...In my opinion, adding Obi-Wan to the Yoda/Sidious battle wouldn't have had much more of an effect then Kit, Agen, and Saesee had on the Mace/Sidious battle. /shrug

By "not close enough" do you mean that they were equals while Palpatine had the higher ground?

Originally posted by Enyalus
That's odd, Galan, 'cause I saw the Yoda/Sidious fight as being in Yoda's favor.

Originally posted by Galan007
Hm, how so?

On even ground, I see the fight playing out a whole lot more unfavorably for Palpatine.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Well first Sidious tries to run away, then Sidious gets disarmed. Plus the virtual stalemate of Lightning which blasts them both away. *shrugs* Yoda's lighter, so of course he'd fly a bit further, and end up slipping off.

On even ground, I see the fight playing out a whole lot more unfavorably for Palpatine.

"Finally, [Yoda] saw the truth. This truth: that he, the avatar of light, Supreme Master of the Jedi Order, the fiercest, most implacable, most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known . . . Just didn't have it. He'd never had it. He had lost before he started. He had lost before he was born." - RotS

Originally posted by Galan007
I don't see it that way. Yoda never had a chance of winning...

"Finally, [Yoda] saw the truth. This truth: that he, the avatar of light, Supreme Master of the Jedi Order, the fiercest, most implacable, most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known . . . Just didn't have it. He'd never had it. He had lost before he started. He had lost before he was born." - RotS

That passage refers to the Rule of Two being a superior Sith strategy.

Originally posted by Galan007
I don't see it that way. Yoda never had a chance of winning...

"Finally, [Yoda] saw the truth. This truth: that he, the avatar of light, Supreme Master of the Jedi Order, the fiercest, most implacable, most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known . . . Just didn't have it. He'd never had it. He had lost before he started. He had lost before he was born." - RotS

I think you're misinterpreting the symbolism because it had nothing to do with the current fight, really. Yoda and Palpatine were equals but Yoda is basically stating that the Jedi lost this fight a long time ago, when Bane created his new order.

Originally posted by Enyalus
lol...And that was due to Palpatine's superior skill?

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
I think you're misinterpreting the symbolism because it had nothing to do with the current fight, really. Yoda and Palpatine were equals but Yoda is basically stating that the Jedi lost this fight a long time ago, when Bane created his new order.

Regardless, I don't see how having Obi-Wan on Yoda's side could have helped things. Mace had three of the best swordsmen the order had ever produced on his side and it didn't help him at all.... Not to mention the fact that in their battle, Mace/Sidious were moving at such speeds that Anakin (aka. teh Dooku-slayer) couldn't even perceive them. Thus Obi would get wtfspeedblitzed!!1!!1

Originally posted by Galan007
Saber-wise, Sidious and Yoda were equals.... But from a force standpoint, Sidious seemed to have the [albeit slight] edge, imo.

Forcewise, I think I'm inclined to agree with you. And personally I think that's what made Sidious so dangerous with his lightsaber - his massive Force reserves with which to boost his speed and strength with.

Originally posted by Galan007
Not to mention the fact that in their battle, Mace/Sidious were moving at such speeds that Anakin (aka. teh Dooku-slayer) couldn't even perceive them. Thus Obi would get wtfspeedblitzed!!1!!1

Obi-Wan would've been more calm and collected and used the Force better to follow the two.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Saberwise, Maul 'nearly bested his master with a flurry of deadly lightsaber blows,' Mace disarmed him, Yoda disarmed him, DE Luke disarmed him...Sidious is in the elite tier, yes, but I can't see him being equal to 'the Order's true master of lightsaber combat.'

Forcewise, I think I'm inclined to agree with you. And personally I think that's what made Sidious so dangerous with his lightsaber - his massive Force reserves with which to boost his speed and strength with.

Agreed.

Originally posted by Enyalus
To be fair, Anakin was in no condition to be standing, let alone observing such a duel. The novel makes it clear that not only was he in emotional turmoil, but he was sick to his stomach and sweating and had a fever (I think?) too...

Regardless, Sids still had some impressive speed feats throughout that duel. Aside from slaying the 3 Jedi with an insane amount of ease, there were also times when even Mace could only perceive Sidious as 'a blur of darkness' or somesuch.... So that's got to count for something.

Didn't Dooku perceive Yoda as a blur in their duels? I'm not gonna go back through the AoTC novel (which was HORRIBLE - what the hell, Mr. Salvatore?) and DR to check, though...

Lazy. 😄

I just read through it, and the only notable points were that Dooku managed to hold off Yoda's surprise flurry, and Yoda's "Fought well you have' comment.

On topic, Kas'im becuase of his superior skill.

Originally posted by Gideon
This amuses me.

Spoiler:
Because if Yoda was "more than a match for Sidious," why did he run from Sidious?

😐

Hahaha.

^ Did you see KT's

Spoiler:
pathetic

Originally posted by Gideon
^ Did you see KT's

Spoiler:
pathetic

attempt to escape that one?

Attempt to escape LOL LOL. You're a funny guy Gideon, you do amuse me so. The thing is, I was asking a general question to all, and that all includes you. Reason being, you frequent the forums, and decided to read my post. Therefore, one could argue that I was talking to you and anybody who read my post. So your.. well you weren't specifically talking to me, and therefore I don't have to answer you, but you have to answer me... was all the more amusing. I'll play along... please elborate for me on what you're asking and when Yoda ran from Sid...

Why are Sidious, Yoda and Dooku even being discussed?

Imma going with Kas'im on this one, probably.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Attempt to escape LOL LOL. You're a funny guy Gideon, you do amuse me so. The thing is, I was asking a general question to all, and that all includes you. Reason being, you frequent the forums, and decided to read my post. Therefore, one could argue that I was talking to you and anybody who read my post. So your.. well you weren't specifically talking to me, and therefore I don't have to answer you, but you have to answer me... was all the more amusing. I'll play along... please elborate for me on what you're asking and when Yoda ran from Sid...

How about, we just skip forum etiquette altogether, as it's pointless semantics? 😐

Originally posted by Gideon
^ Did you see KT's

Spoiler:
pathetic

attempt to escape that one?

I was laughing because it's so easy to address but no one in the thread has done so. 😛

Polaski says that she has addressed it already in the past, though.

KT
Attempt to escape LOL LOL.

Yes, because that's exactly what you were doing.

KT
I'll play along... please elborate for me on what you're asking and when Yoda ran from Sid...

You were attacking Kenobi's assessment of Palpatine's fighting skills based on the idea that Yoda was "more than a match for Sidious," hence why Sidious attempted to flee during the initial part of the duel. I responded with the fact that Yoda fled from Sidious at the end of their duel. Why would he flee if he were more than a match for Sidious?

Blax
I was laughing because it's so easy to address but no one in the thread has done so

Then do it! 😄

Yoda fled because an army of clones were closing in on the senate chamber.

Done! 😄