Sersi Vs Dr Manhatten Vs Silver Surfer

Originally posted by Uriel005
1) Prove Manhattan isn't planetary levels because I know you can't because Manhattan has one series in which he has few showings because of lack of opponents requiring it.

2) Prove that an ethereal plane would actually trap Manhattan and stop his Teleport again you can't because there is no showing on Manhattan that it would work.

3) Manhattan duplicates... Trap OVER 9000 Manhattan's in a board all of them with teleport and matter manip... Right...

Also self replicating matter manipulators where the strength as far as we know isn't divided equally amongst them rather they are perfect copies is no joke.

Bad thread to use Dr. Manhattan no one can prove one way or another the limit of his powers because he has no reason to show the extent of his powers in the Watchmen comics. Him not being able to shoot down the nukes was hypothetical as nuclear war was never going to occur that was Ozzy deliberately countering him. So someone saying that he couldn't shoot down all the nukes is bull because that was based on the fact that he saw a tachyon disruption in the future blocking his vision making him assume he would fail to stop the nuclear war. So I say just to make the people taking this moot point argument seriously rage moar Manhattan takes on all of Marvel and DC and takes the win. There... Try and prove it wrong with no showings of limits or weaknesses of Dr. Manhattan beyond Tachyon disruption which doesn't actually effect anything other than his vision of the future.

Mods stop the Dr. Manhattan threads they don't go anywhere.

You're full of it. Your first two points are beging us to prove negatives, but D_Dude already covered that.

The point is as follows: Manhatan displayed an upper limit by his incapacity to decisevely win nuclear war. Even if he hadn't, we can only judge him by the powers and feats he did show, not speculate about powers he never showed.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Ok...your point?

He will still exist when the fight was happening.And what if manhattan BFRs him?

That or BFR him.

Originally posted by 753
My point is that since it's futile to attack manhatan's body as he is indestructible, SS can attack his mind/soul throught he astral plane.

That or BFR him.

The part where they said Manhattan was incapable of winning a nuclear war was based on a lie. Ozzy didn't think John could stop the coming war which is what launched the whole plot. He blocked John's vision of the future which made John think he failed to stop the nuclear war. The reality is that he could have been able to but because the only event he thought could block his future vision was a nuclear war, he thought it had occurred and that his powers were insufficient to stop it.

Also you're saying to go by his on panel feats... He has hardly any which is why I've repeatedly said he is a bad character to put into a discussion. I will repeat the idea that he could not stop a nuclear war was based on a lie by Ozzy who for as smart as he was is still human who was fearing for the worst in the event of a nuclear war and took steps to prevent it and create a perfect world regardless of whether or not John could stop it. It is unknown how John would respond to a psychic event, what his psionic resistance is, how soul effects work on him etc etc. give me proof that anything your saying would BFR or would absolutely defeat him and I know it won't happen because he has never shown a weakness that would beat him. The most that has ever happened was blocking his future sight.

Dr. Manhattan is a character with not enough background to say how far he could go. He is in a universe where nothing challenges him and no one could force him to show the extent of his power or push his limits, for all intents and purposes on panel he is a God except for the tachyon thing. John should not be used unless there will be more comics on him or the Watchmen in a universe of superpowers to say that he actually has any limits which I hope they don't do because the Watchmen series was a great as it was.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
1) One doesn't prove a negative, sport. Are you new here or don't you already know that? It's your burden to prove that his powers are indeed planetary in scale (such as worldwide matter manipulation or evolving a whole planet or even blowing up a whole planet would suffice). Until then, his best feats are where we derive the upper levels of his powers.

2) Again, asking me to prove a negative. In comics, that Astral plane has always been an existence outside of our own physical bodies and function under a different set of rules. Fact is, the Surfer has been able to pull entities with powers far greater than his own into the Astral Plane to destroy them (See Silver Surfer: In thy Name). What showings does Dr. Manhattan have that has indicated that his abilities can function outside a different plane of existence (any would do)?

And btw, going "it wouldn't work because you need to prove that it can work SPECIFICALLY on this character from a different comic book universe" is a lame argumentation.

Actually, since neither one of them has prep, Surfer can just blitz him before he can react and then trap him in the board.

Oh, and what feats, pray tell, has these copies been able to do that proves that each is a perfect, undiminished copy of the original?

Translation: All you have is implied power and no feats to back it up.

Sadly, when you debate in this forum, you need to base your argumentations on proven feats, not implied abilities.

I just mean to say that Manhattan is a bad character to use in any forum discussion, there really isn't much of a point unless he could be compared on panel to other super powered beings.

Manhattan took time to reform, even the second time when Ozzy removed his intrinsic field. I don`t doubt for a second that Surfer could do the same for a legit KO. Not to mention he could prevent him from reforming.

As godlike DM seemed in Watchmen, he doesn`t even make high herald when compared to the rest of the comicverse.

Originally posted by Uriel005
The part where they said Manhattan was incapable of winning a nuclear war was based on a lie. Ozzy didn't think John could stop the coming war which is what launched the whole plot. He blocked John's vision of the future which made John think he failed to stop the nuclear war. The reality is that he could have been able to but because the only event he thought could block his future vision was a nuclear war, he thought it had occurred and that his powers were insufficient to stop it.

Also you're saying to go by his on panel feats... He has hardly any which is why I've repeatedly said he is a bad character to put into a discussion. I will repeat the idea that he could not stop a nuclear war was based on a lie by Ozzy who for as smart as he was is still human who was fearing for the worst in the event of a nuclear war and took steps to prevent it and create a perfect world regardless of whether or not John could stop it. It is unknown how John would respond to a psychic event, what his psionic resistance is, how soul effects work on him etc etc. give me proof that anything your saying would BFR or would absolutely defeat him and I know it won't happen because he has never shown a weakness that would beat him. The most that has ever happened was blocking his future sight.

Dr. Manhattan is a character with not enough background to say how far he could go. He is in a universe where nothing challenges him and no one could force him to show the extent of his power or push his limits, for all intents and purposes on panel he is a God except for the tachyon thing. John should not be used unless there will be more comics on him or the Watchmen in a universe of superpowers to say that he actually has any limits which I hope they don't do because the Watchmen series was a great as it was.

More importantly: if he could prevent it, it would ruin the point of the story. The idea that not even God could save humanity from itself and that nuclear war can have no winners were major themes within it. stop talking out of your ass.

The rest of your argument is asking me to prove negatives. I don't have to prove Manhatan could be lost in the timeline, because he never showed he could timetravel. That's like asking me to prove superman can't timetravel. Why wouldn't a mind or soul attack work on him? He clearly ahd a mind and was vulnerable to even common psychological manipulation engendered by ozzie.

Originally posted by 753
Manhatan draining the SS? lol

[b]
Has Surfer resisted his energy being drained before? If so, then against who and how, show scans.

Making copies and oneshotting him? lulz

Yes if Dr. M at 10000ft tall attacks Surfer it will be a one shot.
[quote]
And yes he can trap high end energy manipulators in his board, he has done it on panel.

You've ignored astral form attacks and BFR to other dimensions, distant points in the timestreasm and or in space.

I haven't ignore them. SS simply can't do such things to beings in a fight. If I'm wrong them prove me wrong.

lol

Originally posted by Mshinu
Manhattan took time to reform, even the second time when Ozzy removed his intrinsic field. I don`t doubt for a second that Surfer could do the same for a legit KO. Not to mention he could prevent him from reforming.

As godlike DM seemed in Watchmen, he doesn`t even make high herald when compared to the rest of the comicverse.

Originally posted by Mindset
lol

Originally posted by h1a8
Yes if Dr. M at 10000ft tall attacks Surfer it will be a one shot.
Dr. M is more than an energy manipulator; he is a high end teleporter and duplicator too.

I haven't ignore them. SS simply can't do such things to beings in a fight. If I'm wrong them prove me wrong.

Lolz. Did someone hack into your account or are you trolling/drunk?

This post just seems a lot more inept than usual.

This is all kinds of stupid.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Lolz. Did someone hack into your account or are you trolling/drunk?

This post just seems a lot more inept than usual.

What parts are candidates of trolling? Quote each statement that is and explain why it is a candidate. If I'm looking like a fool then please do correct me.

P.S. I'm sincere here and really would like to be brought into the light if I'm way off here. This post is no way meant to be sarcastic but a sincere request for knowledge.

Originally posted by h1a8
Yes if Dr. M at 10000ft tall attacks Surfer it will be a one shot.
Dr. M is more than an energy manipulator; he is a high end teleporter and duplicator too.

I haven't ignore them. SS simply can't do such things to beings in a fight. If I'm wrong them prove me wrong.

BFRing durok into the far future

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/2946/thor19327zt8.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/9743/thor19328hv7.jpg

Trapping legacy with the negabands in his board. He does this often and can be seen absorbing cancerverse invading hordes into it in Thanos Imperative.

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/8547/silversurfer199612217bh0.jpg

Taking a fight with an entity who could devour him in the regular world into the astral plane where he quickly stablishes who is stronger there

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral3.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral4.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral5.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral7.jpg

Binding lunatik to a planet, so he'll die if he ever leaves

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/6866/mcp175p15ty0.jpg

Manhatan has zero chances of oneshoting the SS, who can also duplicate and alter his own size by the way.

Originally posted by 753
BFRing durok into the far future

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/2946/thor19327zt8.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/9743/thor19328hv7.jpg

Trapping legacy with the negabands in his board. He does this often and can be seen absorbing cancerverse invading hordes into it in Thanos Imperative.
http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/8547/silversurfer199612217bh0.jpg

Taking a fight with an entity who could devour him in the regular world into the astral plane where he quickly stablishes who is stronger there

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral3.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral4.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral5.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Silver%20Surfer/surferastral7.jpg

Binding lunatik to a planet, so he'll die if he ever leaves

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/6866/mcp175p15ty0.jpg

Manhatan has zero chances of oneshoting the SS, who can also duplicate and alter his own size by the way.

A beats B not because B is less powerful but because A has the keys to win.

Originally posted by h1a8
This is not applicable due to Dr. M being a teleporter. Dr. M starts the fight after the bell with many of himself as well.
Again not applicable. Dr. M is a teleporter and can phase. He also starts the fight after the bell with many of himself. Dr. M can amp as well, so busting through the board will be no problem as well.

Not applicable because Dr. M is not in astral plane. If SS leaves his body then Dr. M would either destroy it or absorb it.
Not applicable. Dr. M is a teleporter and matter manipulator and will start the fight after the bell with many of him.
I disagree. I see Surfer having no way to win against him and Dr. M having ways to win against Surfer. I don't believe Sufer can duplicate himself many times like Dr. M. Neither do I believe he can alter his size to large proportions like Dr. M can (to small sizes yes he can though)

A beats B not because B is less powerful but because A has the keys to win.

The board absorbs beings into it, they're rendered powerless within it. The nega-bands already allowed interdimensional travel and it didn't do legacy any good.

DM's mind would be a part of the astral plane, like everyone else's. Through the astral plane, one doesn't attack the body in the real world but the mind/soul directly. It's equivalent to a mindrape.

SS once shrank down to the microverse. Why wouldnt he be able to grow? And besides, what makes you think manhatan becomes more powerfull by growing in size?

Originally posted by h1a8
This is not applicable due to Dr. M being a teleporter. Dr. M starts the fight after the bell with many of himself as well.
Again not applicable. Dr. M is a teleporter and can phase. He also starts the fight after the bell with many of himself. Dr. M can amp as well, so busting through the board will be no problem as well.

Not applicable because Dr. M is not in astral plane. If SS leaves his body then Dr. M would either destroy it or absorb it.
Not applicable. Dr. M is a teleporter and matter manipulator and will start the fight after the bell with many of him.
I disagree. I see Surfer having no way to win against him and Dr. M having ways to win against Surfer. I don't believe Sufer can duplicate himself many times like Dr. M. Neither do I believe he can alter his size to large proportions like Dr. M can (to small sizes yes he can though)

A beats B not because B is less powerful but because A has the keys to win.

Originally posted by h1a8
I haven't ignore them. SS simply can't do such things to beings in a fight. If I'm wrong them prove me wrong.

Now whether or not Manhatten can combat such techniques may or may not be up for debate, but he DID prove you wrong about Surfer's general ability to use such tactics against people in a fight so that's a point you should conceed...

Originally posted by 753
You're full of it h1. Manhatan may teleport, but he can't travel through time. SS can drag him through the timestream alright, just blanket the whole area with the power instead of grabing him.

The board absorbs beings into it, they're rendered powerless within it. The nega-bands already allowed interdimensional travel and it didn't do legacy any good.

DM's mind would be a part of the astral plane, like everyone else's. Through the astral plane, one doesn't attack the body in the real world but the mind/soul directly. It's equivalent to a mindrape.

SS once shrank down to the microverse. Why wouldnt he be able to grow? And besides, what makes you think manhatan becomes more powerfull by growing in size? [/B]

DM is a matter manipulator and energy absorber. His larger self has more energy and is more powerful because this is how the writer's are portraying him to be when he grows.

Originally posted by darthgoober
You seem to be forgetting something, the reason 753 posted those scans was because you said...

Now whether or not Manhatten can combat such techniques may or may not be up for debate, but he DID prove you wrong about Surfer's general ability to use such tactics against people in a fight so that's a point you should conceed...

SS can't do the astral plane thing in a fight due to him leaving his body exposed or him leaving the battlefield rule. From that scan that wasn't what I define to be a fight (as in one on one ready set fight).

Also the other poster implied that SS can just send someone into the future with a mere gesture (his statement implied it). He didn't claim how. He purposely stated it in such a way as to be misleading. I knew this and thus called him on it.

There were other claims not yet attempted to be proven though.

I concede that he can do such things to certain beings but not how the OP implied how he would do them.

Dr. M grows 1000ft tall and one shots SS because the bigger he is the more power he has.

Originally posted by Mindset
Dr. M grows 1000ft tall and one shots SS because the bigger he is the more power he has.